After watching all the clips of Barry’s big speech yesterday, I can say one thing about him for sure: He IS smooth. And that is the most important talent shared by all great con artists. The second most important talent of great con artists is the ability to sense when the marks (voters) may be catching on to the con, and maneuvering them back into a renewed sense of confidence in the con man. That ‘s what yesterday’s speech was all about.

After getting rolled by the Republican’s twice since the November election, looking at the coming debt ceiling fight, seeing that Gaddafi may make him and America look weak and impotent on the world stage ("Throughout all this, we will continue to send a clear message that it's time for Gaddafi to go." Barack Obama, March 3, 2011, Source: Time magazine), and the looming Afghanistan troop withdrawal promise evaporating into the thin air of the reality in that country, he correctly sensed he needed to move the marks back into his confidence. The speech was filled with all sorts of red vegetables (organic only) for his base to chew on, and utterly devoid of any specifics on how to actually achieve anything. And, by all accounts on lefty liberal cable TV last night, it worked beautifully. The marks are right back where the con man wants them.

BTW, on a Hillaryous note, the range of reactions was huge. From even before the speech, where one FR lefty liberal was gushing that this was going to “be the defining moment of his presidency”, to Joe Biden’s “This thing is no BFD, I’m gonna catch some ZZZZZZZZ’s”.

Did a little research yesterday into the Queen of TeaBagging, Michelle Bachmann & the entitlements she receives, while criticizing them! On top of the hundreds of thousands of dollars she's received in Farm Subsidy's - looks like she's discovered ANOTHER CASH COW!

Explains WHY she wants to shut down Planned Parenthood!

Sure, you knew Michele Bachmann was a crazy pope-hating Jesus Freak and Republican candidate for Minnesota's 6th district who's likely to win because all those people are crazy down there, but did you know she basically runs a baby farm?

A Wonkette operative says Bachmann has five kids of her own and raised an astonishing 23 foster kids. A nice person would say, "Oh, that's a nice thing." But our cold-hearted operative notes that Minnesota pays $30 a day, tax free, per foster kid.

"So if Bachmann has fostered 23 children, let's say for an average of five years, that would come out to a non-taxable $1,259,250," the Wonk-Op writes. "No wonder she's anti-abortion. Children are a cash crop for her."

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CCAQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwonkette.com%2F211978%2Fmichele-bachmanns-baby-farm&ei=tTKmTZuFEOeT0QGXktjoCA&usg=AFQjCNHwogXU-J-rPs-6K6dYdoLF_Ty4nw

Is it any wonder she's against child labot laws?

Louis J:

Well said. President Obama pretty much laid out what he will not accept and then said the rest is on the table. He told both the democrats and the republicans to get off their butts and come back to him with something he can sign and move this country forward. Let us see what they do now. All the players in this new commission and voting members so they do have skin in the game. Will they act like adults and put the country first or play politics at our expense remains to be seen.

Additional evidence that there is absolutely NOTHING MONEY can’t buy:

Shortly after helping to elect Gov. Scott Walker (R-WI), Koch Industries opened a new lobbying office in Madison near the state capitol. However, little has been disclosed about the Koch lobbying agenda in Madison. The New York Times reported that Koch political operatives privately pressured Walker to crush public employee unions. But Walker’s major payback to Koch relates to environmental deregulation.

ThinkProgress has learned that the Walker administration, along with state Supreme Court judge David Prosser, has quietly worked to allow Koch’s many Georgia Pacific paper plants to pollute Wisconsin by pouring thousands of pounds of phosphorus into the water.

Koch’s Georgia Pacific plants are well known for releasing large amounts of phosphorus into Wisconsin’s waterways. A report by the state government showed that Georgia Pacific is responsible for about 9% of total phosphorus pollution in the Lower Fox River near Green Bay.

http://thinkprogress.org/2011/04/13/walker-koch-phosphorus/

The question we should be asking ourselves is, at what COST?

IMPEACH Scott Walker!!!

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Additional evidence that there is absolutely NOTHING MONEY can’t buy:

That's what the Koch suckers think.

All major charges were dropped, and Koch and Ashcroft settled the lawsuit for a fraction of that amount. Coincidentally, Republican ties. Contributions
www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Koch_Industries

Feisty:

WOW, you are coming out of the gate hot today. Funny how they trash a program but we then later find out they were one of their biggest recipients.

That speech of Obama’s was nothing more than a feeble attempt to shore up the low-information voters in his base. Class-warfare at its finest. Something for the low-brow Liberals to rally around, something for them to cheer about, even though they don’t have a clue about what they are cheering.

Revenue Reality for Dummies and Dems

Conservatives say we have a spending problem. Libs say nonsense, we have a revenue problem - all we need to do is just tax the rich more. Maybe this will help those who have a hard time putting Obama's spending in perspective.

Household net worth fell $17.5 trillion, or 25.5% from 2007 to 2009. So taking 2006 as the last full year before the crash: IRS data reveals that 3.8 million filiers reported income of $200,000 or above and paid $522 billion in income taxes, or 62% of all federal individual income.

So in other words, more than the top 2%'s revenue for 2006 equals what Obama spent in February and March plus (coincidently) April's Fool Day. ($3.7 trillion is roughly $10 billion a day!) 62% of all federal individual income for 2006 was spent in TWO MONTHS by Obama.

I know, I know Feisty ....... still doesn't sink in, huh. Here is how Walter Williams explains it:

If Congress impossed a 100% tax on all households earning $250,000 and above - it would yield $1.4 trillion. Not even enough to cover Obama's deficit! As Williams states - it would keep the government running for 141 days and the problem is .....there are another 224 days left in the year.

So how about those evil, rich, corporate fat cats? Take the Fortune 500 companies. They earn $400 billion profits. Confiscate all their profits, again tax 100%...... buys another 40 days....... and there is still another 184 days left .....a half year!

Forbes says there are 400 billionaires in America with a combined net wealth of $1.3 trillion. Sheez ....... let's quit playing around. Let's confiscate everything , their stocks, their bonds, force them to sell their businesses, their yachts, the airplanes, their mansions, their artwork, their kid's artwork on their refrigerators, their refrigerators, their cars, their kid's cars, their jewelry, the diamonds off their damn dogs' collars .........

OK ... now what ....... after all the above .......we are still a couple months short?

We have killed the goose and we still haven't even covered ONE YEAR!

Yea Obama ....... stick it to the rich. And as Williams says ....... good luck with that.

So, Pat, you and Amy, right? You two need smelling salts. Everytime Obama's face appears on the television, you two swoon. Guess what? You two are in a dwindling minority. Since last fall, his campaign speeches result in his approval ratings going down. It may not be nice to fool Mother Nature, but it is a really bad idea to fool the American voter, and then go out and remind them that you fooled them in the first place. Maybe he can get his wish to be president of China. I understand he believes it will suit him better. Sent by nojoe

_____________________________

David Frum:

“That speech was not so especially eloquent. It was, however, very effective. It frames the debate in a way that is maximally useful for Democrats. This framing was made possible by the efforts of Republicans themselves, blinded by their own hopes, misdirected by their own messaging.

It’s exactly like what happened on health care reform, where Republicans persuaded themselves they had Obama on the ropes even as he succeeded in enacting the most important new entitlement since 1965. We went for all the marbles, and ended with none. Now I fear we are doing it again.”

_______________________________

Dear no joe: Swoon? Isn’t that what happened way back in the 1940’s with Sinatra? Perhaps you forgot, but I was very critical of President Obama last weekend. Very critical.

President of China? You really need better material than this. And do not collect social security or use Medicare okay? Those are socialist programs. Don’t touch them. If you do, you’re a hypocrite.

btw, the rich – the ones you support? The ones that don’t give a damn about you? Their tax cuts are history. And their taxes with all their loopholes? History. Who knows. Maybe they’ll move out of America for good.

Someone the other day put together a bunch of quotes from the Republican Tea Party members as they carefully read the deal made last week between President Obama and Speaker Boehner. And they are not happy campers. They feel they got nothing, zero, zilch. They were all in agreement – it was a BAD DEAL for them. A very bad deal.

Fool Mother Nature? What’s going on with the Republicans no joe? Looks like they fooled the American voter last November. This is from a comment made last night over @ Think Progress:

Public Policy Poll 's newest national poll finds that after a little more than 3 months in charge House Republicans have fallen so far out of favor with the American public that it's entirely possible Democrats could take control of the House back next year.

43% of voters think that House Republicans are doing a worse job now than the Democrats did, compared to only 36% who think the GOP has brought an improvement.
19% think things are about the same.
62% of voters thinking that the Republicans have either made things worse or brought no improvement to an already unpopular Congress does not bode particularly well for the party.

______________________________

Now Amy, Feisty, Beverly, Steeler_Fan, Jody, Nashville and all you ladies.

NO SWOONING!

btw, here are some lovely photos of the President and First Lady from our friend Blackwaterdog; the photos with the kids are adorable.

http://blackwaterdog.wordpress.com/ - Promise now, NO SWOONING.

Eleven Presidential elections! It took that long before I was presented with a candidate who got my vote because he was the BEST candidate; not because he was the lesser of two evils. During President Obama's campaign I listened to him very carefully, and I grew more excited each passing day. After a point, I could finish his sentences before he did. This was my guy. He rekindled the pride I felt in my country.

My expectations were high when he took office. Perhaps that magnified my disappointment when he didn't close Gitmo, when he didn't throw bankers into prisons, when he continued the occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan. I didn't want cool and calm. I wanted fire and brimstone. I wanted change and I wanted it now.

Now, I'm getting that change. In his measured, methodical, coldly calculated intellectual style, he is giving it to me. He is giving me no reason to regret my vote, and last night, he gave us the change he promised without raving and without ranting. He has shown us the end game; the real game. The Republican "leadership" has been playing Checkers. Well, fellas, the game is Chess.

Most of us know we cannot continue to spend beyond our means. The G.O.P. harped on that, but their hackneyed response was to cut taxes for the rich. All but the most ignorant right-wing ideologues know that doesn't work. Most Americans know in their guts, if not their heads, that lowering taxes for the rich paves the road to third-world status. Hey, G.O.P. Check!

The insidious Ryan attack on health care is not going to fool us. The obscene spin? If you are under the age of 55, you will have many, many options when you retire. Really? We hear the health insurance gods give us the best care in the world - an abominable lie - make huge profits for their stockholders and can reward their executives with fabulous compensation packages.

How do they do this? They try like hell to insure only healthy folks. They are the de facto "death panels". But no, the G.O.P. tells us, private insurance companies will line up to offer affordable insurance to seniors. These are the years when the need for medical care is the greatest, and consequently the most expensive. Given the rate of increase for medical insurance for the last ten years, the Ryan vouchers will not even cover the premiums, IF anyone offers them. We're onto you G.O.P. Check!

The President is going to cut the budget in the Defense Department. Check! He is going to continue to focus on alternative energy. Check! He is going to insist that we have clean air, water, and soil. Check! He has promised to continue to cut areas of waste from the budget. Check!

The best the G.O.P. can do is to drag their feet and deliver BS budgets to a President who will use his veto power. Check! When they drag their feet and fail to deliver a budget in 2012, the voters will see clearly the G.O.P. is playing a childish game and will deliver the government to responsible leaders.

CHECKMATE!

Who Needs An Expired Coupon?

Democratic National Committee chairman Florida Democratic Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz dropped a bomb shell which I agree with. Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz said the Wisconsin Republican Wonder Boy Rep. Paul Ryan's new budget proposal would be a DEATH TRAP for seniors.

http://nation.foxnews.com/rep-debbie-wasserman-schultz/2011/04/07/new-dnc-chief-gop-budget-proposal-death-trap-seniors

I am RMOFLW at the righties for 2 reasons because righties say …

1) NBC Doesn't Object to Dem Calling GOP Budget a 'Death Trap,' But Was Outraged Over Death Panel Claims

2) the prophetic haters on the left and the right as well as the ones in the middle knew the President would capitulate, be weak, give a campaign speech, love the sound of his own voice, etc, etc, etc.

Suddenly, what an insult and ohhh so seemingly disappointing to the righties when and even to this day the righties accused the healthcare plan of *ahem* death panels, their violent" rhetoric, and violent" imagery at their T-Bagger rallies is impossible to surpass!!!

T-Bagger wearing a" Guns Don’t Kill”Obamacare kills”sign

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/gallery?Avis=C4&Dato=20100411&Kategori=NEWS&Lopenr=4110802&Ref=PH

The voucher the Wonder Boy Paul Ryan(I like his new part in his hair it does make him look so much like the monster he is) offers up is nothing more than a coupon with an expiration date for a death sentence.

The President’s framework focuses on sensible health care costs. The President’s approach to reforming Medicare and Medicaid keeps our commitments to seniors, people with disabilities, and children while reducing health care spending. By 2023, these reforms will help us save $480 billion and an additional $1 trillion in the decade after that.

The President said--"We have to live within our means, reduce our deficit and get back on a path that will allow us to pay down our debt,"; that is exactly right.

Paul Ryan’s plan in contrast is Sooo … um gimmicky. a voucher to buy health insurance that will lose value over time;so will cancer and any other terminal disease when your coupon expires.

Paul Ryan’s accolades will soon have him bending over and taking it while the President Obama ‘s plan will receive mosts of the credit for - deficit reduction and non-compromise, compromise. Well played sir. Well played.

BTW: I heard Lobbyist wrote Paul Rayan’s budget deal.

Again well done Wonder Boy.

One more thing Obama should know about taxing the Rich - They're not Stupid.

Leftists here at FR not only believe raising the tax rate on the rich solves the problem, that there is enough money to cover Obama's insane spending - but they also seem to believe the rich would simply pay it.

The leftists believe that taxes are static, or in economic parlance, have zero-elasticity. And while that may hold true to a degree for most of us, the rich - not so much. Less than 20% of their income is wages, commissions, bonuses, etc. HR never touches their money. It is handled by the best CPAs and they get paid to make as much tax burden as they can find go away. Taxes are very elastic for these guys, all their behavior is driven by cost benefit, risk assesment and tax consequence.

When government take goes up, corporations report fewer profits and greater cost. Individuals buy tax shelters, hide their money and report less income. Doesn't matter what party affiliation - everyone does it.

As Walter Williams states in a recent piece -

Federal tax collections have been between 15% and 20% of GDP every year since 1960. However, between 1960 and today, the top marginal tax rate has varied between 91% and 35%.

That means whether taxes are high or low, people make adjustments in their economic behavior so as to keep the government tax take at 15% to 20% of GDP. Differences in tax rates have a far greater impact on economic growth than federal revenues.

Pretty much says it all, huh?

So Obama believes Rep. Paul Ryan’s plan is un-American. And Obama says so right to Ryan’s face. Ryan should have gotten up and walked out when this pathetic little man that happens to be President stands in judgment of his plan. And rather than propose an alternative to Ryan’s plan, Obama seeks to demagogue it and dismiss it. To Obama, it’s just not worthy for his eyes and his Liberal minions to see. Ryan’s plan seeks to preserve the entitlements safety nets while Obama rhetoric seeks to maintain the status quo of the entitlements without a plan to fund them. Obama continues on the same line of nonsense that the entitlements can be preserved by removing all the “waste and abuse” to the systems. Obama has been in office 2+ years, and he hasn’t proposed one solution to the “waste and abuse” of any entitlement program.

Once again, Obama, now confirmed from going from being a Big Government Liberal to now being a Socialist after this speech, thinks more central government planning will solve the problems of the entitlements, and he belittles Paul Ryan’s plan of increased competition and increased consumer control. Control out of the hands of the government is foreign to Obama, he just doesn’t get it.

Obama says he’ll cut Defense, but doesn’t say where, or when. Just more reviews, more committees, more talk. Not even a proposal from Obama on what should be done.

And of course there are the tax increases. In less than 4 months Obama has turned on the very legislation he signed to keep the taxes the same. It’s like he forgot he did it. I doubt even the most hardened Liberal thinks any new income to the government will be put towards deficit reduction. In fact that money too will be spent, and all the cuts Obama tried to explain, well, those will be forgotten.

As with any cost cutting, Obama wants to do something, not now, but later, much later, as in never.

Great posts guys, those dots are getting so close together they'll connect themselves. The Conservative plan couldn't be more clearly to enrich the wealthy elites by impoverishing the rest of us.

Navy, that's all we're asking for, to be reasonable and put into practice the oaths they promised to the people. They represent the whole and not the part.

Republicans that sound off are so limited on their perception of reality that I kind of pity them. But not much.

Hey anyone want to play Charades this morning?

I'll go first - Who am i?

blah blah blah i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama - blah blah blah - i hate obama ....

*popcorn*?

Revenue Reality for Dummies and Dems

Great stuff Bob, unfortunately it will probably fall on deaf ears around here.

David Walker

The best the G.O.P. can do is to drag their feet and deliver BS budgets to a President who will use his veto power. Check! When they drag their feet and fail to deliver a budget in 2012, the voters will see clearly the G.O.P. is playing a childish game and will deliver the government to responsible leaders.

CHECKMATE!

Well played!!!

While there's no question that the President's address yesterday was harshly and unnecessarily partisan, and that it will make negotiating to raise the debt ceiling and reach a compromise on a long-term plan to address the nation's debt crisis more difficult, I really liked one part of the President's speech.

For weeks and weeks I have been talking about the projection accompanying the President's FY 2012 budget proposal suggesting that interest payments on the debt will reach nearly $1 trillion annually within the next 10 years.

I have even asked (twice, in fact) the Boiler Room Boys, Mark and Dom, to explain to me why liberal/progressives aren't fixated on addressing the debt crisis in order to prevent $1 trillion a year from being diverted from the federal revenue stream simply to service interest on the debt (no answer on that, yet...).

I have pointed out that every conceivable government program will be cut before there is a default on those debt service payments.

Well...

Lo and behold...

Yesterday, President Obama said this:

"By the end of the decade, the interest we owe on our debt could rise to nearly $ trillion. Just the interest payments."

President Obama added that by 2025, the federal government would only be able to pay for three things: Health care programs, Social Security, and interest on the debt. That's it, folks.

No national defense...no "investments"...no "Winning The Future".

So...I'm glad we got that straightened out, anyway. It's certainly gratifying to know that President Obama understands the implications of the debt crisis even if most First Readers are unable to get their minds around the enormity of the problem.

Holy, cow, Feisty, this is exactly what happened in Maine. The Tea Party governor, LePage, on his election, immediately set about "reforming" environmental regulations, all in the name of making Maine more "pro-business."

A sharp eyed reporter noticed his 39 proposals for repealing environmental protections was printed on paper bearing the mark of a lobbying firm for chemical and manufacturing industries. Thank God the Maine legislature recently shot down his proposal to repeal the ban on BPA used in children's sippy cups, which was one of the proposals the chemical industry asked for. The Maine Heritage Foundation, which receives funds from the Koch foundation, is also very influencial in the LePage administration.

But Walker’s major payback to Koch relates to environmental deregulation.

Louis, Navy, Feisty, Beverly, David Walker--great start this morning, stands and applauds.

Bill, Fairfax VA

Revenue Reality for Dummies and Dems

Great stuff Bob, unfortunately it will probably fall on deaf ears around here.

It already has fallen on the death ears of the visually impaired republi-clown/t-baggers; Bill,.

[snip]

The research Ryan ordered up from the Heritage Foundation( Koch brother's funded) projects that enacting his budget will lead to an unemployment rate of 2.8 percent in 2021. (Um, dudes? The unemployment rate has never been anywhere near that low.) "Bass-ackwards" is another. The Ryan plan calls for big tax cuts for corporations and the well-off and higher taxes on the middle class. How about "random?" Take a pair of twins. One is born December 31, 1956, at 11:58 p.m., the other is born January 1, 1957, at 12:03 a.m. Both work at identical jobs and pay identical taxes. But upon turning 65, five minutes apart, the first will be entitled to Medicare in its current form—a single-player, government-funded, open-ended health insurance plan. The younger twin will get a voucher to buy health insurance that will lose value over time.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_exclusive/20110406/pl_yblog_exclusive/analysis-is-the-u-s-ready-for-gops-medicare-plan

Only a moron would miss that. Well, maybe some morons do acknowledge when they need help.

I'm fired up and ready to go. Bring on the GOP'S of NOPE'S. We're ready for you.

Pat, Boston, MA

Now Amy, Feisty, Beverly, Steeler_Fan, Jody, Nashville and all you ladies.

NO SWOONING!

btw, here are some lovely photos of the President and First Lady from our friend Blackwaterdog; the photos with the kids are adorable.

http://blackwaterdog.wordpress.com/ - Promise now, NO SWOONING.

========================================================

Are you kidding?

*** Obama heads back home to Chicago: And tonight, Obama attends his first fundraiser as a 2012 candidate -- three of them, in fact. The fundraisers, which will take place in his home town of Chicago, will raise several million dollars for the joint DNC-Obama campaign fund.

I'm so excited. I will mosey on down to the beautiful Navy Pier on our beautiful lake front to get a glimpse of our handsome, intelligent, "No Drama" President. The republi-clown/t-baggers just can't beat him. He plays them well.

I told you Pat, our President hasn't forgotten where he came from. He is my fellow Chicagoan, whom I trust, love, and am glad I voted for. President Obama desveres our support. Imagine a republi-clown/t-bagger in charge.

Welcome Home Mr President!!!

Now Amy, Feisty, Beverly, Steeler_Fan, Jody, Nashville and all you ladies.

NO SWOONING!

Are you kidding?

Sorry Pat! Gotta go with my GF Bev on this one! ;o)

I'm in SUPER Swoon mode today!

Welcome Back to Sweet Home Chicago Mr. President!

let me guess, fisty you are a racist

Off topic:

Did anyone else catch Debbie Wasserman-Shultze on the Today Show this morning?

What a FEISTY FIREBALL!

What an EXCELLENT choice to head the DNC!

JoAnnaSmith1

So Obama believes Rep. Paul Ryan’s plan is un-American. And Obama says so right to Ryan’s face. Ryan should have gotten up and walked out when this pathetic little man that happens to be President stands in judgment of his plan. And rather than propose an alternative to Ryan’s plan, Obama seeks to demagogue it and dismiss it.

Joanna that plan is unamerican, its American to show respect for our seniors that worked to build this country. its unamerican to tell seniors that they must Scarface while the well to do don't. its american to provide our seniors with good government healthcare, as it was layed out by Johnson when this plan was inacted. isn't it strange that since medicare was enacted americans are living longer to enjoy the fruits of there labor. but what Ryan's plan does is take us back to when the average man lived to 60 and women to 70, now because of medicade we have added 10 years to both, doesn't that make you feel good to know that your life expectency longer because of medicade. yes Ryans plan is Unamerican. what wrong with giving our seniors the best we have to offer considering how hard they worked.

Once again, Obama, now confirmed from going from being a Big Government Liberal to now being a Socialist after this speech,

Don't put the socialist tag on President Obama, every president since hoover republican and democrats were in many ways were socialist,

Roosevelt enacted SS as a safety net for seniors, Liberal socialist policy

Truman ended segeration in the armed forces, Liberal socialist policy

Ike, cut defense and built the interstate hwy system at the same time sent in troops to force integration in little-rock Arkansas, Liberal socialst policy

Kennedy, with the news reels showing violent scenes of civil rights marchers being beaten and murdered put together the first civil rights laws, Liberal socialst policy.

Johnson finished the vision of Kennedy and passed voters rights laws, civil rights laws, and medicare and medicade, because our seniors were dying before they were 65. Liberal socialst policy

Nixon, added to SS funds to dependent children (i took advantage of this because my dad died at 36 and left 6 children and his X-wife that no longer had his job to depend on. that socilist program saved us, it kept my mother from going on welfare and helped send me and my brother and sisters to college) Nixon also stated student loan program that helped the disadvantage to go to college instead of Vietnam. Liberal socialst policy

Caters well we know he was the liberal of liberals enough said.

Reagan signedimmigration reform yes Reagan the great American conservative hero had socialist tendency's. Liberal socialst policy

Now Joanna your are not being true to your self by labeling Obama this socialist you hate, if you hate Obama for his socialism them you must look back and hate every president since hoover.

Now Obama has a duty just like all the president i mentioned above to do for our own, help the poor disable and most important seniors and ryans plan leaves them out of his grand plan. its more like a class system something we rejected when we gained out Independence from England. England's class system is what made people search for a new way of life and Joanna too much blood was spilled during the revolution to go back to that, Ryan's plan.

Hey no joe - Here's the guy you swoon over!

Think Progress: Christie’s latest foray into bullying rhetoric came yesterday, where he asked a group of reporters to “take the bat out” on a 76-year old female legislator Sen. Loretta Weinberg (D) because she has the temerity to collect a pension in addition to her part-time salary as a legislator...

We Progressives are fired up now, and ready to get off of our butts and get our President, President Obama re-elected. Yes we can, and yes we will.

JoAnnaSmith1

That speech of Obama’s was nothing more than a feeble attempt to shore up the low-information voters in his base.

Pull her string and a stream of wingnut venom spews forth. The most interesting thing about the president's speech was that he vowed not to extend the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy. There's nothing the Republicans can do to prevent him from vetoing the extensions, which will expire unless he approves them. If Boehner wants the middle class tax cuts to be extended (not that he really cares), he'll have to send the president a bill without the upper-income tax cuts.

Class-warfare at its finest. Something for the low-brow Liberals to rally around, something for them to cheer about, even though they don’t have a clue about what they are cheering.

Class warfare at its most vile is Paul Ryan's war against the poor and the middle class to benefit his wealthy campaign donors.

bob-1805084

One more thing Obama should know about taxing the Rich - They're not Stupid.

Maybe. but they do feel entitled.

All but one of the top 30 income earners in the United States are white males.

"All white men, by the way, just one woman," Mica Brzezinski said of the list, "and I didn't see any African-Americans

She referenced a list in Sunday's New York Times of the top 30 earners in the U.S., a list that included "some of the people who drove us into the ditch."

Read more: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/matt-hadro/2011/04/11/mika-brzezinski-rich-white-men-need-contribute-more-budget-solution#ixzz1JVio0uY7

That's not who need to pay less taxes as our President said.

What jobs have they created? Why are they stupid enough to think we peons our gonna continue to allow them to drain US dry and send jobs away?

What else could it be if not stupid? Would you say greedy?

Houston: The most interesting thing about the president's speech was that he vowed not to extend the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy.

Yeah, he's been saying that for years now. So, do tell, what tax cuts did he extend last December?

Jeff, well said.

Feisty & Beverly: no joe doesn't like swooning. Unless it's a Republican of course.

My Kind of Town:

Chicago - the Cubs, the White Sox, Al Capone, Pizza, the Bears, The Bob Newhart Show, Polish Sausage, Michael Jordan, Jack Benny, Dick Durbin...

Governor Deval Patrick. Feisty Redhead & Beverly.

On October 5, 1848 while returning from a series of speaking engagements in Massachusetts, Mr. Lincoln and his family stopped at Chicago’s Sherman House The lame duck congressman was apparently recruited to speak at a rally for Whig presidential candidate Zachary Taylor to be held the next night. Although scheduled for the county courthouse, so many people showed up that the rally was moved to the nearby square instead. The Chicago Journal reported that Mr. Lincoln’s two-hour speech was "one of the very best we have heard or read, since the opening of the campaign. http://www.abrahamlincolnsclassroom.org/Library/newsletter.asp?ID=60&CRLI=140

________________________________

And of course, the President of the United States - Barack Hussein Obama.

Couldn't have said it better, Houston. The GOPTP plan to transfer $3T to the top from the rest of us is class warfare.

Deliberately increasing unemployment to drive down wages is class warfare.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2011/03/monetary_policy_7

Trying to prevent the final destruction of the middle class? That's not class warfare.

David Walker, will you marry me?

Your post perfectly articulates exactly how I feel about President Obama's plan to reduce the deficit. Give me cool and calculating any day over flaming demagoguery.

And you put your finger on the exact problem with Paul Ryan's "brilliant" solution to the high cost of Medicare:

the G.O.P. tells us, private insurance companies will line up to offer affordable insurance to seniors. These are the years when the need for medical care is the greatest, and consequently the most expensive. Given the rate of increase for medical insurance for the last ten years, the Ryan vouchers will not even cover the premiums, IF anyone offers them.

Feisty & Beverly: no joe doesn't like swooning. Unless it's a Republican of course.

That's because it's impossible for 'loons' to 'swoon', unless it's a bully/thug like Christie!

Excellent post Pat! So much to be proud of in this great city!

PS: You forgot Eli's Cheese Cake! lol

Pat, Boston: " Promise now, NO SWOONING"

Thanks for the pictures, Pat - and I tried, honest I did! I made it past the adorable kids and the always stunning First Lady and even the funny shot of him with the cardboard cut-out of her, but when I got to the JFK-like close-up, I just couldn't help myself. Pass the smelling salts, please!

Okay, my bad. I'm going back to reading Tiger Beat now. I promise to be stronger next time..... ;>)

This is from CNBC.com for all those FR financial geniuses that claim the US doesn’t have a “debt problem”. This is another sign that America is fast becoming last century’s world power. If the dollar is tossed out as the world’s reserve currency, the US ability to influence the global economy goes right in the toilet with it.

Can’t happen??

Won’t happen??

The 19^th century’s world power, England’s Pound was the world’s reserve currency until it was displaced by the dollar in the 20^th century.

BRICS Take Aim at Dollar

Reuters

| 14 Apr 2011 | 04:16 AM ET

The five BRICS nations took another step towards cementing their global influence on Thursday, calling for a broad-based international reserve currency system "providing stability and certainty".

In a statement released at a summit on the southern island of Hainan, the leaders of Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa said the recent financial crisis had exposed the inadequacies and deficiencies of the current monetary order, which has the dollar as its linchpin.

"The era demands that the BRICS countries strengthen dialogue and cooperation," Chinese President Hu Jintao said.

The BRICS are worried about the long-term fate of the dollar because of America's large trade and budget deficits.

One other point about Ryan's medicare voucher idea forcing seniors to buy from private insurance companies. If as the GOPTP is determined to do, they were able to repeal Obamacare, those private insurance companies will be able to cancel policies for seniors who get sick along with millions of others and we know they won't hesitate to do so. Ryan is not brave, he is a coward shilling for private insurance companies.

JoAnne: I'm glad you enjoyed them.

The photos are just lovely. And I can't help but thinking of all these children. Imagine meeting the President of the United States in the Oval Office? It seems like a very friendly, down to earth atmosphere in the President's office.

And hats off to David Plouffe btw. His appearance on MTP this past weekend was really a turning point I believe in this Administration. It's great to have him back.

JoAnnaSmith1

So, do tell, what tax cuts did he extend last December?

You must have been dozing along with Joe Biden when President Obama said why he went along with the tax cuts last time:

In December, I agreed to extend the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans because it was the only way I could prevent a tax hike on middle-class Americans.

If the Republicans want to see tax cuts extended for the middle class (which they don't), they will have to send the president a bill separate from their request to extend the Bush tax cuts.

RVZ, why do you always write about black people? You seem obsessed. Same with immigrants.

Are you white?

Pat, don't be surprised if she says she's black. That's the only way certain Republicans can justify being racist.

RVZ: " the often blind and ignorant voting habits of black people"

This is a perfect example of why I don't believe in collapsing comments. Everyone should be able to read this and remember it next time they read anything else RVZ has to say.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Off topic:

Did anyone else catch Debbie Wasserman-Shultze on the Today Show this morning?

What a FEISTY FIREBALL!

What an EXCELLENT choice to head the DNC!

Off topic???

Hell Naw it ain't; Girl friend.

Debbie dropped a bomb on them!!!

Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz said the Wisconsin Republican Wonder Boy Rep. Paul Ryan's new budget proposal would be a DEATH TRAP for seniors.

Paul Ryan's plan in contrast is Sooo … um gimmicky. A voucher to buy health insurance will lose value over time; and so will cancer and any other terminal disease when your coupon expires.

Pat "no swooning"

Thanks for the pictures of the Obamas, Pat. OK, I didn't swoon, but I did briefly go into a kind of quiet trance. I stopped and looked a long time at the picture of the little girl in her Sunday best, patent leather shoe tipped upwards just so, discussing important issues with the President in the Oval Office. The President so obviously connects with people, not a bad quality to have when you are the leader of a democracy. I totally get NoJo's criticism of me, that I hero-worship Obama too much, but, God, is it wrong to want an inspiring leader for a change? Isn't the leader of the free world supposed to be admirable? Or are we only supposed to have Presidents people tend to call gauche, disengaged, uncurious, over privileged, etc. I will say something nice, in the spirit of bipartisanship: Laura Bush was stunning at her husband's second inauguration. I looked a long time at pictures of her in that white coat. Lovely.

Joanna Smith1 sounds like a racist....must be a Tea Party member!! REALLY?? Get a clue loser!!

Houston - the Democrats owned Congress and the White House for two years, and did nothing on taxes for the wealthy or anyone else. Minority leader John Boehner in Sept/2010 even said if he had to give up the tax breaks for the rich to get a deal to extend them for the non-rich, he would, and Obama/Pelosi/Reid did nothing. The deal was on the table, and the Democrats/Obama ignored it.

Source: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/09/12/ftn/main6858401.shtml

So Houston, cut the bull with "The Republicans made us do it" excuses you and the Democrats/Obama are constantly spewing. Obama signed the extensions for the rich - that's his bill - he did it. And now yesterday the Hypocrite in Chief is still trying to talk his way out of it, and you just keeping drinking the kool-aide he's serving up.

Joe in Albany

Can’t happen??

Won’t happen??

The 19^th century’s world power, England’s Pound was the world’s reserve currency until it was displaced by the dollar in the 20^th century.

Joe you sound like that bloke on FOX NOISE; always trash talking. That's why the Chicago Bulls whooped your Knicks' ass the other night.

This ain't no UK!!!

I didn't swoon, but I did briefly go into a kind of quiet trance.

________________________________________________________

Sounds like you have all signed up for a giant internet Messianic cult.

Cults never end well. Usually it's mass suicide.

Jonestown

Branch Davidians

Heaven's Gate

Obamabots??

JoAnnaSmith1

Minority leader John Boehner in Sept/2010 even said if he had to give up the tax breaks for the rich to get a deal to extend them for the non-rich, he would, and Obama/Pelosi/Reid did nothing.

If you think Boehner was ever serious about ending the upper-income tax breaks, your gullibility is truly astounding. Boehner's deeds did not match his lying words. The only way the middle class tax cuts got passed is because Obama agreed to go along with the upper-income cuts as well. The Senate Republicans would have filibustered anything else.

Minorty Leader Boehner was either not negotiating in good faith when he stated that he would get behind the middle class tax cuts without the top tiers, if that's the only way he could get them, or, he is an ineffectual leader and was unable to get his caucus in order.

The middle-class was held hostage for the rich to get richer.

On another note. I'm a super-lib, lower-middle class, and I think all the tax cuts of 00,03,10 should be rolled back. I want to help in reducing the deficit. I am willing to pay my share.

Please do not ask me to send in a check, until you have done so yourself....or gotten on board with higher taxes to pay down this debt that the GOP claims is an emergency situation. If the emergency is as dire as they say, EVERYTHING including revenue increases should be on the table. EVERYTHING. IF, it's as dire as they say. If they don't put EVERYTHING on the table, it is just fear mongering politics.

Pat, Boston, MA

Jeff, well said.

Feisty & Beverly: no joe doesn't like swooning. Unless it's a Republican of course.

My Kind of Town:

Chicago - the Cubs, the White Sox, Al Capone, Pizza, the Bears, The Bob Newhart Show, Polish Sausage, Michael Jordan, Jack Benny, Dick Durbin...

Governor Deval Patrick. Feisty Redhead & Beverly.

You're too kind Pat, Boston, MA

Thank you

I agree with Fiesty no jo is a loon. That woman yodels to preserve all the other loons in the nutty repbuli-clown/t-bagger faction. She is always fishing for a repbuli-clown/t-bagger. How low will she go?

fisty, yea I am sure her constituents are real happy she has more on her plate now than just representing them in Congress.

As far as for Srs, you can't live forever, survivial of the fittest, get out and jog!

This ain't no UK!!!

_________________________________

You just keep on telling yourself that, Bev.

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it."
George Santayana

Ted, Mid Michigan

EVERYTHING. IF, it's as dire as they say. If they don't put EVERYTHING on the table, it is just fear mongering politics.

And President Obama blew EVERYTHING off the table for the republicans.

President Obama says "I Refuse To Renew' Bush Tax Cuts Again".

It would be political suicide if he did. The President has the American people behind him and he listens to them. Since he is very bright he really doesn't need anyone to tell him his framework focuses on sensible, moral, solutions for America.

Houston: If you think Boehner was ever serious about ending the upper-income tax breaks, your gullibility is truly astounding. Boehner's deeds did not match his lying words. The only way the middle class tax cuts got passed is because Obama agreed to go along with the upper-income cuts as well. The Senate Republicans would have filibustered anything else.

Now your projecting, and calling Boehner a liar. Pelosi could have wrote the legislation to Boehners statement and told him "Vote for it big fella!". And if Boehner/Republicans would not have, the media would have (figuratively) killed him. Not a good position to be in right before an election.

The deal was on the table for the Democrats. They could have taken it. Instead Obama waited, lost an election big time, and had to make a very late deal. He signed the law saying tax cuts would be extended to the rich, he could have vetoed it, but he didn't, he had the choice. You see what he picked.

Ok, Obama seems to be a likeable, good looking guy. I also think Jennifer Lopez deserved her title as the "Most beautiful person" by people magazine, barely edging out Salma Hayek in my opinion. But, really this is important why?

Bev,

The reality is that the world recognizes what a complete buffon Obama is.

From the Brazilians, to the Russians, to India and China, to France, Great Britain and Germany, Saudis to Iranians - the world mocks Obama and is moving on and protecting itself from the Obama disaster.

Anyway Bev...... ignore the world, and feel free to keep playing with yourself in your little thinkprogress dumpster .....

Amy B. Portland, ME

"David Walker, will you marry me?"

I'm sorry, but my wife says I can't. I would have gotten back to you sooner, but she made me wash the dishes and mow the lawn first. Being a kept man isn't all it's cracked up to be.

In any case, in the spirit of bringing something new to the vine, I offer this fact. Some years ago, I went to Planned Parenthood to get a vasectomy. So, for John Kyl and other Planned Parenthood haters, if you wish to be rendered non-fattening for the ladies, that's a great place to go. If such a thought challenges your manhood, think of it as a "Cut-and-Play" operation. They do a lot of good stuff at Planned Parenthood, all 139% of it.

I have to go do the ironing now.

Joe in Albany

_________________________________

You just keep on telling yourself that, Bev.

"Those who cannot learn from history are doomed to repeat it."
George Santayana

Oh, I think you meant Carlos Santana - Black Magic Woman; Joe

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAf3gqdCrDs&feature=related

America is sick and tired of the Koch Brothers' hex. It's just unnatural. And their karma goes against the laws of the universe.

Que buenos tiempos!!!

2010, Democrats control the White House, the House of Representatives and have a 59 - 41 majority in the Senate. BUT the Republicans made them keep the Bush tax rates, even after they lost the election and couldn't lose any more seats. PLEASE! Could this crowd have less political courage? What exactly did they stand for? You say Boehner was lying and no deal was on the table, why, with the majorities the Democrats had were they negotiating?

And you tell me these guys can reform entitlements? ROFL!

BTW As this was a revenue bill why could reconciliation not be used to avoid any Senate filibuster?

The Republicans that are never afraid to show their racist side, hats off to you because I would just assume know where you stand instead of you hide behind a façade of policy dislikes... but I'll leave the hat where it lies. No reason to conversate. I pity the narrow and close-minded.

We are of an age where racism has no place in society as we have gotten past segregation and unequal rights. We are a diverse people that needs to embrace one another. The United States is a place for inclusiveness and not exclusiveness. Grow your mind and learn.

JoannaSmith1

Now your projecting, and calling Boehner a liar.

Or maybe he what he said was just "not intended to be a factual statement."

Pelosi could have wrote the legislation to Boehners statement and told him "Vote for it big fella!". And if Boehner/Republicans would not have, the media would have (figuratively) killed him. Not a good position to be in right before an election.

Gee, it sounds like you've been possessed by the evil spirit of Rachel Maddow! Maybe we'll have to do an exorcism. Of course I know that unlike Maddow, you're only motivation is to find some excuse to bash the president. But you may have a point. Perhaps Pelosi SHOULD have written up a middle class tax cut bill to replace the tax cuts lost by the repeal of the Bush tax cuts. Maybe that's what they'll do the next time the tax cut extensions come up for a vote. However, if the economy has recovered sufficiently by that time, maybe all the tax cuts should be allowed to expire as Ronnie Reagan's OMB director David Stockman has recommended.

You don't have to look very deep to catch Boehner lying. http://www.politifact.com/personalities/john-boehner/

The President yesterday placed his proposal in clear contrast to that of the GOP/TP. Throughout his address, he frequently drew that contrast in terms of values: Optimism vs. pessimism, inclusion vs. abandonment, growth and progress vs. regression, thoughtfulness vs. reckless stampede. One essential point in his speech was when he remarked that the Ryan budget plan would fundamentally alter the American "social compact."

Lots of people pooh-pooh such talk. But those terms are as much why this conflict is occurring as what the conflict is about. The President, on one hand, believes that all Americans should enjoy the benefits and fruits of the society; the Tea Party, on the other hand, says the strong survive and expand and the weak die off. Another way to put this is that the President believes in community and shared responsibility while the Tea Party thinks life should be a shootout at noon on Main Street.

This is also a battle about lessons learned. Not just the U.S., but all the nations of the world, have learned that:

• Chemicals, parasites and bacteria in the water kill;
• All have learned that dilutants in the powdered milk kills;
• All have learned that left to their own means and devices, financiers, bankers and stockbrokers will not only swindle the unwary, but make an even better job of fraud with the savvy wealthy;
• All have learned the natural course of business in an unfettered market leads to monopoly and financial enslavement;
• All have learned that with absolute power over the workplace, employers will exploit their employees, subject them to deadly hazards, and abandon them when they beome ill or aged;
• All have learned that a healthy, educated and motivated workforce is one of the leading reasons why business chooses locations;
• All have learned that high employment at good wages, social stability, and peaceful communities equals a population that can afford the goods and services of the national and global marketplace.

And that's just a short list of lessons learned.

The Ryan budget proposal disposes of that list like a used Kleenex. President Obama's proposals give full acknowledgement of them.

But there is one lesson learned, in the 1930's, that President Obama does not yet seem to have absorbed. That is the lesson taught by President Franklin Delano Roosevelt when he, too, encountered much of the same sort of opposition in Cngress that now confronts the present Administration.

President Roosevelt, at first content as is President Obama, to set the course of policy and let Congress implement it, found that he needed far more direct involvement in implementing his plans. he set his Cabinet members to work, actually drafting proposed bills affecting their areas of responsibility, and delivered those bills to Capitol Hill.

President Obama needs to do the same - task each Cabinet member with writing the legislation implementing his budget proposals, and send them down to the Hill.

Under ordinary circumstances, that could be a risky maneuver - becoming so detailed and specific sets up a nit-picking fight and exposes the President to absurd, twisted characterizations in the battle of campaign rhetoric However, this time he will be seenas a working leader fighting for the best intersts of the nation. His specific pieces of legislation become an anvil against which the hammer of public opinion and divided members of the GOP majority, along with a more unified Democratic membership in the House, will forge the final bills.

Mr. President, you've given us a clear and hopeful vision of how you wish to adress the nation's needs. Please, Mr. President take it down to the details this time, and TAKE THEM TO THE HILL!.

RVZ555

To assorted folks above: I always write about black people? Really? I'M not the one that writes at least one post a day claiming that anybody who disagrees with Obama is a racist, am I? I'M not the one who writes gushing, patronizing, condescending posts day after day about my governor or my president because he's "articulate" and "oh so handsome", am I? We get it, Pat. You're ashamed of your whiteness and feel the need to show everybody how cute and cuddly you think minorities are.

You are one sick Zombie, race- chasing, baiter just like Steve, Spanky and the others. Pat has more humanity in just one fingertip than you do in you whole being!!!

The darker side of me kind of thinks you are always pontificating the whiter-than-thou art garbage, when essentially you are a bunch of low lives who think you are privileged poster boys for white entitlement!!!

In the future, please, please keep it to your sleazy selves and don't post it.

That Would Satisfy my Soul

Yea I saw Debbie on tv, she needs to go see an orthodontist bad.

Oh, I think you meant Carlos Santana - Black Magic Woman; Joe

____________________________________

Bev, you really aren't very bright, are you??

John:

You don't have to look very deep to catch Boehner lying. http://www.politifact.com/personalities/john-boehner/

Hmm. Only one Pants-On-Fire award. He's still got some work to do if he wants to catch up to Sarah Palin.

Republican bright idea to solve healthcare………wait for it………COUPONS!!!!!!

That’s right!!! Get out your scissors America because the WSJ is giving you 10% of a hip replacement on Sunday. Not enough…..then you’ll love CRAZY TUESDAYS in the NY Post if you act now get one free Morphine drip with purchase of a liver transplant. That’s crazy America!!!! Over a $90 value absolutely free after you pay an arm and a leg.

Next stop on the Paul Ryan (terribly slow but patriotic) tea party train…bat@!$%# crazyville. Free american flags for everyone!

Houston: But you may have a point. Perhaps Pelosi SHOULD have written up a middle class tax cut bill to replace the tax cuts lost by the repeal of the Bush tax cuts. Maybe that's what they'll do the next time the tax cut extensions come up for a vote.

Well, ya'think! Maybe Pelsoi could have come up with a 2011 budget while she was at it too. And there is no next time for Pelosi Houston because you see, her party lost a couple of seats in the House on Nov02/2010, and Nancy now calls John Boehner "Mr. Speaker".

Beverly in Chicago

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Additional evidence that there is absolutely NOTHING MONEY can’t buy:

A Chevy Volt for every Obama Vote! 2012!!

David Walker

Just goes to show, all the good men are taken. PS I never heard a vasectomey referred to as "making one non-fattening to the ladies!" That's pretty funny :)

bob-1805084

Bev,

The reality is that the world recognizes what a complete buffon Obama is.

From the Brazilians, to the Russians, to India and China, to France, Great Britain and Germany, Saudis to Iranians - the world mocks Obama and is moving on and protecting itself from the Obama disaster.

Oh yea?

The FP Top 100 Global Thinkers

Foreign Policy presents a unique portrait of 2010's global marketplace of ideas and the thinkers who make them.

DECEMBER 2010

3. Barack Obama

Yeah, President Obama for charting a course through criticism!!!

Don't count Barack Obama out. Sure, the brainy young American president has had a tough sophomore year, with a stubbornly sluggish economy, worsening conditions in Afghanistan

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2010/11/29/the_fp_top_100_global_thinkers?page=0,2

=====================================

That was just 4 months ago. Google the pictures of the people thanking our President in the world 4 not being Bush

Anyway Bev...... ignore the world, and feel free to keep playing with yourself in your little thinkprogress dumpster .....

What are doing at the thinkprogress dumpster?

BTW: How's the view under the dumpster?

We get it , Pat. You are ashamed of your whiteness and feel the need...Sent by RVZ

_____________________________________

Who are "we"? Ashamed of MY whiteness? What an incredibly Jim Crow thing to say. What should I be ashamed of?

What I am ashamed of is the Tea Party and their racist signs.

You and your party are stuck in a time warp.

Black people are just as American as I am. And more so than you are.

I admire a great deal about their history. But our history not so much when it came to slavery and Jim Crow.

You are a jealous, afraid of losing the majority, American.

The white people are going to have to get over that long held vision of entitlement. Okay?

You're a lost cause. Your posts illustrate that fact quite clearly.

bob-1805084

So basically you are saying that if you are rich, you are a tax dodging criminal who should have ALL of their money seized for tax evasion.

When government take goes up, corporations report fewer profits and greater cost. Individuals buy tax shelters, hide their money and report less income. Doesn't matter what party affiliation - everyone does it.

Everyone does it, sure, everyone that does not have any ethics. Truly unpatriotic, if you ask me.

As to the speech I am SO happy that PRESIDENT OBAMA finally laid it down as to what he will and will not tolerate. This is the President that I voted for.

Leave it to LouisJ to give us "rational thoughts" Blaming Bush tax cuts for the housing bubble? Really?

Bev,

Do you even read your own crap references? Sheez - it lists all his failures and problems and then sums up with something to the effect - that maybe it will work out for because he is an idealist and maybe the world will thank him. Pathetic.

I don't spend time in the dumpster...... just walk by and seem to notice you in them.

Bateman,

Pretty ignorant response. Well done.

so louisJ - where were the democrats in what you call bushes doctrine? vacation? Hiding out outside the D.C. area? Attending feisties BBQ's?

Feisty and navy - sorry i don't grasp the connection between planned parenthood and child foster care. Obviously you think that children should be hidden, kept out of site or placed in an orphanage.

Beverly - if you and feisty think that money will buy anything, I guess that is why you rail so much against the wealthy and business. You want their money in your pocket without taking the risks and effort they or their parents (predecessors) took to amass the wealth. Your care little about elevating the poor, other than to offer empty rhetoric on "oh, you poor thing, I am sure the government will support you"

David walker - Obama's only focus has been to win re-election. We all know of his focus to create private sector jobs, his focus on creating better foreign trade (assuming of course that foreign labor was properly represented), his focus on debt reduction (3+ months before even acknowledging that maybe we did have a debt problem), but hey he will allow the republican house until late June to submit a plan.

Didn't he say something yesterday about cleaning up waste and fraud would not solve the debt issue? But here you have been suckered into thinking that it will.

Yep! obama can use his veto power allright. he will become the president of NO, H*LL NO! He will become the president who couldn't lead or foster bipartisanship to get America rolling again. His bleat will be it was all bushes fault and those dang republican/tea partiers who came into power (in the house only) in 2010.

Just WTF has he closed on since mid 2009 that the majority of voters agree on favorably? He flits like a buterfly from issue to issue without closing any deal. Closing, btw, means regs written, everyone on board and policies funded.

JohnA - Obamas speech of say 40 minutes placed it in clear contrast to ryans 70 + page proposal? Obama seemed to be more intent on promoting partisanship and re-election rhetoric than leadership of all Americans.

At least you got this right...

Especially in light of the fact that neither pelosi or reid will.

Please, Mr. President take it down to the details this time, and TAKE THEM TO THE HILL!.

batman - jealousy will get you nowhere. Stifling the free will of people will get you nowhere. Crying about laws and regulations that are on the books will get you nowhere.

Bob 180... Many times I have questioned Bevs' conclusions based on what she submitted as links proving it, yet she still puts out links that prove anything of consequence.

The last time I checked out her link proving that exxon-mobil didn't pay income taxes the amount they were given credit for was minuscule with respect to all of the taxes and fees that they did pay to the government.

American:

Let's put on our thinking cap. Too much debt is a problem. We should be able to agree on that, right?

Our infrastructure just isn't that important is it? We gotta pay that debt. Our dams are silting up, our bridges are falling down, our roads need repair. Not to worry, we have to balance the budget right this second. Besides the cost of repair will only go down, right? Funny how that wasn't a concern until Obama took office.

Fraud and waste? Well hell that won't solve the our cash shortfall, only a part of it. Never mind! Let's just ignore it. Wouldn't you guys on the right just love to hear that?

Veto power? The President has the power of the veto for a reason. Perhaps if previous Presidents had discovered the veto power we might not be in this mess. George W. Bush never saw a spending bill he didn't like. If Republicans were capable of feeling shame they could look at the 12 vetoes he DID veto. http://uspolitics.about.com/od/electionissues/tp/Bush-Vetos.htm

You raise the issue of bipartisanship. Go check on the number of filibusters the Republicans threw up to bring a virtual halt to governance before you throw out that kind of garbage.

Don't you even dare to tell me what I am thinking until you've tried it yourself.

Bob and American.

Thanks for proving my point by disregarding it and attacking me. If you misrepresent on your taxes you are a criminal. By hiding income are you not misrepresenting?The rich will do anything they can to avoid paying their share. I could care less how much money someone has. I am truly not jealous. I am also not greedy. The tax laws in this country are ridiculously skewed toward the rich. The middle class CANNOT afford to carry tax dodgers any more.

The Ryan Plan Summary of Major Points: [Part I]

On the tax side, the Ryan plan would make permanent all of the Bush tax cuts for high-income Americans, as well as the striking estate-tax giveaway included in the December 2010 tax package that benefits the estates of only the wealthiest one-quarter of 1 percent of Americans who die, at a cost of tens of billions of dollars. In fact the Ryan Bill will lower the current maximum tax rate from 35% down to 25% further reducing revenues. The Ryan plan loses $700 billion over ten years from making the high-end tax cuts permanent. People with incomes over $1 million would receive average tax cuts of $125,000 a year. These Spending Cuts which are for the most part offset by Tax Cuts for the richest 2% only serves to redistribute the wealth from the middle class to the richest 2% and DOES NOT reduce the deficit/debt anywhere near the amount proposed by the Ryan Bill. In fact the Ryan Bill will add Trillions to the deficit/debt over the next decade, not reduce them. Why is nobody pointing out the fact that if the Ryan Bill gets implemented we will have to increase the debt ceiling dramatically??

The plan contains $1.4 trillion in Medicaid cuts over ten years (which includes repeal of the HCR Medicaid expansion);huge cuts in food stamps, low-income housing, Pell Grants, and other programs for people with limited incomes; and repeal of the HCR’s subsidies to help low- and moderate-income people purchase health insurance. This will throw about 50 Million people off the Insurance rolls leaving them to fend for themselves. This plan will totally destroy Medicaid and many social programs as we know them.

The Ryan plan does call for tax reform that would broaden the tax base. But every dollar of revenue gained would go for cutting tax rates well below Bush-era levels, especially for the richest Americans whose top rate would fall to 25 percent. Not a penny would go for deficit reduction.

In addition, the plan almost certainly would lead to large cuts in investments critical to future economic growth, like infrastructure, education, and basic research.

And the “Privatization” of Medicare will either lower benefits for the same amount of money or cost more for the same benefits. Several reports indicate that seniors will have to pay about $6400 more for the same benefits. Again this will drive people off the insurance rolls putting them in a position of no health care or inferior Health Care, you can bet on it. This would destroy Medicare as we know it as well. The only winners here are the Insurance Companies – AGAIN.

Bottom line is the Ryan Proposal will cost hundred of thousands of Jobs, increase claims for UI, Food Stamps and Medicaid, lower revenues at both the State and Federal levels, stall or even derail the economy, will have little effect of the deficit especially since most of the spending cuts are absorbed by the tax cuts for the richest 2% and the increase in government spending on UI, Food Stamps and Medicaid. This proposal is not about deficit/debt spending cuts but is in fact a huge redistribution of wealth and power from the middle class to the top 2%.

Part II follows below:

President Obama in his speech yesterday has taken a different route to economic stability. [Part II]

It is important to note how got to this point in time to begin with. As President Obama said in the opening remarks of his speech yesterday afternoon:

“To meet this challenge, our leaders came together three times during the 1990s to reduce our nation’s deficit. They forged historic agreements that required tough decisions made by the first President Bush and President Clinton; by Democratic Congresses and a Republican Congress. All three agreements asked for shared responsibility and shared sacrifice, but they largely protected the middle class, our commitments to seniors, and key investments in our future”.

“As a result of these bipartisan efforts, America’s finances were in great shape by the year 2000. We went from deficit to surplus. America was actually on track to becoming completely debt-free, and we were prepared for the retirement of the Baby Boomers. But after Democrats and Republicans committed to fiscal discipline during the 1990s, we lost our way in the decade that followed”. “We increased spending dramatically for two wars and an expensive prescription drug program – but we didn’t pay for any of this new spending. Instead, we made the problem worse with trillions of dollars in unpaid-for tax cuts – tax cuts that went to every millionaire and billionaire in the country; tax cuts that will force us to borrow an average of $500 billion every year over the next decade”.

“To give you an idea of how much damage this caused to our national checkbook, consider this: in the last decade, if we had simply found a way to pay for the tax cuts and the prescription drug benefit, our deficit would currently be at low historical levels in the coming years”.

I offer this as a historical context since the GOP seems to want to ignore their hand in what has lead us to the current economic distress and totally deny that a major portion of the current deficit is from the failed agenda of the previous administration, NOT President Obama.

Our President has laid out a framework of four steps to his plan to achieve $4 trillion in deficit reduction over the next twelve years. It is a plan (model) that puts virtually every kind of spending cut on the table, but also is one that protects the middle-class and the poor, the promises made to seniors, current military and its veterans, and our investments in the future of this country by creating jobs and keep the economy improving.

Step One: “The first step in our approach is to keep annual domestic spending low by building on the savings that both parties agreed to last week – a step that will save us about $750 billion over twelve years. We will make the tough cuts necessary to achieve these savings, including in programs I care about, but I will not sacrifice the core investments we need to grow and create jobs. We’ll invest in medical research and clean energy technology. We’ll invest in new roads and airports and broadband access. We will invest in education and job training. We will do what we need to compete and we will win the future”.

Step Two: Cuts in Defense Spending, per President Obama speech:

“Over the last two years, Secretary Gates has courageously taken on wasteful spending, saving $400 billion in current and future spending. I believe we can do that again. We need to not only eliminate waste and improve efficiency and effectiveness, but conduct a fundamental review of America’s missions, capabilities, and our role in a changing world”.

Step Three: On Health Care the President said “The third step in our approach is to further reduce health care spending in our budget. Here, the difference with the House Republican plan could not be clearer: their plan lowers the government’s health care bills by asking seniors and poor families to pay them instead. Our approach lowers the government’s health care bills by reducing the cost of health care itself”. “Already, the reforms we passed in the health care law will reduce our deficit by $1 trillion. My approach would build on these reforms. We will reduce wasteful subsidies and erroneous payments. We will cut spending on prescription drugs by using Medicare’s purchasing power to drive greater efficiency and speed generic brands of medicine onto the market. We will work with governors of both parties to demand more efficiency and accountability from Medicaid. We will change the way we pay for health care – not by procedure or the number of days spent in a hospital, but with new incentives for doctors and hospitals to prevent injuries and improve results. And we will slow the growth of Medicare costs by strengthening an independent commission of doctors, nurses, medical experts and consumers who will look at all the evidence and recommend the best ways to reduce unnecessary spending while protecting access to the services seniors need”.

The Ryan Bill wants to destroy The HCR Bill and everything associated with it along with Medicare and Medicaid. He wants to turn Medicare over to the Private Insurance Companies and make Medicaid a “Block Grant” putting the majority of the costs on the backs of already strapped States, insuring that both Medicare and Medicaid will be destroyed as we know it.

Step Four: “The fourth step in our approach is to reduce spending in the tax code. In December, I agreed to extend the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans because it was the only way I could prevent a tax hike on middle-class Americans. But we cannot afford $1 trillion worth of tax cuts for every millionaire and billionaire in our society. And I refuse to renew them again.

Beyond that, the tax code is also loaded up with spending on things like itemized deductions. And while I agree with the goals of many of these deductions, like homeownership or charitable giving, we cannot ignore the fact that they provide millionaires an average tax break of $75,000 while doing nothing for the typical middle-class family that doesn’t itemize”.

“My budget calls for limiting itemized deductions for the wealthiest 2% of Americans – a reform that would reduce the deficit by $320 billion over ten years. But to reduce the deficit, I believe we should go further. That’s why I’m calling on Congress to reform our individual tax code so that it is fair and simple – so that the amount of taxes you pay isn’t determined by what kind of accountant you can afford. I believe reform should protect the middle class, promote economic growth, and build on the Fiscal Commission’s model of reducing tax expenditures so that there is enough savings to both lower rates and lower the deficit. And as I called for in the State of the Union, we should reform our corporate tax code as well, to make our businesses and our economy more competitive”.

This is my approach to reduce the deficit by $4 trillion over the next twelve years. It’s an approach that achieves about $2 trillion in spending cuts across the budget. It will lower our interest payments on the debt by $1 trillion. It calls for tax reform to cut about $1 trillion in spending from the tax code. And it achieves these goals while protecting the middle class, our commitment to seniors, and our investments in the future.

Part III follows below:

A Brief Opinion of Both Plans: [Part III]

[The Ryan Proposal]

Congressman Ryan’s proposal (deficit/debt) is based on primarily discretionary spending cuts that assault most of the social programs from the middle class and people of modest means. It cut funds for education, medical research, food and product safety, national security, EPA, IRS, etc. etc. It will increase costs and reduce benefits for Medicare and Medicaid in the short term (adding about $6,000 to Medicare Premiums over current costs) and totally destroying both Medicare and Medicaid for the future. Tens of Millions of people will be removed from the Health Insurance Rolls and left in the street to fend for themselves during a time they need the coverage the most. It attacks the HCR Law further denying affordable Health Care to our Citizens. States will now get a flat fee for Medicaid (block grant) and then be responsible for all the additional costs to make it work. This insures that Medicaid will be destroyed.

The so called Spending Cuts in the Ryan bill are not true reductions to the deficit/debt at all. In fact leading economists claim that the Ryan Bill will add 2-3 Trillion Dollars to the deficit/debt in the next decade alone. This will demand that the GOP/TP will have to increase the Debt Ceiling to implement this Bill. They forget that point in their rhetoric. This Proposal is nothing more than a bait and switch where Ryan cloaks the cuts as “Fiscal Responsibility” when in fact they are being used to fund huge unprecedented Tax Cuts for the richest 2%.

President Obama said yesterday that to give him a $200,000 reduction in his tax bill 33 seniors will have to pay $6.000 each. This is by the way the additional cost to Medicare as proposed by the Ryan Bill. Senior citizens, the middle class and those of modest means will fund the tax cuts for the rich and whatever is left over, if anything will reduce the deficit/debt, Many Social Programs will be phased out. Unemployment will increase as will the claims for UI, Food Stamps and Medicaid costing the government billions more and further reducing the revenues to both the State and Federal Governments at a time they need every dollar to keep many programs afloat. This will also have a negative effect on the continued growth of the economy. People this is not a plan that will solve our current problems. In fact it ignores them and just shifts money around from the middle class to other entities giving a false appearance of reducing the deficit/debt.

[The Obama Model]

Instead of just moving dollars around and ignoring the problems President Obama is going after health care (the number one cost factor) at the source, by controlling costs. His HCR Law will cut 1 Trillion Dollars from Health Care costs. He is going after fraud, waste, non functional programs, etc. He promises to cut spending on prescription drugs by using Medicare’s purchasing power and generic drugs to drive their costs down. He will work with governors of both parties to demand more efficiency and accountability from Medicaid instead of just throwing a “Block Grant” at them and then letting the States blowing in the wind to try and pick up all the other costs, which many strapped States will not be able to do like the Ryan Plan will do. President Obama said he will fight to keep Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security intact and viable for the future. The GOP/TP wants to either “Privatize” these plans or do away with them altogether. In my opinion “Privatization” will no nothing but increase costs through the roof, reduce benefits and funnel more money to Wall Street and the Big Insurance companies. The American people will suffer while the fat cats get “fatter”.

President Obama is going after the Department of Defense to reduce their budgets beyond the 400 Billion already committed and without putting a single troop in harms way.

President Obama is going after our domestic spending cutting 750 Billion over the next 12 years. What he is not going to do is sacrifice the core investments we need to grow and create jobs. We’ll invest in medical research and clean energy technology. We’ll invest in new roads and airports and broadband access. We will invest in education and job training. These are all things that the Ryan’s proposal attacks and has cut spending on or just outright kills.

The President’s Plan will address the current tax code to simplify it and make it fairer so all people will pay their fair share. He will not renew the tax cuts for the richest 2% that costs about 150 Billion or more (Income, capital gains and estate taxes totaled) per year and does very little if anything to create jobs and stimulate the economy. I suspect he may increase the upper limits to 500K or even One Million and then apply the Clinton rates to those over that Taxable Income threshold. He is going after the tax loopholes that primarily benefit the wealthy at the expense of the not so rich. The Ryan plan on the other hand wants to reward the richest 2% by lowering their taxes from 35% to 25%, keeping the free estate taxes and the lower capital gains tax. And as I mentioned above, the Ryan plan makes the middle class pay for these tax cuts to the rich by implemented DRACONIAN Spending Cuts to Social Programs, Medicare, Medicaid and anything else they can get their hands on.

It is up to you the American People which plan you want. One will destroy this country as we know it and redistribute the wealth and power to a select few (Oligarchy). The other will move our country forward, protect the middle class and those of modest means, allow our children the opportunity to a fair and equal education and partake in the American Dream and so much more.

Fantastic work USN, the above should be required reading for anyone who wants to truly understand the budget situation and the difference between the 2 approaches.

Excellent, informative posts US Navy--grand slam home runs.

Shipwreck, do you stay up all night writing this stuff?

US Navy - OUTSTANDING post. OUTSTANDING.

** Standing O **

Your standing ovation is well deserved. And don't mind the haters on here - they CANNOT refute what you have posted so they are resorting to name calling.

Here is something I thought I would never ever see. Nancy Pelosi and Michelle Bachmann will be voting the same way on this legislation. These 2 actually agree on something. THAT CAN'T BE GOOD FOR PRESIDENT OBAMA. Nancy Pelosi democrat icon voting against her president. WOW!

I like to think of Navy as a well crafted tool, that fights the good fight for freedom and justice for all.

You can say that Navy and people like him are a Republican-Tea Baggers worst night mare.

And in the face of a thoughtful contrasting vision, Joanna, the know everything conservative is reduced to calling names.

Kudos Joanna! Kudos.

Do you EVER have anything to add? Ever? All you do is complain, rehash talking points, and carry water for the wealthy.

Joanna, are you rich? I'm trying to figure out why you're carrying so much water for the wealthy?

Great Point, Ted

Perhaps JS1 falls into this category.

The recent Republican maneuvers make me think back in history to the Civil War era. The slave owners were part of the movement to convince the lesser class into fighting for state rights.

However, they were fighting for slavery rights. Many, of these soldiers were fighting to keep themselves from being the lowest in class and by keeping the salves in bondage.

Instead of just moving dollars around and ignoring the problems President Obama is going after health care (the number one cost factor) at the source, by controlling costs. His HCR Law will cut 1 Trillion Dollars from Health Care costs. He is going after fraud, waste, non functional programs, etc. He promises to cut spending on prescription drugs by using Medicare’s purchasing power and generic drugs to drive their costs down.

How do you square this circle?

www.nytimes.com/2009/08/06/health/policy/06insure.html

"Pressed by industry lobbyists, White House officials on Wednesday assured drug makers that the administration stood by a behind-the-scenes deal to block any Congressional effort to extract cost savings from them beyond an agreed-upon $80 billion."

Every analysis I've read claims that the deal with Pharma will cost more because it will increase the use of generics over brand drugs and after the patient through the donut hole there is no limit to the brand drugs that will be paid for by the taxpayer. And of course it still bans importation of cheaper brand drugs from abroad.

@David Walker

You claim that the President will cut the DoD budget. I'll believe that when announces a withdrawal from Afghanistan.

So, apart from the 500B in waste and fraud how exactly is the President going to fund Medicare in its current form?

Oh, I see what I did wrong now in my earlier reply. Let me try this again:

OMG!!!! Shipwreck, this is the greatest piece of literature ever written since Ian Fleming's Casino Royale!!! Of course, I dozed off halfway through reading the first post, but I skimmed the rest of it when I woke up and I was so proud that you included those scary buzz words, DRACONIAN and Oligarchy!!! You must have stayed up all night to write this!!!

KUDOS to you, my disabled friend!!! Only someone like you could paint the bleak, bleak outlook of a Oligarchial government where only the most DRACONIAN measures are proposed by one side!!!

I shall definitely sleep better knowing that a disabled Navy veteran like yourself is out there fighting the good fight against the comapnies and corporations that provide the income for hundreds of millions of Americans and people all across the globe!!! Keep it up and we can eliminate all of those evil American companies like Ford, Coca-Cola, Mattel, and Microsoft!!! Down with evil corporations!!!

THANK YOU once again for showing me the light!!! The sun shines much brighter on the days when you post on here!!! I will definitely up my donations to the VFW in your honor!!!

Somehow, with the way FR scrolls these days - awkwardly and slowly - I posted the below in #3 thread: It belongs here.

Navy wrote:

Many Social Programs will be phased out. Unemployment will increase as will the claims for UI, Food Stamps and Medicaid costing the government billions more and further reducing the revenues to both the State and Federal Governments at a time they need every dollar to keep many programs afloat. This will also have a negative effect on the continued growth of the economy. People this is not a plan that will solve our current problems. In fact it ignores them and just shifts money around from the middle class to other entities giving a false appearance of reducing the deficit/debt.

Navy, you put together an outstanding analysis and commentary.

Perhaps the key paragraph of your opinion portion is that above. You enumerated the ideological basis of the Ryan budget.

The right-wing extremists fear – and as public opinion trends now, the fear correctly – that the 112^th Congress gives them the best, and possibly last, chance to attack government departments and programs they have despised and assailed from the 1930’s forward. If they don’t get their way now, they will never again have the chance.

President Obama called them out on that, too. He said the Ryan budget targets only 12% of the Federal budget. That’s where the hatred of rigid right wing ideological purists is focused.

That focus gives the lie to the phony claims about the GOP budget vehicle. It isn’t about debt, as you so thoroughly documented – it’s about destruction.

Alan NJ - "square the circle?" Well, you implied that the White House secretly reassured pharma after the president's speech yesterday that he was lying. Opp, you liar yourself - from your link:

White House Affirms Deal on Drug Cost

By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK

Published: August 5, 2009

That referred to the negotiations before HCR passed -TWO years ago. This is a common trick used by propagandists to mislead the gullible. Alan, you have ZERO CREDIBILITY.

The President's proposal yesterday made reference to Medicare and medicaid. It also included perhaps the most sweeping change in medical care delivery since the Reagan Administration in the early '80's introduced reforms that are directly responsible for the skyrocketing costs of health care today. President Obama plans to undo those costly "reforms."

In fact the Ryan Bill will lower the current maximum tax rate from 35% down to 25% further reducing revenues.

There is so much absolute GARBAGE in your posts I don't have nearly the time to debunk all of it, so I'll focus on this one.

That statement is an outright distortion bordering on a deliberate lie. The facts are that Ryan proposes to lower tax rates (for EVERYONE, I might add) while at the same time eliminating loopholes. The whole concept (which was also suggested by the president's own debt commission) is to lower the tax rates and broaden the tax base in a way that is essentially revenue neutral. And this isn't some new crackpot idea, it's an old idea that has been supportedby both Dems and Republicans alike who are disgusted with the complexity of the U.S. tax code -- see Charlie Rangell.

But the leftist lemmings on the board gleefully ignore these inconvenient facts and jump on board this train to nowhere because they will use any lie or distortion at their disposal to demonize and discredit anyone who threatens their bogus class warfare narrative.

P.S. Did you copy and paste all that from ThinkProgress? One of these days, try crafting your own arguments to support your position. Then we might believe you can actually think for yourself instead of relying on your left wing icons to do your thinking for you.

What I find amazing is all the comments from the GOP/TPers on this blog about survival of the fittest. If you are old go ahead and die. These are the same people who burn books and protest the teaching of Darwin in our schools.

Ironic that many of them don't believe in evolution, but they do believe in the discredited pseudoscience of Social Darwinism.

@John A.-400474

Alan NJ - "square the circle?" Well, you implied that the White House secretly reassured pharma after the president's speech yesterday that he was lying. Opp, you liar yourself - from your link:

White House Affirms Deal on Drug Cost

By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK

Published: August 5, 2009

That referred to the negotiations before HCR passed -TWO years ago. This is a common trick used by propagandists to mislead the gullible. Alan, you have ZERO CREDIBILITY.

From the Huffington Post First Posted: 12/ 8/10 01:00 PM Updated: 02/ 7/11 05:12 AM which I believe is after HCR was passed. You make these comments although the link was valid in the context. Notice I don't resort to name calling because I would be lowering myself to your obnoxious level.

"A central part of the White House's strategy for passing health care reform was securing the support of the major industry stakeholders, a process that often frustrated congressional Democrats. In May 2009, White House officials met with six groups -- PhRMA, the American Hospital Association (AHA), America's Health Insurance Plans, American Medical Association, Advanced Medical Technology Association, and SEIU -- who promised to voluntarily come up with $2 trillion in savings. President Obama called the announcement a "watershed event."

PhRMA was key to the White House's efforts. The powerful trade group reportedly agreed to cut $80 billion in costs over the next 10 years and spend another $150 million on television commercials supporting reform -- and Democrats who supported reform."

www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/08/industry-health-care-deals-haunt-white-house_n_793041.html

Tell you what, I'll admit I'm wrong if you come up with a link that claims this story is untrue. Deal?

Amazing that Conservatives want us all to forget there was a President before Barack Obama because it's "old news" but they're willing to overlook what President Obama said YESTERDAY;

We will cut spending on prescription drugs by using Medicare's purchasing power to drive greater efficiency and speed generic brands of medicine onto the market.

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/04/13/6465318-president-obamas-deficit-speech

Alkan, you continue to attempt to use mid-information in relation to the President's proposals. As I wrote above, he's talking about finally fixing the horrible, costly gift that Bush gave big pharma when he refused to negotiate for MUCH lower drug prices under Medicare and Medicaid. That WILL result in a massive savings.

Your attempt to stick by the story that has NOTHING WHATSOEVER TO DO WITH THIS PART OF THE PRESIDENT'S PLAN is intentionally misleading propaganda. To make certain, i went back and read the entire piece you originally linked. NOTHING in that arrangement dealt with Medicare or Medicaid - instead, it was a pledge by the industry to give far better pricing to insured who will be covered by HCA.

I stand by my statement.

And this was the gift Obama gave big Pharma for their support on HCR. Notice the incentive to use brand name drugs over generics? And when they get past the donut hole the taxpayer picks up 100% of the brand-name drug cost. Also, their was an agreement that the ban on importation of drugs would remain.

www.naela.org/Public/About_NAELA/Public_or_Consumer/HCR_Timeline.aspx

"Gives Medicare beneficiaries who reach the Part D “donut hole” a 50 percent discount on brand-name prescriptions and a seven percent discount on generic prescriptions."

www.pharmacist.com/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Health_Care_Reform&Template=/CM/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=24782

"Closing the coverage gap
Meanwhile, patients who are in the Medicare Part D coverage gap described above and don’t qualify for the low-income Extra Help program will see a 50% discount on eligible brand-name drugs at POS, starting in 2011. Drug manufacturers will pay for the discount. This is the second step in closing the doughnut hole by 2020 (the first step was this year’s one-time, tax-free $250 rebate checks) under ACA’s Medicare Coverage Gap Discount Program.

In addition to the discount, the federal government will gradually subsidize to an increasing extent both brand-name and generic drugs for patients in the gap until the gap is closed. The subsidy for brand-name drugs will expand from 2.5% in 2013 to 25% by 2020; with the 50% discount, that means 75% of the cost of brand-name drugs in the gap will be covered by 2020. The subsidy for generic drugs will climb from 7% in 2011 to 75% by 2020."

Jody:

Nicely written. We have one party that wants to put the country first and look at the whole picture for cutting spending. The other wants to put Wall Street, Big Business and Millionaires & Billionaires first and only look at cutting spending on programs for the middle class and the lowest income people and using those spending cuts to give tax cuts to the top 2%.

Nicely said as alway, Jody. There were so many good passages in yesterday's speech it's hard to pick one, but this is one of my favorites;

"The fact is, their vision is less about reducing the deficit than it is about changing the basic social compact in America. As Ronald Reagan's own budget director said, there's nothing 'serious' or 'courageous' about this plan. There's nothing serious about a plan that claims to reduce the deficit by spending a trillion dollars on tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires. There's nothing courageous about asking for sacrifice from those who can least afford it and don't have any clout on Capitol Hill. And this is not a vision of the America I know.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,2065109,00.html#ixzz1JVBFPZWL

Thanks. Didn't get to watch the speech in total but printed it and agree, it's hard to pick a favorite part.

Jody, a wonderful post. Truly wonderful post.

Jody, yours was an excellently written post.

OUTSTANDING Job.

Congrats!!

Navy wrote:

Many Social Programs will be phased out. Unemployment will increase as will the claims for UI, Food Stamps and Medicaid costing the government billions more and further reducing the revenues to both the State and Federal Governments at a time they need every dollar to keep many programs afloat. This will also have a negative effect on the continued growth of the economy. People this is not a plan that will solve our current problems. In fact it ignores them and just shifts money around from the middle class to other entities giving a false appearance of reducing the deficit/debt.

Navy, you put together an outstanding analysis and commentary.

Perhaps the key paragraph of your opinion portion is that above. You enumerated the ideological basis of the Ryan budget.

The right-wing extremists fear – and as public opinion trends now, the fear correctly – that the 112^th Congress gives them the best, and possibly last, chance to attack government departments and programs they have despised and assailed from the 1930’s forward. If they don’t get their way now, they will never again have the chance.

President Obama called them out on that, too. He said the Ryan budget targets only 12% of the Federal budget. That’s where the hatred of rigid right wing ideological purists is focused.

That focus gives the lie to the phony claims about the GOP budget vehicle. It isn’t about debt, as you so thoroughly documented – it’s about destruction.

Jody, Iowa

Thanks. Didn't get to watch the speech in total but printed it and agree, it's hard to pick a favorite part

As usual you alway bring plain common sense into view.

Jody you watch the speech here..

http://www.whitehouse.gov/photos-and-video/video/2011/04/13/country-we-believe-improving-america-s-fiscal-future

It is difficult to choose a favorite. They were all excellent points well worth pointing out Republican lies and amoral ideology.

I'm going to refer to them as a FACT SHEET!!!

Query - John A.

As you point out non discretionary funding accounts for only 12% of the federal budget. I agree the GOP tends to pontificate that cutting this portion of the budget would be a cure all. This is what the GOP tout to their base to show how they are fighting evil government waste. In truth, however Ryan's budget proposal gets the bulk of savings/cuts by transforming medicare into a yearly voucher limit. He also places more of a strain on the states to handle medicaid to lower the federal expenditures there.

While I agree with your general premise about the Ryan cuts and their idealogical bent, how does Obama get his savings/cuts?

_______

per the AP - Obama cuts

Of $4 trillion in cuts, Obama said $2 trillion should come from spending, $1 trillion from overhauling the tax system to eliminate some tax breaks and loopholes, and the rest recouped from lower interest payments on the national debt

Obama also wants to allow Bush-era tax cuts to expire for individuals making $200,000 or more a year and couples making $250,000 or more. The revenue that would generate is not counted in his $4 trillion in deficit reduction.

Administration officials said military spending would be reduced by $400 billion through 2023, domestic programs would absorb $770 billion in cuts and mandatory programs such as agricultural subsidies another $360 billion.

An additional $480 billion would be saved from Medicare, which provides health care principally to 33 million seniors, and from Medicaid, a state-federal program that covers lower-income families and is ticketed for a huge expansion under the health care program Obama signed into law last year.

________

I for one am interested to note if his military budget will include his proposed withdrawl from Iraq, Afganistan. Will the decreasing subsidies include oil company subsidies. How will the reduction of medicaid federal funding affect HCR?

Just an outline, but if this is his idea of a balanced first negotiation proposal, I shudder to think what the final outcome will be. I don't think forming another committee is a good use of time going into the last few months of the current debt ceiling expiration date.

Yellowdog, always glad to participate in a serious discussion.

What almost everyone has missed from the President's proposals yesterday was his brief line about cutting health care costs - not cutting the Medicare or Medicaid programs, but the costs of delivering health care. His proposals promise to be the most important and long-lasting of everything brought up in his speech.

His basic idea is to change the WAY that medical services are reinbursed. Medicare reinbursement is the pony that pulls the cart - it literally dictates to the private insurance industry, which will follow suit. And it literally dictates the business practices of the health care providers. So a significant change in Medicare reimbursement can, and has, literally restructed the entire medical industry, from providers of supplies and high-end diagnostic systems to nurses and doctors.

What the President softly proposed, and is such a huge matter, is unrolling the Reagan-era "reforms" that turned the entire medical system into a ferociously for-profit industry with ballooning prices. Those "reforms" ultimately drove more than a thousand U.S. hospitals, most of them serving rural areas as non-profit medical providers, out of business. Most importantly, those "reforms" meant that EVERY step of anything done by a medical supplier was its own individual profit center.

In functional terms, every bandage or aspirin given out had its own profit margin markup - as well as its own accounting and record-keeping entry, which were also specific profit-making services. The massive additional costs in medical record-keeping, billing and accouonting adds a vast non-productive sector of cost to health care.

The President's vague reference yesterday indicated a change to a results-driven reimbursement system. That's a chat for another day, but it would also eliminate the massive overburden of administrative expenses in health care and the even greater multiplications of profit in the current system. it would make medical service delivery far less sensitive to any changes within its closed marketplace as well as to normal fluctuations in the economy, inflation, and labor supply.

rRght now, if some nurses decide to move to another town, the place they leave will suddenly have to jack up bonuses and wages in order to attract replacements - and that goes straight onto the ledger with relative percanteges of profits getting higher, too.

Now, I am by no means opposed to our medical providers making decent money, and nurses are in desperately short supply nationwide. It's the multiplier effect of the current reinbursement system that makes the costs so bad and jacks up rates well beyond the national rate of inflation.

THAT's where the President's proposal will gather a huge amount of savings. It should have been included in HCR but wasn't - well, you pick your place and time for each battle, and this reform will turn into one big catfight, guaranteed.

As for the committee, that's one approach. I wrote above that the President this time might be much better served by tasking each Cabinet member with developing relevant legislation tied to the departments, and then taking it to the Hill as FDR learned to do with success in the 1930's.

Jody, as always, MOST EXCELLENT!

Did you happen to catch Joe Scarborough this morning? I though his head was going to explode. He was outraged that President Obama insulted Paul Ryan. For the first time in my history of hate-hate with that show I found myself CHEERING for Mika and her comment that Republicans have been whispering invectives against the President for years now - at least President Obama made his comments to Paul Ryan's face!

Hell yes he did. And this President is RIGHT! There is nothing courageous about asking the unmonied MANY to continue to re-distribute wealth to those who CAN and SHOULD be paying more. The folly that was 2001-2008 is OVER. Return the rates to a sustainable level, end the wars and SHARE the sacrifice.

Of course, we all know that this crew of misfits are ideologically intertwined with the philosophy that profits are to be privatized BUT losses are to be socialized. I am pretty sure Trump learned that at the Wharton School of Business,...and it has trickled down ever since!

John A - I assume you are speaking about Medicare part A (hospital insurance costs and prices) regarding the possible areas to bring costs down and not Part B and C which deal more with private insurance for medicare A participants.

I will be interested to see how any plan will bring down those costs by merely having newly suggested treatments that may test and or price better.

For all of you who thought it was a great speech or not a great speech, just remember it was just a speech. Until he actually puts the legislation through or even put his plan on paper as he said, it is just empty words.

On another note conservatives will like this, liberals will not. Did you see the view yesterday, when Elisabeth Hasselbeck shut Joy Behar up, made her speechless. It was classic. lol And hasselbeck was absolutely correct.

John B:

Touche' and I agree. President Obama still appears to be the only adult in the room. Our President laid out the blueprint and now both parties need to get their act together and put on the table some meaningful spending cuts and revenue creating programs, like infrastructure jobs, etc.

Should really be interesting between now and the June deadline the President wants.

Navy

An excellent analysis of the two proposals on the table.

Congressman Ryan wants to "privatize" Medicare and Medicaid. I have considerable personal experience with the "privatization" of Government services and would offer this cautionary tale.

A decade ago our last GOP Governor decided to privatize Highway maintenance in this state. So let it be written so let it be done, Pharoah has spoken.

We dismantled our Maintenance operations in all 77 counties. We retired those folks who could retire and moved the rest into construction over-sight jobs. A private company took over all the maintenance of all State and Federal highways. Now this was the low bidder, remember. And, we got what we paid for, which was NOTHING.

Within six months the public was howling over the conditions of the roads here in Oklahoma. Potholes proliferated and trash piled up on the side of the road. During the first ice storm of the season they misapplied the de-icer to a section of road in Tulsa County and it actually made the highway SLICKER and caused dozens of accidents. Luckily no one was killed.

We attempted to cancel the contract and ended up in a lawsuit that cost the state over a million dollars in legal fees and settlement costs. So much for the savings of privatization. But that wasn't the end of it. We'd dismantled our maintenance program and moved the manpower elsewhere. So now we were faced with the costs of rebuilding what we had lost.

Thanks guv. Quite a savings to the tax payers.

Ryan's plan is far more insidious because it will negatively impact the health and welfare of those Americans most at risk. Like our private sector maintenance program it will be a disaster.

Bait and Switch. That's an excellent assessment of Ryan's plan.

Terrific post, John B. I agree, President Obama pointed out the outrageousness of the Ryan/GOPTP plan; it was an extraordinary speech. John Kyl's comment explaining his remarks on the Senate Floor was an inadvertent admission that the GOPTP plays fast and loose with facts.

Amy:

Very true. Our President told both the democrats and the republicans what he would not accept and then threw everything else on the table for discussion. He basically left the door open for any and all ideas except the few he put off limits.

Lets see what they do now, he gave them the ball now they have to score.

Well said, Amy. The GOP refuses to even acknowledge it was their policies which took a surplus and turned it into a massive debt--instead they blame President Obama and democrats. Of course, starving the beast is their policy and their primary goal, so that is no surprise.

Amy - glad to see you brought up the point of "bipartisanship".

I remember when those in Washington who came across the aisle to actually solve problems were the ones who received all of the attention. They were considered successful. Certainly our country was better because of their efforts.

Today, anyone who crosses the aisle is somehow a traitor. Those who "stand up to the other side" receive all the attention. We accomplish NOTHING.

The current climate = PARTY before COUNTRY

Our President seems to be the only one who understands this MUST change. Until it does none of the "peoples" work with be done. (And yet our President continues to walk the talk.)

We can talk adnauseum about everything that should change - taxes, programs, budgets, bailouts, blah blah blah.

Until the attitude between both parties changes....we are not represented.

Until the aisle becomes a blur, instead of the electrified fence it has become, we are not represented.

Bill,

Good morning.

The jig is up. Americans are looking at the results of Republican economic policy and they no likey.

Republicans don't have a plan. You all are selling pipe dreams and ad space.

Time is running out for capitalist fairy tales. Reality is catching up.

Bill, Fairfax, VA:

"We have to live within our means, reduce our deficit and get back on a path that will allow us to pay down our debt."

The president said that yesterday. What a complete and total joke.

Just looked again at the Obama 2012 Budget. Version 1.0 is still there. Wasn't Obama going to come out with Version 2.0, you know the budget to rival Rep. Paul Ryan's plan? Apparently not. Instead we get this manifesto of a speech where Obama swears his allegiance to his socialist roots. Not much "Change You Can Believe In" with that speech.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/tax-cuts-for-the-rich-on-the-backs-of-the-middle-class-or-paul-ryan-has-balls-20110407

Bill I do believe that this gentleman has summarized your vaunted Republican leader a whole lot better than I ever could

Thanks for the link IR . . . good to see you this fine morning!

Bill, Republicans would have greater credibility on the issue of cutting government spending if Cantor (R) and Boehner (R) hadn't recently voted to keep funding a $487 million dollar alternative engine the Air Force empahtically didn't want or need, just because it was built in their districts. The pork Ted Stevens (R) brought home to Alaska is legendary. The President is providing cover for Representatives of both Parties to cut the pork, but the Republicans are choosing politics over getting it done.

You to Nash A day without a visit to Nashville is a day without sunshine on the Hill

No Amy, you're wrong. What Boehner and Cantor did was vote for the second engine, which is their prerogative as congressmen -- and some might argue, their duty in preserving jobs for their constituents.

But that's small ball, the real story in this espisode was that Speaker Boehner (unlike Nancy) opened the floor to all manner of amendments and gave every congressman a chance to advance ideas important to them. One of those ideas was killing the second engine for the F-35 and we all know the result.

I would also point out that beyond "pork" there are many serious analysts who view having a second source for the engine as desirable since it promotes competition that could potentially save dollars in the long run. The Pentagon's positition has been that the actual upfront costs of maintaining the second production line outweighs the potential for savings down the road. So comparing all this to "pork" is really a superficial take on what is actually a more complicated issue.

The notion that Paul Ryan's approach gives tax breaks to the rich is an outrageous distortion at best and an outright lie at worst. From Ryan's plan:

"The current code for individuals is too complicated, with high marginal rates that discourage growth. This budget embraces the widely acknowledged principles of pro-growth tax reform by proposing to consolidate tax brackets and lower tax rates, with a top rate of 25 percent, while clearing out the burdensome tangle of loopholes that distort economic activity."

Did you catch that sports fans? Lower tax rates AND elimination of loopholes. It's called broadening the tax base. For the left to argue that this equates to giving a tax break to the rich is absolute nonsense. Ryan also reduces tax rates at the lower end of the scale. But of course, the left never bothers to mention that.

Bill, you are one smooth operator. The President's Stimulus spending to preserve jobs was outrageous, according to the Right, but Boehner and Cantor's support for pork in their districts was admirable, almost frugal, in that every defense project should have competition in the hopes it will drive down prices.

And you have the nerve to say to Obama "have you no shame?"

Bill got to give you credit for persistence . However as the President mentioned yesterday even David Stockman ( of whom Ryan is just one of the disciples) has repudiated this approach to economics as unworkable and you know it and choose to ignore it

IR -- David Stockman went off the Republican reservation a long time ago and his credibility these days ranks somewhere around that of Paul Krugman.

Amy -- I'm sorry you couldn't grasp my comment.

Others -- from Ryan's plan:

"A pro-growth tax system should be simple, efficient and fair. The U.S. tax code fails on all three counts.

The system is notoriously complex, as individuals, families and employers spend over six billion hours and over $160 billion per year trying to negotiate a labyrinth of deductions and credits, a tangle of different rules for characterizing income, and a variety of schedules for taxing that income. Simply put, the code is too costly and too burdensome.

The code is also patently unfair, as many of the deductions and preferences in the system – which serve to narrow the tax base – are mainly used by a relatively small class of mostly higher-income individuals. Washington should not be in the business of picking winners and losers.

Finally, the U.S. tax structure is highly inefficient, as tax considerations rather than economic fundamentals often distort individual decisions to work, save, and invest, which leads to a misallocation of resources and slower economic growth.

This budget attacks all three of these problems with a set of fundamental reforms drawn from a broad consensus of economic experts and based on the principle that government should never take a dollar from one of its citizens unless that dollar is needed for an absolutely vital national purpose.

It draws on the commonly held view that the key to pro-growth tax reform is lowering tax rates while broadening the tax base – that is, letting individuals keep more of the money they earn, while getting rid of distortions, loopholes and preferences that divert economic resources from their most efficient uses.

The recommendations of the President's Fiscal Commission were clear on this point: lower tax rates are critical to economic growth. The Commission's proposal offered a growth-oriented, simplified code, with individual tax brackets as low as 8 percent, 14 percent and 23 percent – and reduced the corporate tax rate to as low as 26 percent. This budget builds upon the clear bipartisan consensus that lower rates and a broader base are key guideposts for pro-growth tax reform.

In addition, this budget starts, not by asking what is the "right mix" of tax increases and spending cuts to balance the budget, but by asking what is the purpose of government, and then raising only as much revenue as the federal government needs to efficiently fund those missions that rightly belong in its domain, while maximizing economic growth and job creation."

Anyone on the left care to have an intelligent discission on these proposeals? Or would you prefer to stick to your distorted, knee-jerk nonsense?

Bill I'm not particularly as left as all that but in answer to your question as to who wants to have a rational discussion about proposals to solve some problems with the economy you need to go back and find a rational proposal to start the discussion with rather than Mr. Ryan's. His proposal is neither rational and is more than a little bit reality challenged. Find you one that bears some semblance to the possible and probable and bring it on back and we'll kick it around all day and have a good time in the endeavor.

See my comment on your thread. YOU may want to start with some rational criticism of the Ryan plan rather than regurgitating deliberately distorted nonsense.

Well IR, you tried. You'd think the fact that it relies on a truly amazing growth rate, unemployment about half what Economists consider the normal full employment rate, and government expenditures magically reduced to the same level as 90 years ago would be enough to take the Ryan plan out of the realm of serious discussion, but apparently not.

It's Voodoo Economics with a sprinkling of Pixie Dust to make it work.

Bill Fairfax,VA

Regarding the debt commission recommendations concerning tax reform reducing rates and eliminating loopholes; would you agree to tax capital gains at those rates 8%, 15% 26 etc?

Yes I did John B. I keep hoping that old Bill is going to get over getting all testy when you remind him of that Pixie Dust is bad for him and he ought to lay off it a little before he OD's. You can't discuss the irrational with somebody that can't see irationality for what it is.

You can't lay it out much more clearly than that, can you Nash?

You really can't John B . . . and I've tried! :oP

Seems to me the English used to say the same thing of the Lord of the Manor. The whole village was proud of him and his impressive estate...as they lived in homes he owned and worked at jobs that could only be obtained from him, because the aristocracies of Old Europe made sure that all wealth was concentrated at the top.

the services that those who need them should be provided by churches and charity organizations. You live in the Bible belt are you contributing/volunteering, donating?

Dear dontgivemethepenguin:

Newsflash:

The government is funded with MY money. These aholes are bailed out with my money. Their subsidies that they don't need are paid for with my money. The no bid contracts that get after they vote to "privitize" everything come from my money.

The government providing services that we need is what we SHOULD be paying for . . . that is not charity, mmmmmmkay?

Ya'll ain't doing nobody no favors. Why do we need 600 folks in Congress? To make sure rich folks never have to pay their taxes? Somehow I don't think that is what the founding fathers had in mind.

Nash,

Amen to that.

dontgivemethepenguin

the services that those who need them should be provided by churches and charity organizations. You live in the Bible belt are you contributing/volunteering, donating?

Which charities inspect the food in the supermarket to ensure it's not contaminated? Which charities inspect roads, bridges, buildings, and airplanes to ensure they're safe? I depend on the government for those benefits. Seeing as how you are a far right conservative, I suppose that you don't depend on any charities or on Big Bad Government for those services. I'm always impressed by multitalented people who can perform all those services for themselves. I just don't know where they find the time to become experts in food science, civil engineering, medicine, and all the other disciplines that useless government employees get paid their lavish wages for.

From this morning's Morning Joe-ke:

Harold Ford:

Is it not also fair to say to those earning over 1million dollars or 2 million dollars or more you are going to have to pay a little more in taxes, we’re going to lower maybe the corporate rate, and keep your investment rates at a certain level, but its only fair if we are asking middle class and lower class Americans to pay a little more in taxes, to give up a little Medicare and Social Security, to pay our debt, is that not fair?

Gov. McDonnell:

I don’t think the question is what’s fair, its what’s good economic policy. I think from Kennedy to Reagan to what Chris Christie and I and other governors are doing, you raise taxes, you are going to get less economic development and less jobs, and that’s why I don’t support it.

You got that America?

If the rich folks have to pay a cent more than the lowest tax rate they have paid in over 50 years, there will be no jobs!

Pay no attention to the fact that they have had these same tax cuts for damn near a decade and there are NO JOBS! Who are you gonna believe, them or your lying eyes?

You just can't make this kind of crap up . . . truth is stranger than fiction.

lets just go to a flat rate say 12% across the board, seems fair to me, no deductions, no write offs, no exclusions

It is unfortunate that you do not know basic economics. First, the US borrows money - when they do - they must pay interest. As the debt grows, so does the interest. We pay $40B a month in interest. When the government borrows - there is not money for business to borrow (or higher rates) as well as home owners. That limits business growth which means companies are not going to hire. Second, higher taxes mean the rich will pay their accountants and attorneys more to hide the money. You may not care that over 50% of the taxpayers do not pay any taxes while the rich pay. Third, when tax rates go high, alternative locations are found. Read the paper - people leaving New York due to taxes. Companies moving oversees because the tax rate is less (ever read about GE?). Some one has to pay for the benefits that are paid out. Get the debt down and the tax rate right and jobs will follow. This is exactly what JFK, Reagan and others have done. Fourth, the total tax revenue received by the US is $1.8 Trillion. That does not even come close to the nearly $4 trillion Obama generated nor the total of the debt. How high can we tax people? Do you like paying more property taxes, phone taxes, gas taxes? This is a real problem that needs to be dealt with in adult terms. Not one person is threatening killing, starving or caring less for people. However, there is only so much money. In Illinois, they have now dictated that the prevailing wage must be followed for the federal weatherization program. That means that window installers who are currently being paid $15 per hour must pay the union scale of $60 per hour. This means work for unions, but fewer people can be helped as more is paid for the prevailing wage. It is easy to repeat talking points, but take some time to read and think for yourself. Both parties need to stop the rhetoric and get to work! If not, it doesn't matter if we scale back on the budget, the government will be broke and no one will have Medicare, Social Security and et al. Obama offered nothing but talk yesterday. He has not led this discussion nor has he brought anything to the table. Biden will be point man? Obama said this before and Biden went out of town. Obama needs to get serious and the republicans need to get serious as well. Finally, while the tax rate is lower for the rich, they have paid taxes on the money they earned. There are also more taxes today than in 50 years that have been paid as well. I would challenge anyone to show that the percentage of taxes paid by the rich to their income has fallen. Obama has now said that couples making $250K a year are rich. How then does one move up economically? If you work hard, you know have to pay more taxes. Anyone know how one will become rich in the future? Please think!

Dear Readbetweenthelines:

You are not the first person in the 3+ years that I have been commenting at First Read to try to "explain" away reality with a whole bunch of business talk gobbledygook.

Let me 'splain it to you: The economic policy that the Republican party is peddling don't work.

You talk about the interest on the debt, but you conveniently forget that we are charging much of that money to pay for UNFUNDED TAX CUTS for folks who got rich by BILKING the American people!

Hello?

Is this thing on?

Please, please, please do not EVER tell me to THINK when you are advocating the same corporate smoke and mirrors approach - give rich people whatever they want and pray like hell that one day you can be one of them.

We have debt because faux "conservatives" keep having a money party and passing us the bill when their ponsy schemes collapse.

Period.

The invisible hand just keeps slapping us and ya'll pretend you don't feel it.

I call bullsh!t.

who got rich by BILKING the American people!

Who are we talking about here? A plumber who owns a small business and employs 4 or 5 people. I guy who run a bakery or bagel store? If you're talking about the guys selling CDO's and derivatives that is a minutely small number of people. But the plans that you keep proposing would hurt many more than that exclusive bunch. If you don't believe me go look at what is happening in San Francisco. There the pension costs are now equivalent to the operating costs. Is this a right wing conspiracy? Are they cutting taxes for the rich? No, but they are still running out of money.

President Obama made a very nice and compassionate speech yesterday but it contained nothing on how to fund Medicare in its present form as the Baby Boomers retire. Even he said "they will live longer and medical treatment will cost more". So you have three drivers that will raise costs, more people who live longer that demand treatment that costs more. You honestly think this can be funded by savings in waste and fraud, and a yet to be developed efficient delivery model? At least when HCR was being debated I was honest in a call for "Death Panels" because some form of rationing is inevitable.

What did the President tell you yesterday? That medicare did not have to change and could be funded. I don't think so, and you can try a tax your way out of it but that won't work either. Even single-payer systems like Canada, UK, Germany do not have a solution, apart from rationing, to an aging population.

"Unfunded Tax Cuts!" Are you nuts - the money is ours - not the govt's. The money is not the govt's to give back to us as it sees fit. It is our money and we fund the govt and it is the House, Senate and Presidents job not to spend more than we give them.

It's an accurate term, and much less clumsy than the equally accurate "we gave a bunch of tax breaks to rich people and for political reasons didn't feel obligated to tell people it was going to increase the deficits and it would have been bad for our chances at reelection to be honest with them to admit that services would have to be cancelled to balance them out."

I just read readbetweenthelines post (or should I say little economics lecture?) and can definitely say that this person has absolutely no clue as to how economics works. Everything he said can be traced back to a right wing talking point. While some of the items, taken individually and out of the context of his post, are true, the way they were strung together and the overwhelming amount of economic factors that were not included makes his post extremely disingenuous.

Reagan cut taxes and shrunk government? Yes, Reagan cut taxes . . . once . . . in 1981. Beginning in 1982 and continuing until 1987, he raised taxes 11 times. The shrinking government statement about Reagan is just an outright lie. The government grew at a 2.5% rate average each year during his presidency.

So, readbetweenthelines, are you a paid troll or just so uninformed that you have to rely upon Republican/TP Inc. talking points?

Sorry, I don't think there's anything about the desirability of bipartisanship that should require us to accept lies as truth. A massive transfer of wealth to the top of the economic pyramid is what it is.

"Worst of all, this is a vision that says even though America can't afford to invest in education or clean energy; even though we can't afford to care for seniors and poor children, we can somehow afford more than $1 trillion in new tax breaks for the wealthy. Think about it. In the last decade, the average income of the bottom 90% of all working Americans actually declined. The top 1% saw their income rise by an average of more than a quarter of a million dollars each. And that's who needs to pay less taxes? They want to give people like me a two hundred thousand dollar tax cut that's paid for by asking thirty three seniors to each pay six thousand dollars more in health costs? That's not right, and it's not going to happen as long as I'm President.

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/04/13/6465318-president-obamas-deficit-speech

Actually,

Bob is not worth her time. He is like a an broken record that is stuck on the same old worn out ideas.

will it be the rich have been well taken care of or that they were industrious, smart, worked hard, invested wisely their money and earned their status. As far as your health, get out and exercise. Americans are fat and lazy.

dont give me---That's right. If you haven't made it to be a C.E.O. by the time you retire, you are sooo! lazy! Let's bow our heads and pray for the good health and wealth of America's very rich.

dontgivemethepenguin

will it be the rich have been well taken care of or that they were industrious, smart, worked hard, invested wisely their money and earned their status.

No, it will be more like they sat on their big fat butts and gamed the system, like Goldman Sachs CEOs did by conning investors into mortgage-backed securities they had already told their managers to short because they knew were going to tank. Or like the CEO of the Massey Coal Company that cheated on mine safety to make more profit, resulting in the deaths of over 20 miners in his non-union mines. Not all wealthy people are like that, just the ones who finance the Republican Party in order to so they can make more money without those burdensome government regulations that protect the public.

While I don't think middle class should be taxed more, I also don't think it is the responsibility of the wealthy to take care of anyone else. The whole system is a mess, our politicians are looking out for themselves, Big business is as corrupt as it has ever been, people in general have this attitude someone owes them something and they should be paid more than the job is worth and yes many many have become lazy there seems to be a big lack of personal responsibility. I think both sides are playing a game and it is with us, it's sad. I work 2 jobs and I would not be in the situation I'm in had I have been more responsible with my money earlier on....so while the Govt, big biz, the wealthy contribute to many of our issues...look at yourself first I have to and I'm my own worst enemy.

?

That's just Joe being Joe. We love our Uncle Joe.

When you look at what you write here Joanna, ask yourself: "What value am I bringing to this board?"

I see zero. You demean everyone who doesn't immediately agree with your. You demand that people defend wonkish policy proposals, and never defend the ham-fisted GOP proposals. You never show any vision, offer any solutions, or attempt to comprimise.

Your patronizing, condescending, attitude does not sway anyone to your side. I bet, in fact, i turns indies off.....

We understand you hate the President. I get it. Why don't you just post once on each board "I hate Obama!!!" and let everyone else carry on a real conversation.

You grate my cheese. I listen to conservatives that offer substance. Unfortunately you do not fit that category.

Patrick Salt Lake City

?

______________________________________________________________________________________

It was a joke, and unlike the rest of the humor here today, apparently intentional...

Replace Biden with a Bachmann, and then you'll probably lose your ?...

As for me, It's a great day to play 2 at CitiField...have fun lecturing each other, after all, you're TOTALLY right and they're TOTALLY wrong...:)

Ted, Mid Michigan: When you look at what you write here Joanna, ask yourself: "What value am I bringing to this board?"

Ted - Glad to see you here today, I hope all is well with you. Looking forward to many in-depth discussions from you on the events of the day.

Joanna, I'm serious. I look for ideas from your side that my side may have overlooked, or rejected too quickly. I found a good one today a few threads back. Bob (numbers) wants people on public assistance to be required to fill community service needs in trade for public dole funds. I like it, I'm taking my support for the ideas to my Reps. I think it's a fair idea.

My greater point here is compromise. not just sh!t slinging by either side. (not that my hands are entirely clean, mind you....)

You're on here so much, I just wish you used that investment in time to push your ideas instead of simply sh!tting on everyone elses.

Best wishes, I hope your doing fine as well.....

Actually, most independents, like me, you know, the individuals that decide elections, don't care about any of these issues. They care about jobs and the economy, which the republicans have completely ignored with their draconian radical extreme agenda that has nothing to do with governing, jobs or the economy.

I'm an independent and I DO care about those issues RV mentioned as well as the economy and jobs. I'm sick of both sides, I'm tired of hearing the back and forth, I'm tired of all of it.

Babina - you may be registered as an independent but you are a liberal and don't let anyone convince you otherwise.

The tax cuts worked great from 2003 to 2007 when Reid and Piglosi took over the House and Senate and drove the economy off the cliff.

No, deficits increased beginning with GW Bush's very first budget and even before the Bush Recession it was the slowest growth in jobs for any recovery since WWII. Republican, supply-side ideology is a failure.

I see this is up twice in 10 minutes. The Right has their new shiny object. Everyone please concentrate on Joe Biden and ignore the content of the President's comments.

"The America I know is generous and compassionate; a land of opportunity and optimism. We take responsibility for ourselves and each other; for the country we want and the future we share. We are the nation that built a railroad across a continent and brought light to communities shrouded in darkness. We sent a generation to college on the GI bill and saved millions of seniors from poverty with Social Security and Medicare. We have led the world in scientific research and technological breakthroughs that have transformed millions of lives.

"This is who we are. This is the America I know. We don't have to choose between a future of spiraling debt and one where we forfeit investments in our people and our country. To meet our fiscal challenge, we will need to make reforms. We will all need to make sacrifices. But we do not have to sacrifice the America we believe in. And as long as I'm President, we won't.

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/04/13/6465318-president-obamas-deficit-speech

Thanks John, You make my point--The speach was Dumb!

The speech was some of the biggest garbage to come out of 0blamers mouth since he came on the scene. This guy has no clue as to what he is going to do. 90% of the Ryan proposals critics haven't even bothered to read his plan - including 0bummer. Blaming Bush doesn't work anymore. 0bozo wins 13 states plus DC and goes home to take Jimmy Carter's place as the worst POTUS ever.

Biden sleeping was more intelligent than anything coming out of 0bummers mouth.

Houston--The classic Demo BS --It is an easy sell---Make the Minority look bad and raise taxes---Problem with you folks --You don't really notice that the truly rich own the process and don't pay takes---Did you happen to see Jeffery E with his arm around Your guy ? No you are too busy with the BS line to notice it is a shell game, large Corps and really rich people like Sorros and all the really rich Rep.are no different--they own the process and while the rest of us are working our butts off to scratch out a living we soon find that the Gov has printed piles of money and now min wage qualifies as rich. If this process continues any longer giving a large part of the population rewards for not working and giving a pass to the top pretending like we will ever see revenue. It is a process designed to fail and the failing point is near.

Well, this guy is certainly doing his best to game the rest of us.

David Koch joked about his good fortune in a 2003 speech to alumni at Deerfield, where, after pledging twenty-five million dollars, he was made the school’s sole “lifetime trustee.” He said, “You might ask: How does David Koch happen to have the wealth to be so generous? Well, let me tell you a story. It all started when I was a little boy. One day, my father gave me an apple. I soon sold it for five dollars and bought two apples and sold them for ten. Then I bought four apples and sold them for twenty. Well, this went on day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year, until my father died and left me three hundred million dollars!”

Read more http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/08/30/100830fa_fact_mayer#ixzz1JVcr36o9

What a Joke-383488, I take it from you're rambling tirade that you are in favor of extending Bush's tax cuts for the rich. OK. But you're in the minority. That's a fact, not BS.

John, speaking of the Koch boys, the fortune of rightwing boogie man George Soros is pocket change compared to the obscene wealth they've amassed.

Wasn't that a campaign promise in 2008 that he regneged on when he allowed an extension of those same cuts? Do you really believe he's serious now? The man talks the talk but does not have the courage to fight for what he believes in. Sometimes bipartisanship is NOT the answer. Sometimes you have to have the courage to stand your ground and fight. This President is not willing to fight.

Ira Lapin

The man talks the talk but does not have the courage to fight for what he believes in.

Sure, that's why he pushed through the Affordable Care Act even though he knew he was going to take a beating from the Republicans and the media for it. That's why he got the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act signed into law. That's why he's delivered on nearly every campaign promise that didn't involve getting past Republican obstructionists. His promises to increase government transparency is the main area where I think he's fallen badly short because that is something that doesn't involve Congress.

Universal Healthcare is not even close to what he promised. No single payer system cause he didn't fight for it. Anthony Weiner did. Where was Obama? Promised to end the Bush tax cuts and they were renewed. Close Gitomo, still there. There are many more examples. Obama stays above the fray until it's too late. You can't blame everything on "Republican Obstructionists" He may be the smartest guy in the room but not the ballsiest. He needs to fight and explain and define his plan to the American people and not let the Republicans do it for him.

0bummer is the least qualified person in any room he walks into. Those who think he is intelligent are his useful idiots.

bb3

Apparently you're brand of intelligence is FAR superior?

Very true Bongoman, for Conservatives this has very little to do with cutting the deficit. After all, they CREATED the deficit in order to make an excuse for dismantling the social safety net.

"The fact is, their vision is less about reducing the deficit than it is about changing the basic social compact in America. As Ronald Reagan's own budget director said, there's nothing 'serious' or 'courageous' about this plan. There's nothing serious about a plan that claims to reduce the deficit by spending a trillion dollars on tax cuts for millionaires and billionaires. There's nothing courageous about asking for sacrifice from those who can least afford it and don't have any clout on Capitol Hill. And this is not a vision of the America I know.

"The America I know is generous and compassionate; a land of opportunity and optimism. We take responsibility for ourselves and each other; for the country we want and the future we share. We are the nation that built a railroad across a continent and brought light to communities shrouded in darkness. We sent a generation to college on the GI bill and saved millions of seniors from poverty with Social Security and Medicare. We have led the world in scientific research and technological breakthroughs that have transformed millions of lives.

"This is who we are. This is the America I know. We don't have to choose between a future of spiraling debt and one where we forfeit investments in our people and our country. To meet our fiscal challenge, we will need to make reforms. We will all need to make sacrifices. But we do not have to sacrifice the America we believe in. And as long as I'm President, we won't.

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/04/13/6465318-president-obamas-deficit-speech

Really SD? Is the President planning to nationalize industry? Is he trying to institute centralized planning of the economy? Is there some plan for dictatorship of the proletariat of which I am not aware? When will I be assigned to a workers collective?

Sorry, your well-worn meme of Communism, Socialism, and Marxism is well past its sell by date.

What kool-aid you been drinking? 0bummer claims to have a plan to reduce the deficit by $4 trillion in 12 years. No one has seen that plan - or will they ever - because it doesn't exist. Jan 20, 2013 - "The End of an Error"

bb3

I hope this isn't a suicide note. You're not a danger to yourself, too, are you?

What is really upsetting to the GOP is that Obama actually has a plan to reduce the debt, along with the closest thing to a balanced budget requirement the Federal Government ever had. If what is proposed does not go far enough in reducing the debt, then stops would kick in then more mandatory cuts would happen. That is the first real sensible thing proposed in years.

pj all Obama has are words until his plan is on paper for all to see all anyone hears are just words. I would like to see his plan on paper like Congressman Ryan then comparisions can be made. Judging from his past performances I would almost say that what he puts on paper will be nothing compared to what he spoke of. I would really like to be proven wrong but he is a politician running for reelection so I won't hold my breath. BTW Since everyone is so enamored with him and he is such a sure lock for reelection maybe all the money he raises he should donate to the debt/deficit and just talk about his accomplishments, that would be a first for anyone.

0blamer doesn't have a plan and never will. You will never see it. You used to be able to say that 0blamer gives a good speech. The one on Wed. was not even a good speech. It was pathetic.

louisj I would be real careful about how close behind him you stand, something comes up that he doesn't want to deal with, he'll move out of the way and leave you holding the bag. lol