Obama: Hillary 'looked in her element'

Posted: Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:18 PM by Mark Murray
Filed Under: 2008, Obama

From NBC's Ben Weltman and Mark Murray
At his rally in Raleigh, NC today, Obama said the following: "So last night Sen. Clinton and I had our 21st debate of the year [pro-Obama boos]. I will tell you it does not get much more fun than these debates. They are, they are inspiring events [laughter]. I mean last night I think we set a new record because it took us 45 minutes before we even started talking about a single issue that matters to the American people. Took us 45 minutes... 45 minutes before we heard about health care, 45 minutes before we heard about Iraq, 45 minutes before we heard about jobs, 45 minutes before we heard about gas prices."

VIDEO: Obama tells a North Carolina audience that he just had to brush off negative attacks.

He went on to say: "I don't blame Washington for this because that is just how Washington is. They like stirring up controversy and they like playing gotcha games, getting us to attack each other. And I have to say, Senator Clinton looked in her element. You know, she was taking every opportunity to get a dig in there. You know, that's al right. That's her right to kind of twist the knife a little bit [smiles, laughs at crowd]."

"That's why she is only airing negative attacks on TV in Pennsylvania... Look, I understand that because that's the textbook Washington game. That's how our politics has been taught to be played. That's the lesson that she learned when the Republicans were doing the same thing to her back in the 1990s. So I understand it and when you are running for the presidency than you've got to expect it and then you've got to kind of [makes a "brush off shoulder" motion]. That's what you got to do. That's what you got to do [brushes off his shoulder again]."

"But, understand this: That is also precisely why I'm running for president, to change that kind of politics."

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Comments

Still a classy handling of the stuff he's forced to confront. I just wish Hillary would learn from example and step back from the brink, respect the party and show some respect to her colleagues and comrades. She acts like he's a ranking official in North Korea that's only barely worthy of toleration.

Doug, Kansas City, MO (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:23 PM)

Obama seems to be mocking the election process. He sure gets nervous when he is held accountable for all the actions he's had in his life. Hillary has stood up to her past, why can't Obama?

Sam Iam (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:23 PM)

Obama is out of his element when he has to stand up to questions asked by the media? And he wants to be President??

Kelly Grant, Holden, PA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:25 PM)

http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/samgrahamfelsen/gGC5ZM Here is the link to the comments - and how he delivers them!

Carthage (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:26 PM)

Obama, last night proved that old age (60) and treachery, cannot , will not , over come youth and courage--every time.

Hillary cut off her head to cure a headache.

Congradulations: Mr. President Obama.

You have my vote

Andress (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:26 PM)

Barack, these are kid gloves. Nothing compared to what's waiting in November. And certainly not even a fraction in terms of dealing with Iran, Russia and the like. You can't go crying to the media that Putin is going negative. The world would laugh their heads off.

If you get elected, you have Hilary to thank for giving you some training.
Frankly, I think she can face those men far far better than you.

You see, you maybe likeable but certainly do not come off as ready. You stammer and stutter at the toughest moments when you have no script prepared.

Now if only the cowards at MSNBC would post this.

voice of reason, PA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:27 PM)

So Obama is going to change the way debates are held? No more tough questions from the press anymore I guess. When (and IF) he ever gets to the White House, what is Obama going to do, hide in his room? There is something very wrong with this man.

Ann Oakes, Middleton, TN (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:27 PM)

personally, I thought that sham of a debate last night was an insult to both Senators Obama and Clinton, not to mention the public as a whole. "Gotcha" politics does a disservice to everyone... except the media, of course.

B dub, Raleigh NC (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:28 PM)

I really appreciate Obama! He is trying to be honest and he really wants to make a change and try to keep the race positive! I am so glad I support him. I feel proud and happy I am able to look up to him and respect him. I have no respect for HRC, she is too devisive. GO OBAMA! 08

jgardner Greensboro NC (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:28 PM)

If any Clinton supporters call this more "crybaby"-ism, just remember that we've had a bully in the White House for 7.5 years, and Hillary is closer to that "bully" ideal lately than Obama will ever be.

Give me a "crybaby"... at least he's speaking out. "Shut up and take it?" H311 no! I'd rather call her out on her shameless tactics.

Boo Hoo? Screw YOU! (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:29 PM)

Sound like a "negative" comment.

Obama if you can't handle the heat then get out of the kitchen.

The GOP is NOT going to play kissy face with you.They DO NOT play nice and we are not going to have you change the game.

John McCain, The White House (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:29 PM)

For the first time since this started Obama did not have a planned speech which has him always looking professional. This time we saw his true colors. He cannot hardly talk. All he repeated was Uh! at least a thousands times. His preformance last night really showed he is not ready to be commander in chief. I will not vote for him as I thought.

Marilyn Lane Baytown Texas (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:30 PM)

I wonder if Hillary is as tough when she is talking to the collection agents. What does she say to them? "Yeah, I made 109 million in the last ten years, but I am still not going to pay you. Sue me!".

There are people in this country who want someone like that to be our next President? We might as well just give Bush another four years.

Sick of corruption, sick of the Clintons (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:30 PM)

I watched it and he does us proud. No tears and whining "They're picking on me!!"

Hillary, you get to choose your pastor - and your husband. Too bad you didn't through Bill under the bus!! He can't wait to get back to the Whitehouse. He had so much fun there. Lots of great memories.

Terry, IN (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:30 PM)

has anybody thought that hillary may have already knew in advance what the questions were? one, george Stephanopolous (sp?) worked for the clintons and still is a surrogate; two, hillary's answers to the moderators' questions and her rebuttals to obama were way too quick, rehearsed and on the mark; and three, hillary's body language and eye movements were shifty to say the least. she very seldom looked at the moderators and the camera directly as if she's hiding her glee to the questions posed.

has anybody thought of that?

truth be told (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:31 PM)

Fact Check! Ayers and Obama both served on the board of directors of the Woods Fund charity that focuses on groups to assist the poor. When Obama was organizing his first race one introductory event took place at the home of Ayers. Ayers contributed $200 to Obama's legislative campaign in 2001- BUT there is no other sign that he has actively aided Obama's political career. Wow that sounds so bad - 2001 contributed $200 - gee what a joke the media has become. What a waste. Ex-Clinton supporter now an Obama supporter. What a joke the Clinton's have made of this campaign.

Ex-Clinton supporter, PA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:31 PM)

... and Senator Obama ... you looked out of your element.

You always look happiest on this campaign when you are talking to the people - to the voters - about issues ... instead of playing the games we've come to expect in American politics. You looked totally annoyed last night, just as we did watching it.

But Hillary looked quite comfortable in her element... attack attack attack ... you know, screw 'em.

Add me to the list who will no longer watch ABC's This Week w/George & Co. on Sunday mornings.

As to Hillary and McCain supporters - we have no problem with Senator Obama being asked difficult questions - he's campaigning for President of the Untied States - we want it and expect it.

It's not what we saw last night.

Pat, Boston, MA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:32 PM)

Remember the October 2007 NBC debate where Tim Russert and Obama and her other opponents piled on Hillary Clinton?

Obama supporters were not complaining then.

But now they whine that the moderators were unfair…blah, blah, blah, yes, he can….hope…yes, he can – ugh.

He was asked these questions about his Rev. Wright and his “cling to” comments because he has failed to provide plausible explanations to these issues in the past.

And he did not help himself in his stuttering, stammering responses to these same questions last night.

And he flat out LIED about his support of banning handguns on the questionnaire where his handwriting appears supporting the ban.

Meanwhile, Hillary rocked. She was calm, composed and strong. She spoke to the real issues with real understanding and offered real solutions. She was gracious overall but tough when she needed to be.

And Obama wilted under the weight of lies, half truths and attacks.

Sean (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:32 PM)

How pathetic Obama sound when trying to justify his lack of character and lack of responsibility. How long how hard is for Obama just to recognize that he made a mistake?
The longer he continue denying or minimizing the impact of what he said, the most difficult will be for many thinkers American people to trust him and belief on him.

I think its time to pass this point in this race. Many Obama supporters are saying that Hillary is so negative, is running a dirty campaign with her attacks, well, guess what? Every time Hillary point out some of Obama mistake, she is negative.

Every time people said anything against Obama the person is racist. Give me a brake, it is very ridiculous campaign and Obama and his supporters should stop that ridiculous and insane game.

Now many complaining that ABC was hitting on Obama, why they don’t race their voice when MSNBC attacked Hillary? Everybody is quiet, beside, the media is hitting and attacking Hillary every day, and she is still fighting, working, campaigning, that is one leader does, that is what a fighter does.

So, Obama, get real and honest with yourself and stop the blaming game, it doesn’t work, it may work for some of those who are feed by the media, but nothing else,
It may work for those who are controlled by their emotion, but nobody else.
I am tired of Obama’s arrogance and perfection, he think he is that great, that good, the Super Obama, well, Mr. Obama, you are no, get use to it.
I am Joan and i aproved that message :)

joan chicago (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:32 PM)

Don’t you love it how Obama tried to weasel out of the Ayers question.

He said he was 8 when Ayers did bombings in New York; Obama, you nit-wit, the point is that you were 30-something when you worked for him at the Woods Project. That you as an adult made the decision to work for a unrepentant terrorist and are still "friendly" with him is a disgrace for a candidate for POTUS!

Jacob, PA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:33 PM)

voice of reason, PA - if you think dealing with Iran and Russia has anything to do with fielding questions worthy of Entertainment Tonight, you are just about the most unreasonable Pennsylvanian out there. He's not crying, he's calling people out for being vapid morons. Tough cookies. And most Pennsylvanians, which I'll assume you really aren't, don't buy what ABC and Clinton are selling. All the polls in the world won't change the facts on Tuesday night. Get ready for this circus to be over.

squintz, philly, pa (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:33 PM)

"Barack, these are kid gloves. Nothing compared to what's waiting in November."

People always say this but why does that make it right? So all of a sudden, because this is what the Republicans plan to do it's ok for Clinton to adopt their tactics against him as some of a 'warm-up'? I mean, truthfully, I don't even look at her as a democrat anymore! She feels like she's on the other side.

And a note about that, trust me- in the general, McCain will get the camera swerved to him because right now he's enjoying the biggest free pass ever as this rages on. With a unified party set it's easy for him to lob attacks and use Clinton as his proxy. the part us democrats have to worry about is how quick she is to assume the position.

that's why she's a fraud and the bloody kneecap stuff has to stop. It's no small wonder that he's stayed in as long as he's had despite the media backlash and microscopic gaffe silliness. Perhaps b/c he has a REAL coalition of people and grassroots? Scary isn't it! People that can actually think instead of react.

Mark F, NC (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:36 PM)

We know Senator Obama. We get it. Only your supporters get it. Not the rabid repubs, who love attack politics, (not all repubs do), and not the vicious, jealous dems who are willing to employ, and witness, (as supporters), the anything goes, win at all costs, sleazy, lying, cheapshot, cheating kind of tactics in politics. There is no honor in that.

We ain't mad at 'cha for being bigger than that, last night during the debate. It takes courage to rise above the temptation to go negative. We want a candidate who inspires us to be better. We want you to continue to be honorable. We are proud of you. You will reap the rewards for your admirable behavior.

YES WE CAN!

donna, pgh., pa. (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:36 PM)

The myth that republicans shall "do in" Barack Obama any worse than the hatred for him by Hillary has already done may prevail, but it doesn't make it so. Hillary, who has been ensconced in her bubble of inevitability and coronation dreams, will never recover from this young upstart presiding over her permanent political burial and emphatic rejection by her own party. Even republicans do not despise Barack like Hillary, except for the Hannity types, and they will give Obama a fair shake since the moderates and independents like him very much. But Hillary? Never.

Rita OK (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:37 PM)

If you aren't going to vote for him because he takes a minute to say the right thing, and instead will vote for the person who has an attack at the tip of her tongue all the time, you will not be voting in your self interest. It will come back to haunt you, and the rest of us, and we will be in the same trouble we are in now, and we've been in for the last few decades.

I don't want someone who is the best at playing the political game, I want someone who has the best ideas. I'm sorry you don't have the time for someone to think about what they are saying, I happen to really enjoy the thought that Barack Obama puts into EVERYTHING he says.

p.s. he writes his own speeches, unlike Hillary. The words she uses, the policy she supposedly spews, is just some other writer's words that she has memorized.

matt, worcester, MA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:38 PM)

The people putting Obama down -

You didn't listen carefully to the answers of the few substantive questions posed to the candidates in the 21st Debate. Especially the ones regarding Iraq, Iran, and Israel.

McCain or Clinton will validate Rev. Dr. Wright's sermons, about the Tora's parable of the "smashing of infants heads on the rocks of the dried-up creek bed by their conquerors". That is if McCain and now Clinton's retaliation, as stated last night, are unleashed against Iran, if Israel is threatened or in McCains view, the Iranian CUDs force doesn't stop acting like we are the Russians and they are the Afganistanis' in Iraq.

We all are aware of the more than 100,000 innocent men, women, and children already dead in Iraq. If I were an Iraqi I would be bitter.

George Bush, Dick Cheney the 76-77 Senators and the others who supported the Iraq War have already proved the technicalities of the full content of the Rev. Dr. Wright Sermons.

McCain and Clinton are joined at the hip due to their votes on the labeling of "Terrorists Group" to the Iranian CUDs force.

Dwaine, CO. (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:39 PM)

Hilton supporters should thank Obama instead of saying he is weak. HE chose that route in politics. Questions he could have asked to give back in same coin as Clinton (or the moderators could have):

(1) Can one accurately say you are implicitly spending Columbia's money while you claim to be against their trade deal since you fie a joint tax with Bill and he took 800K from them?

(2) If you are very serious about this opposition to the deal, why would you not fire your top staff member that collects money for promoting the deal you oppose?

(3) As a follow up to the Bosnia story (the way they kept hounding Barack): Can you call it a mispeak if you repeated the same falsehood three times?
Is Bill's explanation accurate that this happens when one 60 and getting a little forgetful?

(4) Do you believe that Barack is indeed elitist compared to you considering that you also went to Yale and made 110 million last year?

(5) Peter vs. Paul: Does this suit claiming payments in exchange for potential favors not keep dogging you folks not present a problem against the GOP - if not at worst another impeachment or white house trial?

The only counter Obama lobbed regarding pardon of the same underground members Clinto raised and she wsa asked to respond or do so after the break, she quickly recoiled, chose the latter, and never brought it up again. Hill really is a bully!

J. Richter (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:39 PM)

O'bama again proved that he is the person who should be our next president. He didn't go negative despite the many times Clinton snarled at him. She looks and sounds desperate. I thought that she and Bill were better people than they are proving themselves to be.
They sound racist and elitist.

Jean Turnipseed, Denver, CO (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:39 PM)

This is total BS.
He fumbled big last night. He could not handle tough questions and he is now complaining.

Leye, Richmond, Va (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:39 PM)

The notion that Hillary Clinton has been vetted and can handle right-wing attacks is a joke. The right-wing is laying off her, because they like this Democratic fight, and Obama doesn't go after her as hard as a typical candidate might.

No one has taken off the gloves on Hillary yet. If she was the front runner, we'd be talking about white water, Clinton pardons, her failure on healthcare, sniper fire, the poor management of her campaign, unpaid bills.

There are those that post here who believe that because Obama is getting all the mud now, that it's a sign that Hillary hasn't gotten through all this already. She's been vetted. But that's untrue. She's not the front runner. She's not the likely nominee. Republicans and the press are focused on Obama.

And if you look at the polls, he's handling it just fine. If you look at the polls, you also see that Hillary didn't do so well this primary season. When she was properly vetted, back in January and February, Primary voters decided they didn't want her.

I don't know the trick to posting here. I've submitted several comments in the past and have never seen one go through. Hope this one makes it.

Check Raise (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:40 PM)

Actually, Obama is misleading in his statement. Hillary is running negative and positive ads in Pennsylvania, just like Obama is doing. The more he gets attacked the more he seems to like to play with the truth and the subtle negative jibes he's been doing are getting less and less subtle. This is weird behaviour if, as he and his surrogates say, he's got the nomination locked up.

John, NC (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:41 PM)

So Obama is trying to change politics but those statements sound like a typical negative attack. This is why is Obama is the nominee he is going to get slaughter in the general election. He can not handle being pressed on issues and it seems to me that he has a lot of baggage he is trying to brush off and hide.

Do you want a man as president connected to people like Ayers, Rezkoa, Rev. Wright and Rev. Farahakkan?

Craig (Boston, MA) (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:41 PM)

I find it amazing that Clinton supporters will advocate any action as long as it reaffirms their candidate. Why is she different from republicans again?

Look at the poll as to who won, in the last first read after elections viewer response was considered, now......yeaaaaaa

At least acknowledge that Obama was gracious and passed on the opportunity to hit Clinton about the Bosnia "mispeak" He even said give her a break

She didn't and wouldn't return the sentiment.

Dr.Strangedog, DETROIT (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:42 PM)

That was the most pathetic excuse for a debate that I have ever seen. Hillary just gave me the creeps every time she twisted Obama's words and pushed the knife in deeper. You'd think she was McCain's running mate instead of a Democratic Presidential candidate. Obama looked like he was bored and uncomfortable and I just wish he could have said to those right wing tools posing as newsmen to stop asking those stupid gotcha questions and worrying about lapel pins and engage on the real issues. Wake up America. We need CHANGE!!!

stephanie hoadley, lenox,ma (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:42 PM)

Just like a pig in slop. I'm glad to say I didn't watch the "debate" last night. When 50% of anything includes Silly Hillie you can expect slop.

bill, okla (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:42 PM)

I'm voting for Barack. I wouldn't support Clinton for any position in our government now.

Josh (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:42 PM)

someone up there said "obama seems to be mocking the election process"

The process is already a joke, wake up!

Clinton was in her element. Back and forth, I got more dirt on you. She knows no better. It's time to start purging the system.

chris, boston MA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:43 PM)

Did anybody watch McCain's standup at the Hardball this tuesday (at Villanova). He is more on the Barack side - not negative and was positive about Barack as well. I don't think McCain is going to tolerate negative campaigning. So that is not the game that will be played in Novemeber. It will old vs young. It will be experience vs message etc etc. Hillary is not in that game. She knows how to be a spoiler - but not play a constructive game. She should have stood in 2004 - missed a golden chance to rip Bush apart. Too late...

Wolfson (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:43 PM)

Obama cries like he needs a good diaper change...boo hoo, they're all against me at these debates...boo hoo, they are saying negative things about me...boo hoo hoo...whatever, stick a fork in him, he's done! He's gonna get killed by McCain!

Pat Huntington NY (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:43 PM)

Obama - associates with:
terrorists
racist pastors
anti-semites
...he's the most unelectable dem. candidate ever!

Pat Huntington NY (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:44 PM)

If Hillary actually said something positive, would she melt? Well, I suppose that if there is nothing good you can say about yourself, you might as well resort to attacking your opponent.

Ron Jeffers, Arizona Independent (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:46 PM)

I WOULD VOTE FOR A 3RD BUSH TERM BEFORE I WOULD EVER VOTE FOR HILLARY...SHE IS A DISGRACE TO THIS COUNTRY.

GWB BEFORE HILLARY (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:46 PM)

Clinton is always saying, 'the republicans will say' and then proceed with a nuclear bomb. Where are the republicans. Stop, they are not saying it. You are, why use them as scapegoat!

Alan, Miami, FL (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:46 PM)

Senator Obama and the viewing public would have welcomed questions about Russia. Flag Pins, on the otherhand, have no relevance in my life, how about yours? Nonsense, utter nonsense.

Next time, they should just put a mudring in the debate room and have the candidates get inside it and start throwing the mud at each other.

Overall, however, I thought Senator Obama looked remarkably Presidential under some truly absurd pressure. I particularly admired the way he threw Senator Clinton a life-raft on the ridiculous rehashing of the Tuzla-non-incident.

Kim Pasadena (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:46 PM)

Hillary has NOT stood up to her past. She RIDES the good CLinton years...and denies the NAFTA, CAFTA, DONOR LIST, as Bills deals, wont let you see her ear marks, she is a double sided coin. She tells fibs, not once or couple times...but 3 times and DOES not apologize, she says she MIS SPOKE. She has accepted more lobbyist money, and stated in debates with Edwards, Obama and Richardson THAT SHE WILL CONTINUE. In 15 years she could not pass health care..cause she was too polarizing...too power hungry..too me me me...that even her own party voted her down. Half America hates her. Half America hates her. Feminist vote for her...because they want a woman president...what a good reason! I am a 55 year old white woman, but she is the WRONG woman, I can wait!

lee faneuf, Treasure Island, Florida (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:48 PM)

I think the debate went well. Obama has been treated like fine china (handle with care), in all the previous debates. Maybe it was fair for him to actually be asked to explain some of the negatives in his life. Now you Obama-ites know how the Hillary supporters have been feeling all along as the media works over timet o crucify her. I think it worked and I think Obama will win the nomination. George Stephanopoulos made a comment that 1/3 of the Hillary supporters say they won't support Obama,(he went on to say he didn't believe it). Well, maybe he should start beliving it. I have been a registered democrat for my entire adult life and will (unfortunately) have to vote for a republican if Obama gets the democratic nomination.

Billie Prineville,OR (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:48 PM)

but what about hillary's vagina, obama is automatically not qualified, and bad, and ugly, and not smart cause he is vaginaless

Bionic Beaver (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:48 PM)

I liked the debate. It is time we get to know the candidates who might next be our Commander in Chief. Obamas campaign needs to address the American people in their need to know the person's character as well as their political views. I mean really, he could be in charge of our nation's future. This is serious! Who we have running our country will not only be viewed by Americans, but by foreign entities as well. That will affect our future with them as well. I don't care who it is- Clinton, McCain, or Obama- we need to know who this person will be. The coverage up to this past several weeks has been very kind to Obama. However it is time for the media to really show some substance and do the investigating that journalism is supposed to be about. Read the blogs, read past articles about the candidates and get it out to the people. We count on you. Perhaps too much and then we come up short on the facts. Our futures depend on what we know. We need to arise above the views of the groupie mentality that is currently so hyped by the media. That is what is now dominating the primary. Heck the media doesn't even know how to handle last night's debate. Now they have to do their homework. Hold them accountable!

Heidi, Bozeman (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:49 PM)

Those who openly mock Obama for his mature stance on the childish games Hillary is playing are in denile. Obama has picked up 65 Supers since Feb 5, Hillary has only a handful.

SO, all you Clinton supporters keep on fightin' hard for your girl, but in the end you will have wasted your time and money.

As for the debacle last night, I am in awe of how horrible fellow journalists can stand for the biased comments that were presented to Obama. He did, however, prove to above both commentators and Hillary by not stooping to their levels

Oh, yeah, I also just donated another $100.00 to Obama's campaign.

Paul, Riverside, CA (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:49 PM)

I could care less who he worked for, what he did in the past, what he eats for breakfast, what decoration he wears onhis lapel.....he's our next president!
Get used to it!

Flint Patty (Sent Thursday, April 17, 2008 3:49 PM)

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