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First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



Bill vs. Obama continued in Buffalo

Posted: Monday, January 21, 2008 10:54 AM by Mark Murray

From NBC's Abby Livingston and Mark Murray
And so the fairytale -- or rather telenovela -- between Bill Clinton and Obama continued last night. Speaking at a rally in Buffalo, NY, Bill essentially accused Obama of running a cynical Nevada campaign. “[Hillary] won a victory in spite of a very well organized, and I might say a very well executed strategy by the Obama campaign, which included doing well in the north of Nevada, where his demographic of upscale voters lived, and by making an explicit effort to get Republicans to come and vote for him in the Democratic caucus.”

Bill continued, “[Obama] said President Reagan was the engine of innovation and did more, had a more lasting impact on America than I did. And then the next day he said, 'In the 90s the good ideas came out from the Republicans,” Clinton continued. “Which it'll be costly maybe down the road for him because it's factually not accurate.”

Obama, however, didn't quite say that about Reagan. Here's what he did say: "Reagan changed the trajectory of America in a way that Richard Nixon did not and in a way that Bill Clinton did not. He put us on a fundamentally different path because the country was ready for it." More: "I think [John] Kennedy, twenty years earlier, moved the country in a fundamentally different direction. So I think a lot of it just has to do with the times. I think we’re in one of those times right now. Where people feel like things as they are going aren’t working. We’re bogged down in the same arguments that we’ve been having, and they’re not useful. And, you know, the Republican approach, I think, has played itself out. I think it’s fair to say the Republicans were the party of ideas for a pretty long chunk of time there over the last ten, fifteen years, in the sense that they were challenging conventional wisdom."

As for the future of the race, Clinton has set his sights on Super Tuesday. Making the campaign stop in the bitter cold of Buffalo, Clinton proved he is not taking New York for granted. In return, he implored New York not to take his wife’s campaign for granted. “New York has an election on February the 5th, and it is very important that we not to take that election for granted. That we not say, ‘Well, there won't be a big contest here, we know she's going to win. We don't have to vote.' You do have to vote, because this is a battle for delegates. And the more people who vote in New York, the more delegates she will in New York.”

“On February the 6th," he added, "all the news coverage will be who won what states, when we have all these elections. On February the 7th, all the news coverage will be who has how many delegates.”

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Comments

Real Democrat...I agree with you 100%
Bill Clinton along with George W Bush and Richard Nixon, are three of the most documented liars in presidential history. Do we really want to continue this 'say anything' Bush/Clinton Era?

Teddy, could you please give Bill another call.....I don't think he got your message last time!
Do you know what a "Blackout" would mean to the Democratic Nominee?

*Note: Blackout= AA stay home on Election Day
Obama said absolutely nothing concrete. It's general verbiage that needs substance. He has no center of ideas or policies. Bill Clinton was the innovator and thr Reaganomics and the Bush triclke down thing is a fraud. Bill wins every time. Read Krugman today in the NYT.
I am starting to hate the Clintons as well.  there is no way I can give them my vote now.  What is funny is Hillary lists Ronald Reagan as one of her favorite Presidents.  Double standards in affect?
I'm sorry, Mr. Obama.  As much as John Kennedy gave the national a psychological new start in 1960, it took the hard work of Dr. King and many others and the political skills of Lyndon Johnson to secure the Civil Rights Act, the Voting Rights Act, the Older Americans Act, Medicare, and other landmark pieces of legislation.

Lyndon Johnson, with all the internal conflicts in his mind and heart, was the last U.S. President willing to change "the trajectory of America" in a way that truly benefits us all. He was willing to give up the South for a generation to do the right thing.

What comparable political sacrifice did Reagan make?
There are none.
deb, Obama said the republicans were the source of good ides..

like outsourcing jobs,
installing religion in govt
ending social security
invading random countries.

That's Obama's idea of good ideas

he really needs to switch parties.
Those who are distorting Obama's point about Reagan are either in the bag for Clinton or ignorant. *Obviously* Reagan changed the course of this country in a way that Clinton didn't. The legacy of Reagan is low taxes, less regulation, big military and budget deficits galore. Might not look like a great legacy to me, but it has persisted throughout my lifetime. What did Clinton bring us? Free trade is being questioned by everyone, the days of balanced budgets are long gone, peace in the Middle East? nope, universal health care? oh sorry, guess we'll have to give his wife another chance on that one. The only Clinton legacies I can detect are welfare-to-work and a healthy disrespect for the office of the Presidency. And I say this as a Clinton *fan*. I'm apalled that we Democrats appear to be opting for a repeat of this melodrama. Then again, if the Repubs wise up and nominate McCain against Hillary, there's no need to worry--we'll be looking at another 4 years in the wilderness. Thanks Bill!
Senator Obama should understand that hard-core Democrats have never been fond of President Reagan.  And in a Democratic primary, any positive reference to Reagan is not going to sit well with the Democratic base.  He comments would have been better served in a general, not a primary election.
Mark, Columbus, OH (Sent Monday, January 21, 2008 11:42 AM)

Are you referring to the socialist/pacifist segment of the party?  If so you are correct.
Bill Clinton is permanently tarnishing his legacy with this nonsense. It again reinforces the notion that the Clintons will do anything, even misrepresent history, to get Hillary Clinton elected.
somebody smack down billy for me!!

He is ruining his name all for the sake of a flase victory for his wife the hill

billy is a liar  
Good Bill, hit the baby Obama! about time someone has the guts to call him on in what he says. Obama is riding a free ride, 24/7 press and friendly tv commentary on everything this guy does while Hillary gets 24/7 bad press and cynical editorial comments, not to mention the same press totally ignoring Edwards.
I am tried of the press never ever questioning Obama at all and the love dance and free coverage they are giving him. Enough is enough!
Seem's like Bill Clinton has been INHALEING too much lately!!!!!!!!
Bill Clinton along with George W Bush and Richard Nixon, are three of the most documented liars in presidential history. Do we really want to continue this 'say anything' Bush/Clinton Era?

adam/Brooklyn New York City (Sent Monday, January 21, 2008 11:52 AM)


The reason why Obama deserves to lose and lose badly is encapsulated in the idiocy of conflating the Bush and Clinton presidencies by his born-yesterday cult members who seem to be willing to throw everyone and every principle that the democratic party has stood for in pursuit of, "unity".
Bill Clinton along with George W Bush and Richard Nixon, are three of the most documented liars in presidential history. Do we really want to continue this 'say anything' Bush/Clinton Era?

adam/Brooklyn New York City (Sent Monday, January 21, 2008 11:52 AM)


The reason why Obama deserves to lose and lose badly is encapsulated in the idiocy of conflating the Bush and Clinton presidencies by his born-yesterday cult members who seem to be willing to throw everyone and every principle that the democratic party has stood for in pursuit of, "unity".
There are gonna be sooo many of you people having to run out to your Drs and asking for antidepressants on election day. Can't wait for the Clintons to be in the White House again. All you fools, along with the rightwing nuts can all get on planes and leave the country too. Wooooooo, that will be a hoot!!
any of you Hillary supporter monitoring these comments sounds like Bill For presidnet. again tell me whats shes done for her 35yrs of service 7 are related to her yrs in the senate what about the other 28 or is this something you cant answer....not ready for a king and queen in the white house
Russ Wells, Maine (Sent Monday, January 21, 2008 11:29 AM
__________________

Why are you asking the Hillary’s Supporters this question....They're never going to answer the question....Believe me, I've tried....

The seems to be completely obsess with Senator Obama
With all this fighting going on between Clinton and Obama, maybe the democratic party should've gone with Edwards. Maybe Edwards is smart enough to know this, maybe that's why he says he is going all the way to the convention? By then maybe everyone will be tired of Clinton and Obama.
What is a Fairy tale? "Consider another presidential candidate who was far more of a novice.  He had the gall to run forfor president even though he had served a single undistinguished term in the House of Representatives, before being hounded back to his district.  That was Abraham Lincoln.
Another successful president scorned any need for years of apprenticeship in Washington, declaring "The same old experience is not relevant." He e suggested that the most useful training comes not from hanging around the White House and Congress but rather from experience "rooted in the real lives of real people" so that "it will bring real results if we have the courage to change.  That was Bill Clinton runnning in 1992against George H.W. Bush, who was then trumpeting his own experience over the callow youth of Mr. Clinton. It might seem obvious that long service in Washington is the best preparation for the White House, but on the contrary, one lesson of American history is the length of experience in national politics is an extremely poor predictor of presidential success."  This exerpt was taken from the NYT Sunday January 20, 2005 article by Nicholas D. Kristof.
As a true blue Dem, I have no problem with Obama's Reagan comments. He didn't say Republican ideas were all good, but was acknowledging, from a historical perspective, that those ideas influenced our culture at the time. He was also implying that the pendulum tends to swing and that we are in a position now to make another cultural shift. What is sooooo hard to understand about that?

Obama, as usual, is ahead of the curve in making a case for Dems to the general public. Unfortunately what Obama doesn't have is a spouse who is a former president. The press gives undue attention and weight to every whiny, complaining, and misleading thing Bill says. Hillary is not succeeding on her own merit if she is dependent on him to take her opponents down.

Even more frightening is the perception by the country of this developing into a co-presidency. The only thing that would unite Republicans and Independents more than rejecting Hillary is getting another shot at Bill as well. If he continues to inject himself into her campaign this aggressively there is going to be a backlash. Maybe too late for Obama to gain the nomination but certainly not too late to derail a Democratic victory in the fall.
Obama twisted both of the Clinton's comments during Nevada race to bolster his position.  B. clinton's "fairy tale" comment re Obama's Iraq position (a damed good observation) was twisted to imply his "whole" candidacy.  What dirty politics.  Then, H. Clinton's intelligent, non-offensive comment about Roosevelt and M. Luther King, was twisted to imply dis-respect for the latter, just to lure black voters.  So much for Obama's "unity" talk.  Now he turned around to claim his character and words were twisted.  Give us a break, for goodness sake.

Banners in front of Harlem church include Obama supporters telling Hilary Clinton not to steal obama's black voters.  What's going on?  If she isn't allowed to win black voters, does it mean Obama isn't allowed to win white or other minority voters?!  what a joke.  Obama, wake up, be realistic, and more honest...get real...so many of these just show up his inexperience...the process just show another side of him not seen by Americans before
Bill shut up!!  I agree with Barack and not you.   Reagan did rally Republicans, Democrats and Independents behind his candidacy.   You did not.   Granted you did have good economic times.   However, what could have been one of the best administrations of our time was turned into a smut war.  That was entirely your fault, no one else.  I for one do not want to go through that again.  Besides could Hill run without her last name being Clinton?   No way.   We shouldn’t vote for Hill because we will be stuck with Bill.  For his 3rd term no less.  
I am starting to hate the Clintons as well.  there is no way I can give them my vote now.  What is funny is Hillary lists Ronald Reagan as one of her favorite Presidents.  Double standards in affect?
Aaron- Phoenix (Sent Monday, January 21, 2008 11:56 AM)
_______________

Starting?..... I have surpass that emotion
One can not be certain Bill thinks he 'is' campaigning for Hillary.  We must all remember the meaning of 'is' has historically not been one of his strengths.  Biil Clinton is not so much dividing the party as much as abrading the less loyal Democrats and Independents away.  
He sounds like he's trying to get a surrogate elected so he can have another shot at the Presidency.  I found his first 8 years only so-so and considering his current 'campainging', I can only imagine 4 or 8 more years would be worse.  Hillary needs to send him and his race baiting mouth to time-out.  I supported Hillary until she allowed herself to become 'Billary'.  
Contrary to his opinion, African-Americans do not OWE him or his wife anything.  I can tell you for certain his administration was not as good to African-Americans (or women) as he wants folk to believe.
To the FIRST READ STAFF... thank you for FINALLY reprinting what Barack Obama actually said. Now if you had done this in the FIRST PLACE, and had your or your reporter embeds confronted the Clinton campaign on this in a more timely fashion, I wouldn't be peeved at you now.

This lame-a** reporting of only the Clinton spin on a story has to come to an end. Chuck Todd, I single you out because you are the "face of NBC Politics" and if you are lazy at your job, no one is served. You cannot deliver fact-based analysis of the political campaigns if you ignore the facts.

Bill Clinton has been lying about Barack Obama since the waning weeks of the Iowa caucus campaign. It is high time the facts as they are, and not the "facts" as Bill Clinton wishes them to be, are reported.

Bill and Hillary are a disgrace to our democratic process and our country.  Just who is the candidate?  Looks like Bill thinks he is.  Bill & Hillary brought in busloads of people from New York and the surrounding areas the day before the new Hampshire Primary.  They also brought in busloads of people from California as well just before the Nevada caucuses.  Notice the influx of NEW voters voting for Hillary in both states. Hillary did not legally win those states. Watch for the same to happen in SC. This underhanded and illegal method of getting out of state people to vote for Hillary has to be stopped, NOW!  Hillary is not a winner; both she and Bill are  losers, they have no integrity and are dishonest; sooner or later their slash-and-burn tactics and illegal use of out-of-state voters will catch up to them.  Hope it is sooner!!  Howard Dean needs to step up to the plate and stop this corruption by the Clintons.  Perhaps the DNC can strip Hillary of her candidacy for all of the violations and illegalites for which she and Bill are responsible.  Their methods strip us of our democracy!  
Someone toss Bill another cigar and a fat chick.  We need him to shut up for a while.
I am a 57yr. old black, single woman.  I am also an Obama supporter.  I have been surprised and disappointed by Bill Clinton and the Clinton campaign's desperate, mean, nasty, implied racist, and phony emotional tactics. Any hope stirred from the Iowa caucus, that race could finally, possibly, be overlooked has been lost. Always having voted Democrat in the past, I’m sorry to say that if Obama doesn't win the nomination, I won't go Republican, but neither will I be voting for the ClintonS (plural)!!!

Bill needs to get over it and face the fact that his wife is running, not him! Makes one wonder exactly who would be the President should Billary win.
I, for one, am glad to see Obama speaking up about the lying tactics that Bill Clinton has chosen to use to get his wife in office and give himself a 3rd term!!!

Obama has pretty much steered clear of engaging Clinton, but at some point he had to speak out, or the media would have jumped at the chance to call him weak.

Lastly, I’m no fan of Ronald Reagan, but Obama said Reagan changed the “TRAJECTORY of the country…”, that I’ll accept, he did, in my opinion, not for the best. Obama is clearly trying to unite this country with it’s many opinions, divisive issues and growing language of hate toward others, while the Clinton’s have chosen to lift and carry the old, tired, worn banner of the Republicans to divide, divide, divide and conquer. For shame!!

I am let down, disgusted and disillusioned.  
But…how silly of me anyway…such audacity to dare assume hope!!!
Sierra Obamas paid consultant. Your same old comments getting tired. You need to quit writing a book on here.
I submitted a comment earlier which never made it on the board. I guess it wasn't nasty or devisive enough to post. I read through these comments and I can't believe that we're all supposed to be on the same side. Democrats. It's not the candidates who are ripping the part apart--it's us. look in the mirror if you want to see who is to blame.
Obama was extoling the republican party as "the party of ideas.. for the better part of 20 years". Look at the video tape. He said it. And he said it to do exactly what Bill Clinton said he said it for.. To get republicans to vote for him in the caucuses.. They did, so he got more delegates in the caucuses than Hillary even though she got more votes
These idiots just want to HAND the nomination to Obama!! Bill Clinton is the only one in the party who is challenging this inexperienced, substanceless media darling! Get a grip. Getting either parties nomination to run for president should be a difficult, challenging campaign, not just a long book tour. Thank you Bill for trying to shed some light on this lightweight insubstantial pretender who likes to vote "present" instead of YES or NO. "Present" is what you tell your elementary school teacher when he or she calls roll.


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