ABOUT FIRST READ

First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



Clinton's choice record questioned

Posted: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 10:45 AM by Mark Murray

From NBC/NJ's Aswini Anburajan

DES MOINES, Iowa -- Describing it as a press conference gone awry would be putting it mildly. Before the start of the NPR debate yesterday afternoon, the Clinton campaign arranged for Ellen Malcolm, the head of Emily's List, to hold a press conference with reporters.

Malcolm took the podium and argued that Clinton was the only candidate in this race who had stood up when it was tough, especially on women's issues. She said that Clinton -- standing up to the Bush Administration -- had led the fight to get the FDA to approve the Plan B contraceptive. She also cited the nomination of Chief Justice John Roberts as a time when Clinton had been the strongest voice against his nomination, taking the floor and giving a passionate speech on why his nomination threatened Roe vs. Wade.
 
But the minute Malcolm stopped speaking, she was hit by questions from reporters armed with info sent out by the Obama campaign. Malcolm hadn't mentioned Obama by name, but she said that those who vote "present" at tough times don't show a true commitment to leadership -- referring to Obama's "present" votes on some anti-abortion measures while serving in the Illinois state Senate. But reporters asked Malcolm why the head of the Illinois Planned Parenthood had said in the Los Angeles Times that Obama was getting in trouble for a "present"-vote strategy that the pro-choice group had devised. Malcolm repeated the quote from the Chicago Tribune, which said that Obama's seat had not been in jeopardy unlike other vulnerable Democrats.

But she didn't have an answer for what came next.

Referencing the battle Planned Parenthood had waged in South Dakota to repeal a law that had banned all abortions in the state, Malcolm was asked why Clinton had done nothing to help support that effort. Obama had sent money and written a letter in support of the group. The head of the South Dakota Planned Parenthood had called Clinton's silence on the issue "mystifying."

Malcolm sidestepped the question, raised Clinton's speech on the Senate floor again, and said that her example then had shown true leadership. Obama only had one sentence on Roe in his floor statement in comparison on Roberts' nomination, Malcolm said. Both senators voted against confirming the chief justice.

Obama's campaign followed up on the press conference by circulating a letter Obama had received from Malcolm praising him for his keynote speech at the 2006 EMILY'S List Majority Council Conference and a list of pro-choice activists willing to speak on behalf of Obama's commitment to women's reproductive rights.  

If anything, yesterday's exchange illustrated just how coveted the women's vote is and that neither campaign is willing to give any ground on the issue.

*** UPDATE *** The Clinton campaign called First Read to object to the characterization of yesterday's event as a press conference gone "awry." The campaign also cited a comment from the head of the Illinois National Organization for Women, who has criticized Obama for his "present" votes: "In each case, the right vote was clear, but Senator Obama chose political cover over standing and fighting for his convictions." It's worth pointing, however, out that Illinois NOW -- as well as the national organization -- has endorsed Clinton.

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Comments

How dare you criticize Hillary? Nothing will stand in the way of her coronation. Hillary, with her wanting to bomb Iran is a neo-con.
I am so tired of this issue of abortion. One commentor said it simply. Why are so many females out there having unprotected sex? I cannot beleive they are all rape victims or have serious medical issues. If you choose to live an irresponsible sex life, I do not think everyone else should pay for it. In other cases, I cannot be a judge. Personally it would be devasting for me to destroy a life and would have serious problems deciding on a rape or medical issue. How decadent is our society? But I especially abhor the murder of a viable child in the womb. Seems to me this child could be delivered and put up for adoption? Even in medical decisions, could not this child be delivered? And how horrible & cruel the death of this child. Are we all just animals? The doctors that perform such things are inhumane but getting rich! I do not wish to put any religious beleifs on any one, that is up to the individual as we can all make choices, but how about common decency???
Good job FirstRead, keep up the good work, when Hillary Clinton's camp calls in a panic, things must have went "awry". They are ridiculous!!
JK Lerner, you are RIGHT ON.  Either of these candidates, or ANY of them, for that matter, would be acceptable alternatives to the GOP.  We Better think in terms of the GENERAL election, is all I am saying.  All the candidates need to craft their messages to incorporate independants, who will decide the election.
While I agree with you in principal, Janice, the issue has always been how do you craft enforcable laws to meet such a position?  How do you allow abortion for "he said/she said" rape situations.. without making it legal in the first trimester?  How do you protect victims and those who have legitimate medical concerns, without protecting the right as a whole?  

It's easy to disagree with abortion.  Much harder to craft laws that take into account all the gray nuances.  Perhaps we as a society would be better off concentrating on prevention and education.
Obama keeps saying how he was always against the Iraq war and that Hillary voted for it. If Obama was in the Senate at the time and had access to allthe info that the Senators had, and he was under the pressure they were under I wonder how he would have voted. He is greatly disingenuous on this issue.  
Dominic A. Martin (Sent Wednesday, December 05, 2007 11:41 AM)

****************************************************

Wrong! As we all know Hillary didn't even read the NIE beefore givng her vote to go to war in Iraq, and she had all that "access". She didn't have an informed opinion, she calculated how her vote to go to war would look for the 2008 presidential election.(ambition skewed her judgement? maybe?) Now who is being disingenuous?

Obama would have read the NIE. And would have seen, as the few senators that did read read it saw, that Iraq did not pose a direct imminent threat to the United States.

Your argument is flawed. Bush said for years, "If you knew what we know", you would have suppported the war. So now the Hillary camp is truly taking a page out of the Bush/Cheney playbook.
Abortion is wrong and when the right wakes up and votes properly, you will see that all this action between Obama and Clinton is only self gratification.
I am so tired of this issue of abortion. One commentor said it simply. Why are so many females out there having unprotected sex? I cannot beleive they are all rape victims or have serious medical issues. If you choose to live an irresponsible sex life, I do not think everyone else should pay for it. In other cases, I cannot be a judge. Personally it would be devasting for me to destroy a life and would have serious problems deciding on a rape or medical issue. How decadent is our society? But I especially abhor the murder of a viable child in the womb. Seems to me this child could be delivered and put up for adoption? Even in medical decisions, could not this child be delivered? And how horrible & cruel the death of this child. Are we all just animals? The doctors that perform such things are inhumane but getting rich! I do not wish to put any religious beleifs on any one, that is up to the individual as we can all make choices, but how about common decency???
I consider myself a fairly intelligent conservative person. I fail to see why anyone would be falling all over themselves to vote for Hillary Clinton. The media has made it clear for years that she is their candidate and have been propping her up and ignoring any of the dirt she is involved with. Can't her "followers" see how phoney she is? She is ill-prepared to deal with the threat of Islamo-terrorism simply because she "is" a woman. Muslims in the Middle East treat their women like shi*. Muslim leaders would never sit down to negotiate with her. If she is so outspoken on women's rights, why does she not deplore the way women are treated in the Muslim countries. I firmly believe that if she is elected President, our Country will come under direct stepped up attacks by Muslim terrorists and the likes of Al Queda. She has absolutely no experience to deal with such a threat. This next election is not a joke folks! When voting for our next President, consider which candidate seems most Reeganesque. That is the kind of leader that we are going to need over the next eight years to deal with the evils and threats to our lives that exist in the world today. Neither Clinton has the integrity or honesty that Ron Reagan possessed. Think! Think! Think!!! Do we really want another eight years of the Clintons? Their bid for the Presidency is all about power for them. They could care less about us!
CitizenJ,

I think we agree.
Typical of Clinton, she attacks her enemies but when the same light is turned on her, she side steps her flaws and still doesn't answer the question.
David Anders--just another STUPID, UNINFORMED FOOL, and unfortunately from TX.  You provide Jerry company in the "foolish men from TX" category!
"I think one reason is that they don't really have a narrative for the republican race yet, so until they can tie everything up in a neat little package, you get Hillary and Barack, "Smackdown '08"!" "

I'm glad I'm not the only that thinks Barrack sounds like the Rock from WWF fame with his voice.  LOL

On the subject of Hillary.  I really don't see where her vast political experience is supposed to come from.  The only real experience she has is being a NY Senator.  Her saying she has experience in the White House because she was first lady is like those Holiday Inn commercials.  You know the ones that go something like this.

Hillary:  I have 8 years experience in the White House.

Voter: Wow you mean you were president?

Hillary:  No, but I did sleep there when my husband was president.
Amazed, I would be willing to bet my life savings and everything thing I own that your husband is in the minority. Hillary Clinton is NOT the democratic candidate most republicans willl support in a general election.  I'm just the items you listed are "leftist" positions. For example, MOST americans thing the 2002 authorization was a mistake.
Clinton Has Issues, Obama has Issues, EVERYONE has Issues! EVERY politician whoever RAN FOR OFFICE preaches about change but how many of them ever REALLY Bring it? Looking back over the last eight years I remember when it was "Damn Near Unpatriotic" to question what the Hell Bush/Cheney and the Republicans where doing.....

WHO IS GOING TO BRING REAL CHANGE FOR US AMERICANS.....WHO....F#$K WAL-Mart, BEST -BUY, FORD, CHEVY, GOOGLE, ETC.... WHAT ABOUT US? THE AMERICAN PEOPLE..... 8 years later all I see is CEO's with 300 million plus (YOUR FIRED) retirement packages, MElting Ice Caps, Minimum Wages that are a joke, Health care that most of us can't afford or just don't have, The rest of the world HATES US....Have any of you left the Country in the last 12 months....They Hate US... NOT BUSH....NOT CHENEY....NOT DEMS OR REPUBS....NO THEY HATE US....AMERICAN Mr/Mrs. JOE SMITH....WHY for not doing anyhting.....FOR NOT IMPLEMENTING CHANGE....IF WE RULE THE PLANET.....WHY ARE WE NOT HOLDING OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS ACCOUNTABLE?

WHO IS GOING TO CHANGE THINGS?
I don't care if anyone wants an abortion...it's an issue that has nothing to do with what'll protect us from terrorists, save us from global warming, and put more money in my pocket.  
and put more money in my pocket.  

pat huntington ny (Sent Wednesday, December 05, 2007 1:14 PM)

If you want more money in your pocket.....
a tax and spend liberal is no way to vote......
kalsey, the moderaters of this forum are fine with any women, in general or specific , being called anything.

but call Obama the N word, and your post will never appear..

it seems the boys of this forum see rape and forced pregnancy as a male right, but good forbid you attack a male
GOOD GREIF!! Sillary will just keep throwing mud to try and confuse voters. Hillary is a poverty pimp plain and simple. Whats going to be next.... what.... Obama eats for breakfast. Her campaign is just getting ridiculous. The more mud she throws the less i respect her. Plus i think she will say or do anything to become president ask your self how come Bill and hillary did not show support for Gore during his run or more support for Kerry during his run?  Because she knew if they lost she could try and run but uh-oh here comes a true statesman.... Obama... and she is pissed.

Go Obama please iowa and NH and sc plus NV get it right.
I looked up the word MELTDOWN in the dictionary and it gave this definition: HILLARY CLINTON'S CAMPAIGN.
HClinton's gaffes continue:
First KINDERGATE and now this. Here is part of the article below:

click
http://progressivegovernment.blogspot.com/2007/12/from-anne-and-women-for-obama.html

quote for article:
Now they’re trying to attack Barack Obama’s 100% pro-choice record.

Today’s attack was delivered by Ellen Malcolm, President of EMILY’s List – which has endorsed Senator Clinton and is spending millions on an Independent Expenditure campaign to try to get her elected. Malcolm called into question Barack’s commitment to protect women’s rights by pointing to old votes on a few politically motivated bills in the Illinois Senate. What Malcolm failed to point out was that Barack cast these votes as part of a strategy employed by pro-choice leaders in Illinois. That’s why so many top pro-choice leaders were outraged by the attack and immediately defended Barack’s record of leadership on this important issue.

Not only is Senator Clinton’s claim another baseless, desperate attempt on her campaign’s part to distort Barack’s record, but this tactic does nothing more than divide the pro-choice community at a time when we need to work together to elect a pro-choice candidate for president.

But don’t take our word for it. Read what leaders in the pro-choice community – who have worked side by side with Senator Obama – had to say about the latest Clinton attacks:
“I am a supporter of Hillary Clinton and an EMILY’s List donor, but this line of attack is unacceptable. While I was the president of Chicago National Organization for Women, Senator Obama worked closely with us, could not have been more supportive of a woman¹s right to choose, and there was no bigger champion in Illinois on our issues. What¹s important is that the candidates do not cannibalize each other on issues we all agree about because we need to win in November.” Lorna Brett, former president of Chicago NOW
"During his years in the state legislature, Barack Obama was a strong and consistent supporter of women's reproductive rights. He worked hand-in-hand with Planned Parenthood in developing and executing strategies to make sure that women had access to reproductive health care. I also want to thank him for standing up with us in the effort to open the Aurora clinic and for his introduction of legislation guaranteeing access to low-cost birth control. Planned Parenthood/Chicago Area has proudly endorsed Barack throughout his entire political career." Steve Trombley, CEO & President, Planned Parenthood/Chicago Action

"The present votes Obama took at that time, along with many other pro-choice legislators, were 'no' votes to bad bills being used for political gain. We asked Senator Obama and other strong supporters of choice to vote present to encourage Senators facing tough re-elections to make the right choice by voting present, instead of caving to political pressure and voting for these bad bills. In the Illinois State Senate, Obama showed leadership, compassion and a true commitment to reproductive health care. The Republican Senate President at the time constantly used anti-abortion bills to pigeon-hole Democrats so that he could target them with misleading mailers during campaign season. It was a tactic that was about politics, not policy - and Obama didn't let them get away with it." Pam Sutherland, President & CEO of Illinois Planned Parenthood Council

“Senator Obama is one of America’s strongest and most loyal defenders of women’s rights on issues of reproductive health care. I’ve contributed to EMILY’s List in the past ­ but I never will again, because I¹m so disappointed in their decision to launch these unfair, false attacks on behalf of Senator Clinton¹s campaign.” Libby Slappey, a former 13-year board member of Planned Parenthood of East Central Iowa.

Even Ellen Malcolm has praised Barack as recently as last year, after Barack gave the keynote speech at the annual Emily’s List Luncheon. In a letter to Barack, Malcolm writes:

Senator Obama,
Thank you so much for helping to make the 2006 EMILY’s List Majority Council Conference such a great success. Our Majority Council members told me again and again how energized they were to hear directly from you and how much they appreciated your spending time with us.
You truly inspired our members and reminded them why they support our work to elect dynamic pro-choice Democratic women ­ especially after hearing you speak about how you’re fighting to make change happen.

I appreciate your commitment to EMILY’s List. Here’s to victory in November!

Warmest regards, Ellen R. Malcolm, President

Handwritten: “You were terrific and really lit a fire with our members!
Thanks so much!!”

In regards to Iraq, we have Barack Obama's 2002 speech. We also have this part of his comments in interviews that seem to be left off.
'But, I'm not privy to Senate intelligence reports,'' Mr. Obama said. ''What would I have done? I don't know. What I know is that from my vantage point the case was not made.''

You know guys, the email that pointed out that MSNBC,
specifically; Joe,Chris,Dan(Keith O.is a bit better) seem to have it out for Hillary RODHAM Clinton is right.  Occasionally you will and do attempt to muster a "fair and balanced" Hillary review just to make us think you are not out to get Hillary out of the race for President. You haven't turned your investigative arm on Obama yet... or at all (are you freightened of Opra?).  Don't tell me this is not intentional, I would find it very hard to believe you.  Maybe it makes for good ratings, but it is most assuredly turning me off MSNBC and back to other news outlets and CSPAN. Do you know if the cable companies give credits on your bill when you blackout news networks like MSNBC and Fox?
kalsey, the moderaters of this forum are fine with any women, in general or specific , being called anything.

but call Obama the N word, and your post will never appear..

it seems the boys of this forum see rape and forced pregnancy as a male right, but good forbid you attack a male
Tuck,Realityville, KS (Sent Wednesday, December 05, 2007 1:33 PM)

Thanks Tuck for letting us know that you have attempted to use the "N" word to reference Obama!! Good to know where you stand on the issues!!
What, Aswini Anburajan again ?
Don't you guys do your homework well ? What a shame article. What day is today ? She should really have a day off. Save some time and go home.

Where is quality control, Chuck ?
Perry you are quoting the known nut Chris Matthews.

Do you really believe or trust any word that comes out of that unwell man's mouth.

If Matthews is your reliable news source, you may need help as well.

Bee, who cares about who you vote ? Do you think you are here 24/7 people will follow what you say ? Go home and have a job. You are so boring, just like Obama, talk, talk, talk,.....no real stuff.


Hillary has a long, long and strong steady support for women.

We women know it.  Maybe Obama does too but we KNOW Hillary will be there for us.

Hillary Clinton  '08

She's my girl and she will SHOW UP, VOTE FOR US and  be there for us.
Dear Amazed in Atlanta - I am a woman voter in New York and want to thank you for articulating exactly how I feel about all of this - your comments are practical and I think accurately reflect the facts about the election for president- others commenting in this blog unfortuantely I fear have "fallen in love" with Obama much like one does with a new romantic partner -I fear that it is an infatuation that is hollow- wake up people he has only been in national office about 2 years - no one knew about him a couple of months ago - why oh why are you pinning all your dreams on someone so unkown, someone who appears so naive and simplistic??  Please look at Hillary Clinton's record - do you homework, for the sake of our country and yourselves. Gayle from Sea Cliff NY.
"Food for Thought"
Just a quick refresher course lest we forget what has happened to the "ex friends" of the Clintons.
1- James McDougal - Clinton's convicted Whitewater partner died of an apparent heart attack, while in solitary confinement. He was a key witness in Ken Starr's investigation.
2 -Mary Mahoney - A former White House intern was murdered July 1997 at a Starbucks Coffee Shop in Georgetown. The murder happened just after she was to go public with her story of sexual harassment in the White House.
3- Vince Foster - Former White House councilor, and colleague of Hillary Clinton at Little Rock's Rose Law firm. Died of a gunshot wound to the head, ruled a suicide.
4- Ron Brown - Secretary of Commerce and former DNC Chairman. Reported to have died by impact in a plane crash. A pathologist close to the investigation reported that there was a hole in the top of Brown's skull resembling a gunshot wound. At the time of his death Brown was being investigated, and spoke publicly of his willingness to cut a deal with prosecutors. The rest of the people on the plane also died. A few days later, the air Traffic controller committed suicide.
5- C. Victor Raiser II- Raiser, a major player in the Clinton fund raising organization died in a private plane crash in July 1992.
6-Paul Tulley - Democratic National Committee Political Director found dead in a hotel room in Little Rock, September 1992.  Described by Clinton as a "Dear friend and trusted advisor".
7-Ed Willey - Clinton fund raiser, found dead November 1993 deep in the woods in VA of a gunshot wound to the head. Ruled a suicide. Ed Willey died on the same day his wife Kathleen Willey claimed Bill Clinton groped her in the oval office in the White House. Ed Willey was involved in several Clinton fund raising events.
8-Jerry Parks -Head of Clinton's gubernatorial security team in Little Rock. Gunned down in his car at a deserted intersection outside Little Rock. Park's son said his father was building a dossier on Clinton. He allegedly threatened to reveal this information.  After he died, the files were mysteriously removed from his house.
9-James Bunch - Died from a gunshot suicide. It was reported that he had a "Black Book" of people which contained names of influential people who visited prostitutes in Texas and Arkansas.
10-James Wilson - Was found dead in May 1993 from an apparent hanging suicide. He was reported to have ties to Whitewater.
11-Kathy Ferguson- Ex-wife of Arkansas Trooper Danny Ferguson, was found dead in May 1994, in her living room with a gunshot to her head. It was ruled a suicide even though there were several packed suitcases, as if she were going somewhere. Danny Ferguson was a co-defendant along with Bill Clinton in the Paula Jones lawsuit. Kathy Ferguson was a possible corroborating witness for Paula Jones.
12-Bill Shelton - Arkansas State Trooper and fiancée of Kathy Ferguson.  Critical of the suicide ruling of his fiancee, he was found dead in June, 1994 of a gunshot wound also ruled a suicide at the grave site of his fiancee.
13-Gandy Baugh - Attorney for Clinton's friend Dan Lassater, died by jumping out a window of a tall building January, 1994. His client was a convicted drug distributor.
14 -Florence Martin - Accountant & sub-contractor for the CIA, was related to the Barry Seal Mena Airport drug smuggling case. He died of three gunshot wounds.
15- Suzanne Coleman - Reportedly had an affair with Clinton when he was Arkansas Attorney General. Died of a gunshot wound to the back of the head, ruled a suicide. Was pregnant at the time of her death.
16-Paula Grober - Clinton's speech interpreter for the deaf from 1978 until her death December 9, 1992. She died in a one car accident.
17- Danny Casolaro - Investigative reporter.  Investigating Mena Airport and Arkansas Development Finance Authority. He slit his wrists, apparently, in the middle of his investigation.
18- Paul Wilcher - Attorney investigating corruption at Mena Airport with Casolaro and the 1980 "October Surprise" was found dead on a toilet June 22, 1993 in his Washington DC apartment. Had delivered a report to Janet Reno 3 weeks before his death.
19-Jon Parnell Walker - Whitewater investigator for Resolution Trust Corp. Jumped to his death from his Arlington, Virginia apartment balcony August15, 1993. He was investigating the Morgan Guaranty scandal.
20-Barbara Wise - Commerce Department staffer. Worked closely with Ron Brown and John Huang. Cause of death unknown. Died November 29, 1996; Her bruised, nude body was found locked in her office at the Department of Commerce.
21-Charles Meissner -Assistant Secretary of Commerce who gave John Huang special security clearance, died shortly thereafter in a small plane crash.
22- Dr. Stanley Heard - Chairman of the National Chiropractic Health Care Advisory Committee died with his attorney Steve Dickson in a small plane crash. Dr. Heard, in addition to serving on Clinton's advisory council personally treated Clinton's mother, stepfather and brother.
23-Barry Seal -Drug running pilot out of Mena Arkansas, death was no accident.
24-Johnny Lawhorn Jr. - Mechanic, found a check made out to Bill Clinton in the trunk of a car left at his repair shop. He was found dead after his car  had hit a utility pole.
25-Stanley Huggins - Investigated Madison Guaranty. His death was a purported suicide and his report was never released.
26-Hershell Friday - Attorney and Clinton fund raiser died March 1, 1994 when his plane exploded.
27-Kevin Ives & Don Henry - Known as "The boys on the track" case. Reports say the boys may have stumbled upon the Mena Arkansas airport drug operation. A controversial case, the initial report of death said, due to falling asleep on railroad tracks. Later reports claim the 2 boys had been slain before being placed on the tracks. Many linked to the case died before their testimony could come before a Grand Jury.

THE FOLLOWING PERSONS HAD INFORMATION ON THE IVES/HENRY CASE:
28-Keith Coney - Died when his motorcycle slammed into the back of a truck, 7/88.
29-Keith McMaskle - Died stabbed 113 times, Nov, 1988
30-Gregory Collins - Died from a gunshot wound January 1989.
31-Jeff Rhodes - He was shot, mutilated and found burned in a trash dump in April 1989.
32-James Milan - Found decapitated. However, the Coroner ruled his death was due to "natural causes".
33-Jordan Kettleson - Was found shot to death in the front seat of his pickup truck in June 1990.
34-Richard Winters - A suspect in the Ives / Henry deaths. He was killed in a set-up robbery July 1989.

THE FOLLOWING CLINTON BODYGUARDS ARE DEAD:
35 -Major William S. Barkley Jr.
36-Captain Scott J . Reynolds
37-Sgt. Brian Hanley
38-Sgt. Tim Sabel
39-Major General William Robertson
40-Col. William Densberger
41-Col. Robert Kelly
42-Spec. Gary Rhodes
43-Steve Willis
44-Robert Williams
45-Conway LeBleu
46-Todd McKeehan

Quite an impressive list! Pass this on. Let the public become aware of what happens to friends of the Clinton's!
HILLARY FOR PRESIDENT? SURELY YOU JEST !!
I think it's interesting the way the Clinton campaign is being pointed out with how they "setup" the stage with their own supporters but infiltrate Republican venues.
What's even more interesting is Obama is the one pointing.
Obama still has the edge for the facts, what he has done, not just said. Hillary flip-flops. (Like Iraq)
It always amazes me when Democrats allow their nomination races to do so much damage to their eventual candidate.  Their loyalists eviscerate one another to the point that they have accomplished the republicans job of undermining each of their credibilities and reputations.  And this year, they have so many top notch people running for the nomination who aren't even getting a serious look because of all this nonsense between the Hillary and Barack camps.  Too bad the party of such wonderful ideas continues to implode over personalities.  You have allowed weaker and less civilly minded people from the other party to win because of your self-destructive tendencies.  I am all for passion in politics but not at the expense of both common sense and eventual victory.
Since no one else has made this point, I will: abortion is most often a financial decision. Abortions are chosen by impoverished women who don't feel they could support a child, not those with resources.  Reduce poverty and you will reduce the abortion rate.  Which party tends to reduce the poverty rate when in power? Certainly not the corporatist Republicans.  The abortion rate fell under the Clinton administration and has increased again under the Bush administration.  It will most likely fall again under the next Democratic administration, so if you hate abortion, vote a democratic ticket.
Chris Mathews and especialy F oops Tucker have a Hillary Problem we now Turn them off 1 Watch bbc and get  news instead of poppy cock! Pundits have ruined the news !What makes these people so smart. talk about issues .we don't care about Britney and opinions from Ann Coulter or you Chris and f oops Tucker
This message is for fac/ AZt who posted @11:21 AM.  I found your posting very offensive.  Maybe there would be less need of abortions if more men would take responsibility or preventitive measure not to get a woman pregnant.  I am not for abortion but I am for a womans right to decide.
My only regret in being male, is that I will never the joy there is in having an abortion....
Here again is living proof on womens reproductive rights that BINLADEN is the offspring of Hillery Clinton having made love to NANCY PELOSI
Amazed, you're right on the money:

"Can't win without crossover votes, period. Hillary's more moderate, thought out positions would stand up better. Please Dems, don't snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Not AGAIN."

Amen.

"While it wasn't a sexy or popular answer with the left ... Hillary's answer on that question was dead on. That she would not commit to something that she could not predict right now, or that could be used against us as a propaganda tool.  That is a pragmatic, practical, and presidental answer."

In addition to the wisdom of the point you're making, I think you've hit on the key to many people's fascination with Obama: he's sexy. Not in the prurient sense, but in the sense of attractive flash, for want of a better synonym. He dazzles. Who wouldn't prefer a young showman like Obama to a sometimes frumpy, bewrinkled doyenne who qualifies her positions rather than tossing out fortune cookie answers to complex problems?
I hadn't expected to say this, but a politician out there is actually more dishonest and immoral than Bill Clinton.  Guess that's why he married her, they come off as practically the same person now.  Only difference is, while he would lie, steal, and risk lives all day long without a care, he had the ability to hypnotize the people and make them turn a blind eye to what he was doing.  Hillary tells all the same old lies and is trying the same old tricks that he did, but doesn't have the speaking potential to cover it all up.  Now she's blowing it with practically every sentence.  It doesn't take much to see why she has the highest negativity rating of any candidate ever in the history of the United States.
The numbers don't lie, while people have recovered from negative ratings this early in the process, she's too far down already to recover.  Regardless of whether she wins the candidacy for the Democrats, it's a fairly safe bet to say that she's already lost herself the election.  If she had just kept her mouth shut, people might have believed she actually had morals, but she blew it.
I remember when I used to get flak for my posts being too long...:)


Van
Larry George, Poquoson, VA (Sent Wednesday, December 05, 2007 2:10 PM)

Someone notify his family that he's loose again...


Van
"sure Hillary is pro choice which is supported mostly by druggies, that want an abortion to cover up their mistakes when high, and trading sex for crack, there are exceptions, but few."

So you suggest punishing those "few" (which are actually thousands upon thousands) because of the actions of some, those wholly unrelated to the innocent ones?  By the way, those few are actually considered to be in the majority versus the minority that are druggies.  You're really talking about controlling the majority because of the immoral acts of the minority few.  Never touched a drug, but am one hundred percent pro choice.  There's a big difference between an abortion in an early term and later when a brain has actually developed.  I've seen the pictures that some pro-life groups have released, showing what they claim to be an aborted baby.  So far, the greatest number of those has been proven to be a medical abortion, death at birth, or illegal abortion late in the pregnancy.  Their biggest campaign was with a picture of a death at birth (not even close to an abortion), while claiming that it was an abortion in an obvious lie to fool people into thinking an abortion was something different than it is the majority of the time.  The average abortion occurs early, and if you look at the aborted material, all that there is to see so early in the pregnancy is a small flap of skin, like picking off a piece of skin around your fingernail.  There's no brain, no limbs, no life.  I'm pro choice until there's something that can even remotely qualify as a life, something with a least the beginnings of a brain or lungs or any organ outside of a flap of skin.  Pro choice has nothing to do with late stage pregnancy abortions, and those I stand against.  But when it's not a baby, when it's a flap of skin sticking out like a hangnail and no more, it's the woman's right to remove it.
The armchair pundits out there saying that Hillary's campaign is doomed have no clue of reality.  They're projecting their hopes over facts. Those Republicans are running scared.
Hil would be a terrific pres.... why, she has those fancy pantsuits, that great haircut, and who could ever forget that heart warming laugh of hers! Not to mention her great wealth of political knowledge and insight from her years of being married to Bill. She's so caring, I bet she will return all of the furniture she took from the White House when Billy ("I'm gonna' say this one more time...") and she moved out of there! Maybe they'll even bring back all of the "w"'s for the computer keyboards that their staffers mistakenly took. Maybe she'll have Sandy (burglar) Bherger (sp?)return the documents that he mistaken put into his pants and socks when leaving the archives room! She's so great, she may even bring Vince Foster back from the dead. Ew, I can't wait!!! Go, Hil!
Go away. Please.
Hey Lewis, I wouldn't bet that money just yet.  You are correct that many republicans aren't OPEN to Clinton, but that's because they've been listening to too much Rush Limbaugh.  If you lined up the positions, however, and asked them who in the democratic party they agreed with more (and didn't reveal the names).. I bet THAT result would surprise you.. and THEM. You are right about one thing.. they might not ever know... as many are closed minded on the subject.  
Right on target there Beckwolf. I agree 100%. It must be awfully frustrating for "HER ROYAL THIGHNESS" not to be getting away with spewing lies like her impeached husband did. And for Linda, I ask again, if Hillary supports women so much, how come she does not specifically speak out against the atrocities commited by men against the women of the Muslim world? What about their rights?
I'm so glad that I'm a Republican.  We only have homosexuals to worry about. And they are not running for president.  I've got my man picked out.  Ron Paul in 2008,
How long will it be until "HER ROYAL THIGHNESS" shakes a finger at us denying one of her lies? ENOUGH with the Clintons! Yes, please just GO AWAY!
Senator Clinton and her cronies are incorrect about many things and just as the Bush team does they never agree they are wrong on an issue, they just change the subject.  I wish that we would be free of both the Bush and Clinton families, they are all jerks and hypocrites.
My oh my, there is some pretty tasteless stuff on this site today. Not really necessary, is it---we can make our points in a more civil manner, don't you think?
I hope Senator Obama wins, I do not like Senator Clinton, she seems like the icy queen from Narnia- a pandering, mean spirited, spiteful, two faced witch who has no real friends, just a bunch of cowards hovering around her for political scraps. I Obama can't overcome her I am voting for Mr Guilliani, even with his faults he is more trustworthy than Senator Clinton who is a "knownothing" puppet like Mr Bush is now.  


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