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First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC Political Researcher



Clinton camp: Debate 'game changing'

Posted: Thursday, April 17, 2008 11:43 AM by Domenico Montanaro
Filed Under: ,

From NBC/NJ’s Athena Jones, NBC’s Domenico Montanaro and Andrea Mitchell
Clinton aides held an hour-long conference call Thursday morning to highlight what they described as a winning debate performance last night by the New York senator, calling it a "game-changing" moment because it had raised new questions about Obama for voters and the press to consider.

Communications Director Howard Wolfson called the meetup in Philadelphia last night a "very important and illuminating debate" and said that in it Clinton showed "the strength of her leadership" in foreign policy, getting troops out of Iraq and other issues.

VIDEO: Tim Russert, moderator of "Meet the Press" talks with TODAY's Matt Lauer about the Democratic candidates’ debate in Philadelphia.

Wolfson also framed the debate as one about forthrightness. He said Clinton “gave straight answers” on the tough questions (Bosnia, integrity) and Obama, by contrast, still has some explaining to do (on 1960s radical Bill Ayers and Obama’s stance on gun rights).

“His campaign tried to dodge and weave” when it came to Obama’s answering a questionnaire, in which Obama advocated for a ban on hand guns, Wolfson said. “Last night, he did not give an answer. Sen. Obama needs to be more forthright.”

The campaign also continued to maintain that Clinton never made the “screw ’em” remark about Southern white voters after the 1994 midterm election losses -- as has been claimed by three people present.

Spokesman Phil Singer insisted that Don Baer and Bruce Reed, other participants in the Camp David 1995 meeting, have no recollection of Clinton making the comment and don’t remember this as reflecting the tone of the meeting. Singer went on to say that if you look at the way Sen. Clinton has lived her life and the policies she's pursued, it’s clear she's advocated a progressive agenda aimed at lifting all Americans up.

Benjamin Barber, a noted political scientist and author who was also at the meeting, wrote in his 2001 book that Clinton did say it. As we noted earlier, Barber confirmed to First Read that he heard her make the comment and added that he is a Clinton supporter and donor. FEC data shows Barber donated $1,000 to Clinton’s campaign on Jan. 24.

“We’ve given you our answer on this,” Wolfson said when questioned about Barber’s account. “I do not know the gentleman in question.” Wolfson added that he’s “glad that he’s a supporter” and that he’s not quarreling with Barber’s memory, “but the recollection of other people in room is different.”

The campaign also continued its focus on the significance of the Pennsylvania primary. Singer highlighted Obama’s financial advantages, that he’s spending $3.4 million this week there, an amount Singer called “"earth-shattering, record-breaking, eye-popping, extraordinary.”

“One has to wonder,” Singer said, “if Sen. Obama cannot win under these circumstances, it will affirm, in my view, that … Sen. Clinton is the best candidate to be our standard-bearer going forward.”

Of course, pouring money into the state is not just about the primary. Even if he were to lose the primary, but win the Democratic nomination, those funds could be seen as an investment in the general election.

Some other points:
- Aides were also pressed about Clinton's pledge not to raise taxes on the middle class and her commitment to setting military policy in Iraq -- specifically a policy to begin withdrawing troops within 60 days of her inauguration -- herself and directing the military commanders to carry it out. Aides said the purpose of a campaign was to lay out a candidate's goals and resisted the idea that her answers had boxed her in should she eventually become the nominee or president.

- When challenged on the matter of the two members of Ayers’ Weather Underground group who were pardoned by President Clinton, Wolfson said the two women pardoned were contrite about their past actions whereas Ayers was not and that neither of the women had hosted an event for Clinton at their home, as Ayers had for Obama.

- Aides challenged Obama to agree to a debate in North Carolina -- Clinton has agreed to one, but he has not. Clinton herself has argued Obama only wanted to debate her in states where he was not in the lead.

- When asked whether Clinton's admission that Obama could win in November undermined or contradicted the electability argument she was making to superdelegates, Wolfson said it did not and said that saying somebody can win isn't the same as saying that he will win.

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Comments

Democrats: Always bitter, always angry, always playing games.
The Clinton camp gets more delusional by the day.
Wolfson is no better than either Clinton... He is slippery, slimey, and dirty. Politics as usual.

Let us talk about Bosnia, Columbia, their conversations about NAFTA. If everyhing is on the table, let's revisit Monica and Whitewater and all those pardons of President Clinton. How about the donations to his library. People who live in glass houses should not throw stones.

ABC = HRC = Politics as usual
Why isn't first read reporting on the lastest Clinton "mispeak" which is commonly known as a LIE.  

In the ad that she attacks Obama in---one of the men is a campaign volunteer from New JERSEY....

You cannot trust her at ALL!!!!
Ha! Ha! You wish !

What a phony campaign ... Clinton-Style!
The bottom line is that superdelegates are moving in Obama's direction.  Clinton spin no longer works.

I wonder why no one questioned HRC about throwing Al Gore & John Kerry under the bus to score a political political point last weekend.
Wait.. so now the debate is game-changing?  First it was Michelle-gate, then wright-gate, then bitter-gate and now debate-gate


PATHETIC... Hillary, you answered forthrightly last night.. you admitted you are a liar
Of course it was game changing. People are going to start asking Obama some hard questions. All obama can do to answer hard questions is say it is "silly season".Don't look at my judgment of selecting people I associate with .

OBAMA YOU ASSOCIATIONS WITH PEOPLE LIKE WRIGHT,AYERS, SAY A LOT ABOUT YOUR CHARACTER.

Clinton 08
This video sums up the Hillary question in her own words.

http://www.youtube.com/user/jedreport

I wouldn't count on it Clinton. Couple new supers and another Penn. newspaper endorsement just kicked off Obama's day. The American people are smarter than Clinton gives credit. We're tired of the same old dirty politics and that's why Obama will be the next president.
"If you look at the way Senator Clinton has lived her life so far..." That is priceless.  She has lived her life telling lies and exaggerating her accomplishments.  When I listen to her go on and on about bringing the troops home, I just want to scream at her that she is the one who sent them there.  She is the one who stood up and applauded George Bush.  What is wrong with people?  These are the issues.  This is what needs to be talked about.  
I cannot believe what this country is doing;how people are validating the lies and schemes of the Clintons.  
Doesn't anyone wonder why the Clintons did not want to release this years tax returns until after the primaries?  Do you really believe that Bill doesn't owe anything to all of these countries that he is flying around to and taking money from?  Hillary basks in the $800,000 that came from Columbia, but she doesn't approve.  Keep on believing.  
The one thing that I am sure of is that Hillary will not be president, if by some underhanded disgusting manner she should get the nomination.  I know that there are many democrats who will never vote for her because of her lack of character and morality.  The way that she treats Senator Obama is the way that she treats anyone who disagrees with her.  That is why we have gone another 15 years without Universal Health care.  This is the way she does business.  
Shame, shame on ABC for running the most trivial, superficial debate yet.

Here we had a chance to talk about real economic issues that affect PA and the rest of the country - instead we hear about flag pins, Bosnia, and hippie friends.  The dodos that ran this debate should be ashamed - what crap!
Debates are fine - moderators asking questions are not - these are not debates - they are theater, and bad theater at that. And now Hillary has another comment that she says she did not say and those that heard could have heard it can not recall it? As a parallel thought, did you see Larry King last night asking the polygamist wives questions about teenage girls  at the Texas compound - and they all answered with the exact same nebulous response.
Yes, Hillary, it is game changing.

Voters and Supperdelegates will be RUNNING to Obama to avoid association with YOU!
I don't think the debate changed a thing. In fact, it reinforced my notion of the Clinton's as nothing more than low class political fixers. With her husband's former staff member as one of the moderators, I didn't have much hope for anything balanced. I wasn't disappointed.

If she had been held accountable for Mark Penn's paid work for the Colombians and his continuing work for her campaign, she might have had the chance to make it a real game changer by being forthright for once. Or if she had finally been made to answer whether or not any of the $800,000 Bill Clinton received for speaking favorably on behalf of Colombia...or if she had been asked why she thought southern democrats should be screwed because they lost Congress...or if she had to account for her past associations with Peter Paul and Norman Hsu...or had her feet held to the fire about her church going gun shooting history...or how her constant state of exhaustion readies her to be President on day one...

But no, there were no game changers...just the same old predictable games of the Clintons and their cronies.

Get in line America and be prepared to wait until the Clintons repay all their political debts before they get around to the rest of us.
It's funny how Senator Clinton wants us to overlook her mispeaking about Bosnia, but refuses to overlook Senator Obama's mangled remarks in San Francisco.  It to me almost 'elitist' to feel she deserves more consideration than her rival.
This character assasination attempt will fail miserably. Hillary's negatives will go up even higher. People are not as gullible as they're assumimg. Just watch.
Oh, Baer and Reed (both Clinton supporters) say they don't recall Hillary saying "Screw 'em" about working class southern white voters, while three others who were present at the meeting do?  Well, it must not have happened then.

Why is this story not getting the airtime the "bitter" story did?  Please don't sell out, MSNBC!
Clinton has had 7 years since 2001 to contest that "screw 'em" comment... Why did she wait until now? Maybe it was true that she said it...

Clinton's campaign saying that her policies are a "goal" and haven't "boxed her in" makes them sound a lot like hypocrites... They jumped on Obama's camp for those Iraq-related comments by that woman who got fired for calling Hilly-zilla a "monster"... Makes you think...
Yep, when the quarterback gets a concussion it is "game changing".

When ol' glassjaw Clinton tries for a jab and ends up on the recieving end of an uppercut, it's "game changing".
10..9..8..7..6..5..4..3..2..1.. Your out!!!!!!!!

American hates you Hillery, open your eyes.
But what we should really be afraid of is putting a racists like Obama in the White House...

Vote for the other Democrat: John McCain
The debate was not aired in our area.  I hope the panel asked Hillary if there is a conflict of interest between her stance against Bolivia's free trade agreement and her husband lobbying for it.
at this point, barring a downright disaster, i really don't care that much about the little things that obama and mccain might do wrong or say wrong.  i just cannot stand hillary clinton.  anybody but hillary!!!
Oh, Baer and Reed (both Clinton supporters) say they don't recall Hillary saying "Screw 'em" about working class southern white voters, while three others who were present at the meeting do?  Well, it must not have happened then.

Why is this story not getting the airtime the "bitter" story did?  Please don't sell out, MSNBC!
The Obamapods get more desparate when their candidate stumbles and stammers his way through a poor debate performance, they predictably blame on moderator bias.  Whatever. Obamarama is going down, and down fast!
I think this is a very dangerous political time for Sen. Clinton.  She is all over the place and has no message or coherent theme.  She is hemhorraging superdelegates and endorsements and if she wins Pennsylvania, she might net about 1/2 dozen delegates.  I would be very very concerned about the future of her campaign.  Very concerned indeed.  Very troubling times . . . very troubling.  A shame.  And I am someone who's given money to her in the past.
Wolfson says that Hillary won the debate... my question is .... what debate???  I felt sorry that Senator Obama had to step into that "peanut gallery" and be subjected to more of the same about what already has been discussed and put to bed as not significantly relevant. Kudos to Senator Obama for not being dragged down into the fray and jumping on the Bosnia lie. Why comment on an obvious lie and a lie and a lie. The lie speaks for itself. The lie speaks for the person. I'm glad I wasn't Senator Obama..I would have walked out shaking my head saying that this is a bunch of bull.
two words:  PETER PAUL.  hillary should be in prison.
I think Obama rocked last night!!! ABC should be horribly ashamed for the way the moderators clearly attacked Obama for the first 40 minutes. However, it only served to show how Presidential he can be when under fire and just elevated my level of respect for the man. He could have thrown Hillary under the bus for the Bosnia statements, but she did that on her own with the worst response I've ever heard in a presidential debate and as I watched the meters it showed. Chuck, I have to disagree with your opinion of the debate. As a new Obama supporter, he made me finally see why he is the best candidate for the job.
THERE ARE MANY QUESTION ABOUT CLINTONS PAST AND HOW SHE IS AS SLIMMY AS HER PEOPLES TALKING POINTS.

I AGREE OBAMA DIDNT HAVE A GOOD DEBATE LAST NIGHT BUT SHE HAD THE WORSE DEBATE AND OBAMA SHOULDNT DEBATE HERE AGAIN PERIOD.

CLINTON DID ANSWER THE BOSNIA QUESTION VERY WELL AT ALL SAYING SHE SLIPPED TWICE, WELL SORRY HILLARY YOU SAID THE SAME THING 4 TIMES NOT 2 AND HOW COULD YOU BE TIRED WHEN IT WAS SAID IN A NEW CONFRANCE SHE HAD TWICE IN ONE DAY ONE AT 9 AM AND ANOTHER AT 3 PM.
GET THE STORY RIGHT HILLARY.

YOU AND YOUR HUSBAND ARE SLICK HILLARY AND SLICK WILLY YOU BOTH HAVE A HARD TIME WITH THE TRUTH.
Camp Hillary must be doing drugs.  This was no way, a game changing event.  These guys are the Whirling Dervishes of spinners.  The more they spin, the more they turn the public off.  Bill Clinton has defamed his legacy during this campaign and Hillary's embracing of the politics of personal destruction has ruined her political future in this country.  I guess they have nothing left to lose.

In any case, the issue for me is the war.  And since I am convinced that Hillary voted for the Iraqi war resolution in 2002 (without reading the NIE) for reasons of political expediency, she has forever nullified any support that I had at one time given her.  The Clintons represent a dying breed that can't understand that the internet obliges one to carry his/her past forever.  You can't change what happened.   It's like Marley's ball and chain; you reap what you sow.  All I can say is 'screw 'em'.
Obama '08
Obama will be alright no matter how hard those who oppose him try to hurt him!Obama is the man needed to get the job done.Hillary stated Obama can win General Election.Finally told truth about something!
The winner of the debate last night was John McCain.  The loser of the debate was ABC.  The two democratic candidates were just treading water.  We wanted to hear about issues that are important to us, not the spectacle called a debate that we saw last night.  Now I'm disgusted as well as bitter.
You know - this debate WAS game changing for me ( an undecided pa voter). This "debate" made me want to take a shower, yuk. I am now SURE I will not vote for Ms. Clinton.
What was the clincher??? The ugly smirk on her face. It looked like a "gotcha" moment, which makes me think this was a setup. SHAME on ABC. So much for professionalism.
A pathetic performance by Obama....poor Obama did not like be asked anything about his negatives. His disdain was showing. Looks like it is too late for Clinton...President McCain...sounds that way as Obama cannot and should not win. Since when do we vote for a cult of personality and no actual substance?
Shame on ABC. 4 negative questions for Barack and 1 for Hill on Bosnia.

No question on MArk PEnn, or Bill Clointon collecting money on Columbia trade deal. Does this not mean that Hillary is spending Columbia's money (since she files a joint tax with Bill) while she opposes the associated proposal? How is this not more important than serving on a board with a former member of the WEather Underground (when you dont appoint the board)?

And when BO points out that Bill pardoned two members of the same underground, Hill was asked if she wanted to respond or wait till after the break. She chose the later and retreated off this attack for good.

Its not true that Hill can face the republicans because she's been vetted. IT only appears so because Barack choses not to play the same politics of atack. Please PA, help us end this nightmare for good.

Clinton and Obama are fighting over exactly what the Repubs want them to. Meanwhile McCain is positioning himself for an end run. Guess what? Looks like Johnny just may get just away with it. What is right and logical will have no part of the up-comming elections. Dems. are giving it away once again.
Okay - Clinton Camp may WISH the Debate was "game changing" - I'm sure that is what Stephanopolis (Clinton's former aid and wanna-be future aid) wishes as well - And this was a game changer - for ABC - their news department has totally LOST ALL CREDABILITY
It was game changing - Sen Clinton threw away her only remaining argument to super delegates by admitting that even she thought Obama could beat McCain. So the question is, if Obama leads in pledged delegate, states won, popular vote, head-to-head match ups against McCain, highest favorability ratings, and even Sen Clinton thinks he can beat McCain.... the WHY should ANY super delegate vote for her?

She was cornered into giving an honest answer, and unfortunately for her the TRUTH is that Obama is the strongest candidate the Dems can put up against McCain.
Ah, Wolfson said its a game changer. Given his track record for credibility, Obama must have won the debate.

See, you don't need to actually watch debates, at least not after the first 19. Just wait for the reaction from the campaigns after the fact.
Dr. Barber wrote his book in 2001 and Senator Clinton has not denied this before now?  Well, this story is rather like FLAG PINS! and BITTER-Gate and SNIPER-Gate -- and oh! Let us bring in the mud-pit!  

Why don't we talk some more about flag pins.  Personally I believe flag pins should have taken up more than 15 minutes of the debate, but have been the entire debate.  Flag pins are the only thing I care about as a voter.

Because you see, I am not really concerned that it takes almost $100 to fill up the gas tank (each candidate got ONE minute to tell us how they would lower gas prices).

Yes, let us ask about flag pins -- the issue on every voters mind!

Howard Beale would have done a better job moderating this debate.  "Network" became a reality last night.

Before anyone says it, I believe Senator Obama won, simply because he refused to throw any nonsensical mud and he brushed off all of the mud thrown at him without difficulty.  The debate, however, was nevertheless, utterly useless.

Dream on, Hillary!  Just wait for the tsunami heading your way.  You aren't attacking Obama - you are attacking all of us Americans who are sick of your brand of politics.  
OBAMA WAS ON THE DEFENSE LAST NIGHT BECAUSE THAT IS RIGHT WHERE ABC AND HILLARY WANTED TO BE.NO HARDBALL QUESTION FOR HILLARY!IT WAS DEBATE THAT SHOULD OF AIRED ON FOX NEWS.NOTHING FAIR OR BALANCED ABOUT THIS DEBATE.
There were no game-changers for Hillary last night, unless you count the people who are now wondering if she's switched allegiance from the Democratic to the Republican Party. All the tabloid-attacks from the right-wing moderators were old news, asked and answered by Obama.

I hope Americans are not so gullible as to buy the words of the Clinton spin machine. There should be an amusement park named after it.
First Read,

Please level the playing field here. The 'screw 'em comment should be as sensationalized as the 'bitter' remark, that was so unjustly taken out of context. Let the people in Pa. decide whether either comment is relevant to them. You have given them more than ample exposure to the innocent comment made by Senator Obama. Now the voters deserve the opportunity to compare these two comments by their respective speakers.


Sam Neill, College Park,

You asked about Senator Obama's stutter, or stammer.

One of the greatest leaders in all of the history of mankind stuttered. Even so he was chosen by God to lead the Children of Isreal out of bondage. His name was MOSES. Perhaps Senator Obama has been chosen to free the American people from the tyranny of the Bush Administration, and past Administrations. I think so, and I don't care if you don't. Talk about your empty suit argument. Adolph Hitler was very articulate. What do you think of his leadership qualifications?Obama '08
Game changing ? Yes. In Hillarys favor ? No.  
Hillary is wrong when she says that she has the experience to deliver results for the American people if elected president.  

Let's look at health care for example.

In 1993 she tried to bring about universal healthcare in the U.S., right?  At the time, her husband was the President of the U.S. and Congress was controlled by the Dems.  

BUT SHE STILL COULDN'T GET HEALTHCARE PASSED!!!

That's like the Judge is your husband and the Jury is made up of your cousins and friends and you still LOSE the case!

She touts herself as being the FIGHTER.  But the American people should ask themselves - whose cause are you fighting Hillary?  Our cause?  Or your own?

I cannot believe that the Dem's are going to sabotage themselves in an election that should be a slam dunk.
Against Clinton, McCain would win.  Against Obama, he would have a harder time.
This win at all costs does nothing for the USA.  I support Obama, after initially supporting HRC.  Hillary came off last night not as Presidential, but as someone that is petty, period.
Let's get away from this BS and focus on issues that will directly improve all our lives.
C'mon people...the only thing that we are accomplishing is putting all this negativity to the forefront when we need to be united.

McCain is the only one benefiting from the Democratic bickering.
Obama "needs to be more forthright" you say?

Posters may be interested to know about NLP, Neuro Linguistic Programming, a kind of body language that can help voters gauge what they are hearing.
Notice eye focus when candidates speak.  "Most" people who look up as they speak (Hillary) are accessing inner visual images of future possibilities and/or remembering past visual experiences.  People who look down as they speak (Obama) are accessing emotional feelings and/or sifting through mind chatter to create their sentences.  That chatter may be why he tends to pause and stutter quite a bit.

There are other definitions. Google it.
oh game changing right? just like how a superdelegate today switched from Clinton to Obama?

So this is how far we've evolved as a culture, in our thinking and our spirituality.  The position of President of the USA will go to the biggest bully on the block.  No different now than in the days of the Roman empire, the dark ages and the grabbing of power in numerous small countries around the globe.  Apparantly, Americans can only respect those who scuttle in the gutter with gossip, arm twisting inuendo and character assasination.  Any one who tries to pull us above the fray will be looked at with suspicion and hate.
Everyone is wagging their heads...Oh Obama he came across weak, he was on the defensive, Hillary and the moderators finally showed who he is.  I guess it's just beyond most people to realize that he was trying to demonstrate what it is to keep the dialogue out of the gutter.  So it's now 2008 and here we are.  So this is how we've evolved in our thinking...and our spirituality.


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