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First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC Political Researcher



Back to the Future?

Posted: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 10:04 AM by Domenico Montanaro


From NBC’s Domenico Montanaro
A day after the McCain campaign accused Obama of having a Sept. 10 mentality, it kicked the day off hammering the Illinois senator on the issue again. The campaign got the jump start on the conference call circuit with an early morning (9 am ET) one with former New York City Mayor and failed presidential candidate Rudy Giuliani.


VIDEO: Newsweek's Richard Wolfe discusses John McCain's comments which accuse Barack Obama of being "a perfect manifestation of a September 10 mindset" and of taking a "law enforcement approach" to terrorism.

Yesterday, Giuliani also put out a statement attacking Obama on the issue and went on MSNBC’s Morning Joe this morning to echo the sentiments.

“There are very clear, dramatic, important differences between McCain and Obama,” Giuliani said, describing those differences as “one wanting to be on offense, the other wanting to be on defense.”

Giuliani said he believed Obama’s inexperience was evident because he likened how the U.S. should handle terrorists to how those accused in the 1993 World Trade Center bombing were prosecuted.

“These are not isolated criminal acts,” Giuliani said. “They are a loosely defined conspiracy and an act of war. For Sen. Obama to suggest ’93 is the best example of how to deal with this is a good example of him wanting to go on defense.”

He added, “The real problem with Sen. Obama’s answer is he seems to think the 93 situation was correctly handled. It’s the failure to recognize that you had to go further than.” He said it was treated as  “a criminal act” when it should have been treated “as an act of war. We didn’t recognize that even as late as the Cole. …It seems to me Sen. Obama is of that mindset.”

He also expressed astonishment that Obama camp seemed to imply, he said, that even Osama bin Laden would get habeas corpus rights.

“That bin laden would be given habeas corpus rights is startling,” Giuliani said, adding, “it shows where Democrats are going. There seems to be more concern about the rights of terrorists than American security.”

McCain adviser Randy Randy Scheunemann said that McCain is for trials for suspects held at Guantanamo but not under the rules of federal courts. He and Giuliani warned that there would be risks of giving away sensitive intelligence, specifically how evidence was obtained, during defense discovery at trials.

Giuliani also replied to Obama foreign policy adviser Susan Rice saying on MSNBC’s Morning Joe that this was a choice between a “stupid” foreign policy (Bush continued by McCain) and “smart” (Obama).

“I think that’s language that probably shouldn’t be applied to this debate,” Giuliani said, adding, “Addressing the merits of it, criticizing the Bush administration in this area is probably an area of weakness for the Democrats …. This country has been kept safe over the last seven years. …

“If we move back to a defensive approach, like Sen. Obama wants, is at our peril. … Why do you want to go back to making the same mistakes of the 1990s?”

After pledging not to call Obama naive for his stance, Giuliani added this: "The words irresponsible and naïve were applied to Sen. Obama not by a Republican but by Hillary Clinton."

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GO AWAY - We're not buying this anymore.
hind sight is 20/20...but where was John McCain on 9/10.?..

Losers point at others for answers; winners point to themselves for the answers...

Obama'08

I laughed out loud this a.m. listening to Obama surrogate Susan Rice.  When asked if Obama were captured, would Obama agree he has rights to be tried in US courts?  Her response was that if they had the opportunity they would KILL Obama.  But, if they only captured him, then he had to had full habeas corpus rights.  Now, let me see, killing somebody without a trial is okay, no violation of rights. But, damn, if we can't kill you, then we have to respect your rights.  Do you Obamatons see the ridiculousness of your Messiah's position?
Obama continues to show how really lame and weak he is on protecting the country.  

If any of you special forces go into Pakistan and find Bin Laden, please save the taxpayers millions of dollars and just shoot the fool!  In the back if possible.
Rudy...an act of war made by WHO? What country!? It's astounding the level of ignorance that the GOP is displaying now. Terrorists are international criminals...period.
Does anyone really care what the cross-dressing, lying, wife-cheating Giuliani has to say?

Really?
It is really simple, if you want roe v wade overturned, no universal health care, a warmonger in chief, continued tax cuts for the rich and no tax relief for the middle class, no diplomacy, a further erosion of the rights and morality our forefathers fought so hard to create, someone who flip-flops on every issue because it is polling well, a government influenced and a campaign architected by federal lobbyists, college only for the rich, someone by their own admission does not differ from Bush on the major issues of our time, a country run by fear and intimidation and a supreme court ruled by conservatism...then go ahead and vote for McCain. However, realize that none of these represent being a Democrat. If you are a "Democrat" for McCain, it is time to change your affiliation to the GOP because nothing he stands for equals a Democrat in any way. Playing the fear card does not work so well when 9/11 happened on your watch and when the GOP has officially lied to take us to war.
Hey, Rudy, maybe instead of worrying about whether or not bin Laden would get Habeas Corpus you should be more worried about why Dubya and his administration have failed to capture or kill his sorry terrorist butt!

The US Constitution is the US Constitution.  I'm sorry the GOP finds it to be such an inconvenience right now.

...and all this time I thought they wanted a strict interpretation of the US Constitution.
Most obvious quote of the year nominee:

“There are very clear, dramatic, important differences between McCain and Obama,” Giuliani said.

No kidding! Just as Giuliani said repeatedly during the primaries, "just wait until Florida".  Well Florida just spoke in today's Quinnipiac poll giving Obama a sizable lead over Grandpa Flip-Flops.

Add to that the images of tar-covered beaches in Florida destroying the tourist trade due to off-shore drilling, and Obama's lead over McSame will grow to double digits.

Obama/Wetzler '08
Rudy hopes if he uses inflammatory language most Americans won't bother to really critically think about the substance of what he's saying.  Worked in 2004--but I don't think it's gonna work again.  Rudy, just go away already--you're old news.
I knew Hillary's lines would come back to haunt Obama, but I didn't think it would happen this fast.
The only thing the GOP has in their political playbook is FEAR. Bringing Guiliani out from under a rock isn't going to convince anyone the nation would be safer under McFossil. We haven't forgotten 9/11 and don't need Guiliani to remind us. However, the GOP is underestimating the American public this time around......we're no longer buying what they're selling. It might be packaged different, but it's the same old brand of dog food they were selling 8 years ago and we've learned to say NOT THIS TIME! Bush has made American UNSAFE rather than safer as more nations than ever HATE the USA. Obama will bring back the honor and integrity American once had a world leader.
On the one hand, the McCain campaign wants to paint Obama as "on the defense"... and then on the other hand, they want to paint him as "too crazy" for wanting to bomb terrorists in Pakistan without the Pakistani government's permission...

America won't fall for this again, McCain.  Not again.
Guiliani, go back under your rock, and stay there, you suck, big time!
Oh man, Rudy, you're right! The absence of an attack means that George W. Bush has been doing a great job!

C'mon, anybody who's not completely brain-dead knows what terrorism is: coordinated prosecutions of senseless destruction intended to cause fear. If we play into that fear, we are weakened. There is no reason to fear war; but there is less reason to embrace it. The way to defeat them is to take away their power -- the power they find in fear.

Sometimes, I think the South Park episode that turns Osama bin Laden into Elmer Fudd is the only time we've relegated terrorists to the status they deserve: buffoons.
It's 1994 again with McSame playing Bush, and Rudy taking on the roll of Dick "the jerk" Cheney. Good luck with that strategy Repukes.....
Rudy Giuliana - Mr. 9/11, who actually hasn't done anything whatsoever about the war on terror, except be a mouthpiece.  When you don't have anything to do with policy, or decision making, you're just an empty suit.  Maybe you and Spitzer can go find new mistresses together
Am I the only one that believes that once you catch a terrorist, you should try him or her?  I fail to see how restoring habeas corpus for alleged terrorists makes us less safe.  Can one of you righ-wingers please enlighten me?

Something about Giuliani, who got about 1% of the primary vote, speaking for McCain, makes me feel all warm and tingly for November.

Obama 08

Oh no..not Giuliani again!
I love watching McCain, Bush and Giuliani moving backwards!

OBAMA 08
So in other words, Obama hasn't developed the same stupid, non-sensical, mis-guided reactions to the 2001 terrorist attacks as have Bush and McCain?

(i.e., the brilliant idea of invading a country that had nothing to do with the terrorist attacks...)

Good. I'll sleep better at night knowing a hide n snivel Republican isn't cowering under the Oval Office desk after this January.
Crawl back in your hole worm.  Nobody gives a sh** about what you have to say.  You were an inept mayor and proved to be an inept candidate.
OK.  Here we are having the FEAR card playing for us again by Republicans.  Please, people, don't let it happen.  GW has destroyed our country and we will not have this phony fear mongering influence our votes again.
["These are not isolated criminal acts," Giuliani said. "They are a loosely defined conspiracy and an act of war."]
--I don't remember Giuliani ever taking the stance that he was at War after taking offic yet prior to 9/11.  His statements smack of hypocrisy.

It's so nice to have him back, a clear signal of why he lost.
Would you waste your vote? Obama represents Washington self serving paper hangers. He has no concept of foreign policy, he has no back ground of military defence, he chants rather than leading.  Like Hillary, Just quoting data does not mean you understand what your saying!
The repugnant ones sound like a broken record with a broken message.  The repugnant ones are the ones who haven't learned the lessons of 9/11 and just abuse 9/11 for political advantage.  Where's Osama bin Laden at?  Yeah he's still laughing about 9/11 and laughing at what incompetent idiots we have in the White House.

The repugnant ones are the Keystone Kops of their phony war on terror.  They can't even get a third rate terroist from a third rate terrorist organization in almost 7 years of incompetent trying.  All the repugnant ones want is neverending war so they can keep fooling America into thinking they are the only salvation.

Time to win the war on terror by putting Barack Obama in the White House as he'll show that Democrats can get the job done quickly and correctly.

Go Obama 08/12!
Obama studied consitiutional law at Harvard. Giuliani spent his entire campaigne in Florida and couldn't get enough votes to be nothing more than a political spot of dust. The people of Florida didn't respect him or anything he said. Who's opinion should I respect? I could care less what Giuliani says about anything.
When are Republicans going to learn that The Great Writ, the writ of habeas corpus, only means that a person has the opportunity to ASK the court to review whether there is reason to detain them. The court isn't even obligated to hear the petition. Does anyone honestly think that IF a court granted a hearing to Osama bin Laden, that court would say, "No, there isn't reason to detain you until your charged and a hearing has been held." Get real, Giuliani.

Fear tactics at their finest.
Yet another reason why, I'm sorry clintonites, Hillary Will not be VP.  read . . .

"After pledging not to call Obama naive for his stance, Giuliani added this: "The words irresponsible and naïve were applied to Sen. Obama not by a Republican but by Hillary Clinton.""

They are using HER words against Obama on KEY political issues!  He will be laughed at if he picks her.  So Obama is supposed to pick her to not piss you Clinton backers off??  

No, no way.  Perception means a lot in this election as do the issues:

He will be perceived as having caved in to the Clinton camp pressures and will to spend a lot of time spinning his decision to pick her as VP as the Republican assail him mercilessly with the obvious impression of weakness and campaign antithetical practices along with ALL of HER and BILL's Baggage!  He will spend so much time on the defensive he'll have no time to talk about the issues!!  We'll lose! The country can't afford that.

Let me rephrase the question:  Should Obama give away this election in order not to piss you Clintonites off?  

If you dare answer that, if you DON'T have anything but SILENCE in response to that question you guys were NEVER really Democrats to begin with.

Be objective:  Clinton's tactics during the primary where Barrack has shown so much restraint is like Manna from heaven for the Republicans.  She has HURT the Democratic Party's chances by the type of campaign that she has run.  She and the rest of us Democrats have a lot of work to do to negate what she did.

Her appearance with him the way you guys would like it will both nullify and divert the campaign he's trying to run.

The Country CANNOT endure for more GOP years!
Yeah and if that idiot that we currently have for a president read the warnings with the same intensity that he read the goat story maybe 9-11 would have never happened.  
You know what I JUST LOVE about Hillary supporters? How they back Hillary on every issue and stance...except when she calls for them to back Obama, since his policies are closer to hers, than that of McCain's (and VERY obviously so).

Way to support your candidate with dignity and grace....then again..
Guiliani, there you go again!  You were cast aside in the primaries, no one respects you, your opinion doesn't count anymore...you are done as a politician. We won't let you be the GOP pimp and whore out the 9-11 tragedy.  Go away!
Why are the republicans acting like habeus corpus is a bad thing? All it does is give people a chance to question why they are imprisoned. They are acting like it would set terrorists free. The reason it was made a part of the constitution was because England allowed kings to hold anyone in prison without just cause or the right to prove their innocense. Our founding fathers knew that no man should have that power over another person. We have had horrible men commit atrocious crimes throughout the years and they were all allowed the right of habeus corpus. What were the consequences? McVeigh - death, Manson - life in prison, Bundy - death, unibomber - life in prison, Sadamm Hussein - death and the list goes on. Habeus corpus is what makes this country a free democracy. It allows us to question our leaders and get fair trials. Giving bin laden a trail is not a sign of weakness. It would be a show of what makes our country great. It would show that even the most vile men in the world will be treated fairly by the USA. Once proven guilty he will get his deserved punishment. Changing the constitution out of fear is what would show weakness.
Obama wants to put a lot more military resources into GOING DIRECTLY AFTER BIN LADEN! That's "defensive"???  

Bush/McCain/Giuliani are the ones who have us playing defense by wasting thousands of American lives and billions of tax-payer dollars in Iraq, a TOTAL WASTE!
They still need to choose good VP's, and the poll at http://www.votenic.com just posted their results for the 2008 Weekly VP poll for both Dems and Reps. See who America thinks should be the Presumptive Nominees' running mates.
Whatever - let the GOP ramble on.  They are lost and still trying to play th 9/11 game.


If the GOP had all the answers - why haven't they solved any of the problems.

It's appears they only thing that matter to the GOP is how to continue to try and inject "fear" in the hearts and mind of the American people.

Thank you and GOD BLESS AMERICA
The post-September 11 mindset - which I assume Giuliani and McCain tout - have not made us any safer.  Iran is stronger, not weaker, than before.  They are well on their way in developing the ability to create NUCLEAR WEAPONS because of this post-September 11, Cowboy, go it alone foreign policy.  We have become to symbol for Al Qaeda to get new recruits.  And now, the Taliban is resurging again in Afghanistan.

C'mon, McCain and Giuliani are RIDICULOUS.

By the way,  where's Osama?  Where's the WMD's?  Where are the lower gas prices that were promised to us for having gone into Iraq?  Where's due process?  All this coyboy diplomacy brought us Abu Ghraib.  Gitmo and Soldiers shooting at the Koran.  (remember that one?  The President had to APOLOGIZE)  

The only one that seems to be okay is Halliburton.  And they moved their operation to the MIDDLE EAST to avoid paying their share of US taxes.

Yeah, all we need now is 4 more years of Bush.

And I'm a REPUBLICAN!!!

People don't seem to understand that the terrorists are patient. They will wait, ten, twenty years or longer to pull off the perfect attack. They worked on 9-11 for years. So just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it won't!
Barack Obama is right to ask "Why hasn't Osama been found?" My guess is Osama is probably staying in a "Holiday Inn Express" in Pakistan, and the US Intell community knows it. The Bush admin is so corrupt that they's let Osama run free just to they could have a GREAT "October Surprise" to influence this years election, i.e. Headlines on the day before the election "The capture of Osama Bin Ladin IS CONFIRMED".  
Once again A Right Out of Karl Roves Play Book of 2004.  

We The People will not fear any man because the Bible teaches us that we don't have to.  

Being the Christian that this Republican Party continues to profess relative to their faith one would have to ask why they would attempt to put Fear in Americans

The answer is simple it's all about politics and religion is only necessary when it furthers their cause.

The Fear Mongering won't work.  We have been there and done that even the Media was afraid to speak and We The People certainly hope that the Media has grown as much as we have on this issue.

SOS Same Old Stuff

Just Wont' Work.  

If the Administration is so concerned about our Safety perhaps they should have captured the man responsible and keeps sending Tapes when he feels like it.

Let Them answer that question
Yet another reason why, I'm sorry clintonites, Hillary Will not be VP.  read . . .

"After pledging not to call Obama naive for his stance, Giuliani added this: "The words irresponsible and naïve were applied to Sen. Obama not by a Republican but by Hillary Clinton.""

They are using HER words against Obama on KEY political issues!  He will be laughed at if he picks her.  So Obama is supposed to pick her to not piss you Clinton backers off??  

No, no way.  Perception means a lot in this election as do the issues:

He will be perceived as having caved in to the Clinton camp pressures and will to spend a lot of time spinning his decision to pick her as VP as the Republican assail him mercilessly with the obvious impression of weakness and campaign antithetical practices along with ALL of HER and BILL's Baggage!  He will spend so much time on the defensive he'll have no time to talk about the issues!!  We'll lose! The country can't afford that.

Let me rephrase the question:  Should Obama give away this election in order not to piss you Clintonites off?  

If you dare answer that, if you DON'T have anything but SILENCE in response to that question you guys were NEVER really Democrats to begin with.

Be objective:  Clinton's tactics during the primary where Barrack has shown so much restraint is like Manna from heaven for the Republicans.  She has HURT the Democratic Party's chances by the type of campaign that she has run.  She and the rest of us Democrats have a lot of work to do to negate what she did.

Her appearance with him the way you guys would like it will both nullify and divert the campaign he's trying to run.

The Country CANNOT endure for more GOP years!
Giuliani forgets that it was a Republican NY govenor a Republican NYC mayor, and a Republican President the day of 9/11.  How is it that Republicans are the ones that keep us safe?  

Oh yea, and the reason we would give the people captured trials is because we're BETTER then them.  They would execute us without hesitation, it is our kindness, and greatness that affords rights to even the most evil people in the world.
They are using the same fear tactics Bush/Cheney used to over-ride the Constitution, and give himself illegal powers.  They scare the public into relinquishing their individual rights by falsely predicting horrendous consequences.  Since most of us have very limited knowledge of Constitutional law, it's difficult to know who to believe.  

Our government was set up with checks and balances to prevent anyone from having all the power.  Bush/Cheney has gotten away with assuming power they don't have.  After 9/11, anyone who challenged them, was accused of being un-American, or pro-terrorist.  In going along with this, we have surrendered our own rights.

What about all the totally innocent people who have been rounded up and stuck in Gitmo?  What about the innocent German guy who was detained at a "secret" location, and tortured for months before they decided they had the wrong guy?  After they let him go, they blocked his right to sue, because a trial would jeopardize "national security".  What if they grabbed your brother, or father?  Don't be fooled into thinking they haven't made many big errors.  They have proven how easily they lie to us.  

History will prove how corrupt they've been.  We can't buy into fear tactics again.
It's hard to imagine how the republicans and John McCain can suggest with a straight face that we should continue the policies of the current administration. Are they so out of touch that they can't see the handwriting on the wall? Do they seriously think that Americans will fall for another 4 years of the same failed policies? Do the republicans think Americans are that stupid to fall for the politics of fear? I was a supporter of John McCain, until the primaries in FL. That's when the senator decided to trade in his "maverick" card to pandering to a base and party whose policies have literally destroyed our economy as well as our standing in the world community.
Here is a guy who used to tell it like it is not worried about winning elections. Now it seems, he's lost his way. What happened to that guy? Maybe, McCain is in a "state of confusion". Or maybe he doesn't remember the stances he's taken on several issues. Issues like: Gitmo and raising taxes during a time of war. He critizes the Supreme Court for taking a stance he once shared only a few months ago.
This can only be explained two ways. Either McCain is saying anything to get elected or he is suffering with a serious case of "dementia".
 
Good mayor please explain the how country has gone bankrupt do to the policies of the Bush/McCain republicans.  National security is tied to our own ability to viably exist as a superpower both militarily and economicaly , we are at our breaking point under both standards.  On both fronts you "borrow and spend " republicans have done great harm to the U.S.  The mere fact we did not follow the Geneva convention or military a tribunal system to prosecute the suspected terrorists lays at the republicans door step.  You took the tragedy of 9/11 to try to creat a rebublican majority. You threw away a chance to build national unity for pure political purposes. You ruled as politicians and not as statesmen.  To equate utilizing our justice system as pre 9/11 thinking is akin to me stating you and your republican breathern are living in  pre 2004 thinking when fear was utilized to win elections.  The truth is you manipulated the intelligence to fit your political goals. You and your friends are making a good living off of 9/11.  Its a shame that you have to do it at the cost of U.S. and Iraqi lves while lining you pockets and bankrupting our economy.  Like Ms. Fiorina I guess we can outsource all that is U.S. and allow you to keep the profits at our expense.
What the media seems to have forgotten is that September 11, 2001, was the date scheduled to sentence the '93 WTC bombers.  They also neglect to mention that the attorney for one of them, (the so-called blind sheik) was tried and convicted of conspiracy for passing plans that he gave her during her attorney visits to other terrorists.  Great idea to treat terrorists as if they were common burglers, no?
“That bin laden would be given habeas corpus rights is startling"

No, see, to not give Bin Laden Habeas Corpus would be startling.

Because, you know, the United States is not Nazi Germany or Stalinist Russia.
So, is MSNBC going to use any discretion? Or is the idea of "balance" in journalism just to repeat one side's talking points word-for-word, and then presumbly the other side for equal length another time.
What a crock!  People around the world are hailing the nomination of Obama and now he leads in every poll even in Ohio, Florida and a huge lead in Pennsylvania.  This is because we're all tired of the fear-mongers and do-nothing politicians.  Obama gives us the possibility of real change for America and the world.  McBush is McSame and we will reject both! Obama 08!  Freedom, justice, peace and prosperity!
  What are all you liberals whining about?  All the criticism of The Messiah in the last day were just repeats of what Hillary was trying to tell you.  She's one of you, isn't she?
I'm sorry but Rudy Giuliani is an idiot.  As a former resident of NYC (of about 20 yrs, I left in 2003) - I can tell you that he was just about universally despised by the citizens of NY before 9/11.  I'm so tired of hearing him called a hero because of the tragic events of 9/11.  He is not.  He did his job, which is what he was supposed to do, as any mayor would have.  That does not make him a hero.  And his use of 9/11 as a money-making, political tool is despicable.  But typical of him.

So for him to criticize Sen Obama is absurd.  He has no standing - moral or otherwise.

Obama '08


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