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This afternoon's White House press briefing was dominated by questions about the letter President Obama sent to House Speaker John Boehner (R-OH), Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV), Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-KY) and Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-CA), calling on them to pass legislation to eliminate more than $4 billion a year in tax breaks for oil-and-gas companies.
The move to end what the White House calls "wasteful subsidies" was portrayed as a way to both address the deficit and to reduce American consumers' susceptibility to oil-price shocks in the future.
It is hard to argue that given where the price of oil is now that there is a need for subsidies for the oil and gas industry when oil company CEOs themselves have said they do not need these kinds of incentives to continue to explore, Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters.
"At a time when Americans are suffering every time they go to the gas station and pull out their credit card or the cash to pay a very high price for a tank of gas, to then tell them that actually we need to spend $4 billion a year of their money to subsidize oil companies who this week are reporting massive profits is just not a credible argument," Carney continued. "He [President Obama] certainly believes that now more than ever the argument resonates."
With gas prices approaching record highs nationwide, the letter seemed a clear attempt by the White House to show Americans the president is concerned about the kind of pocketbook issues that are at the top of voters minds. But it's unclear what impact eliminating the subsidies would have on prices at the pump.
Obama has repeatedly said there is no "silver bullet" to bringing down sky-high gas prices, but believes that ending the subsidies -- as he proposed to do in his FY2011 and FY2012 budgets -- and using the money to invest in clean energy was one step that could be taken to ensure Americans don't "fall victim to skyrocketing gas prices over the long term." Carney said there was "nothing symbolic" about this new push to end the tax breaks and insisted it was not part of a political calculation.
"We don't look at this as an issue of electoral politics in 18 months, we look at this as an issue of hardship for average Americans today," he said, adding that he didn't believe people were thinking about the 2012 election while filling up their gas tanks. "You don't have to introduce electoral politics into it to make it a matter of great concern because we are concerned about it here today."
Though Speaker Boehner told ABC he was willing to "take a look" at these subsidies paid to oil companies in an interview that aired last night, his spokesman Brendan Buck released the following statement in response to today's letter from the president:
“The Speaker wants to increase the supply of American energy and reduce our dependence on foreign oil, and he is only interested in reforms that actually lower energy costs and create American jobs. Unfortunately, what the President has suggested so far would simply raise taxes and increase the price at the pump.”
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This is a NO brainer!
These enviromental rapists are raking in RECORD profits and paying little to ZERO taxes!
Those subsidies out lived their purpose 30+ years ago!
If they're going to do ANY type of subsidies in this day & age, they should be alternative energy!
I will now sit back and wait the arrival of the DRILL BABY DRILL crowd!
Got *popcorn*?
Gonna be fun the next couple of hours, watching the posters that will appear on here, and stick up for subsidies for the oil companies. I'm with Feisty- Rest assured, there will be some.
BTW- who's not drilling on all those inactive leases, and what are they waiting for- the price to go up even more? Then, there was the argument yesterday about 'summer blends' that need to be made because of the whackos that want a somewhat safe environment for our kids to live in. As though this is the first year in history they (blends) ever had to be used, right??
Drill Baby Drill, or Spin Baby Spin??
I'm on board with this also. No point in tax subsidies for an industry that's making money hand over fist.
Summer blends reminds me of leaded and unleaded gas. When cars first required unleaded gas, the price per gallon was substantially more for unleaded despite the fact that it cost more money to add lead to the gas in the first place.
Get rid of $3 billion in subsidies to US countries?
OK, but what about the $2 billion to Petrobas in Brazil to drill at depths twice as deep and dangerous as the Gulf with the promise of another $8 billion? Isn't Petrobas in the top 5 biggest companies in the world? We are we borrowing money from China to give them to drill for oil that they sell to China?
What about the $2.84 billion to Columbia to build a new refinery in Cartegena when we haven't built a comparable refinery in 30+ years here in America?
What about the $3 billion to Papau, New Guinea for their liquid gas project?
Taxes? Reform the tax codes like Ryan suggests. Make all the multinational companies like GE and Exxon pay fair taxes instead of the cronyism and political manipulations.
Subsidies? Get rid of the subsidies - for everyone. Get rid of green subsidies too - sheez they cost to many other jobs. Get rid of the insanity of Ethanol subsidies.
But this is another Obama distraction du jour from his own incompetence or willingness to develop an honest energy policy.
We have more natural resources than any country on the planet. There is no need for our dependence on anyone. Obama has wantonly crippled the energy industry - his Energy Secretary has even said he wants $8 a gallon gas to push the green agenda.
Why won't Obama be honest ...........
1. He is Obama.
2. He is in full campaign mode.
OK-
No problem.
Defend $5 dollar per gallon gas prices.
Tell us all how the economic recovery from the "Great Recession" can survive that.
Who believes it?
Nonsense, Mr. President.
Who believes this?
No one...not even here.
"he is only interested in reforms that actually lower energy costs and create American jobs. Unfortunately, what the President has suggested so far would simply raise taxes and increase the price at the pump.”
There is nothing Boehner has done since he became Speaker that indicates that he is interested in lowering energy costs or creating jobs. And can someone explain to me exactly how reducing or eliminating oil company subsidies will increase taxes?
Just another bluff to call on Obama.
$5/gal gas. 9% unemployment. Trillion dollar deficits. And look, inflation appears to be picking up, too much QE'ing perhaps?
Well at least the war in Libya is going well. How many people did we humanitarianly kill today?
crazy talk.......this guys are not ready to do anything. this a way to shift attention from the pounding they're receiving from ryan's budget they adopted and voted for. you'll wait ages to have republicans support the removal of oil tax rebates.
Great - do it.
But it would be nice to also eliminate all "green" energy subsidies.
Or heck, they could just get GE, you know it brings "green" things to life, to actually pay some taxes.
See it's not enough we are subsidizing crapping windmills and solar, but we also subsidize them by allowing them to not pay taxes.
I know, I know, he's totally "leading from behind" and all.
So subsidizing anything. Stop spending money we don't have.
poor JOhnny One note.
A wonderful start. No industry that makes such outrageous profits should be subsidized by our tax dollars. But lets not stop there. Believe it or not, but I actually think bob1805 has a good point about foreign oil industry subsidies as well as ethanol subsidies. End them also. This corporate welfare fiasco is robbing the middle class blind.
If you want to live in a great country you can't depend solely on the private sector and the free market. If you do you will not achieve anything or have anything unless and until it is profitable. Lots of people in rural areas still would not have electricity because it is not profitable for a utility to run miles and miles of poles and wires to sell a liittle bit of electricity to a farmhouse. The government created the rural electrification project. This is how the TVA (for instance) started and it is the only reason some people have electricity in Tennessee. The terrain is rugged and the population is spread out and like many other areas in the US it was not profitable and did not warrant the investment by the private sector. It is not profitable to land a man on the moon, but this nation takes pride and learned a lot from the accomplishment. If you want to have great things, and do great things, sometimes the government has to subsidize projects. If not you will only have what turns a profit, and you won't have it after it stops turning a profit. Think about this country and what the government (we the people) have accomplished and bequeathed to all future citizens. Now think of a country where there is virtually no government involvement, no subsides, no regulations, we trust the free market exclusively, we run the country like a business. You think we would have or done a lot of the things that we think make us great. The key is what you subsidize as a country, you subsidize what you need but business won't bring to the market. There is no need to do as republicans want to do and subsidize the health insurance industry, and the oil industry. These are two of the most profitable industries on the planet right now. They don't need tax support, they will drill anyway, they will sell oil, they don't need your tax dollars to help them sell gas. People will get sick and be charged outrageous sums for health care. That is a good solid business plan, that does not need to be subsidized. The health care insurance providers and the hospitals are making out like bandits, they don't need your medicare tax dollars handed directly to them. You don't need to subsidize what is already profitable, but we should subsidize important projects when the private sector isn't interested.
I don't think it'll have much more than a psychological effect, but as Feisty correctly states...This is a NO brainer!!!
Thanks Grimey!
BTW - I sure HOPE you won, betting on 'red'! ;o)
Good point, Grimey. Right now we could use a little psychological boost. It may not have a great affect but neither will the "drill, baby drill" we're again hearing from conservatives. In 10 years, drilling might save us $.03 per gallon. The good affect it will have is $4 billion per year in increased revenues to invest in clean energy, education or infrastructure--invest in America's future not its past.
I will agree with Feisty and Frank, It pretty much is a "no brainer" wasting $4 billion on the oil companies that make huge profits.
But that money should be used to pay down debt, and we should cut subsidies to all areas & countries. If anything, that money should go to the infrastructure of this nation, not more tax breaks for wind energy & corn producers. Give people reasons to invest in this country, not extra money to make more profit with.
Does Ted Turner really need a farm subsidy? How many others are out there like that?
Or Michelle Bachmann for that matter!
Her cash crop of foster kids should be MORE than enough for her to get by on!
Jody - so precious.
You know Jody if we drilled here, and produced our own oil we could stop buying it from the folks that hate us.
And for goodness sake Jody, are the basic tenets of supply and demand just too difficult for you?
Jody dear please point to one "clean energy" that is remotely as cost effective or efficient as the "dirty" stuff.
Windmills? Solar? Fairy dust and unicorn juice?
Jody- so precious.
You know Jody if we stopped building and buying barges that people use as 'commuters' we could stop buying it (oil) from the folks that hate us.
And for goodness sake Jody, are the basic tenets of supply and demand just too difficult for you? Don't you realize those barges consume WAY more that is needed to get people around?
Jody dear please point to one "clean energy" that is remotely as cost effective or efficient as the "dirty" stuff. If you can't, there is NO GOOD REASON to even TRY to get off the 'dirty' stuff, now, is there? It would be so much better for both our security AND our environment to just give up even trying, now, wouldn't it?
C'mon, Grimey...
That's obvious!
ALL of Feisty's posts are, by definition...
"no-brainers"!
Spanky-
Jody - so precious.
You know Jody if we drilled here, and produced our own oil we could stop buying it from the folks that hate us.
Spanker how many times does this have to be said to you " you can drill every drop of oil we have here in the states and it will not drop the price of oil" Oil is sold on the world market and at the world price. I thought you were a lawyer come on you gotta be better than this or maybe not....
And again you are mocking the ladies. I am really starting to think that you have a problem with them as you are always marginalizing their posts so why don't you explain to all of us why you continue to do this and clear it up for us.
Sorry to disappoint Rick - I poke fun at any and all, regardless of gender, race, ethnicity or social status. But my, my aren't you the white knight.
So what about supply and demand eludes you Rick? Or is it your belief that an increase in supply will not decrease the price. Particularly regarding the current speculation. Rick, you do understand that the speculation is for increasing prices? So if we increase the supply, from any source then they will have to think long and hard about betting for continued rises.
Basic macro-economics Rick. Plus there is the whole produce here and stop buying so much from the bad guys. Or are you content for Obama to implore Brazil to produce more? Is he stupid too Rick? Why did Obama ask Brazil [and loan them an assload of money] if as you say it will do no good?
Why do you hate Obama so much?
You guys just don't get do you? We are going to use every last drop of oil before we are done. It makes the most sense for the security of the United States to use all of our competitors oil first. We will continue buying foreign oil until they decide they need everything they have left and stop selling to us. ONLY then will we ramp up domestic production.
No way man - we'll be totally green in a year or two. I know this cause Obama said so.
Look he was spot on about the sea levels not rising. He totally fixed that warming thing. In fact I'm kinda hoping he could make it a tad bit warmer. It's cold, right Feisty?
Oil prices are not subject to the laws of supply and demand. There is a great surplus of oil now, yet prices keep rising due solely to speculators. It doesn't matter how much we drill. Most of the oil from Alaska goes to Asia anyway.
Fiesty and Bev, you are needed over on other MSNBC articles to defend our CiC. Please jump over and help defend his character. Non FR articles.
Hey Spanky whats up with healthcare costs? Is there a shortage of hospitals, doctors and nurses? If we build a bunch of hospitals, and churn out a bunch of MDs can we solve the problem of healthcare costs. I guess if the government took a fraction of the obscene amount of medicare money now spent and built enough hospitals and trained a large enough medical staff then the supply would cause the costs to drop like a rock. Healthcare would then be affordable for many, many more citizens. I get it Spanky!
The President has no control over the price of gas we pay at the pump. Speculators in the crude spot market have driven the price of gas up, making huge profits. This is NOT about supply and demand. None the less Obama has been blamed for the rising price of oil. Removing oil company subsidies will do nothing to bring the price of oil down BUT it will put billion s in the Treasury. Makes both parties look good. This is a win...win for both parties.
According to Goldman Sachs, commodities trading is adding $.75 to the cost of every gallon of gas--and Goldman should know since they're in the commodities business.
Jody....That's wholesale. Yep, Goldman should know. They're one of the largest commodity traders in the US.
One would think we would have learned how subsidies work from the collapse of the banking industry. As Ira pointed out the President has no control over the price, speculators do.
As long as America refuses to get serious about conservation and alternate energy and alternate transportation, we will continue to be in this cycle and we will continue to be at the mercy of the speculators and the oil companies themselves.
Yet, conservatives refuse to consider alternatives, to the point of defunding those initiatives already in place. And conservatives call for MORE drilling which only prolongs the cycle. It often seems that the only way to force the issue is indeed to let prices rise.
That Ira is just stupid.
Just what are those speculators betting on? You think it's that prices will go down? Come on.
Obama says we are going to ramp up production right now and boom, immediate decrease in speculation.
Or are you aware of a commodity trader trading on a downward price curb? Of course you are not.
And really guys why did the EPA deny Shell a permit for an ice breaker? Just stupid.
But it looks like fielden is with Obama - let gas rise. Just trade in your existing car, right? Oh wait my family won't fit in that Pruis.
Oh and we will certainly end the ridiculous subsidies on electric cars, right?
Spanky-
That Ira is just stupid.
Just what are those speculators betting on? You think it's that prices will go down? Come on.
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No I don't think prices will go down anytime soon as long as traders can speculate in the futures market on the price of oil. Each time they exexcute a trade that means a buyer is betting the price of oil is going to go up. Trade in very large quantities and you can move the market yourself. You made my point. Stop speculators from artificially forcing the price of oil up and watch the price respond.
....and if you think ramping up production will bring the price of oil down one cent you're living in a an alternate universe. Drill baby drill is just nonsense.
Ah, and yet nothing is done about the speculation.
I get you disagree about the effect of a call for more supply here, so that makes it even more imperative to stop the so called speculators. So why won't they [the feds] do something?
Of course Ira they said prices would never come down in the summer of '08, yet by April '09 I was paying $1.42 a gallon.
Obama cannot afford to let prices go any higher. He is now forced to action. The easy way would be through production - plus it gets us off of buying from the bad guys. I more afraid that the government can never get regulation right and there will be some unintended consequence.
Spanky....why don't the feds do something? They couldn't get regulations or oversight on banks that are to big to fail They could not expand SEC regulators authority. The GOP has blocked every attempt at regulating banks, brokerage firms etc. Are you for real?
Ira Lapin
Spanky, Are you for real?
No he's not. He knows or should know that the GOP (Gang of Polluters Party) has blocked attempts to regulate derivatives and speculating as well as eliminating subsidies. He just loves to stir things up don't pay him much attention.
But gosh Ira - is just so obvious, yet the SEC is powerless? How about the DOJ? They can't do a thing, eh? Too bad.
Come on big guy, you are better than that.
And yes Rick I am only a figment of your imagination. But you will note my marginalization of Ira. Now I don't know for sure, but I don't think Ira is a girl. :)
Spanky,
You know the SEC and DOJ are powerless in this situation yet you throw it out there as if were a fact. These are legal trades. You know that unless we regulate derivatives and speculation in the futures market oil prices will continue to rise. You know that ramping up production will not reduce oil prices will not decrease one cent. You know that the GOP has blocked attempts to regulate derivatives and speculating as well as eliminating subsidies. You know everything I said is a fact yet you continue this absurdity with arrogance and stupidity. You know what, have a beer tonight with your buddies and tell them how you got one over on a lefty liberal if that makes you feel better. I'd prefer to be marginalized and be correct and factual then continue this circular conversation. Not a single fact, just insults. As I have said before, stupidity is arguing something over and over, facts be damned, expecting a different outcome.
The SEC is powerless because Republicans WANT the SEC to be powerless;
http://www.heatingoil.com/blog/showdown-over-funding-for-oil-speculation-reform-looms-as-federal-budget-debate-heats-up0301/
The shocking reality is that the United States is looking at $5.00 per gallon gasoline, or even higher, in the very near future if something is not done to relieve the pressure valve. That relief valve may very well be the U.S. domestic oil industry itself even though, today, that industry is mostly shut out of its own country.
The logical solution to this problem would be to drill here, in America, where we have plenty of resources. But the Obama administration and his buddies, the environmental terrorists, are preventing us from drilling off U.S. shores!
Every oil-producing country in the world is drilling in the Florida Keys, Gulf of Mexico, and along the California coast---EXCEPT THE UNITED STATES!! Our government is subservient to the fears that environmentalists have raised.
Drilling for oil here in America would not only reduce our prices and prevent us from being at the mercy of the volatile Middle Eastern region---but it would also BRING JOBS TO AMERICA.
" the environmental terrorists..."
Explain that term for us would you? Sounds like these 'environmentals' have wreaked havoc, death and destruction on some refineries? On some oil fields? Some of our pipelines? What??
Bob-1887910...
What you posted is an arguement that has been refuted over and over. The US has 2% of the oil reserves in the world. That's 2%. If we sucked every drop of oil from wells in the US we would not make a dent on the price or supply of oil in the world. Again...it's NOT demand. It's speculators making huge profits in the commodities markets and we're paying the price for it at the pump. Even releasing strategic reserves would have no impact. Regulate the speculators and watch the price of oil drop dramatically.
Bob,
I'm really puzzled by your statement: "Every oil-producing country in the world is drilling in the Florida Keys, Gulf of Mexico, and along the California coast---EXCEPT THE UNITED STATES!!"
As I understand it, all the oil that is drilled in the world goes into one big pot. It isn't like America gets to keep oil drilled on US territory for it's own use. Furthermore, the Obama administration has approved more than 35 off-shore wells since the moratorium was lifted, following the BP catastrophe.
(Michelle Bachman earned herself a "pants on fire" rebuke from Polifacts for claiming the Obama administraion had only approved 1 new well.) http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/mar/29/michele-bachmann/michele-bachmann-claims-there-has-been-just-one-ne/
Bob - Do you think that when Exxon or Texaco puts an Oil Derrick off the Florida coast that the oil goes directly to the USA?
It goes to the global oil market where its bought and sold. Its a common misconception that oil drilled in the U.S stays in the U.S. Even if the U.S with its 2% oil reserves flooded the market with all its new ( drill , baby drill ) oil, OPEC sets the prices.
Perhaps you think that Exxon or Texaco can then say "We'll sell our oil for $50 a barrel even though all the OPEC oil is going for $120?"
Would you sell something for $50 that could go for $120?
Its a business you know.
Speculators have jumped on a minor skirmish in Libya; OPEC ( Saudi Arabia ) is artifically holding the price up as well. Welcome to Capitalism and Monopolies
The end of this all is to get off of oil but all of the airplanes used in our new no-fly zone run on ..you guessed it ..OIL
Absolute nonsense--the current price of oil is supported purely by speculation. At this point there's ample excess capacity in the market such that the current price is nothing but unadulterated profit for people who have so much money they can afford to dominate the market and in so doing steal from the rest of us.
Of course, when the House was owned by the Democrats, they did nothing. Now, all of sudden, they're "sending letters". What a joke these people are.
So fine, get rid the oil subsidies. And the farm subsidies. And the sugar subsidies. And the ethanol subsidies. And the windmill subsidies. And the subsidies for that stupid car Ford makes. And the other 1500+ subsidies the government doles out to buy votes.
I have no problem cutting oil subsidies. We need to produce more oil at home. The Bakken oil fields in the Dakota's would be a good place to start. This is how Canada produces it's oil.
My understanding is that oil drilled in the US does not go into US oil reserves, but into the world market. How does that reduce the price at the pump? If we haven't built any new refineries in 30 years and the ones we have are operating at capacity, how does drilling more oil here make any difference to the price we pay at the pump? It sure muddies the water when rather than the purpose of news organizations being to inform the public, it now seems, for some of them, to be the dissemination of misinformation.
"Of course, when the House was owned by the Democrats, they did nothing"
Yes, I remember that. Oil was $112 a barrel when the Democrats 'owned' the house. What?
Never mind....
Were you not paying attention to the BP disaster in the Gulf a year ago?! Have you seen and read how much oil still exists on Gulf beaches? That's more than "fear"! Do you really want something like that in YOUR yard? Do you really care that little?
Not that I totally agree with Bob's rendition of "environmental terrorist". But why haven't we build a new modern oil refinery here in the United States.
Heck, besides working on alternative energies, we should drill, safely throughout our own nation. I believe in solar, wind, and water energy, but until we find a better solution we also need to get our own oil.
Until we quit allowing everyone to file lawsuits on behave of the spotted, redwinged, head twisting, backward flying owl, we are going to continue to hurt ourselves.
Anyone every heard of survival of the fittest. Seemed to work for centuries, prior to socialism:)
What the Congress should have done was vote No when Obama asked them for their input on him attacking Libya and causing all the oil supply uncertainty in the middle-east. That vote will haunt both houses of Congress.
Oh wait, Obama only got the UNs approval and something called the "Arab League" (Whoever they are. Do they have the Designated Hitter like the National League?) approval to start that war. I guess those two outfits are more important than our Congress.
Never mind....
And a barrel of crude was $50 bucks when Bush was in office. Those were the days . . . . .
The Greens won't allow it. Besides were Leading from Behind and Winning the Future (WTF) with all this Green Energy! Feel the burn, right?
I beg to differ:
Wasn't 'W' & the 'Dick' still at the helm back then?
Looks like your 'leading' days as the 'one woman wrecking crew' are FAR behind you there darling! ;o)
Sorry, the National League does it correct, the have no DH. It's the American League that has it. The Arab League? Who knows.
$1.70/gal gas when Bush left office.
So Obama, how'd you screw that up?
Rule on of the baseball rule book says each team has 9 players. American league cheats - they play with 10. They play softball.
As for the price of gas he didn't screw up - he is getting what he wants - skyrocketing energy prices.
He's just screwing us. But then again, there has been a lot less traffic out, so that's nice.
Lets see him win re-election with that attitude. I'm certain the middle-class that Obama so "tirelessly fights for" is taking notice of what it costs them to fill up.
Joanna,
That was because the bottom had dropped out from under the economy at the end of the Busheney reign. It was the one bright spot in the fall of 2008 when the ka-ka-moo-hay hit the proverbial rotary blades. Lower gas prices! Before that I thought I'd never see $1.70 again in my lifetime but the Fall of the Emperor with no clothes saw to it that I did get the chance. Summer 2008 during the rising oil prices before the fall though, THAT again was speculation.
Do try to remember the reality of our national nightmare that began under 'W'; not the disconnect of a GOP/TP rightwing nirvana that never existed.
Let e guess Missy - Literature major.
Am I right?
$1.70 a gallon you say JS1. Just above you, the Spankster said he paid $1.42 in California, no less, which always pays higher prices. Yall need to get your act together, someone's lieing.
I seem to recall before Bush/Cheney, gas was $1.12, but then those 2 got together & Destroyed Iraq's Oil for another 10 years(at the least).
Them were the days!
You Betcha!
Since I presume Carney knows the difference between a tax break and a subsidy, howmon earth does a press corps made up of professionals let him get away with lying?
There are no transfer payments from taxpayers to companies, no matter who they are. It is simply a question of their tax bills- not a "subsidy", which would be a taxpayer payment. Kind of like the ones made to 47% of people in this country.
The other problem is that the "consequentionalist" in the white house wants to take money from oil and gas producers, who make products that are in shortage, and give those funds to his cronies with the rainbow factories- the ones who produce nothing but rhetoric and empty promises. They do, however, contribute to Obama's campaigns, so I guess that is the reason.
He cannot truly be stupid enough to believe we can run cars with little windmills on top, can he?
I am tired of a president who leads from behind. I would like one with a brain that functions beyond campaigning and tell g himself how wonderful he is.
Perhaps, rather than complaining about silver bullets, he can roll back his decreasing production in this country- we are down 30,000 barrels a day now, scheduled for an additional 120,000 barrels a day next year. That is going to have an effect on gas prices, okay.
They will be going UP again.
He tell the environmentalist to go pound salt- and let the fracking begin in North Dakota. That will increase domestic production.
He can tell the environmentalists to go jump in a lake, and allow drilling the the ANWAR.
He can get rid of the environmentalist wacko heading the EPA, can the cap and trade policy they snuck in through the back door on Chriatmas Eve, and immediately see a reduction in people's energy bills.
He can stop growing corn for ethanol, start ramping up wheat and corn for consumption production, and ease world food shortages, which will calm the unrest in the Middle East.
Of course, if he had done this last year, we would not be having this discussion this year.
That seems to be the problem with Leading From Behind. You are always behind the curve. Or is it the eight ball?
I realize this is a stretch - but, have you ever considered it's YOU whose doing the LYING?
Like anyone is EVER going to take a serial liars word for it! *wink wink*
Look Everyone - the NJ ding bat has found herself a new & improved Tea Bagger CHANT!
Isn't THAT special?
I'm with No Jo. We need to use up all of what we have, and use it up NOW!
(But, I hope like hell I'm dead and gone, then, when we need to import ALL of it from, say, the Middle East)
The Republican Supporters still believe the total BS that is preached to them about oil supply and prices. If were drilling at max levels, that would still not be enough.
Tough rules and regulations need to be made to clamp down on these traders. Perhaps if a few went to jail, that would show them that we mean business.
Big business and wall street have proven that they can't police themselves, and government
"Leading from behind" is so yesterday's news. New talking point, please.
Meh - leave her alone Jody - she has to have something to chew on! lol
"Leading from Behind". It has a cute-sy ring to it, but what the hell does it mean? I mean, besides not a damn thing....
No Jo:
88% of "subsidies" to oil companies is in the form of tax breaks, however, oil companies also get "Royalty Relief," as in, they get a discount for drilling in public land, which does not belong to them, and for which they should be paying a "royalty" to take the oil there. There is seems to be no end to the way oil companies and the U.S. government are intertwined.
In order to promote the extraction of certain kinds of natural resources, the Interior Secretary may exercise powers under the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act and the Deep Water Royalty Relief Act of 1995 to grant royalty relief to drillers. In the mid 1990s, when the latter law was passed, fossil fuel prices were low, so certain types of drilling projects seemed uneconomical without government assistance. The subsidies took the form of relieving companies from having to pay federal royalties on the resources they extracted.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2010/jun/16/edward-markey/markey-says-oil-companies-pay-nothing-gulf-drillin/
Job l , I'm still waiting for the Justice Dep't to indite the Wall St bankers who caused our economic collapse. I have been talking about this for months.
It was used in an article in the New Yorker attributed to an anonymous White House source to describe the President's foreign policy. So it actually comes from the Obama administration.
www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/05/02/110502fa_fact_lizza
The article also documents the many contradictions between Obama the candidate and the actions of the Obama administration in taking military action in Libya.
PS Royalty Relief has nothing to do with how we are going to feel after this wedding madness is over :)
Hey Feisty,
I happened to check back on one of my old comments and saw ........
Really? I made the statement that 80% of the hedge fund guys supported the Dems / Obama in 2008, JoAnna gives you a link from 2010 that says 98% of the hedge fund money was going to the Dems in early 2009 ....... and she says that proves we are lying fools..... LMFAO! You are laughing your fat @ss off over that? (BTW - How big an old girl are you?)
The big boy of Wall Street, Goldman Sachs gave Obama $994,795 to their hedge of $230, 095 to McCain.
The American Thinker in an October 21, 2008 piece had hedge fund money going to the Dems at the time as $770,100 to the Repubs $60,000. Get a 4th grader to do the math for you, but hint: it's about 12% above 80%.
Then there is the big boy of the hedge fund guys, George Soros. Soros doesn't mess around with just the small stuff - he donated $23,581,000 through 527 groups. $23.5 million! I know you want a source, so this from Wiki - pretty simple, huh? It is funny they don't list the number for 2008. Strange, especially since Obama is the perfect Soros puppet.
Soros stated in his book "The Age of Fallibility" that......
Sounds just like Obama with his world apology tour, huh. Anyway, this is who Soros is, who the big money heavy hitter behind Obama is. This is what Center for American Progress, America Coming Together, MoveOn.org, thinkprogress and all the others that Soros funds are all about.
So not only the richest of the hedge fund guys support Obama - he feels the United States is the problem.
You must be so proud.
Actually, in light of your posts and comments, that should be ....... You must be such a proud idiot.
Anyway, thanks for TRYING to play.
Regarless of where it came from, it sounds goofy. Now, as to contradicitons- it would surprise me very much to learn this is the first time we've seen THAT about ANYTHING.
H Lisa,
I agree. I don't know why they have not gone after these wall street bankers.
no joe, no bo, nj
They will be going UP again.
He tell the environmentalist to go pound salt- and let the fracking begin in North Dakota. That will increase domestic production.
He can tell the environmentalists to go jump in a lake, and allow drilling the the ANWAR.
He can get rid of the environmentalist wacko heading the EPA, can the cap and trade policy they snuck in through the back door on Chriatmas Eve, and immediately see a reduction in people's energy bills.
He can stop growing corn for ethanol, start ramping up wheat and corn for consumption production, and ease world food shortages, which will calm the unrest in the Middle East.
No Jo i understand where your coming from, but untill our government stops allowing oil on the world makert we could pump 3 billion barrel a day and it won't make a difference as long as it goes on the world market. i agree stop the ethanol and sudsidies to big oil, give that to the car makers to product 3 Electric car lines each, If ford, GM and chrysler mass produce electric cars the cost will go down to a normal combustion engine. the same way the cost of a car went down when henry Ford mass produced cars, untll then cars cost 4 times what ford sold the model T for.
No Jo after what happened last year in the gulf, do you really trust them in the ANWAR or North Dakota. Honestly.
lets take natural gas, we have more of it than anybody in the world but it does not keep the cost down, No. why, because we don't control prices because its on the world market.
i could less than 2 craps about world hungry (SORRY AFRICA), We should trade wheat and corn for oil, and charge the middle east and russa what they charge us for oil. pay back is a mother.
In 1977 or 78 Jimmy carter made the car companies achieve fuel standards, i remember my mothers 71 skylark only got 10 MPG today the same car gets almost 30 a gallon, gas would be 6.00 per gallon before this latest screw over by big oil, because of that we cuts our dependence by 1/4 by 1980
Speaking of SO yesterday.. *yawn*
Booby - The mere FACT that you're still obsessing about that, tells me all I need to know! ;o)
You were LYING back then and NOTHING has changed my friend, NO matter how many times you click your ruby pumps!
Wikipedia seriously? And here I thought you were 'sharper' than that! LMAO!
There was NO reference in JoAnna's link to back up your claim - but then again, you already know that! ;o)
Instead of your hatchet job - why not re-post the ENTIRE comment? Wait... that would PROVE you're still a loser and a liar!
Once a TOOL, forever a FOOL...
Obsessing about it? Nope. Was just reminded of it by your latest little childish taunt of liar, liar.... thought you would appreciate another slap down.
Too bad you are too stupid and too inept to understand how stupid and inept you are.
Ahhh - More personal attacks from you there bobby!
I would hardly call that a slap down!
Yeah WHATEVER! LMFAO!
What's the matter little man - afraid to take my challenge?
Actually, the quote originates with Nelson Mandela.
He used it to describe the way shepherds control livestock. They let the smart animals work their way to the fron and the shepherds remain at the rear to control the flow. Leading from the rear.
So it's not as silly as it sounds.
Here Bobby - since you're not man enough, allow me:
WOW! Imagine my surprise when I read the link JS1 posted and didn't find anything to substantiate your claims there bobby..
For those interested, below is the full text of her link and maybe someone can point out where it references the 2008 elections or 80% for that matter!
Now you know what a REAL smack down feels like there little guy! *OUCH*
It's clear to me now, why you're still 'stinging' after a week! ;o)
Definitely up there with "Win the Future" and "We are the ones we've being waiting for"
" she has to have something to chew on! lol"
Cud, anyone?
You have got to love that Fiesty "wins" through cutting and pasting.
Feisty - whatever you do do not change. Pure comedy gold.
"Winning The Future"?
WTF?
That has to be in the same league as "leading from behind", doesn't it?
I can only hope that will.i.am resurrects the "Oh-Bah-Mah" messianic chant and video for the 2012 campaign.
Wouldn't that be a hoot, after the nation has actually endured four excruciating years of the Obama Presidency?
I'm guessing the Obama re-election campaign will choose something a little more reality-based...
lol
Feisty,
Thanks for proving that you are too stupid to realize how stupid you are.
1. Your cut and paste states that in 2009, the hedge fund guys gave 98% of their money to Dems. It doesn't directly confirm my statement, but certainly does not refute my statement. If anything it seems to support it. A moron could see that.
Nevertheless a source was offered in #5.11 dated October, 2008 that puts the number for 2008 at 93%.
You refuted nothing.
2. If you are looking at the .....
It states finance, insurance and real estate interest - not the hedge fund guys.
First - Do you need me to explain the difference? OK - you probably do.
JP Morgan Chase is not a hedge fund. Blue Cross Blue Shield is not a hedge fund. Fannie May and Freddie Mac are not hedge funds. Countrywide was not a hedge fund.
Secondly - Do you need me to point out that a 10 year period does not address or apply specically to statement about 2008? OK BTW - I just did.
Again 2010 not 2008 and again, not specifically the hedge fund guys.
Hope this didn't go over your head, but if it did, maybe a 4th grader is home from school and can help explain it to you.
Sheez ....... how dumb can some people be?
I wish thinkformeprogressives.com had a help line for you guys.
Maybe they could at least make it interesting.
BTW Feisty,
Lay off the ad hominem to the people that don't mess with you and don't deserve it.
Me? .......... come after me any day any time.
Look bob I really think we need to defer to Feisty on this one.
Like she says from the git go it is a "no brainer."
And if ever there was an expert on that subject - it'd be Feisty "no brain, no headache" Redhead.
Nah Booby!
You're not worth MY time or energy!
I've dealt with rookies such as yourself for years around here!
Long posts of 'double' speak does nothing to advance your argument!
You're dismissed!
PS: You of ALL people bringing ad hominem attacks... PRICELESS! ;o))
Are you hitting the Scotch early again?
Yeah Feisty we can see he's not worth your time, as evidenced above where you spent three hours cutting and pasting.
Psst Feisty you are not doing well today. Call it a night old girl and get back in here tomorrow and give it a fresh run.
Jaysus, Feisty: poor bobby certainly has his knickers in a knot today. I guess he doesn't like being called out and found wanting. Poor bobby.
They don't need to do hearings they know exactly who is doing this ...the hedge funds ! But they are their friends and dont want to see them lose any money ...just like the bank bailouts ...their friends got back all the money they lost....Its time these "BUMS" told the truth !
We're broke! We're broke! We're broke!
(hmmm, but Speaker Boehner has to mull over saving the tax payers 4 billion a year in subsidies for an industry that is the most profitable in the history of the world....what is wrong with this picture?)
It does make you wonder how Boehner can stand in front of a microphone and keep a straight face. It's like Paul Ryan cutting another 10% from the highest tax bracket and claiming he needs to eliminate medicare and cut social security to pay for his tax cuts.
So perhaps one of you ladies can explain why Obama said we can't raise taxes now, we are in a recession?
You think he knows that taxes and jobs are related, or is he just stupid?
Jody? Amy?
Ask Durbin how taxing the Internet just screwed Ill outof not just a butt load of tax revenue, but also a whole lot of jobs.
But seriously if debt is no problem and the gov can just print money at will, why even tax anything? Just print, print, print, right?
Sen Murkowski:
Perhaps most misleading is [Obama's] claim — also made by others — that the United States has “about 2, maybe 3 percent of the world’s proven oil reserves; we use 25 percent of the world’s oil.” That line is crafted to make the audience think that America is both running out of oil and using oil at an unsustainable rate.
In truth, “reserves” is just one of several categories used to quantify oil and, on its own, misrepresents America’s potential. To classify a barrel as a reserve, you have to drill, prove the oil is there, and meet strict criteria established by the Securities and Exchange Commission. It’s not an easy process.
Right now, America has an estimated 22.3 billion barrels of oil reserves. But that’s hardly the whole story. A recent Congressional Research Service report that I commissioned with Sen. Jim Inhofe of Oklahoma found that the United States’ recoverable oil resources are estimated at 157 billion barrels. That is seven times as much as our reserves and doesn’t even include the roughly 900 billion barrels of unconventional oil resources nearing commercialization.
Consider this: While our nation’s oil “reserves” have never reached 40 billion barrels, we’ve managed to produce nearly 200 billion barrels since 1900. Between 2008 and 2009, America’s oil reserves rose more than 8 percent, even as roughly 2 billion barrels were produced. That was made possible by our substantial resource base. Reserves alone have never provided the full picture.
Those who repeat the 2 percent argument are falling into an old trap. Government officials have claimed since 1919 that America is “running out of oil.” Nearly a century later, we are still the world’s third-largest oil producer, behind Saudi Arabia and Russia. Our consumption levels may seem high, but in fact they’re directly proportionate to America’s share of the global, petroleum-based economy
"...we are still the world’s third-largest oil producer, behind Saudi Arabia and Russia"
Where is Canada in that raking? Anyone know?
Estimated reserves by country. Canada is third. The US isn't the top 17.
Just proves that if a person is going to post a comment and quote sources, it is best to double check the legitimacy of those sources. The U.S. gets most of its oil from Canada.
That's what I thought. Thanks, you two (Ira/Jody).
The KOCH... brothers wont allow Speaker Boehner to do anything ....if he does.. the bribes are no longer coming his way ! Its a true fact..... its about the bribes .. the GOP will do everything they can to stop this . Not whats in the peoples best interests!
The oil subsidies/tax breaks were put in place in the 1960's to assist an industry struggling against the newly found oil in the middle east. They now make billions in profits every year. Not only that, they do not pay much in royalties for the oil they extract from land owned by Americans. It doesn't matter whether you are a liberal or a conservative, there is no reason that tax payers should be subsidizing a multi-billion dollar a year industry with $4 billion per year in tax breaks and then pay more to these companies at the gas pump, the grocery store and everywhere else we buy things. As FR pointed out, President Obama has had this in both budgets he presented Congress but the GOP/TP seems powerless against the big oil and coal industries; they are too weak and cowardly to move America forward.
It is about time for the USA to take that $4 billion annually and use it to subsidize other fledgling clean, renewable energy firms. Now is the time to do this, not five, ten or twenty years from now. Oil is a finite resource and eventually, it will be gone, not to mention the risks of drilling deeper and deeper beneath the ocean floor. The USA could lead the way and create thousands of jobs but we cannot do it if politicians remain entrenched in old technologies and refuse to invest in America.
GOD DAMNIT...we are so freakin tired of you GOP/TP bastards lying to U.S... you can not make it stick...PRESIDENT OBAMA is not the reason for high gas prices ...IT's the OIL COMPANIES and SPECULATORS!!!
Stop lying GOP/TP ...why do the Media print these lies...BONEHEAD's trying to get his lie to resonate about gas prices - we know it's your rich buddies that are purposely inflating the prices- so that you can blame POTUS - plain and simple.
Stop insulting U.S... please!!!
ENOUGH IS FU_KING ENOUGH!!!
Boehner had the nerve to tell the President to grow-up when he is spreading lie after lie after lie after lie!!!!
What? are you stupid...also - yes there is a silver bullet to halt high gas prices...take oil and gas off the market....or stricken the regulatory rules...there is plenty of ways...
FOLKS get smart on this...gas should cost no more than $1.50 and the oil companies will have plenty of profilt and America can live a decent life and not have to spend 60%(and growing) of their income on fuel cost.
IT's GREED - PURELY NOTHING ELSE!
TRUTH - not CRAP
Thank you and GOD BLESS AMERICA
But...but...but INDIA and CHINA are growing by leaps and bounds, and are driving up DEMAND!!
Oh, wait- I forgot: they must have actually shrunk the last couple of years when the price of oil was back DOWN, right? But NOW they are GROWING again!! Anyone amused by THAT one lately???
Oil companies $.09 per gallon, Government $.48 per gallon.
Yep those fat cat oil companies are really sticking it to us.
Wouldn't it be just peachy if the government produced oil and refined the gas? Now that would be fantastic!
Come to Iowa and see who is getting fat off your taxes paid to the "Green Ethenol" business. Yea Farmers really need subsidized. Look at what government intervention has done to the price of farm land. Does this chart look anything similar to the price of houses that ultimatley lead to the crash you liberals blamed on Bush? I say the government should stay out of the subsidy business period.....
PRESIDENT OBAMA is a major reason for high gas prices , because he opposes drilling for more oil, and his radical EPA is preventing US oil and gas industry from doing their job.
If you moonbats want to end "subsidies" to OIL COMPANIES, I am with you.
Subsides are tax credits. They are not handouts.
Let's have a flat tax system, simple tax, all individuals and businesses will owe
No more subsdies for phony "alternative energy" boondoggles either.
No Bob1887,
Hate to bust your bubble, but 2/3rds of the oil and gass leases in the Gulf are left fallow. They are not developed, drilled or explored. Don't even know if they have done seismic or gravimetric on them yet either. I was an oil field geologist with Geophysics Intrnl in Dallas, Texas. Fox news doesn't have access to my brain either. The gasoline prices are due to oil speculators.
The reason for the sudden price changes is because back in 2000 - 2001, Bush decided to take oil off of domestic commodities exchanges and put them on the Foreign Board of Trade (FBOT). He did this to circumvent regulations (there's that word again). Price controls and safeguards against speculation were removed. That is why the cost of gas can now swing 30 cents / gallon,.....overnight.
Yup. Republican deregulation.
Are ya' livin' the dream boy?
Dammit Greg can you please talk to the design fellas?
The new Charger? That's the best they can do?
Bob - 1887910 you are completely wrong!!! You Republicans can try to spin this all you want!!! Drilling will not stop the speculators and oil companies from rigging the prices...it will just give them more oil to work with.
The gas prices were never this high - if you take a moment to think and if you are old enough to remember...never this high until George Bush allowed oil and gas on the market and the oil companies and speculators to run wild this product - a product THEY know we can't live without!!!.
Drilling has nothing to do with it and you know it just as well as we all do.
This is just another GOP/TP lie!!!
EXTRA DRILLING WILL NOT LOWER GAS PRICES - stopping oil lobbyists and enforcing and strikening WALL STREET AND OIL COMPANIES WELL!!!!!
TRUTH - not CRAP...
Thank you and GOD BLESS AMERICA
Well said as usual Democrat Soldier. No pun intended.
Say I don't suppose you fellas would like to discuss the other side, now would you?
You all are flat wrong about the effect of increased supply and what the nasty speculators are speculating on. Hint - it is decreasing supplies. SHould supplies go up then that'd be that. Cause see they are not going to buy futures on something that'll be worth less in 6 months.
But let's talk demand and price. You all recall getting gas in say 1977/8? Not so much fun, eh? See, you let OPEC and the gang control supply, you got some big problems.
So how about say we produce as much as possible? If nothing else it'll be less of our $ going to crap hole nations.
Plus Obama wouldn't have to start another war for oil, right?
Spanky. Surely you are smarter then that, you being a lawyer an all, Do you really believe OPEC pulls the strings when it comes to oil prices? If we drilled every drop of oil in north America, we would not pay a cent less at the pump.
As an aside, In ultra conservative Utah we pay substantially higher state taxes on gas then we do federal. So much for republicans being against taxes.
Exactly Patrick.
Most of U.S. oil comes from Canada anyway. I think Saudi accounts for, what, 15%?
Yeah, lets take Saudi Arabia out of the supply mix. Would we pay more or less?
But thanks for highlighting my point - even the smallest increase in production will effect the cost. ANd yes, Opec has a huge string. Good thing the need our money more than they want to screw with us, at this moment.
Greg - um, the Charger? Say I saw Ford busted some skulls, again. How's the mighty Mopar doing this quarter?
Mopar? Doing good Spank TFA. Police forces are turning in their Crown Vics for Chargers at a record pace. Cops like em' better. They're faster, better mileage, more maneuverable and their MDS blocks get better mileage for municipalities looking to save $$$ on gas. Them Hemi blocks are screamin' mofos.
Michigan State Police are buying them. Seeing them all over the country now. Imagine if GM, Xler and Ford went under. Would you pull over for a cop driving a Toyota Camry? You might die of laughter.
Bottom line:
No matter what is decided to do with the money, subsidies for the oil companies should just stop!
And oil should be taken off the commodity market and out of speculators hands!
Period.
Oh,....and the BS about the Bakken Formation in the Williston Basin is a giant pile of idiot bait too. The primary difficulty in the Bakken is permeability of the productive horizons. The formation is super "tight" as they say in the oil patch. Nearly impossible to suck the oil out of that tight shale unit. Production is slow.
Even the report that the right wing likes to cite says this. Read it.
And I used to work in the Silurian Pinnacle Reef trend of Michigan and the Anadarko Basin in Central Texas/Oklahoma.
You Liberals do know that Commodity "speculaters" also place trades "speculating" that prices will fall as well don't you? And check this out-----A Speculater can make money in the commodity market regardless of rising or falling prices. If you really want prices to rise, just cause some uncertainty with supply like say Obama putting a moritoriam on drilling or say supporting the over throw of the governments of OPEC countries. All Speculaters do is react to the most likley scenario.....
Not only are we paying exorbitant prices at the pump, we spend $10s of billions/ every year to import oil from foreign sources. We are subsidizing countries, many of whom are our enemies, when we have oil here that can be retrieved. The federal government is standing in the way of domestic oil exploration in America, in favor of impoverishing America by buying foreign oil. How dumb and irresponsible is that?
You Connies know that doesn't help you NOW though right? Tell the cashier at the gas station you want a lower price cause Rush Limbaugh told you that speculators cancel each other out. Seriously, do it and get back to us. Tell us what they said.
Come on Greg, you know Speculaters don't "cancel" each other out. Like I said traders react to the most likley scenario. If more bids are placed on the buy side prices go up. If more bids are placed on the sell side prices go down. Rush Limbaugh is an idiot but I think even he knows that.... When oil prices rise far enough other sources will become cost effective. See problem solved w/o a subsidy imagine that....
My next car is an electric plug-in.
And which one in the Chrysler line up is that?
Any hybrids even? What's up with that Greg?
And how come they have sold so few of them Volts and Leafs?
But hey if you do get a plug in you can power it up with good old fashioned, cheap coal. How anti-progressive of you. Oh, I know you got solar there in Detroit, right?
No comment Spanks.
When gas his $5.00/gallon they won't be able to produce those vehicles fast enough.
And yes. Solar panels are apparently more efficient up here in Michigan as ambient temperature has a lot to do with a panel's generating efficiency. But you knew that,....right Spanks? Solar panels in Arizona have to contend with 120 degree heat, we don't. Germany has abundant solar panels and is lots gloomier than Michigan. They work in Germany just fine Danke Shoern.
Meijer stores in Michigan are building plug-in charging stations for their shoppers. Go shopping at Meijer, and plug your car in while you are in the store.
Lotsa' alternatives we have yet to explore. Now if only we can bounce the Connies out of office we will make some progress.
BTW:
Don't think for one lousy minute that government or anything else can stop the oil companies. This country is run by and for Big Business, and if they stand to profit by keeping that oil in the ground then they will allow it to sit there,....unproduced.
One measley little president and one measley little Congress cannot withstand the imperial power and might of Big Oil and Big Defense.
They have the keys to the U.S. Treasury, and no power on earth can stop them.
the light shines on obamo wants to cut taxes to the rich oil company's now watch how gop the rightest one turn into your hurting the poor people by cutting the credits to the rich they won't be able to hire the people to drill if we cut there credits off. just like they have been doing for 30 thirty plus years. Give to the rich so they can help the poor, tax the rich and the poor will hurt. Jesus put it best, it's easier for a camel to go Thur a eye of a needle than a rich man to get to heaven. Keep voting gop { GOD } the one keeping track.
What a joke.
End subsidies? Great idea! End all subsidies. Get the govt out of the price fixing business.
Or if it is something King Obama the High One wants for his "peeps" it rises above being a subsidy and becomes an investment?
Has the DoJ concluded yet that it is the Fed and the Obama administration's policies that are the culprits of rising oil prices? Or do they need a few million dollars more to study the issue?
2012 cannot get here soon enough.
ABO.....ABO....ABO....ABO....ABO....ABO....
What you are referring to is puts and calls in options trading. This problem will not be solved by "market forces" overnight. The Europeans have solved the problem by installing a Eurorail sysytem whereby they can go all over Europe for a song,....and somebody else does the driving. Gas prices in Europe are out of sight. Sweden doesn't invade Iraq at every price change in world oil. Any oil extracted from the U.S. goes on the WORLD market. You can produce as much as you want and the world will just yawn.
The Europeans have solved the problem, eh?
Say after the Euro collapses which one of those economic powerhouses gets to foot the bill? You really think the Eurorail will go anywhere other than Germany?
But hey, at least we invaded Libya, right Greg?
After the Euro collapses... more what ifs from Spanky ,as if he has any clue.
Euro seems to be going pretty strong Spanks. Germany has a worker shortage, almost no debt, and their economy is booming. Musta' been that back rub Bush gave to Angela Merkel, that,.....and they didn't have Reagan.
Last I heard it the Eurrail was the way to get around pretty much all of Europe that does not involve getting immersed in water. Read it n' weep.
http://www.eurail.com/countries
Spanks. Do you ever get tired of me making you my Connie b**ch? ;o)
Strong Euro. That has to be a joke.
Eurorail is a collective. It fails the second that the Euro fails.
Boy you sound dumb.
The KOCH... brothers wont allow Speaker Boehner to do anything ....if he does.. the bribes are no longer coming his way ! Its a true fact..... its about the bribes .. the GOP will do everything they can to stop this , not whats in the peoples best interests!