Hillary's stiff arm

Posted: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 9:23 PM by Mark Murray

From NBC's Mark Murray

Chicago's Soldier Field hasn't seen a stiff arm like Hillary Clinton wielded tonight since the days Walter Payton played for the Bears. And if we were to give her stiff arm a nickname, we'd call it the George W. On nearly every question -- whether it was on Iraq, No Child Left Behind, NAFTA, or why lobbyists earn more money than average Americans -- Clinton responded by invoking Bush's presidency or record.

When you're up double digits in the polls, and when you receive tough questions, it's a great tactic to use. And to be fair, she isn't the only Dem who does this on tough questions. But she does it more than most.

At the end of the debate, Obama seemed to make a dig at Clinton's Bush references when he said, "It's not enough to change political parties." It's an argument that Obama, Edwards, and the other Dem candidates will have to make to strip the nomination away from her.

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Comments

So what's the surprise? Hilary's true colors are showing; a viscious pit bull, with a growl that can sound like a black southern baptist in a church. Remember her sudden change in accent when she was addressing black people? Hilary is everything to everyone...except honest. Has she ever answered a question? Has she ever worn a dress??? lol
God help us all if she is elected.

Ken Weaver New Plymouth, Idaho (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:27 AM)

hillary is a dishonest corporate owned wealthy elitist who has no intentions of helping the middle class, where the hell is her healthcare plan? the media pummels edwards plan which will actually work, at least he has a plan that everyone will benefit from, hillary is business as usual, why do you think big business backs her, she will not give a straight answer to any question, take a close look at who backs her, the same people that back giuliani, an administration under her will be no different than what we have now, a fascist regime ran by the lobbyist, if she gets nominated we are all doomed to business as usual, vote for change, hillary offers nothing, if you think she does please explain what it is she offers because I ain’t seeing it

MK,MO (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:36 AM)

Does anyone know where Clinton stands on anything?

Actually we do know a little, and she is impressive. She has been able to drag her Democratic supporters into defending Washington lobbyists and not answering questions about foreign policy.

Paul Miller, Woodbridge, VA (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:37 AM)

Did she actually say she that because of nuke drills ' she remembers hiding under the desk'?
Finally she and Monica have something in common..
WhiteWater, TravelGate, CigarGate they won't go away..

RH Oregon (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:41 AM)

Every answer was anti-Bush. Were does she think that nobody realizes that she is just more politics as usual? She may raise her skirt and run out of Iraq, but everything will still be politics as usual. If you truly want a change don't vote Hillery.
Bush1, Clinton1, Bush2, Clinton2... The song remains the same.
TravelGate, WhiteWater, CigarGate...
Now HilleryCare, HilleryHousing, HilleryHell...

RH Oregon (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:46 AM)

The debate was interesting but I became irritated at the know-it-all tone of Chris Dodd, Joe Biden, and Hillary Clinton (who I might still vote for) The point that they still authorized the war and have not been the beacon of congressional success bites against this experience that they tought. I think Obama handled the pressure pretty well but he seemed to stumble over his words from time to time and Edwards just never said what his position was on anything except give America back to the people. Dennis really was on point at this debate but he is so far left he is touching the right (Keep in mind Pat Buchanan wants to end NAFTA and WTO as well) The polls mean little right now, at this time 2004 Kerry was running behind everyone from Howard Dean to Dick Gephardt so there is alot of room for movement between now and December. All in all, decent debate

Chesseley, Raleigh, NC (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:53 AM)

I was not aware of the debate and stumbled onto it flipping channels. I was immediately drawn in by the rowdy audience and the candidates seemed to pick up on that and were much more animated than before. I was impressed by Obama's composure and his assertive stance on handling the Pakistan question. From the reaction of the crowd it was apparent that they were on his side. Then I watched some of the coverage after. I was expecting them to state the obvious. Obama came out on top because he held off the onslaught and got in a few jabs of his own. Instead the various media experts, including Chuck Todd, basically declared Clinton the winner again.

Apparently the media, instead of rationally discussing the candidates varying views in a substantive way and allowing people to choose for themselves, are doing everything possible to skeu the public view in Clinton's favor. They want her to win because the Clintons against the Republicans would be clash of the titans. The ultimate political drama. Obama's vision of a unified peaceful country doesn't play as well on the Tee Vee. These media pundits are the same people who distorted Al Gore's campaign and allowed outright lies to influence votes. It goes without saying that if the media had been more fair to the candidates in 2000 we might not be in the Bush dark ages right now.

AParks Mt Prospect IL (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:56 AM)

RH - don't leave out that the "smartest woman in the world" actually bought Bill's line about how he was spending so much time with Monica because he was "ministering" to her.

Paul Miller, Woodbridge, VA (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 9:57 AM)

You media guys are certainly out of touch with the voters. We are tired of being taken for granted and having candidates shoved down our throats. It is obvious that you are all Hillary supporters. Who are you polling? I have never received a call;as a 46 year old African American female who has voted in every election since the age of 18, (surprised aren't you) I would have expected to receive a call by now.

Obama is clearly leading in fundraising, crowds, and volunteers. I guess that doesn't equal votes!

Alisha Thompson Texas (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 10:01 AM)

More of the same. I must really be missing something because honestly I just don't see all of this alleged butt-kissing going on with the MSM and Hillary. I admit, I did not watch the debate in its entirety, but the clips I saw did nothing to convince me that Obama is prepared to run this country. I think Hillary's comment about not saying what you think all the time was dead on; world leaders have a responsibility to speak carefully.

Strangely, the more Hillary pulls ahead in the national polls, the more people whine about the MSM handing her the nomination. Coincidence?

Carrie, Eastern Iowa (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 10:44 AM)

I propose to change entirely the american political system by forming at least 5 party system that we'll bring real democratic ideeas onto the american political landscape.The two party system is flawed and already smeared by corruption and corporate influences, money, lobbying and looks more like roman senate than a a 21st century political forum. Amerika ubber alles my dear fellow americans . God help us all.

jdoe boston ma (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 11:06 AM)

Still astounded here that the media folks hand kudo's to Hilary and clamor she "won" the night and trying to actually figure if THEY are part of the "vast right winger" contingency or not in this uberized promotion of Hillary despite that others in the Dem field have much to offer and ordinary folks KNOW/REALIZE it. Found it intersting with Dodd, and for sure, see him carrying water--but he did so in the case of Liebermans retainment as well in Conn.in 2006 and look what that has wrought..should give some insight folks. Richardson is groveling, how many caught his comment that whoever is VP needs to be "ready"/capable of stepping into CIC spot should something or other occur...Bets are thinking that would be a HC/Richardson ticket..first woman, first hispanic to pander to those segments votes to get the prized titles. Think too many are hesitant regarding Obama due to race--just won't admit that indeed there yet remains a racist core in this nation and that makes folks afraid of his electiability no matter how appealing on the issues. Obama had it right on the ark regarding WE THE PEOPE DO NOT WANT NOR CAN WE AFFORD just a name/face/gender change, we do NOT want nor can we afford a Bush/Cheney lite for sure in these troubling times not in our foreign policies nor where our domestic issues are concerned and certainly not due to egregious enfringments of executive empowerment and CONSTITUTIONAL refinements that are NOT in our best intersts nor serving the greater common good of the people or the principles we THOUGHT were sacred !!!!

Bozly, Orange County Ca (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 11:18 AM)

YES BARACK THERE IS A GOD and if barack has been living in this country the last 20 years YES WE DO WANT TO "JUST" SWITCH PARTIES AND THAT WOULD BE ENOUGH<Oh and the next thing barack can use is bushs line we get bin laden DEAD OR ALIVE that quote looks rigodamndiculous now,just as saying if we can act in packistan we will,isnt that the bush doctrine anywhere anytime anyone we will attack when evere we feel threatened COWARD ,thought he was the antio war canidate turns out hes a war canidate afterall

kenn"Some things are best done and not talked about "O (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 11:27 AM)

Hillary was right---haven't we had enough of a president that just blabbers everything out that comes into his head?Axis of evil,bring em on.I'm the decider,mission accomplished,putin has a good heart I'm lookin through his eyes,Good job brownie,There are reams and reams of Bushisms.My favorite?Docs are havin a hard time makin love to their patients.UUUUGGGGHHHH.

HMT-MI (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 11:53 AM)

Surprised at the UNDER estimating folks are allowing..Have no others caught the snips/wuips from the "righties" that GIVE HER SPACE and PROMOTE even ? SHE IS THEIR DREAM OPPOSITION, sure to rally THEIR base as well as others who do NOT swoon at all things Clintonian and frankly folks, many of us are NOT CLinton fans for a number of reasons and not the blathering ones such as Bill penchant for outside marriage vows...Sure good economic times in those years of HIS reign, but NOT all his doing and we rather DO know that and as for Hillary being THE most "expertised" in foreign affairs /executive decisons...get a reality check and examine that a bit more fully. She was FIRST LADY, and yes, has traveled to many countries but she did NOT formulate polcies. Her tenure as a one full term, now into second term Senator has been more of a nonstop "campaign" pandering all along in the quest for becoming the first female face to hold the CIC title. NOT GOOD ENOUGH for a mere gender change, and her experience/expertise has had her backing/allowing the transfer of powers that delivered to us the egregious quagmire which is Iraq and all the inherent consequencing that DOES need mitigating but she does NOT show even the propensity nor the AUTHENTICITY needed to accomplish such so we would continue with the SAME-O's running us further amuck !!!

Bozly (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 12:13 PM)

Hillary will be our next president. She's as tough as nails and smart too. The Clintons are very powerful and thats what we will need to go up against the lying, scumbag republicans. She will prevail.

F StLouis (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 12:33 PM)

Honest, folks, you've convinced me. There is no way I'm voting for George Bush this time!

Richard, Washington State (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 12:43 PM)

I'm seeing the future in this blog. Hillary will be nominated and then a new party will be formed out of frustration. The third party will be the "Outsiders" and their party platform will consist of three planks: 1) "George Bush Is/Was an A******. 2)All Republicans are morons. 3)Hillary Clinton is a b****.

In their enthusiasm to change things the outsider candidate will garner 7-9% of the vote and we will have 1992 in reverse, except Rudy will get 47% instead of the 43% Bill got.

Hillary will get 45% and the outsiders will remain outsiders with 8% but they will make a statement and that's what counts. They will even call it a "victory".

Based on the anti-Hillary tone (on the part of Democrats)that permeates the blogs, I'm not sure everything will revert to "kumbaya" when she's nominated. It's way too early, but I'm beginning to feel better about 2008.

Hillary would still have an outside chance of becoming president by getting a majority of the electoral vote, but she would have to concede anyway because we know Democrats don't believe in winning by electoral votes.

Anyway, be careful Dems. This one is yours to lose and it's going to be fun watching you try.

Richard, Washington State (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 1:20 PM)

Leave Hillary alone. She will be the nominee so better get on board.

Mary (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 1:35 PM)

Hillary does NOT come off as AUTHENTIC, that point seems to escape a few too many, and the MSM is not exactly in tune with the general populace that find it so as well. Tuff as Nails? She is perservering, but she panders according to the audience and that is apparent as well. There are far fewer who are so willing to "settle" for such and know that we need someone far more capable. Trash Obama for speaking up in regard to acknowledging that IF there was "actionable intelligence" , he would not take any options off the table...LOL, Hillary has said the very same and caught her copting other Obama stances as well. Obama stated it well, for all her expertise,experience she DID vote to give that authoriztion to Bush and has never regretted it nor apologized let alone, admitted it as a major mistake that experience/expertise did not save her from so doing !!! If you are willing to allow MORE of the SAME-O's to helm, can see where you so willing to allow such as Hillary be your choice but it is NOT good enough for many of us nor would it prove to be a good choice for the nation !!!!

Bozly (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 1:37 PM)

Bozly (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 1:39 PM)

Don't worry everyone. Soon Hillary will be in charge, and you will never have to worry about health care, the government will pay for it; bankruptcy, the government will bail you out; war, Hillary will have Biden negotiate the terrorists away; the deficit, Clinton will take the money from the rich to pay off the deficit and the debt; global warming, all corporate factories will be shut down; hunger, Hillary will feed the poor; equality, we will all be equal in all ways; taxes, only the rich will pay, all others will not be taxed.

I for one cannot wait.

Lisa Young, Charlotte NC (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 1:52 PM)

Curious, we argue that we want someone from outside the "beltway", we want someone who is willing to take a stand on principle, and we don't particularly care if they have the intelectual where-with-all to actually make the Country run.
Seems to me that's exactly what we have now.

I urge you all to take a close look at your local politicians,, all the way up the chain, town, County, State and Federal and ask one question: "Is this the best we can do?"
Re-elect no-one

Norm, Winnsboro SC (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 2:29 PM)

LOL, yeah LY, sure is alot of yadda-yadda-ing and wishing ful "wantings" catered/pandered to as well. Have folks REALLY remained so easily manipulable ? Time will tell, the bells and whistles are sounding but HAVE folks really learned the harsh lessons with the examples of the Bushlerized years of reign witb all the various blunders, bumbles and bungles exposed and revealed or are they still sipping koolaid and wearing rose colored glasses while heads still stuck in the sandpits of reality....time will tell.

Bozly (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 2:39 PM)

I'm so sick of the press coverage of Clinton & Obama.
There are candidates on that stage that have 25+ years of both domestic and foreign policy experience and records of achievements and never get a chance to speak. The press manipulates every debate, every poll and every question.

8 years as First Lady doesn't qualify as experience to be president, 50 trips to foreign countries don't count as foreign policy achievements, and rookie senators (and that includes Ms. Clinton - she's a JR. SENATOR JUST LIKE OBAMA!)don't have what it takes to undo the damage done to this country.

Here's a novel idea - how about we actually have a real debate on the issues. No scripted questions (and that includes that ridiculous YouTube joke of a debate)and everyone has the same amount of time to answer it and each candidate gets to answer the same questions. No more directing which candidate gets to speak their robotic rehearsed answers!

I want answers. And Clinton's "we're not going to answer hypothetics" is not an answer. And that, to me does not constitue a winner in my book!

cr, nj (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 2:42 PM)

Jerry was making the same predictions on NOV. 5 2006......remember jerry ........yeah karl says he has the math ........sounds like dare I say it MISSION ACCOMPLISHED midnight snack? how about yours and every other loyal lemming.

KENN"I DIDNT GET YOUR RANK"O (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 2:58 PM)

oh delaware republican hows your team workin on values fred macain newti Rudi three wives .scumbag ?the only man out of the bunch who saved his marriage is the guy you call scumbag,makes you go um........

Kenn"check yourself before you wreck yourself repub"O (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 3:02 PM)

If Hillary wins the nomination, I am voting for Ron Paul. At least, he is honest.

King, Dallas, Texas (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 3:21 PM)

It's quite amazing that during the coverage after the debate msnbc did not mention Clinton being booed after chastising Obama on speaking his mind. This was the immediate reaction from the floor yet what the media would have us believe is that Clinton won

Go Obama!

Urich (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 3:45 PM)

Norm - It all sounds very familiar, doesn't it? Bush was supposed to bring a different feel to the White House - the cowboy from TX who would stand up for what he believed in no matter who disagreed with him. He seemed like such a nice guy, didn't he? Someone the average American could relate to...could sit down and have a beer (er, soda) with at the end of a long day.

Be careful what you wish for.

Carrie, Eastern Iowa (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 3:46 PM)

Bozly babbles:LOL, yeah LY, sure is alot of yadda-yadda-ing and wishing ful "wantings" catered/pandered to as well. Have folks REALLY remained so easily manipulable ? Time will tell, the bells and whistles are sounding but HAVE folks really learned the harsh lessons with the examples of the Bushlerized years of reign witb all the various blunders, bumbles and bungles exposed and revealed or are they still sipping koolaid and wearing rose colored glasses while heads still stuck in the sandpits of reality....time will tell.

Pay attention everyone. This why you should never, ever use a random word generator.

Lisa Young, Charlotte NC (Sent Wednesday, August 08, 2007 5:55 PM)

I have yet to see Hillary bring up any issues by herself. Obama on the otherhand is not afraid to answer and discuss the issues brought up by the people. Hillary listens to what Obama says goes back to her dig to do a small poll and find out what people would like to hear, and then spits out what the poll thinks is the right answer. This is no way to run a country. Under Hillary, lobbyists, Bubba and other pundits who do the polling will be running the country. They will run it to the ground.

D'Souza (Sent Thursday, August 09, 2007 1:39 AM)

"Leave Hillary alone. She will be the nominee so better get on board." I don't mean offense, but Mary, is that what you tell yourself?

HMT: "Hillary was right---haven't we had enough of a president that just blabbers everything out that comes into his head?Axis of evil,bring em on."

It might surprise you to know that "Axis of evil" was a very intentional, crafted phrase by David Frum, former Bush speechwriter.

Jan, Nashua, NH: "Have any of you noticed that her support is actually GROWING? I guess that makes everyone but Clinton Haters just plain stupid?"

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/daily_presidential_tracking_poll__1
Perhaps this is a blip, or perhaps not.

When she rolls out comprehensive policy speeches, she will open herself to attack and may not enjoy her position now afforded by not taking a stand on issues.

Jeff Morgan, Austin, TX (Sent Thursday, August 09, 2007 1:55 AM)

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