And if you go to www.mormon.org, you'll get all the white washed bally-hoo. So once you're done there, check out the resources at www.exmormon.org and you can get the rest of the story.

Mormonism is NOT another Christian Denomination and  people who think it is, need to flipping GOGGLE it. Here. Let me HELP you get started.

http://www.angelfire.com/ms/seanie/mormon/lds_racism.html

Evangelical Republicans may not have a problem with it because they have the same attitude towards People of Color as the teaching in the Book of Mormon, but Black Evangelicals will be making certain, all during the 2008 Election, if Romney gets the Republican Nod, just what Mormonism really is.

So, if people don't want to learn about it BEFORE the primary voting takes place and they nominate Mitt Romney for the Republicans candidate anyway, everyone will get a lesson on Mormonism for sure. Believe that!

Marc Larocque, no he didn't say that - go back and check your sources and look at everything in context.  Words to live by.

Mr. Romney is successful, articulate and appears to be a very family oriented.  I am not convinced that what he says is dependable since his position on importan issues has changed, in some cases, more than once.

I keep reading the comments of people, who claim
that Mormons aren't Christians and that
Mormonism is some kind of a "cult".  I can't
believe that so many people speak out so loudly
about something that they obviously have not
studied or become remotely familiar with. I wish
all of these ANGRY people would figure out what
it really is that they are so angry about and
stop speaking out about Mormonism before they
have the facts or the education about the
religion.  There is nothing intelligent about
speaking out about something that you obviously
know nothing about!  Read up!  There is plenty
of information out there.
about what they are  

Mormon politicians have a direct line back to Salt Lace City? Then either Senator Hatch (R-Utah) or Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nevada) must have the wrong number, because they couldn't be any more different politically.

I read this board and am afraid for our country. Most of you have no idea what you're talking about. To those who do, thank God for you.

If you want to know what Mitt won't tell you about mormonism go here. http://www.exmormon.org/tract2.htm

Our constitution guarantees a separation of church and state.  What a wonderful concept.  All you have to do is look to other places in this world to see that it's not such a bad idea.  As such, why is religion being dragged into this political debate to start with.  I don't care what his religion is....I care about his leadership qualities and what he offers to solve the problems of this country.

"Mormon family values is his greatest strength, Mormon history of denying blacks, encouraging polygamy, and subversive treatment of women will be his weakness and it won't be forgotten."

Every religion has a past that is unsavory in the present. (Like the Catholic preists accepting payment for forgivness of sins, or religious witch hunting in Salem, Mass.)

If you want to know how the LDS church stands on blacks, ask a black Mormon. If you want to know if they oppress women, as a Mormon woman. (Also, the LDS church did away with polygomy for almost 100 years now.)

If you really want to know what Mitt Romney believes, do the work. Study it for yourself. Ask Mormon's around you. Guaranteed there is a Mormon congregation near you meeting every Sunday. Go, Ask, Learn.

Don't point fingers at Mitt Romney because of your lack of due diligence.

Bottom line, religion aside, do you think he'd make a good president?

As a Mormon myself I take great exception to that statement. Perhaps you could explain yourself better instead of invoking hate-filled invective you accuse me (or my religion, anyway) of? Perhaps you would list some of your qualifications to speak definitively on what I do or do not believe? I'm sorry you've had some negative experience with some Christians, but please don't paint us all with the same brush.
Thom, Idaho (Sent Thursday, December 06, 2007 11:20 AM)

---------------
If you read my post carefully, I was not condemning the entire Mormon religion!  I was condemning this man who's part of the religious crazed culture war, trying to dump his views and so called family values on all of us.  For example, his views on marriage, gay rights, abortion, evolution, science, etc.  My post had nothing to do with the Mormon religion. I don't make it practice to belittle religions. Perhaps you should read it again.

I was a Mormon for over 25 years of my life. For Mitt Romney to say that being President would be his highest commitment to God and that he would serve no one religion is absurd. In the Mormon temple, Mormons make a covenant before God to sacrifice their time, their talents, their money, and even their own life if necessary for building up the kingdom of God and The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. Look it up folks, it's all out there to be investigated.

Romney is probably a descendant (grandfather or great grandfather that had multiple wives) I doubt if he will address it just like he avoided using the word Mormon.   He will be influenced by Salt Lake City LDS heirarchy.  

He's all about religious freedom....as long as people are religious.  So, he's trying to get his nose under the tent with Christian Fundies as a fellow ultra-conservative righty.  He's a Theocrat through and through and not to be trusted.

yeah, mormon.org

Not actually dealing with the term "Mormon:" was a mistake. That's what voters are wary of. They don't care about how religion affects his decisions; they want him to explain his "cult" more.

http://www.political-buzz.com/

ALL of the religions are ridiculous. There are good people who also go to church, but any religion that insists that their stories and fables are actual or real is a drag on humanity.

I can already hear all of the simple minded religious nuts coming out of the woodwork. So I'll temper my statement with this. Think if you had been raised in a different culture, for example Saudi Arabia, do you think you'd still be a Christian? No, you'd be a Muslim and you'd think that anyone who didn't subscribe to the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed was wrong and ridiculous.

Step outside of yourself for a second, please.

Realize that all of these books are just that books. You can't run on religion. Mitt Romney's religion thinks that the Indians were one of the lost tribes of Israel. Christianity thinks that the earth is the center of the universe, divorce is a sin condemnable by death, homosexuality is a sin condemnable by death, and that the earth is 6000 years old. Muslims think that homosexuals should also be put to death, women should have to wear scarves to cover their bodies, and that it is okay to have multiple wives.

Now again there are people within the religion (maybe even yourself) who don't believe in such foolish nonsense, but it is what the religion believes in. These beliefs are founded in unreality (I know its not a word, but not reality doesn't exist) or faith.

I don't think that deep down ANYONE really believes the hateful/ridiculous things that come out of their respectively horrendous holy books. But few people ever really read or adhere to the things that exist in their books. Which brings me to the point. Why do you need to defend something that you don't really believe in? If Mitt doesn't believe all of the kooky things in the book of Mormon then he shouldn't be a mormon. If Christians don't want to defend or even in some cases read the Bible then why be a Christian?

The answer is it is a herd mentality. Religion provides a social network for people. Further, it is a source of their identity. To cast their religion out is to cast themselves out. Thusly, they'll defend it until they are blue in the face or in some cases to the death. But why, for what, people rarely ever stop to think about why they defend something so vehemetly that they don't even know for sure.
As you can tell I'm trying to be nice. So do try in your responses to be nice as well and ask yourself, why is anything regarding one's beliefs about myths important at all.

His speech was fine, except for one little poin that went completely overlooked: Sally Quinn made the observation that he "completely oblitered" the separation of church and state. None of the othe commentators saw fit to even respond to her. THAT disturbs me. Otherwise he could be a pantheist for all I care.

Why is religious prejudice the only form of acceptable prejudice left?

Bob, no you want get a true perspective. They have a saying in the mormon church "Milk before Meat", meaning they will only tell you the warm and fuzzy stuff to get you hooked before you learn the real doctrine later (like that they still believe in polygamy - they just don't practice it because its against the law, blood atonement, god was a man, etc.)

Spoken like a true president who knows history, the constitution, and his place to serve the people of the United States of America.

"Mormon history of denying blacks, encouraging polygamy, and subversive treatment of women will be his weakness and it won't be forgotten."  

I am sorry, but why is this his weakness?  You, as an American, belong to a country which historically segregated against blacks, did not allow women to vote, and recently had a president openly commit adultery, etc.  I guess you are "weak".

"Romney has said he will not have Muslim member of his cabinet. That's absurd."

Reference please? Or should I just take your word for it?

Domenico -- did you get paid for counting words?  Instead of a comment on the substance of the speech you give us minutia. Come on. You're supposed to be a "researcher". Do some. You're supposed to be a professional. Be one. Get informed and turn on your mind and make a substantive comment.

As for others (mule) you ought to do the same. A little bit of honest research goes a long way. If you want to know about Mormons ask a Mormon not a detractor.  If you want to know about Muslims or Jews or Catholics or whatever ask somebody who holds those beliefs.  Then think about the substance of what they say rather than just counting the words.

@Bob, Pascagoula

Because, Bob, as a Mormon of almost 30 years I was shocked about the amount of information about my own faith I was completely ignorant about. Mormon leadership does just as Romney did today. They keep critical information from their membership so as not to tarnish their image.

Jon--Outlining a religion's basic beliefs is not his job.  Romney shouldn't have to tell anyone what his religion believes in.  He should explain how his beliefs will help or influence his decisions as President, but that's all.  That's what he addressed in his speech.  I believe he has been honest in expressing exactly how his faith would inform his Presidency.

@Bob, Pascagoula

Because, Bob, as a Mormon of almost 30 years I was shocked about the amount of information about my own faith I was completely ignorant about. Mormon leadership does just as Romney did today. They keep critical information from their membership so as not to tarnish their image.

Frankly, I think the important comparison of Romney and Kennedy is being overlooked or ignored - the fact that both are very good looking.  It worked for Kennedy, and Romney is a hunk! Shallow, maybe, but possible, yes?

I may be stirring somebody's pot here, but I'll say it anyway.

Being Christian, or whatever, doesn't make you a good leader by default. Nor does it make you a good person by default. What you believe in and what you do are two separate things.

"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion."

I have a cousin who is, along with her entire immediate family, Mormon. When she turned 23, her LDS church warned her that she needed to hurry up and find a husband so that she would fulfill her duty to God, and they hounded her until she tried to marry someone she met online, who was from another country, who she had known for 3 months, and had never met. When that didn't work out the church was even more frustrated with her and drove her to marry ANOTHER foreign national who she knew for only ONE month. He left her, surprise!, and she moved half-way across the country to try and work off the massive debt she had acrued. Yet even when she had nothing to her name, she couldn't pay off her debt because the church in her new home was still convincing her to tithe 10% of the virtual pennies she brought home and reminded her she had let God down. I have been a Christian all my life, and always will be, but i'll be damned if I'll believe that a "church" that willing to pray on someone's insecurities has anything to teach me about values.

Over 25 years ago I read a book titled "Who Really Wrote the Book of Mormon", by H.A.Davis. It is very thought provoking and after reading it one can make their own decisions about Mormonism. Do a Google search for Who Really Wrote the Book of Mormon, and my first option came up as thedigitalvoice.com/enigma/wrw/1977DavA.htmhedigitalvoice.com/enigma/wrw/1977DavA.htm. The Holy Bible says there shall be "no supplements". Another "supplement" now appearing is something called "theophostic counseling" - another supplement. Just read the book online, "Who Really Wrote the Book of Mormon" it is all there so you don't have to leave your home or spend any money to be able to read it then you will have more understanding. For me, it raised the spectre of misleading many people from the path of Christ and taking them away from their salvation. When wives can only get to heaven, "if they are called by their husbands", and this "marriage for eternity" are too far out for me, and those are just 2 examples. I don't care what Mitt believes in for himself, but I do feel he might be unduly influenced by the hierarchy of the church, in a similar manner to what George Bush has done in his fanatical "religious" positions. The fact he can not be a true follower of Christ is around us every day in the way he lives his life and governs "the world" with radicalism and arrogance. Christ cared about people, George Bush does not. Romney probably actually cares more about people than GB, but who would really be governing? He is in a position of governance in the LDS church.  

"Let me assure you that no authorities of my church, or of any other church for that matter, will ever exert influence on presidential decisions. Their authority is theirs, within the province of church affairs, and it ends where the affairs of the nation begin." - Mitt Romney today

Is this too ambiguous for you?  geesh...this is just a blog full of people who had already made up their minds.

As a fellow Mormon, I'll be honest and say that Mitt should have made this speech months ago. Making it now gives the appearance that he is pandering to the Christian vote because Huckabee is now even with him in Iowa.

On the other hand, that such a speech should even be required of Mitt is pathetic. The Mormons hosted and ran the 2002 Olympics. What happened then that showed how wrong it was for Mormons to be in charge of something? As far as I know, a huge defecit was turned into a profit and everyone (non-Mormon included) had a "normal" olympic experience. How has Harry Reid, Senate Majority Leader, ruined the Senate by his being a Mormon? How have the Marriots (hotel chain owners) affected anyone by being Mormons? How did Steve Young ruin the NFL or ESPN by being a Mormon? The secretary of Agriculture under Eisenhower was a Mormon. What did he ruin? The founder of Jet Blue is a Mormon. How has he ruined Jet Blue?

Mormons live and let live. Do we have opinions? Sure. But when placed in positions of leadership and responsibility for others, not of our faith, we do not force our faith on others, or make judgments strictly in adherance with our faith. Were that the case, the Marriot hotel chain would not offer porn on their televisions or allow for the consumption of alcohol and tobacco on their premises. I defy anyone to illustrate where a Mormon has been the wrong choice for a leadership post simply because of what he/she believed.

How can anyone take Mormonism seriously?  Isn't its church suppossedly there to receive the faithfull and fallen; to be inclusive not exclusive?  Try going into the TEMPLE in Salt Lake City without your Mormon card and you will shown the door to the Bank of Zion to make a deposit!

The problem is people like Land who represents the Southern Baptists who present at the speach who when asked if Mormons are Christian point blank said no. Its one thing for the leader to say he doesn't agree with something, its another to lie blatantly to the people about such a fact. If the definition of Christian is believing in Christ as the Savior, I would say Mormons or the real name not the nickname of "Mormon" originally given to Latter-Day Saints as derogatory "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints" is a pretty telling feature that they believe in Christ.  People, please get your facts straight about Latter-Day Saints before you say something that illustrates your ignorance.

If Mitt were running for the National Pastor then I guess he should answer questions concerning his faith as it would pertain to that posistion.  He is running for the political position of President therefore, shouldn't his questions be based on those aspects of his ability to be President.  If you want to know about the Mormon Church perhaps you can look elsewhere other than the one candidate for President.  Goto www.lds.org, www.mormon.org to ge the details on Mitt's religion.

Mormon beliefs are worth scrutinizing.  I wouldn't consider them mainstream at all.  They were founded by a con-artist who had a rap sheet a mile long.  Their beliefs have pretty much been refuted by accurate historical records.  CLDS was deemed a cult by the Federal Government until they raised enough money and hired enough attorneys to tell the Govt. to buzz off.  Just like Scientology.

Read Under the Banner of Heaven by Jon Krakauer.  Excellent history of the CLDS and its checkered past.  They also don't want to mention that there's something  close to 100K polygamists out there that aren't paying taxes and have the lay of the land in Utah.

Between Mitt's flip-flopping and this issue, it will be difficult for Romney to move forward I think. I don't think you can compare JFK's Catholic beliefs to Romney's Mormon beliefs.  

Do your research.

I was raised in the mormon church, but once I objectively researched it -I had to leave. I think the startling lack of skeptisism a mormon has to possess is disturbing given how recent the religion is, and the data available that can fallsify it. I would be afraid of any President who counts to much on faith (see GWB), faith and reason are incompatible concepts. We need a rational and realistic mind running our government, not someone who will veto stem cell research for example because of dogma and conjecture.

"Actually, the people that say this are the same ones that actually read and study their Bibles...this is how they come to the conclusion; for instance, the Bible clearly teaches that there is only one God, yet mormons believe in many gods. Mormons believe that Jesus Christ was a created being, like satan, while the Bible clearly states that Jesus Christ IS God. I could go on all day, but it is clearly not Christianity. It would be the first and only brand of Christianity to be polytheistic. It doesn't really matter what they call themselves, as the Bible is the final authority on what is what. This is how Evangelicals (and many others) feel, and this is why Mr. Romney's speech will do nothing to help his polling numbers."

Thank you for demonstrating your ignorance.  It is great to see another person who really hasn't truly studied the beliefs of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.  If you had, you would know what you are saying isn't what it believed, and you are just trying to manipulate some beliefs to meat your own perogative.

Very intolerant religion.  Does not recognize any church other than its own.  Also thinks that God takes the form a human, as does Jesus.  What size suits would you say they wore?  I think that God would shop in a Big Man's store.  Jesus, well he's kind of skinny, we might have trouble fitting him without taking the waist in.  And what about Mormons' insistence that the Jesus is coming again but he this time he's landing in St. Louis.  Why St. Louis?  I personally know that Jesus loves more arid climates and would prefer coming back in Santa Fe.  Does Mitty have a problem agreeing to this change for my vote?  Probably.

I am a Catholic that has lived in Salt Lake City Utah for about 8 years.  I will tell you without question that every significant decision made by state government is dictated by the Morman church.  If you believe that this specific faith will not dictate Romney's decisions, you are not familiar with this religion.  
If the Morman's want to become mainstream they need to open up the faith for observation, and therefore judgement by as a true faith.  This is the only way not to be considered a cult.
If anyone wants to truly know about the church don't go the Morman sponsored websites.  I encourage you to go to those that discuss the rituals that take place in the temples.  No non-member can enter.  For that only memebers who have paid their correct tithing can enter.  
Do a search for "Morman temple ceremony", if you want to really learn more

Mitt's eyes look vacant.  He seems cold and with out a soul, robotic if you will.  How can a conservative republican be elected governor of Massachusetts?  How can he be a Mormon, yet have been pro-choice?  This guy is a phony and a hypocrite.  He seems to like to hear himself talk an awful lot as well.

This speech has taken America nowhere, with respect to resolving the existing Mormon question. It is no longer 1960, today's politicians lead the discussion with their bibles as their guides. We've allowed that to happen, and rightly or wrongly, Americans relate to their politicians according to their spiritual beliefs. By and large, Americans lack the same relationship and/or understanding of the Book of Mormon, along with the other LDS scriptures and therefore cannot gauge the moral similarity or dissimilarity between themselves and Romney. Until Americans recognize the religious value of Mormonism this issue will persist. Accordingly those that reject Romney on the basis of his faith have no reason to reverse their thinking based on Romney's speech.  

Please do not compare this to JFK's speech. JFK was trying to tell the public in the GENERAL election that his religion wouldn't affect his decision making process. This speech was to convince Evangelical voters in a PRIMARY that he WILL let his religion affect his decisions, but that they will be affected in the same way as if he were an evangelical Christian.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the same church that has been from ADAM, and all the other Prophets thru the Old Testament and and the New Testament with the organization that CHRIST organized. This is the first presidency (Peter, James & John) the the Twelve Apostles & Prophets. This is the same Church that Mitt Romney is a member of.

Do we really need this constant barrage of religion in politics?  There is no evidence that any candidate for president,  past or present, has ever based their actions and decisions on their religious beliefs. Rather, they do what is politically expedient at the moment.  Religion has no place in politics.  It's the ultimate wedge issue for politicians bereft of ideas and statesmanship. GW Bush is the poster child for touting his belief in the "Almighty' while making a mockery of compassion and humanity.  He lies, he tortures, he's committed the U.S. to an endless war.  Romney can't unequivically condemn and deny torture.  He's talked about attacking Iran.  He's pro-life one day, against it the next.  Religion is nothing but an ongoing campaign tool for politicians, the current crowd included.  They're all televangelists dressed up as candidates for president.  None of this nonsense occurs in local elections for city councils, mayors, judges, governors etc.  Why do we have to put up with it in national elections?

Who care?

Phil, you are wrong. He said that the percentage of Muslims in this country would not justify having a Muslim as a higher cabinet member. That is a religious test. You need to get your facts straight. Try googling his speech to get his exact words.

What's bad about Romney isn't his religion.  It's the fact that he changes what he says depending on the audience.

Face it:  EITHER HE LIED TO THE PEOPLE OF MASS. ABOUT HIS VIEWS OR HE"S LYING TO US NOW  One or the other.

I feel frustrated to hear people say that as a member of the Mormon faith Romney will put orders from the church leaders above the needs and laws of the U.S. One of the basic principles of the church, which is taught as young as 6 years old states "We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law." This is Article of Faith 12, of 13.

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