The DNC weighs in on Michigan

Posted: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:40 AM by Mark Murray
Filed Under: Democrats, 2008, Michigan

From NBC's Mark Murray
DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee co-chairs Alexis Herman and James Roosevelt issued the following memo to members of the committee:

"We have recently been asked whether the legislation as proposed by Michigan would fit within the framework of the National Party’s Delegate Selection Rules. Our review of this legislation indicates that it would, in fact, fit within the framework of the Rules if, it were, passed by the state legislature and used by the Michigan State Democratic Party as the basis of drafting a formal Delegate Selection Plan. If a formal Delegate Selection Plan is received we will convene a meeting of the RBC to consider such a Plan."

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Comments

The Democrats are so screwed up, they don't even know how to run an election. How can anyone expect them to run the country?

If you are a Democrat, all of your votes definitely do not count.

Turtle G. (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:44 AM)

Someone had suggested to let the pledge delegates vote according to how their districts would vote. I think this is a good idea. It will save money definitely.
Or do a re-vote - a primary and punish their super delegates instead. Just don't disenfranchise the voters who had nothing to do with moving the election date.

Or DNC will suffer in November!!!

voice of reason, PA (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:46 AM)

AND THE MEMOS ARE FLYING like paper airplanes this morning~

Lynette, NYC (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:48 AM)

This is how it should be. Angry voters' demands should be hammered out between the State and the DNC. The campaigns should stay out of it and abide by the final decisions. Florida too. This would have been solved already for those millions of voters in both states if the campaigns would butt out.

Margaret, Columbus, Ohio (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:52 AM)

I understood Obama to say that he would abide by what the DNC decided...so, isn't it now on the legilature and DNC?

Obama 08

Lisa, New Britain, CT (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:53 AM)

Compelled to respond to a very desperate Hillary. This is a very self centered politician. It is too damn late, and I do not understand why the DNC is intervening so late.
The fact that Hillary has to change her schedule to go to Michigan to lobby hard for her own interests speaks volumes. She ants to finish her political career with a presidency tainted by more scandals, thanks to stupid and hypocritical voters who would vote for her.
If for any reason nobody does not like Obama (and I could not think of legitimate reasons for why they don't), then do a favor to America by voting for McCain. Hillary is too corrupt to be a president, period.

Jerry S. Oakland, CA (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:54 AM)

Obama is doing everything possible to prevent any re-votes in Michigan and Florida. It looks like he will succeed. It kindof makes me sick to my stomach that a democratic presidential candidate is deliberately trying to disenfranchise millions of voters.

William, Warrior, Alabama (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:55 AM)

HOW CAN YOU HAVE MILLIONS OF PEOPLE.... AND NOT ALLOW THIER VOICES TO BE HEARD IN FL and MI ??

THIS IS AMERICA and BY NOT ALLOWING VOICES TO BE HEARD IS OUTRAGOUS!!

HOWARD DEAN and THE DEM. PARTY OUGHT TO BE ASHAMED OF THEMSELVES !!

Does this mean voters, people and fellow American do not matter !!

Ashamed to be a DEM. (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:55 AM)

WHATEVER IT TAKES
TO LET THE VOTES BE COUNTED.
AFTER ALL THIS IS AMERICA.

MAY HILLARY WIN--BIG TIME.

SHIRLEY NW,AR. (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:56 AM)

Blame Michigan.

adam/Brooklyn New York City (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:57 AM)

Newsflash to the Obama camp: why aren't you arguing that giving Michigan a re-vote would essentially disenfranchise millions of voters who played by the rules? Letting Michigan vote in June would give the lawmakers who broke the rules originally PRECISELY what they want; they'd have an outweighted say in who the nominee is.

Scott (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:03 AM)

The rules are the rules. You don't change them in the middle of the game, that's absurd. Get over it.

chessplayer (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:05 AM)

Well Obama now what?Where is that leadership?Why cannt you let these people have a voice?Think they will remember this if you get the nom?You are really messing up this election, this party and this country. You must be very proud.

Mox (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:07 AM)

Hillary Clinton is despicable. That's right. I know Patty, J.Merle, Francis and the rest will scream foul ("you're so nasty you Obama supporters"). However, it's the truth. She doesn't care about Michigan voters. She cares about stealing this election. The part that makes her despicable is to try to pin this on Barack. The fault lies with the lawmakers in Michigan who thumbed their noses at the Democratic Party. Of that, there's no question. The fault also lies with you, Senator Clinton. YOU signed the pledge. YOUR man Harold Ickes agreed to the rules. YOU are now trying to get a do-over after the game is finished.

ME, CA (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:08 AM)

The DNC wants the revote. They know Obama can't win now and need to find a road of legitimacy for Clinton when the super delegates back her nomination. Obama knows this and is obstructing (what happened to your confidence in the "insurmountable" delegate lead Barack?). It's not going to look good when Obama appears to be denying MI voters their franchise. He can use the "rules" argument, but he's already on the record as supporting a fair revote. And he broke the rules in Florida by running TV ads. Keep it up Barack and the Dems won't get FL or MI in the fall.

You have no one but yourself to blame Barack. You campaigned on hope and change and got caught playing the same old games. The poll numbers don't lie. Clinton beats McCain. You lose. And now that the White House schedules are out what will you have to whine about? The tax returns will be out in April and the earmarks are already registered and certified in the Congressional Record.

Your campaign is transparent you keep saying. Yes it is, and America is seeing right through you.

Shtuey (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:12 AM)

Chessplayer... you're right, the rules are the rules... and the rules say that the superdelegates are to vote for the candidate they believe will win the general election, and they are NOT bound by popular vote totals or elected delegate totals at all. So the Obama crowd should stop arguing that superdelegates should be bound in some way, because THAT is a change of the rules.

Rob in NV (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:17 AM)

Just do it quickly or don't do it at all. It is beyond all reason that the state democrats would wait more than 3 months after they know they have a problem to do something about it. A cynic might think they were waiting to see how the delegate count ran first.

nuanced (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:18 AM)

WHY IS THE OBAMA CAMP DOING EVERYTHING THEY CAN TO STOP A RE-VOTE in MI or FL??

I thought that Obama wants to UNITE America... but by thier actions of not agreeing to a re-vote --suggests they do not care about thier fellow Americans !! THAT IS AWEFUL !

AMERICAN VOTER (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:18 AM)

Oh please let this be happening..
Hillary will take Michigan and be on her way to the White House...There is way too much not known about Obama...And for me what I do know is not good stuff.
He can talk but talking is not going to create jobs,get healthcae for my children ,or save our economy..

sheron,largo,fl (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:19 AM)

Hillary is once again demonstrating that she's willing to destroy the Democratic Party and its chances of winning in November in order to secure the nomination. She's self-serving and desperate.

Enrique, Chicago (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:22 AM)

Hey, at this rate we in Oregon will have our primary before Michigan can get thier mulligan. Neither will mean much. This system with only two parties is broken. Who the hell is the DNC in Michigan to change rules and loose the vote of every Michigan Democrat for the primaries?

One day primary vote on January 2 of the election year for every state.
One list of Candidates as broad a spectrum as possible.
Narrow field to top 4. And have a spending cap.

Keep it simple.

RH Oregon (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:23 AM)

Scott,
That's pure nonsense.
It doesn't matter what day any state's primary is held. Delegates are selected according to who gets more votes in what district.
The argument that allowing Democrats in Michigan, or Florida for that matter, to simply participate in the selection of their party's candidate disenfranchises anyone else is just plain silly.
The votes in the other states still count, as do the delegates. It isn't like allowing Michigan and Florida to be part of the process negates anyone elses participation.
But, if The DNC chooses to go along with refusing to count the primary election that was already held in both states and seating delegates accordingly, OR if it refuses to do a re-vote and simply seat delegates on a 50-50 basis, then Democrats in BOTH states who voted for Hillary just might decide to cross the aisle in protest come November.
I know I would if I were one of them.
There isn't any reason not to allow a re-vote if either state comes up with a date, and the money to do it, OTHER than the fact that Obama is worried he would lose.

J. Merle Stanley, Westchester, NY (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:23 AM)

I'm dying to have someone give one example of the Obama campaign doing anything to prevent a revote in MI. If you think that the Clintons would bend over backwards for a revote in MI if they had lost the state you are kidding yourself. When Obama's the nominee (emphasis on WHEN) he will win MI; he will win FL. I'm sure there are a lot of voters in MI and FL who would like a revote, but my feeling from many of those I've been in touch with is that they think that the Clintons are using them as their Hail Mary pass.

D. W., Greensboro, NC (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:24 AM)

Sorry, the politicians in Michigan and Florida SCREWED UP
They defied the party rules
You made your beds, now sleep in them

Trying to be 'king makers'
Gov. Grandhold, Sen. Levin..... Your FAULT !!

TS

Billary is just trying to draw out the process
No dice
The rules are the rules

Even for Billary

Sierra, SF (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:25 AM)

Is this Former Secretary of Labor Alexis Herman from the Clinton Administration...Ah yes it is!
Where was she when they decided on this debacle?

All the Hillary supporters very much in charge of the process; I see.

Let me see, have another revote and allow the Republicans to continue to hijack the process from us.

What is really going on?

The legislators are betting the people will get mad as hell enough not to vote them out of office for disenfranchising voters.

Democrats stand firm. Are they on the ballot in the general election? You not only vote for a US President, but you often vote for local offices as well. Check it out! Get them out of office. Even if you can't stomach the other candidate for President, stay invloved locally, make it clear locally that you disapprove of them.

They are betting that you will be too mad to show up and vote at all. Whatt they don't bet on is, it is not happening, not this year!

Michelle Zee (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:26 AM)

"Obama is doing everything possible to prevent any re-votes in Michigan and Florida. It looks like he will succeed. It kindof makes me sick to my stomach that a democratic presidential candidate is deliberately trying to disenfranchise millions of voters."

The Obama side is saying that the elections need to fair, properly managed and not exclude voters who voted in the Republican election because they thought they would never get to vote in the Democrat election.

I don't see that as disenfranchisement but rather a bid for fairness. Keep in mind that this was not started by the Obama campain and that the Clinton campaign is the one that has pushed for a revote from the beginning when THEY agreed the Fla. and Mich. primary wouldn't count.

bobw Mendon, NY (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:27 AM)

Why can't the DEMOCRATS do the same as the REPUBLICANS did, give the president candidates, partial delegates as to who won the most votes. I am a Democrate living in Florida. I am believing what my grandmother said, "WHY VOTE THEY ARE NOT COUNTED, ONLY A FEW WILL BE HONORED. HILLARY HAS A RIGHT TO BE PRESIDENT.

Catherine Chesser Crestview, FL (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:27 AM)

The rules are the rules. You don't change them in the middle of the game, that's absurd. Get over it.
chessplayer (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:05 AM)

Were talking politician here, not chess...

RH Oregon (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:30 AM)

Sounds like Bill got to the DNC Rules Committee.

Go Ahead Hillary, Cheat....and good luck in the general.

Mkd (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:31 AM)

Rules don't matter! Don't "disenfranchise" the voters! Let's not hold the state legislatures responsible for messing up the system in the first place, no, let's blame the candidates who tried to abide by the rules. Reward Hillary for disregarding DNC guidelines, for winning Michigan uncontested and winning FL by being the only one to campaign there!

Sounds like a great plan.

Jason Rhodes, Baltimore, MD (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:31 AM)

nuanced (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:32 AM)

William, Warrior, Alabama: '...It kindof makes me sick to my stomach that a democratic presidential candidate is deliberately trying to disenfranchise millions of voters...'

Actually, Hillary's strategy is for the Super Delegates to OVER RULE the will of the Democratic voters.

She wants Super Delegates to ignore the fact the Obama has the most pledged delegates, the most states and the most votes AND NOMINATE HER !!

How do you feel about disenfranchising the Democratic primary voters ?

How's your stomach feel ?

Billary just wants to draw out the nominating process by having re-votes
No reason to accomodate her
She CAN'T overtake Obama in pledged delegates
She CAN'T overtake Obama in states won
She CAN'T overtake Obama in the popular vote

GAME OVER

Sierra, SF (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:34 AM)

Obama is trying to disenfranchise voters? Imagine that. Isn't that ironic? I guess he didn't mean a word of his "big" "speech" yesterday. What a joke.

Obama is OVER. His fatal mistake in defiantly refusing to completely disassociate himself with an avowed racist, anti-white, anti-American, anti-semitic, pro-Louis Farakaan Nation of Islam supporter is the death knell for this and any future campaign.

Also, Obama proved himself a liar several times in the last few days. On Friday, Obama finally admitted to the Chicago Tribune and Sun Times newspapers that he had lied about his relationship with the under criminal indictment Antoin Tony, who he took twice as much money from as he originally stated.

Yesterday, Obama lied again during his "big" "speech" about never having been in his "church" during one of his "pastor" Wright's offensive tirades. After claiming all weekened that he never heard them, yesterday he admitted he had. Obama is a lying fraud.

MSNBC, how does rapid Obama supporter Keith Olberman like being directly lied to by Obama on Friday night????

No Presidential nomination, no VP nomination, and likely no re-election to the U.S. Senate. Obama is toxic now.

The Dems better act quickly to get this toxic loser out of the race or they will have a crushing defeat in November.

Go Hillary!!! May God Bless America, NEVER, NEVER, "God Dam- America" as Obama's favorite "pastor" and "mentor" likes to shout.

What kind of character and judgment does Obama possess to subject his two young daughters to this preacher's hateful, anti-American words in a so-called "church"??????????????????????????????

Jack (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:35 AM)

"...The rules are the rules. You don't change them in the middle of the game, that's absurd. Get over it. ..."
chessplayer (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:05 AM)

Even if it disenfranchises 2 million voters in 2 seperate states?
I thought Obama was about 'change,' and about including everyone in the process of government?
That isn't what this looks like. It looks like he's afraid to lose in Michigan and Florida, and as a result he found a technicality to keep that from happening.
That isn't "change." That's just another politician using the system to their advantage, and that's the "same old, same old."

J. Merle Stanley Westchester, NY (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:36 AM)

Here is the difference between the Obama and Clinton campaigns:

Obama thinks it is the place of the state Democratic Parties and the national Democratic Party to decide how to re-do a primary.

Clinton thinks it is her place to decide when and how this election will take place - an election in which her name will be on the ballot.

The Democrats will not win in November, and we have Hillary Clinton to thank. But hey, as long as she wins her precious - yet worthless - nomination, she'll be happy.

CitizenJ (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:36 AM)

How can Sen. Obama go around the country sayiung he wants to unite Americans from all corners of our country and yet, NOT allow them to be counted.

What does this say about his candadacy and his ability to actually LEAD this counret in the right direction?

MANY, MANY situations are now making me seriously think about his leadership abilities !

It is really shameful not to allow voices in this country to be heard.

Shame on the DNC and Howard Dean!

Vote in America, Right? (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:37 AM)

I agree with Margaret. Well said. Regardless of whoever supports whom, the candidates need to leave it alone. Ordeals like this are where wasteful bureaucracy is born.

Joe, Pensacola (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:38 AM)

sharon,largo,fl (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:39 AM)

They shouldn't give in to these spoiled babies! When Repigs say the Dems won't be touch enough negotiators with terrorists and bad guys, they'll point to this as the perfect example...and they'll be right.

Class Warrior, D.C. (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:39 AM)

Hilliary will be the nominee. Get over it.

Hillary or McCain '08

Brandon, Louisville, KY (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:39 AM)

Just curious, what would be the distribution if the delegates were awarded as they stand after the primaries in both Florida,and Michigan?

just jerry sioux city iowa (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:39 AM)

everybody this isnt just now. There votes should count like Hillary just said in a great speech. Boy Obama is sure milking this speech, another today lots of free press. Is his money drying up with this pastor blaster? They will issue a total now -they are so easy.So predictable politican.Little by little people are seeing him for what he is. I hope it doesnt take to long.These people cann't get there vote now what do you think they will do in Nov. Tell you what I would do.Maybe Obama thinks the state isnt important. Seems like that is what he is saying now.He could mess up a good dream

joe-pa (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:40 AM)

Chuck,
I am wondering why superdelegate Jack is hypocritically backing Hillary if she does not even admit the war vote was a mistake and failed to read intelligence reports before voting? If Jack opposed the war, it is best to stay netural until the nominee emerges, or Obama should be selected.
Hillary's superdelegates seem to be mostly hypocrites or are supporting her out of their long, cozy relationship with her. Like Putin's successor, friendship is what drives some superdelegates to support Hillary. We had the corrupt Waters backing Hillary and now a hypocritical Jack. Or are the supers backing her because she is the establishment candidate regardless of anything, including scandals even if that means Hillary, when pairing with McCain, would lose the general election?
Friendship should not be a reason for voting for a particular candidate, nor should bribery. Talent and honesty should be the keys to making a meaningful election of the candidate. And Jack should have remained netural or back someone who is opposed to the war, like Nader or Obama, and avoid being labeled a hypocrite.

Ron Hussein Allen (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:40 AM)

Jerry in Oakland ... the same stupid people who voted for an inexperienced Bush in 2000 are now voting for Obama. These are people that ignore the facts and issues and choose to go with the flow and vote for whomever makes them feel warm and fuzzy inside ..... are these the people you are talking about :)

RGO, Californi (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:43 AM)

The people voted. Count their votes. BO has done so much harm to our party. If he had won those states you better bet they would count or he'd say Hillary was stealing the nominee. This man is too much trouble, I only hope the past few day's will make people wake up and see him for what he is. Do we really want someone in there that if you don't agree with him then you're a racist.

Jamie (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:46 AM)

I see all of the ignorant Obama supporters are out in full force today .. once again speaking volumes and truly saying NOTHING just like their candidate.

RGO, California (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:46 AM)

i am sorry, but i just cant understand how the DNC is getting blamed for this... it is all at the fault of the elected STATE officials who made the decision to move the primary after MUNEROUS warnings of the repercussions!!!! why arent they to blame? they are the decision makers that "disenfranchised" their respective states voters...

michigan & florida: dont re-elect these idiots! they are to blame!

and why spend $10 to $12 million (per state) to essentially didvide the delegates in half... it is a waste of tiem and money... especially since it would essentially not change a thing due to the 2024 needed delegate count to be proprtionally adjusted upwards... nothing would change!!! it would be a total waste of time and money!

Mich. & FLA, you want "justice"? do NOT re-elect the state officials that made the decision to move forward the primaries after being warned numerous times that the state delegates would be stripped if they did so. they still did it, knowing what would happen... this whole mess is their fault!

BIG franky, Rochester, NY (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:46 AM)

William Wrrior,
Actually, the problem is that Hillary never spoke up on behalf of any state until the outcome does not favor her. She stated once that Mich. and Fl. did not count and even signed a pledge not to campaign and to abide by the rules. But after Obama, who preferred to play by the rules, was ahead in the delegate count and the popular vote, she is now speaking up loudly and falsely accusing Obama. He is refusing to appease her and satisfy her political interests at his own (and his supporters') costs. He cannot jsut let her take advantage of anything at his own expense.

Ron Hussein Allen (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:47 AM)

and Sierra in SF .. you are the most ignorant one of them all ... people like you embarass the state of California. I really think you should move away.

RGO, California (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:47 AM)

Not that the MSNBC Gang would ever talk about this but doesn’t Senator Obama’s obstruction of re-votes in both Florida and Michigan completely undercut his position that the Super’s should honor the will of the Pledged Delegates. For someone who wants everyone to believe he’s ahead, isn’t this both self-serving and shortsighted? He can only win if Florida and Michigan don’t count?

Ralph, Mexico, NY (Sent Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:49 AM)

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