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First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



Clinton: The bigger loser?

Posted: Monday, April 28, 2008 9:09 AM by Domenico Montanaro

Bloomberg's Al Hunt sums up what is probably the undeniable fallout of this campaign regardless of who ends up the Dem nominee: "Bill Clinton May Be Biggest Loser of Campaign." More: "Before this campaign, he was an international statesman extraordinaire and the guru for ambitious Democratic politicians. In recent months, he has devalued himself and his future by his conduct. Although he has a decent relationship with John McCain, given the continuing partisan resentment of Bill Clinton, he would remain largely in exile under a Republican president.”

“If Hillary Clinton upsets the odds and wins the presidency, it's likely to prove an unhappy time for her husband. He would be scrutinized, politically and personally; political strains between the president and first spouse would emerge.”

“A President Obama would drive him crazy. If not irrelevant, it would make Clinton a secondary figure within his own country and party. There is little that would make him more frustrated or angrier."

Speaking of Bill, the New Yorker's Lizza has an interesting piece about Bill vs. Barack. "Adjusting to the modern, gaffe-centric media environment has been wrenching. At most of his Pennsylvania stops, the national press was represented mainly by a pair of young TV-network ‘embeds,’ whom Clinton regards not as reporters but as media jackals who record his every utterance yet broadcast only his outbursts, a phenomenon that has helped transform him into a YouTube curiosity and diminished him -- perhaps permanently. ‘It’s like he’s been plucked out of time and thrown into the middle of this entirely new kind of campaign,’ the adviser told me. Jay Carson, a senior Clinton campaign official and Bill’s former spokesman, said, “Because of the way he is covered, the only thing anyone ever sees is fifteen seconds that is deemed by the pundits to be off message.”

About that $10 million in one day from 100,000 donors... Politico's Vogel throws some cold water on the figures: "It made no difference that the details didn’t always add up -- wide variations in the numbers of new donors; a conflicting timeline of when the money was actually raised. It was the eye-popping $10 million figure -- the most ever claimed in a 24-hour period -- that dominated the news cycle."
 
More: FEC "reports cannot and will not prove the campaign’s claim of raising $10 million in one day." And: "Unlike the Clinton campaign -- which also indicated it raised $4 million after both Super Tuesday and the March 4 primaries -- Obama and Paul on their websites displayed tickers of sorts keeping a running tally of contributions received in real time during their respective fundraising surges." Though, he points out those are unverifiable and had some "technical glitches."

The New York Times’ Kristol, um, crystallizes the chatter we've heard from conservatives regarding the never-ending Clinton candidacy. "I do think I can speak for most of my fellow right-wingers when I say this: We once looked forward with unambivalent glee to the fall of the house of Clinton. Many of us still do. But we also see the liberal media failing to give Hillary Clinton the respect she deserves. So, since we conservatives believe in giving credit where credit is due, it falls to us to praise Hillary.”

“The fact is Hillary Clinton has turned out to be an impressive candidate. She has consistently defeated Barack Obama when her back was to the wall -- first in New Hampshire, then in several big primaries on Super Tuesday, on March 4 in Ohio and Texas, and then last week in Pennsylvania, where she was outspent by almost 3 to 1, yet won handily. She is, of course, still behind in the race, and Obama will most likely be the nominee. His team has run the better campaign. In particular, it realized how important the caucus states could be: Obama’s delegate lead depends on his caucus victories. But Hillary may well be the better candidate."

NBC/NJ’s Mike Memoli asks: Lincoln and Douglas didn’t debate in a flatbed truck, did they? But that’s what Clinton proposed last night in her latest effort to pressure Obama into a fifth one-on-one meeting. On Saturday, Clinton proposed a moderator-free debate, mocking the complaints from her rival’s supporters after the Philadelphia debate April 16. On Sunday, Obama told reporters that he didn’t want to spend more time “in a studio,” preferring more direct voter interaction.

But Clinton would not back down. “I think that this state deserves a debate,” she told hundreds gathered on the Cape Fear River in North Carolina. “We could even do it on the back of a flat-bed truck. Doesn't have to be in some fancy studio somewhere.” The debate challenge, Memoli adds, has become a regular part of Clinton’s stump speech since her victory in Pennsylvania last Tuesday. Obama had accepted an invitation to debate in North Carolina, but the forum was later canceled by organizers.

McClatchy’s David Lightman revisits the management question. “Despite Hillary Clinton's big win in Pennsylvania last week, the story of her campaign is often one of mismanagement and missed opportunities, and it raises questions about how she'd organize and run the White House. ‘There's a certain style to the campaign, and it shows what we might expect in a Clinton presidency: a lot of viewpoints and a messiness,’ said James McCann, a political science professor at Purdue University in Indiana.”

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I'm so tired of hearing Billary talk.  She and he speak out of both sides of her mouth.  I actually liked them at one point, but now I'm so disgusted by them and their "Clinton" math.  This is their downfall. And if you can't see the 2012 angle, you don't deserve to vote.
NOTHING ON MR. WRIGHT BOYS? YOU NEVER SEEM TO AMAZE ME ......IF THAT WAS CLINTONS PASTOR LAST NIGHT YOU ALL WOULD HAVE BEEN ALL OVER HER. YOU ARE ALL SO SMOOTH...........  WE KNOW YOU ARE BIAS AGAINST CLINTON.YOU THINK OBAMA WALKS ON WATER...........
If Hillary Clinton was to win the Democratic nomination with a majority of valid elected delegates, she would have a reasonable chance of winning the general election. If she gained the nomination any other way, well, remember the Titanic?

If Senator Clinton can not win a majority of valid elected delegates and can not win the general election with an illicit or suspect nomination, why is anyone still supporting her campaign?

It appears to be time to move on.
The effort to taint Bill Clinton's reputation has been part of the overall Obama plan.  Select a statement, pick it apart and call it a gaffe.  It doesn't happen to just Bill Clinton, many supporters of Hillary have also been attacked for making observations many others have made.

Just last night I spoke with a friend in Indiana and learned that Bill Clinton spoke in her small town to a wildly enthusiastic crowd made up by most of the people in town. I guess they haven't read that Bill is a political has been and has lost whatever ability he once had.
The bigger question is did she in fact raise $10 million,given her track record of endless lie's and the fact that the number of donors keep changing I rather doubt that she raised much at all.She stated that her campaign was running on fumes but when you look at her limited amount of advertising I would rather believe she is now running on nothing but vapors which of course means only one thing,she's running on nothing but desperation and the race is over!!!
Debate in a flatbed truck...
With hay bales and chickens around them??????
A couple of bottles of moonshine for them to drink?...

Everybody knows Bill Clinton's game.  He is running his wife so he can get a third term as president.  His wife has proven that she does not have the stones to be a president.  She cannot keep a checkbook in the campaign and her ideas have been laughed at and torn apart by the experts.  In this age of youtube and increased internet scrutiny, Bill is seen as nothing more then a moron who nobody can figure out how e got two terms as president.  Why this man is not in jail for lying to a grand jury and being a sexual predator is beyond me.
The defeat of the self-righteous finger pointer and his whining, sulking wife will be no great loss to the democratic party or America.  
Sorry....but there can be nothing further from the truth that Hillary might be the better candidate. She might be the most aggressive candidate....the most dishonest candidate...perhaps even the most evil candidate ..... but "better" ..... not even "better than nothing".
‘There's a certain style to the campaign, and it shows what we might expect in a Clinton presidency: a lot of viewpoints and a messiness,’

Amen to that.  Scary thought, eh?
My comment is simply this and it's addressed to Keith Olberman, Chris Matthews, David Gregor, Nora O'Donnell or anyone who will answer the question for me:

Why hasn't the story of the Peter Paul lawsuit against the Clintons been covered in the media?  I had seen several references to it on First Read by bloggers in various story comments.  I followed the links left by the commentators and kept following the threads.  I eventually found: http://www.paulvclinton.com/pp_complaint_022504_njw.pdf
Makes you think about the old adage about the 'Leopard changing it's spots" or "dis-honor among thieves".  

I have no party affiliations, and I probably fall within Mrs. Clinton's voter range, 57 year old white woman, own my own small business. One thing though, I don't feel I am owed anything.  I work hard, I respect others and give a helping hand when I can.  I do not respect the Clintons or their political or business habits.  I am asking/demanding all of you, report what is real in this race.  I want to know and I am sure the public does.  I have heard enough about Rev. Wright.  Tell me about this lawsuit.

Thank you if someone replies on air.
Kristol wishes Hillary is the candidate because he knows he can beat her, but Obama is the anti-Bush and will move the country in the right direction, away from the precipice to which conservatives have taken us.
I've lost plenty of respect for Bill Clinton, whom I voted for twice, with his overly contentious spiel on the campaign trail this year.  The more he talks the more I now dislike him.  Keep it up Bill and soon you'll only have the Republicans rooting for you.

Go Obama!
Hillary and Bill could never be trusted. They both lie and talking about race both Clinton's have allow their true color to show. We use race to divide and I often ask people if you were black and all you ever had was white presidents how would you feel. Hillary and Bill are hurting because they didn't think a black man could win the party.
Why is Hillary Clinton receiving so much praise? Clinton is a household name. She was suppose to blow Barack away by February 5th and she didn't. You all can stop trying to put the onus on Barack because remeber, he's the inexperienced candidate that's beating her.

I would hate for her to steal this election. If America thinks we're in bad shape now, just imagine  what the rest of the world will think of us then. I've always been taught that you lead by example. What sort of message will we send to the rest of the world?
Clinton desperately wants another debate because she knows the pre-debate TV hype would make her seem like she's still viable, despite the numbers. Right now she's desperately trying to retain that impression of viability - a campaign of "seeming" over "being," and she needs (and is getting) media help with that purpose.

But the reality - the "being" - isn't there.
It is amazing how everyone forgets all the good that Clinton did.  I wich I had the 1990s economy back.  
I used to think Clinton was one of the greats as a president...still do, maybe.  He rescued the nation from the economic mess Bush 41 had made and transformed the economy into a dynamo.  But now, he just seems like some craven jerk who can't keep his foolish opinions to himself.  I don't know what happened, but someone needs to put a muzzle on that man...especially (God forbid!) if he rambles around the White House again.
Who would trust a women who trusts Bill Clinton?

Did we learn anything last time?

Bad Judgement!
Probably a bit of a biased blog post title...

but true nonetheless.

http://thepajamapundit.com/
I just listened to Rev. Wright's address to the National Press Club and the Q and A afterward in its entirety.  No doubt, he is a fiery orator, but he speaks truth.  He presented a colorful history lesson about the black church in America and its tradition of liberation theology.  

He stated that it was not really him or Sen. Obama who was under attack, but the religious traditions of the black church.  Hopefully people will listen to the entire address and learn or be reminded of some American history.

If the media insists that this speech was damaging to Sen. Obama, they will be culpable for making it so.  I don't think it was and hope it won't be presented that way.

As Jesus said, "Let those who have ears, hear."  
The Clinton campaign has no one to blame but itself for completely falling apart mid-stream. The candidacy was hers from day one, but her lack of management strength, lack of strategic focus, questionable choice of advisors and poor financial oversight has led her to where she is today: unable to win the candidacy due to her current position.

While Obama is somewhat of an unknown to many voters, they can take solace from his superior management skills - which include the ability to develop and stay on plan, superior staffing and money raising abilities. Since he also hasn't adopted a 'slash and burn' approach to his opponents, it should be easier for him to unite the party when he wins the nomination.  Hillary has lost in that category as well...
I wouldn't be surprised if Hillary would try to steal the nomination. It is so typical of her to do that. In a billion years I would not vote for this woman.
I have it on good authority that radicals within the powerful rightwing Jewish Lobby including [AIPAC] American Israel Public Affairs Committee are vexed, frustrated and displeased with Barack Obama's refusal to accept special interest money and consequentially seek his crucifixion. The concern is that the Senator's policy prevents them from exerting influence or extracting favor from his administration should he become the next President in these United States of America. In an effort to allay their fears, Senator Obama has offered his assurance that if elected, an Obama administration would not be a foe- yet this does not seem to halt their resistance to his candidacy. Reportedly, Senator Clinton's campaign saw an opening to exploit the Jewish community's apprehension and began stoking the anti-Obama fire behind the scene.

In collaboration with the Clintons, they [the Jewish Lobby] dispatched a number of "candidacy assassinators" including former Clinton special counsel, Lanny Davis, Florida congress woman, Debbie Wasserman-Shultz, California congress man, Brad Sherman, CNN news anchor, Wolf Blitzer [vis-a-vis Lou Dobbs], Independent Senator, Joseph Lieberman, the far right crippled Washington Post Journalist, Charles Krauthammer and others to torpedo Obama's nomination bid. The above mentioned Jews were mandated to fan the flames of hateful passion against the Illinois Senator using demagoguery and nefarious spin of the Reverend Wright issue to toxify the American voters. Their mission is to convince the public that Obama would be unelectable in November due to his optics and alleged third party association to Rev. Farrakhan. This while simultaneously promoting Hillary as the only friend of Israel. It is also reliably reported that Democratic Jews are being counseled to vote for John McCain as a penultimate option should Senator Clinton not get the nomination.

Take a look at the YouTube video where Rachel Maddow from Air America recently discussed the topic on her show. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdYzGzvXO0U

African American Leaders dub the Jewish and Clinton's anti Obama campaign, "mean spirited" but so far have opted to remain restrainedly tentative. They however suggest hypocrisy when Governor Rendell [who happens to be a Jew] is able to extol the virtues of Minister Farrakhan by praising his "goodness" and still remains an embraced surrogate of Senator Clinton. Elected Democrats have also taken note and are increasingly frustrated with the Clinton's controversial tactics of infusing racial divide into the electoral process. Appalling is how they describe her alliance to hawkish groups including John McCain to annihilate a democratic colleague and worry that it provides damaging ammunition to their nemesis [the republicans] that could derail Obama's candidacy should he become the nominee. Some are even calling her conduct treacherous and privately accuse her of deliberately trying to sabotage the Democratic Party because of the unlikely odds of her fairly winning the nomination. Mrs. Clinton has also been criticized for taken the low road by exploiting the gender card to foster disharmony amongst the sexes. But who is willing to bell the Cat? After-all, the Clinton's wield influential power within the party and super delegates worry about political reprisals should they offer public criticism.

Additionally, the Jewish Lobby has tremendous financial reach and political clout. For decades they have been able to effectively manipulate the Holocaust to keep politicians beholden to their agenda. Those who resist or oppose are targeted with the anti-Semitic or Bigoted label [as evidenced by President Carter] in order to gain compliance. Some feel they run the risk of overplaying their hands in this instance though. Their chief Obama "Hit-Man", Lanny Davis is causing tremendous concern at the great lengths he goes to decapitate the Illinois Senator's chances of ever ascending to the Presidency and his conduct is described as vilely snake-like. The argument is that public opinion can boomerang if blacks are able to expose hypocrisy in what many now view to be a Jewish lynching of Senator Obama. Some posit that Jews have a historical pension for betraying visionary men who promise sweeping changes to the status quo. Coincidentally, it was they [Biblical Jews] who betrayed Jesus to the Romans so he could be crucified.
Have fun with your analysis.  If Hillary's math is wrong (and Florida and Michigan aren't seated as voting delegations in Denver) you can begin plans for at least four more years of failed Republican policies.  The general feeling in Florida is count us now, or count us out.  I guess if you ignore the plight of Floridians (as MSNBC has for some time now) and marginalize our own take on the issue, you wouldn't know that though.  Rallies were held throughout the state Saturday in protest and buses are leaving from all major Florida cities tomorrow morning to protest on the stairs of the DNC.  Where's the coverage?  
Neenahfox,MI

One simple answer,  African AMerican are just blind, desperatly want a black for president, so, they have to drop the Clinton in order tosupport Obama, because he is black, thats all.


In the landmark civil fraud case against Bill Clinton in Los Angeles, where the former President is charged with defrauding a Hollywood dot com millionaire to help Hillary Clinton obtain more than $1.2 million from him for her 2000 Senate campaign, Los Angeles Superior Court Judge Aurelio Munoz ruled on Friday, April 25 that Hillary Clinton would not be required to testify in sworn deposition as a material witness in the case until AFTER the November election!

In an astonishing ruling by the Judge he ordered that Hillary Clinton would not be compelled to explain in a sworn deposition what her role in the illegal solicitation and cover up of the largest contribution made to her Senate campaign was until after the election. This is the same contribution Hillary denied knowing about or receiving to the Washington Post in August 2000 and in four false FEC reports made from 2000-2006
http://twocanpete.blogspot.com/
That White House must be some fancy digs to give up $10 million a year!
C'mon, she did not raise $10 million, and if she did, it's only going to pay off the THOUSANDS of hard working vendors, caterers and locations that she owes. And a lot of them will get stiffed. How is not paying for "EVENTS", helping the average blue collar workers that need a paycheck, just like the Clintons. Anyone who donates money to Hillary's Campaign are suckers, she's the Field Bet on a Crap Table.
Did you say 'big win?'. Has anyone given Obama credit for closing the gaps in all the so called swing states? The trend says that Clinton is running a losing campaign and with time she'll be lucky even to be saved by the bell.
Hillary is a fighter I will giver her that.  However, she is saying "If I go down, I'm taking Obama with me" and that is not right.  She hasn't pulled anything in while.  Not since she exploited the "bitter" remark and had her Boy Steph moderate a unbalanced debate.  But I'm sure she has something up her sleeve before the May 6th Primary.
Hillary Clinton is the best candidate because just like Paris Hilton she has name recognition :-)
CLINTON FATIGUE - I am so sick of hearing and seeing them on TV that I change the channel now whenever they appear.  I can't imagine them in the White House, I'll never be able to watch TV again.  Hopefully Senator Obama will prevail and we can all be happpy again.  Having the Clinton's back in the White House is like the Bush's never leaving.
This is interesting, but what happened to the days when a reporter actually dug up news to report? The Obama campaign is making a push online for new contributions, and there is a big donor offering a "matching grant". Who is it? Follow the money.

Bill Clinton has no one to blame but himself.  He's turned into the buffoon we've ever had as a Past President.  The voters will decide, but nothing would better serve the country than have Bill fade into relative obscurity.  He's like an over-the-hill actor who doesn't know when to get off stage.
I think the superdelegates should vote now and get it over with because even if half of them vote for Clinton she still can't possible win.  So why not bow out gracefully now Hillary for the sake and well being of the party, and maybe you can still keep some  of the dignity and friends you have left.  If not you lose everything.  
It is quite simple...the more that Bill speaks, the more we truly understand his real person. He and Hillary USED the African American community for years...until they needed to play the race card and show their real faces. They are the most disgusting politicians in history, and HRC is QUITE inexpertienced for this job, because she shows NO signs of leadership and unity.
The 1990's economy was, to quote The Guardian, "a potemkin economy" in both the US and the UK.  Also Bill passed NAFTA, repealed Glass Steagall (enabling the subprime debacle), and promoted trade with China.
Hook, crook, lie, steal, will and deal. This is the Clinton's stratergy. The only thing they care about is getting in office and lineing up their deals so they can make another $109 million dollars after leaving the Whitehouse. Superdelegates wake up and put a end to this before the voters put a end to the Democratic Party.
Give credit where credit is due. Obama would have been crushed and smeared all over the U.S. if the media did the same to him that they do to Hillary and Bill Clinton. For once the media questioned him on  his associations with Wright and Ayers (who are definitely anti-american) he fails miserably in his explanation, then he cries, whines and blames. He is weak. Hillary can take whatever they dish out. We need a strong President. Not a WIMP who can't win a debate to save his life.
How is clinton is better candidate? where is proof? She is destroying democratic party. she needs to quit.
Obamabites like to call it both ways.  They call him the "inexperienced" candidate, but then say he has more legislative experience.  They say "Clinton's a household name" - well he is now too, so you have no arguments to justify.

He won't debate because he looks like a fool in debates, plain and simple . He only speaks "eliquently" when reading his speeches off teleprompters.  

His arrogance and cockiness are just like Bush's.  I don't want a cocky, arrogant "know-it-all" as my president.  

The obamanoids have succeede d in destroying Bill Clintons 2 terms in office.I cannot stand all this uniting of the Democratic party that has occurred.I suppose that when Obama gets creamed in the general they will blame it on the Clintons like they blame them for everything else.One thing Obama has taught his crazy followers--is to never take the blame for anything they say and do---blame the clintons.Oh dear---rev wright getting death threats and Nation of Islam is protecting him.Are they protectin Tavis smiley from the death threats from the Obamanoids ,too?
If Hillary is the Biggest Loser, then why is her butt still soooooo faaatttt!!!
Cheryl,

If you read more of the comments on the Internet concerning the Peter Paul Fraud trial you will find that someone has stated that the news media WILL NOT report on the trial.  So we are on our own.

I do not have the link at this moment but I will try and find it and post it.  However I have posted many comments on the trial and MSNBC has not posted ANY of them
Gregory Peek, Birmingham, Alabama:
What do you mean by Valid Elected Delegates?  You mean states that have Cacuses where you have to spend hours upon hours, where I had people yelling at me to switch to Obama?  This is what you call a Valid Elected Delegate?   Where turn out in Cacuseses are alot lower than direct voting?  Where working class individuals, and elderly (which are Clinton's strong points) cant come out and spend hours on a week night?  THis is what you call a valid Elected Delegate?  Where Clinton losses Texas delegate count although more people voted for Clinton?  Get Real!  Clinton is doing just as well as Obama.

(I know MSNBC will not post this, as I have lost alot of faith in them.  They are rank and file Obama fans.  really sad)

John
Maine
“Because of the way he is covered, the only thing anyone ever sees is fifteen seconds that is deemed by the pundits to be off message.”

HOW RICH!!!!!!!!!  deja vu??? IRONIC JUSTICE?

Kinda like the Rev. Wright snipits?  The "BITTER" remark??

I agree with you. we all wish he had the 1990s economy bnack, but we dont. this is no Obama's fault. the clinton's down own the white house, they did good and they served their time, now it's =time to give someone else a chance to also do some good. they are not the only ones can do good. do you realized fort he past 20yrs or so, the country have been run by either a bush or a clinton? it's a democracy or so they say, time for someone else to show what they can do. if she win the nomination by all means .......but if she does not then .......move on.
Major conjecture! The path back to yesterday is not spelled "Future"! DNC, The dumb no counts have destroyed progress and unity. By all counts, HRC and Obama have failed the experience and leadership qualifications required! Yes, their party has nothing which is qualified. Such a failure, people are being forced to vote an idiot into the oval office. Sense when are they and their lies leadership traits.

Is their being not what we already are being forced to contend with now, so in reality these two offer nothing!  
The way I feel about Bill is give him enough rope....  The problem with him is that he just can't help himself.  The desire to be back in the white house is too great.  He and Hillary will do anything to move back.  We can't have the dishonesty that accompanies the Clinton team.  And when I say team, that's exactly what it'll be.  Bill and Hillary both ruling the US.  The fact that they act as if the presidency is their entitlement is rather distasteful.  We really need Obama to take us in the right direction.  He is the one individual that can unite the country like no other.  
I wholeheartly agree with Cheryl in her last post......this is a court situation where the Clintons have to acount to a judge and/or jury people......is there no shame with you all?? You would rather harp about a preacher in Senator Obama's church instead.  If you really must go on and on.......my memory tells me Rev. Wright was embraced by PRESIDENT BILL CLINTON at a prayer breakfast very shortly after his come to Jesus moment with Monica Lewinski.  Yes Hillary, you defintely can choose your pastor, and Rev. Wright was one of those chosen.  Now, the Hell enough with the crap that will do absolutely nothing to lower my taxes, bolster my infrastructure, and keep this country in better world standing.  OBAMA 08


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