First thoughts: Fred's debut

Posted: Monday, October 08, 2007 9:33 AM by Domenico Montanaro
Filed Under: First Thoughts

From NBC’s Chuck Todd and Domenico Montanaro

*** Fred's debut: All eyes are on Fred Thompson this week as he makes his debate debut at the CNBC/MSNBC/The Wall Street Journal debate on Tuesday from Dearborn, Michigan. It is the first Republican Presidential debate of the 2008 campaign focusing on economic issues, and will be broadcast live on CNBC at 4 PM ET, live streamed on msnbc.com, and re-broadcast on MSNBC at 9 PM ET. CNBC's Maria Bartiromo and MSNBC's Chris Matthews will host the debate. So how much detail will he have at his fingertips? Will he show real enthusiasm for winning? Perhaps the best thing to happen to Thompson was the "SNL" parody, which helps lower expectations even more. And the "SNL" parody served as a guide as to what NOT to do, and what not to say; what stereotype traps NOT to fall into. Here's a good question for the Thompson campaign, did they have the candidate watch the parody?

*** Edwards’ last stand: What is it about politicians on the brink that bring out their potential best? Edwards is getting very comfortable becoming the chief Clinton attacker on the stump. Does this help him or Obama, though, in Iowa? Remember, in '04, when one-time Iowa frontrunner Dick Gephardt started getting more strident on the stump (and attacking the then-frontrunner Howard Dean)? Both went down. This is certainly the scenario Obama is counting on. But for Edwards, he doesn't have much choice. Since, as he notes, he's yet to run a sustained TV campaign in Iowa, he needs to garner as much free media as he can. By the Way, check out his electability argument against Clinton. It was one of his strongest moments on "Meet" Sunday. Watch Obama borrow that language.

*** New Year's in Iowa! State Republican leaders met via conference call last Friday night and agreed to "recommend" Jan. 3rd as their caucus date. Democrats have not picked a date yet, but Democratic sources say that -- contrary to rumors flying around last week -- the two parties are unlikely to split their caucuses over two different nights. So there ya have it folks, Iowa will be Jan. 3 (probably announced the week of Oct. 15 in a bipartisan way if it gets negotiated in time). It may have been necessary for Iowa to hurry up and grab a date before New Hampshire's Bill Gardner decided to snatch either the 3rd or the 5th. Now, N.H. either goes the 8th or leapfrogs to December.

*** Speaking of Iowa, there's no poll that gets (and deserves) more attention than the Des Moines Register poll by ace Iowa pollster Ann Selzer. The bottom line: Clinton's surging; Edwards is slipping; and Obama's stalling. Clinton appears to be benefiting from her gender and from her concerted effort to woo older Iowans. On the GOP side, the big buzz is for Fred Thompson's second-place showing (does he have the organization to sustain that?) and Huckabee's third-place finish, just ahead of Giuliani. For Romney, his campaign is probably hoping Thompson's showing is enough to lure the new candidate into seriously contesting the state. By the way, don't miss the collective media C.W. all starting to treat Iowa as make-or-break for the Democratic side while holding off on making that claim for the GOP side. Over the weekend, Clinton was challenged by an Iowan on Iran. Look for more campaign trail confrontations for the candidates now that things are getting even tighter and more (desperate?) for some of Clinton's foes.

*** Rudy's ambition: Today is a big deal for Italian-Americans and the New York Daily News uses Columbus Day as a backdrop to look at how Giuliani is tapping into Italian-Americans for his campaign. Perhaps the best scoop in the Daily News piece: Giuliani first began thinking about running for president in 1963. Okay, "thinking" is a bit of a stretch but it's one of those "moments" we in the media love to find out about in our presidents. Remember, we LIKE our presidents to have ambition. By the way, Columbus Day (parade and all) coupled with the Yankees comeback win last night sure makes for an interesting day in NYC.

*** Quick hitters: Future of the GOP stories are starting to hit critical mass; Goldwater HBO doc will add fuel ... Is Al Gore campaigning for a Nobel Prize? And if he adds a Nobel to his Oscar- and Emmy-heavy resume this Friday, will Obama-weary anti-Clinton Democrats renew their draft calls? ... The upcoming joint Biden-Brownback Iowa event has us wondering why other second-tier candidates haven’t paired up in a bipartisan way. Imagine how excited the Davids (Broder and Yepsen) would be if Huckabee and Biden did a Lincoln-Douglas schtick across Iowa? ... The Los Angeles Times has a great "how's-she's-done-it" piece on Clinton ... Has Richardson's new anti-war track hurt him in South Carolina? At least with one supporter. ... By the way, will Obama ever travel to South Carolina and not talk about faith?

***On the trail: Biden continues to campaign in Iowa with five stops, including four meet and greets and a house party; Brownback campaigns in his home state of Kansas; Clinton makes four stops in Iowa, including a speech on economic prosperity and three organizational rallies; Dodd makes five stops in Iowa, including two community forums; Edwards makes three stops in Iowa; Hunter is in Michigan at the North Oakland Republican Club Presidential Forum; Obama speaks on energy in New Hampshire; Elizabeth Edwards has four stops in New Hampshire where she discusses health care.

Countdown to MA-05 special election: 19 days
Countdown to LA GOV election: 12 days
Countdown to Election Day 2007: 29 days
Countdown to LA GOV run-off (if necessary): 40 days
Countdown to Iowa: 87days
Countdown to New Hampshire: 92 days
Countdown to Michigan: 99 days
Countdown to SC GOP primary: 103 days
Countdown to Florida: 113 days
Countdown to Tsunami Tuesday: 120 days
Countdown to Election Day 2008: 393 days
Countdown to Inauguration Day 2009: 470 days

EMAIL THIS

Comments

Don't look now, but Bush sucks. Impeach Bush.

z (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:42 AM)

If Hillary was having a 40 days campaign on faith and family you would be in the church praying to her.
For your information, Obama has a 40 days of faith and family campaign in which he goes to SC to different churches and if asked to speak will.
but, may I ask, will there ever come a time when you guys report the facts fairly and not just kiss Hillary's a** or is that what you and the rest of her loyal poodles on msnbc get paid to do. By the clinton.

diane (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:42 AM)

I wonder about that Hillary surging in Iowa comment and yet she gets challanged by a guy at a meeting and she comes out snarling. Guess media matters will be looking for that guy today.

One has to wonder who is the chief Hillary attacker on the Edwards campaign; John or Elizabeth? In a way, John Edwards is more electable then Hillary Clinton because he does not carry as much baggage as Hillary does.

jerry/corpus christi texas (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:54 AM)

Its going to be Guliani and Clinton and she will win in a landslide. We are going to have another Clinton in office....to clean up Bushs disasterous mess. She will be wonderful.

Students at UNF (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:57 AM)

I'm guessing Chris Matthews' first question to Thompson will have something to do with his wife's age, or possibly something else more irrelevant.

Dan G Pensacola, FL (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:57 AM)

The more the repubs rail against Clinton and spew their hatred,the stronger this woman will become. Bill was really tough but Hillary is even tougher.

JeanneGA (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:58 AM)

Al Gore! Even Democrats aren't that stupid.

Frank (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:01 AM)

The repubs keep calling Hillary shrill, and it is them who are becoming shrill. They go after her for apologizing to a guy who confronted her and when has Bush ever apologized to anyone. Shes intelligent and open minded and doesn't take crap from anyone. Sounds like a leader to me and the right wingers are shaking in their boots just thinking about her becoming president and turning this country back around to helping the middle class. They cannot stand this. I hope she kicks butt.

Susan, Miami (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:03 AM)

diane is a big crybaby. Just vote for Guliani, phoney democrat.

G (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:04 AM)

I saw Edwards on MTP and I thought his strongest moment came when he said, very matter of factly, that its not about what happens to him personally, but about the millions of people who will still be uninsured if the Republicans win. Political reporters get so caught up in this peronality thing, they seem to forget what is really at stake. If Obama or Edwards win, we will see real change after eight years of mismanagement and decline.

Amy B Portland ME (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:07 AM)

It is obvious we do not need another moron in office when Thompson stated recently that are main foreign policy concerns are China and the Soviet Union. Hello!!!!Can someone please inform the man that it nolonger exists. Apparently, he been the last few days, not doing any campaigning so he can catch up on his homework. GEEZ IS THIS THE GREAT WHITE HOPE THE CHRISTIAN RIGHT WAS HOPING FOR?

juan,ft lauderdale,fl (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:13 AM)

It was announced today that Sandy Berger, former clinton security advisor will be joining the Hillary Clinton Campaign. Berger as some of you know pleaded guilty, to stealing Top Secrets Documemts for the National Archives, to prevent the 911 commission from tying Bill Clinton to Terrorism, or the lack there of in protecting the country from Al Queda. Berger also gave up his law license to avoid answering questions pertaining to the Top Secrets documents.. Many in the Clinton circle is wondering about Hillarys choseing Berger, Again this scandal, involving national Security, is not being reported by NBC, CBS, ABC, CNN,or MSNBC. Reference: WWW.DRUDGEREPORT.COM. IS the lead up to another attack on US coming and the Clintons want to look the other way again? embassies not protected, American war shipships blown up, id this what we have to look forward to under another clinton presidencey... Joe Biden/ Edwards 08

Joes the man USA (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:13 AM)

You know things are going well when you lash out and accuse everyone of being against you. No, wait, that's paranoia.
The polls are rigged, the media is a co-conspirator, everyone who doesn't agree with me is uninformed, brainwashed, stupid, or worse.
If things started suddenly going your way, would that indicate that your candidate had made a better pact with the devil, becoming PART of the machine, or that the sour grapes, wild accusations and paranoid fantasies were just that?

George (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:19 AM)

I have noticed with the campaign heading towards the end how the media, in compliance with the dictates of the Clintons, have been stepping up their gushing on the wonders of Hillary and their attacks on Obama.

diane (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 9:48 AM)

You know things are going well when you lash out and accuse everyone of being against you. No, wait, that's paranoia.
The polls are rigged, the media is a co-conspirator, everyone who doesn't agree with me is uninformed, brainwashed, stupid, or worse.
If things started suddenly going your way, would that indicate that your candidate had made a better pact with the devil, becoming PART of the machine, or that the sour grapes, wild accusations and paranoid fantasies were just that?

George (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:23 AM)

Sandy Berger working as an unpaid advisor to Hillary Clinton?

I guess we know where that $850,000 in campaign returns is going to.

I hope Sandy is not going to be stuffing paperwork down his greasy shorts anymore.

Criminals hiring criminals; The Clinton Motto

jerry/corpus christi texas (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:23 AM)

Dems won't hold impeachment hearings for the Worst. President. Ever. because it would be harmful to Hillary's presidential ambitions - with the media focused on OTHER impeachment hearings.
Heck! Obama doesn't even think Bush has committed impeachable offenses!! He probably got a bunch of Repub donation$ after that statement. That must be what Obama calls "working across the aisle."

annefrank, FL (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:24 AM)

"I don't oppose all wars. And I know that in this
crowd today, there is no shortage of patriots, or of
patriotism. What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I
am opposed to is a rash war."

-Barack Obama Anti-War Rally, Chicago 2002

Barack Obama opposed Hillary Clinton's dumb war in 2002.

Hillary Clinton can't guarantee that she'd have us out of Iraq by 2013 if she were elected President

Hillary Clinton, 15 years of dishonesty, scandal and divisiveness

Sierra, SF (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:25 AM)

The Clintons have REFUSED to release the list of donors to the Clinton Library - however news reports indicate the Saudi and Dubai governments are among them.
When will the media step up and urge the Clintons to release the names?
Tick...tick...tick....

Margaret, NYC (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:28 AM)

I'm sure Fred, being a Politician, does what all the other Politicians do, and only watches himself on TV.

Steve Turner Cedar Falls Iowa (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:28 AM)

Mr Todd,
So Obama will borrow Edwards language to make a point, you think? This man wrote two best seller book. I was listening book review on C-SPAN other day and pundits said his first book "dreams from my father" was an American classic that people will read even after 100 years with a lot of interest. The man who started as a community organizer to help people who are in need. The man who defeated his opponent in 2004 Senate by 70% to 26% margin, one of the highest margin if not the highest margin of victory. The man who taught essence of constitution law. A man who can bring thousands of people on their feet by his oratory and passion and eloquence. You think he needs someone's borrowed word to make his point?

How about look at Clinton? She copy many exact phrases from Obama: "I will work with Republican (when never did before", "I will go to UN and declare America is back", "there is no good option in Iraq, there is no military solution (when she always pushed forward only military solution)", how about stealing the whole "change" argument from Obama? How about stealing from Bill Richardson the phrase" with me, you get both change and experience". I can keep going on and on. She is so scripted. Even now her script is not enough. She has to steal other people's words. When a question is asked beyond her scripts then either the question is hypothetical or the person who is asking is a "plant" from competition.

You folks on this page are pathetic. You have to add grains of salt on Obama always, even when the story has nothing to do with Obama. That tells people, he is the man with enthusiasm, he is the man loved by people except hired pundits. That you guys and your candidate Clinton is SOOOOO scared about Obama candidacy.
Tell me honestly, are you guys racist? Are you guys implementing Rupert Murdoch's mission? Are you guys bought by Zionist influence of money and media. It's clear Hillary is sold to those. Seems you guys are lining up as well. Guess what, someday you will have to answer to the people of this country for selling the essence of an honest profession: Journalism. I am waiting for that day.

Arshad, Newburgh, NY (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:30 AM)

I see George McGovern is throwing his support to the Hillary campaign; hopefully this will be the kiss of death for her white house run.

Who accepts anything from someone who got whipped in 49 states?

jerry/corpus christi texas (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:30 AM)

Hillary is not ahead in Iowa - because the poll is 7 MOE.
But the media certainly likes touting the polling for 311 Iowans.

Richard, FL (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:30 AM)

From The Politico:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1007/6219.html
Penn-Blackwater link puts HRC on defense

By: Ben Smith
Oct 5, 2007 05:39 PM EST

Penn is a singular figure in Clinton’s orbit, often
described as her Karl Rove.

Hillary Clinton found herself defending her chief
strategist Friday after The Associated Press reported
that the public relations company Mark Penn runs had
helped prepare the chief of the controversial military
contractor Blackwater USA for his congressional
testimony.

“Mark Penn did no work on the Blackwater account,”
Clinton spokesman Howard Wolfson said Friday
afternoon.

Burson-Marsteller, of which Penn is Worldwide
President and CEO, “has cut its ties to Blackwater and
that was the right thing to do. Mark is and remains a
valuable member of our team,” Wolfson said....'

Why did Mark Penn HAVE TIES with Blackwater in the first place ? Penn also defended the Argentine military dictatorship and anti union corporations.
Why would Hillary select this evil dwarf to lead her campaign ?

'...Penn’s unusual dual role as corporate executive and presidential strategist has been a running source of distraction for Clinton’s typically single-minded
campaign. Though her supporters believe that voters
will ultimately be unlikely to make their choice based
on the actions of a consultant who is little known
outside political circles, Penn has drawn a steady
stream of criticism from other campaigns and from key
Democratic groups.

Labor leaders objected to his firm’s work against
union organizing, and Burson-Marsteller’s work for
clients that include the tobacco industry and a
leading, troubled subprime mortgage lender,
Countrywide Financial, have also drawn fire...'

Nark Penn is a 'union buster' !
Why would Hillary hire a 'union buster' ?
Why would any honest union support Hillary ?

'...“Bush has been a perfect example of cronyism, because Blackwater has given hundreds of thousands of dollars to Republicans and to President Bush. I also saw this morning that Sen. Clinton’s primary adviser, Mark Penn, who is like her Karl Rove — his firm is
representing Blackwater,” former North Carolina Sen.
John Edwards said in Iowa Friday.

“I think it is important for Iowa caucus-goers to
understand the choices they have in this election. And
it is the reason I continue to say we don’t want to
replace a group of corporate Republicans with a group
of corporate Democrats.” ...'

Corporate Democrats !!
Why support crooked Hillary ?

Sierra, SF (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:33 AM)

I thought Edwards made a great showing on MTP Sunday. He answered Russert directly and intelligently. If he joined forces with Obama, they would be unstoppable.

Jim, Santa Cruz (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:34 AM)

Thompson will fall flat on his face, but the repubs desperate for someone, anyone other than Guliani, will praise him and call him Ronald Reagan. What a joke!

G (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:36 AM)

Pretty sad that the best conservatives can do is throw bombs at the Democratic candidates with nothing positive to say about the Republicans. Although there's plenty of time for the momentum to change I'll say this about the Iowa Poll; it's virtually always in the ballpark. I've been watching it my entire adult life and on every issue and candidate the poll provides a good snapshot. Personally I'm a little disappointed because I'd prefer to see Edwards as the candidate, but my conversations with Republicans indicate that Romney is very strong in Iowa. The people I talk to do not trust Giuliani.

John B, Des Moines, IA (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:46 AM)

Big news for Hillary in the last 48 hours......

Hires a convicted felon as a unpaid advisor.....

Gets the ultimate liberal loser to back her campaign, considering he got horsewhipped in 49 states.....

going to be a long week for that girl.

jerry/corpus christi texas (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:47 AM)

Our Next President? But Fred Thompson could be the MAN!

All the others are JUST Washington Paper Hangers which are like teats on a a borer hog. America has lost the meaning of law and order. Kangaroo courts and judges, ego driven revenue cops, meaningless borders, self serving Washington Agenda.

What good is there in stateing your opinion,, Washington could careless what we think or say. Its all in the Hands of the Washington Paper Hanging self serving idiots!!!

Stated truth / AZ (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 10:59 AM)

I've come to the conclusion that people of little character and child-like behaviors also have small letters for a name. g z

Jim B. Towanda, PA (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:00 AM)

the only honest man the republicans have to offer is ron paul, which explains why they keep the squelch turned up on him, honesty and politics don't mix, this whole election cycle is an absolute farce with the ultimate loser being the american citizen, business as usual, you bet

MK,MO (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:04 AM)

Hey Hillary,

Are you stacking your nest with convicted felons?? Seems like someone is watching you very close. Of Course,, ""You Know Nothing about HSU and now this felon.. Stinking foul Washington Paper Hangers always hang themselves!!!

I'll give you a free rope Hillary,, Do America a favor

Hard Facts / AZ (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:07 AM)

First Read ".....Giuliani first began thinking about running for president in 1963. Okay, "thinking" is a bit of a stretch but it's one of those "moments" we in the media love to find out about in our presidents.".....
*****************************************************
Could you be anymore biased?
No matter....Gigolo Rudy "G" isnt't winning anything in '08'
(....and you know it)

J. Merle Stanley, Westchester, NY (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:08 AM)

Obama: Has a Turnaround Begun?

Monday, October 08, 2007
Advertisment

In the first few months of 2007, Barack Obama burst onto the national political scene and quickly took hold of the number two slot in the race for the Democratic Presidential Nomination.

For the month of April, just before the first of way too many Presidential debates, Obama’s support averaged 31% in the Rasmussen Reports weekly national polling update and he seemed poised to audition for the role of frontrunner (see summary of weekly poll results).

But, those April numbers represented a peak for Obama. His numbers slipped to 27% in May, 26% in June, 25% in July and 23% in August. He managed to stabilize in September and hold steady at 23%. For the week ending October 7, his numbers have inched back up a few points. It’s too early to tell if this is a turnaround, but it is worth watching.

One possibility is that Obama is gaining ground at the expense of John Edwards. The 2004 Vice Presidential nominee has struggled in both polls and fundraising. He recently announced that his campaign will accept public financing and all the restrictions that entails. Still, Edwards does better than any other Democrat in general election match-ups against GOP hopefuls (see summary of all match-ups and other key stats for Democratic and Republican candidates).

Through it all, Hillary Clinton remains the Democratic frontrunner. As noted a week ago, her nomination is not inevitable. However, she has gained support throughout the year and is showing no signs of letting it slip away. Rather than a sudden surge of support, Clinton’s approach has been slow and steady. She was supported by 33% of Likely Democratic Primary Voters in April. Her support then increased to 35% in May, 36% in June, 39% in July and 41% in August. It slipped a point to 40% in September but is up to 42% in early October.
For the seven days ending October 7, 2007, Hillary Clinton earns 42% of the vote. Barack Obama is second at 26% followed by John Edwards at 12%. Bill Richardson attracts 4% while Joe Biden is at 3% and Dennis Kucinich at 2%. Chris Dodd is supported by 1% Mike Gravel less than half a percent. Ten percent (13%) of Likely Democratic Primary Voters are undecided (review history of weekly results).

The seven day results typically include interviews with more than 1,000 Likely Democratic Primary Voters. This includes both Democrats and those independents likely to vote in a Democratic Primary. In some state primaries, independent voters are allowed to participate in party primaries while in others they are excluded. The margin of sampling error for the weekly update is +/- 3 percentage points with a 95% level of confidence.

Updates prior to July 16 were based upon four days of polling conducted the Monday through Thursday preceding release.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/2008_democratic_presidential_primary

Van

vanreuter, NY NY (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:16 AM)

fred DOES look a lot like a monkey - maybe he could replace the one we have.

Monkeys are people, too (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:18 AM)

vanreuter, NY NY (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:21 AM)

Fred, has few original thoughts so he will hijack Ron Paul's campaign and say he is the next Ronnie Reagan.
The momentum is with Paul after a half year of filtering candidates. Fred's people acknowledge this and the only question is, does he steal Paul's issues
one by one or come out all at once.

Next, Fred will get dressed up with a straw hat, buy a shotgun and pick-up truck, chop some wood, ride a horse, etc.

Fred's people will not let Fred be Fred. The Ron Paul camp should be aware.

Ron R. Pittsburgh, Pa (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:22 AM)

Nixon was awesome remember jerry,oh thats right you werent born yet.Oh he did wonders for this country a secret war in cambodia where MIAs were never reported ,watergate and his lies to the US,made friends with the red monster MAO,yea, mcgovern would have been worse ,in what ways?

Kenn"LETS REWRITE HISTORY"O (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:25 AM)

hillary clinton continues to display what a corrupt, dishonest, and corporate owned entity she is, and the media continues to praise her, they can't give a coherent reason for praising her, but praise her they must, seems to be the general consensus of all her backers, we don't know why we back her but we sure as hell do, a single file line of sheep obediently marching to the slaughter-house

MK,MO (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:30 AM)

Margaret NYC please tell me where to find a list of the contributors to the George H W Bush library, the Reagan library and the Nixon library.

Rufus Gibbons, DC (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:37 AM)

Yeah, Jerry, we are SO lucky we got Nixon instead of McGovern, that went so well... you gonna crow about the 2000 coronation, excuse me, election now? You and the other 30 percenters who still are glad we got Bush rather than Gore? Same people who are cheering for a win in Iraq like its a freakin' football game. Get some perspective, folks. Republicans get elected and people die in astonishing numbers. Keep that in mind. McGovern would have had us out of Vietnam in early '73, saving many American lives.

Doug, San Diego (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:42 AM)

Kenn"LETS REWRITE HISTORY"O - mcgovern would have been worse ,in what ways?

We'd be speaking Russian now.

russ gwen (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:46 AM)

I'm wondering, ""VAN" You like Hillary are misleading in the subject matter,,,more like twisting subject matter to be self serving. Just maybe you have a big tree in your back yard Hillary and you can use!!!

P.S. """STFU"""

Hard Truth //AZ (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:47 AM)

I'll give you a free rope Hillary,, Do America a favor

Hard Facts / AZ (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:07 AM)

Gee, I wonder what the responses will be to this person?
I wonder what they would be if this post was directed at senator Obama?

I hope that everyone can agree on joining in condemnation of this post and the troubled sould responsible. Get help! Now!

Van

I'm sure then you will agree in condeming "First Read's' ( in an earlier post today) use of the phrase "WARNING PEOPLE OBAMA WOULD ATTEND BLACK CHURCHES' Why does that require a warning? Is there something that they impy should be feared by a Black Man attending a Black church...what about a white church. What about a woman meeting with a group of women.

Rarely if ever do I agree with Van... but on this I will. That type of language has no place, in light of current events. The language is too inflamatory ( however, I must state the reference does have different connations when used against Black People)and it does not advance any dialogue.

First Read has repeatedly made snide and veil racist comments and MSNBC should be called to account, people who use words for a living should be held reponsible for their choices.

Lyn, MD (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:47 AM)

vanreuter, NY NY in his infinite wisdom proclaims / 'I hope that everyone can agree on joining in condemnation of this post and the troubled sould responsible. Get help! Now!'

maybe everyone should ban together and condemn your spelling instead. Get spell-check! Now!

you pompous illiterate oaf, it must suck to be you

MK,MO (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:49 AM)

FOR INFO ON THE STORY NOT BEING COVERED BY THE MSM:

http://www.northcarolinaconservative.com/index.php?subaction=showfull&id=1188428152&archive=&start_from=&ucat=&

WHERE IS THE MEDIA COVERAGE and WHY aren't they on this story???

A (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:56 AM)

From the DailyKos:
http://www.dailykos.com/

'...How anti-war is Hillary?
by kos
Mon Oct 08, 2007 at 08:08:56 AM PDT
Retired general endorses Clinton, says she doesn't oppose the Iraq war at all.

A retired U.S. Army general visiting [New Hampshire] to campaign for Hillary Clinton said yesterday she does not oppose the Iraq war -- and she said she's never heard Clinton oppose it, either [...]

Kennedy said, "I don't oppose the war. I think it's being very badly led by the civilian leadership." And, [Retired Lt. Gen. Claudia Kennedy] added, "I have not ever heard (Clinton) say, 'I oppose the war.' I've heard her say that we need to begin withdrawal under a plan led by the military and defense secretary. I've heard her say we need to create a regional stabilizing group by allies, by leaders in the world and by all of the states that are bordering Iraq. That is a very important idea and the point of that group is to create incentive and assurances that will keep the neighboring countries from becoming involved and entering Iraq. That's a much more sophisticated thing than saying, 'I oppose the war.'"

Huh? What the heck is she talking about? Is this some pathetic attempt to differentiate herself (and HIllary, by extension), from those dirty fucking hippies that just want to, er, end the war?

But if she wants to broadcast to all of New Hampshire that Hillary is not anti-war, then by all means, she should keep doing so.

More troubling than a confused retired general is this:

At a campaign stop here, Hillary Clinton sparred verbally for several minutes with a man who pressed her on her recent vote to call Iran's army a terrorist organization.
Randall Rolph, from nearby Nashua, asked why he should support Clinton's candidacy when she did not appear to have learned any lessons from having voted to authorize force in Iraq.

Clinton thanked him for the question and explained her Iran vote would lay the groundwork for using diplomacy and sanctions to pressure that government.

Clinton accused the man of being a plant who had been sent to ask the question, to which he took exception, saying the question was a result of his own research.

"I apologize," Clinton said, explaining that she had been asked the very same question in three other places.

She's being asked that question because many can't believe that Hillary is so damn stupid as to give George Bush a rationale for attacking Iran.

She really didn't learn her lesson the first time. Is she seriously claiming that this resolution was really needed to "lay the groundwork for using diplomacy and sanctions"? What, was Condi Rice (remember her?) hamstrung on her ability to conduct diplomacy without Congress giving her the thumbs up?

Does she think her audience is that stupid? Apparently so.

No wonder she won't apologize for screwing up the Iraq War Authorization. She sees nothing wrong with that vote, and has every intention of casting that kind of vote over and over again...'

'...Does she think her audience is that stupid? Apparently so...'

Especially her supporters!! (see above)
Hillary IS NOT ANTI-WAR !
Hillary is PRO-WAR !!

'...She's being asked that question because many can't believe that Hillary is so damn stupid as to give George Bush a rationale for attacking Iran...'

Hillary is PRO IRAN WAR !!
Why else would she vote for this ?

Hillary has said she won't guarantee an end date for leaving Iraq !!
If SHE can't guarantee an end date for leaving Iraq
Why did she ask Bush for and end date ?

Just political positioning !!

Hillary Clinton, 15 years of dishonesty, scandal and divisiveness

Sierra, SF (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 12:00 PM)

I don't think you can qualify a 6 point lead in Iowa with a margin for error of 4 as surging. Especially since polls are so difficult to track in Iowa. Other polls have a statisical dead heat and one with Obama in the lead. I think it's still a 3way tie.

sonya, atlanta, ga (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 12:02 PM)

Thanks Lyn-

When it comes to bigotry, race-baiting, lynching references, etc., we should all be able to put aside our differences to agree that this type of stuff is sick, unless they are sick too (MK).
MSNBC is often guilty of the yellow journalism you refer to. They do their best to toss red meat into our respective cages to get the maximum response, often at the expense of the truth, and more often then not, good taste.

No, Lyn, we don't often agree, it's true, but we are united in our hatred of bigotry and those who espouse it, endorse it and in the case of MSNBC, encourage it.

Van

vanreuter, NY NY (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 12:17 PM)

G: '...diane is a big crybaby. Just vote for Guliani, phoney democrat....'

uThe Clinton Cult Charm Offensive continues.
More mindless nonsense from g.
Does THAT little boy have anything meaningful to say ?

Why don't you condemn THAT, van ?
As long as you're now regulating speech on this blog....

;-0

Sierra, SF (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 12:19 PM)

"...maybe everyone should BAN together and condemn your spelling instead. Get spell-check! Now!
MK,MO (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 11:49 AM)

Let's all BAN together for spell-check!

It must be a laugh-riot to be you, I'm LMAO right now!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

vanreuter, NY NY (Sent Monday, October 08, 2007 12:20 PM)

Next >>

SEND A COMMENT

PLEASE READ: All comments must be approved before appearing in the thread; time and space constraints prevent all comments from appearing. We will only approve comments that are directly related to the blog, use appropriate language and are not attacking the comments of others.

Message (please, no HTML tags. Web addresses will be hyperlinked):

Your name, city and state (John Doe, Seattle, Wash.):

Your e-mail address (jdoe@msnbc.com):

Your website (it's okay if you don't have one):

Remember me? (We'll keep it private) Remember me?

TRACKBACKS

Trackbacks are links to weblogs that reference this post. Like comments, trackbacks do not appear until approved by us. The trackback URL for this post is: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/trackback.aspx?PostID=401552