ABOUT FIRST READ

First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



McCain camp hits Obama on taxes

Posted: Monday, July 07, 2008 11:21 AM by Domenico Montanaro

From NBC’s Domenico Montanaro
Flat-taxer Steve Forbes went after Obama on taxes, claiming Obama’s tax proposals would “devastate” the American economy. He said that even though Obama now says he will cut taxes for the low-income to middle-class voters, Forbes and McCain economic adviser Douglas Holtz-Eakin claimed Obama voted for increasing taxes on those making as little as $32,000 a year.

VIDEO: Sen. John McCain will be in the Rocky Mountain State of Colorado on Monday, working to convince voters he's the best candidate to confront the rocky economy. NBC's Kelly O'Donnell reports.

This gets to Obama’s “credibility,” Forbes said on a conference call with reporters, and cited it as an example of the Illinois senator “saying one thing and doing another.”

The McCain campaign also sent out a memo, reinforcing the point. "This year, Barack Obama returned to the United States Senate twice to vote in favor of a budget resolution which raises income tax rates by three percentage points for the 25, 28 and 33 percent tax brackets," Holtz-Eakin writes in the memo. "This would mean a tax increase for those earning as little as $32,000. While Barack Obama campaigns on a promise of no tax hikes for anyone but the rich, we once again find that his words are empty when it comes time to act.  In both March and June, Barack Obama could have put the force of his vote behind his words. Instead, he decided that 'rich' now means those making just $32,000 per year."

But NBC’s Ken Strickland spoke with a Democratic aide at the Senate Budget Committee who said there was never a budget vote that said: Let's raise taxes. What the budget vote did do was estimate how much additional revenue would be needed, and then it would go to the Finance Committee to determine how to raise that amount (raise taxes, close loopholes, etc).
 
The aide thinks what the McCain campaign has seized on is this revenue growth -- and has taken one of the possible ways to get there: by raising taxes among all income groups. But the budget vote never called for raising taxes, the aide said.

On the call, Holtz-Eakin said, “Sen. Obama can say what he wants this week… but this is about his record. It reveals what his true values are” -- that he voted for something that would raise taxes on low-income voters, Holtz-Eakin claimed.

Forbes also called Obama’s proposals, the “biggest tax increase since Herbert Hoover.” By contrast, Forbes called McCain’s proposals “very exciting” and would do more for small businesses than Obama. He added, “You don’t raise taxes when the economy is in trouble” and claimed Obama would tax “anything that moves or breathes in this country.” McCain “believes the way to get economy moving is to cut the tax burden.”

Asked about Democratic charges against McCain of “flip-flopping” on taxes -- that he didn’t vote for the Bush tax cuts, but now says he’d expand them -- Forbes said, "Sen. McCain has never voted for a tax increase.”

*** UPDATE *** The DNC issued this response, in part: "On a conference call with reporters today, Steve Forbes and Doug Holtz-Eakin showed how far the McCain is willing to go to deflect attention away from McCain’s promise of a third Bush term on the economy. First, Forbes falsely claimed that John McCain has never voted for a tax increase—a claim that prompted a rebuke from the Club for Growth during the primaries. In fact, McCain has support tax increases on everything from vaccines to phone cards.

"Then, Doug Holtz-Eakin tried to explain how John McCain plans to make the Bush tax cuts he once opposed permanent and still balance the budget by 2013.  His recipe: cutting discretionary spending and promoting growth.  Not only does McCain’s math not even come close to adding up, but Holtz-Eakin himself said it would be impossible to cut enough spending to balance the budget.  Plus, before he reversed himself to pander to the right wing of his party, McCain used to reject the idea that we can grow our way out of budget-busting tax cuts.  The new McCain, however, is promising four more years of George Bush’s borrow and spend budgeting."

*** UPDATE 2 *** NBC's Ken Strickland fact checks Holtz-Eakin's memo:
The questionable line from the Holtz-Eakin memo is that Obama "returned to the United States Senate twice to vote in favor of a budget resolution which raises income tax rates by three percentage points for the 25, 28 and 33 percent tax brackets. This would mean a tax increase for those earning as little as $32,000." 

Is it true? As with many things political, the answer is yes and no. Secondly, it's a recycled argument Republicans make often about Democrats and raising taxes.  In other words, what at first blush appeared to be newsworthy is 'not so much' in my humble opinion.

THE FACTS:
- There was no vote during the budget resolution process to actually raise taxes.  Simply put, there was not a vote which in effect said, "let's raise taxes by 3% on certain tax brackets." So Obama did not vote to raise taxes per se. BUT... 

- The overall budget resolution does assume the BUSH 2001/2003 tax cuts will expire (or have to be offset by new spending.) And if they expire, taxes in the 25, 28, and 33 percent tax brackets would increase 3% as Holtz-Eakin suggests. (Democrats are happy to remind folks that McCain was against those tax cuts, before he was for them.)

- Also noteworthy: The budget resolution is NOT/NOT a law, NOT binding. (The President of the United States doesn't even sign it.) Instead, it's a blueprint of sorts that gives guidance to how congressional tax writers write tax laws in the Finance Committee. That panel is not bound to what the budget says, and often votes to "waive" budget rules.

Bottom line: While it may be a bit of a stretch to say Obama voted to raise taxes, it is accurate to suggest that Obama's support for the budget resolution indicates a willingness to let the tax cuts expire--thus potentially causing a tax increase.

*** UPDATE 3 *** The Obama campaign, per NBC's Andrea Mitchell, maintains the budget resolution encompassed middle class tax cuts, more than offsetting the lost benefit of the Bush tax cut extensions for lower-income taxpayers.

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But NBC’s Ken Strickland spoke with a Democratic aide at the Senate Budget Committee who said there was never a budget vote that said: Let's raise taxes.
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Maybe Forbes should do more research before making false claims and accusations.  It's one thing to hit a candidate on their policy stances - but it's something else to make-up things to support your own conclusions.

http://thepajamapundit.com/
McCain will cut taxes, increase spending, and eliminate the deficit.....AND stay in Iraq the next 100 years, spending BILLIONS of dollar a month (borrowed, of course, from China)! He's quite the guy, isn't he? I've got some swamp land to sell you, too. It's worth about as much as a McFossil presidency would be. Zip. Nada. Zero. Nothing.

Diane from Illinois

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Do you find yourself running into walls and doors when you go on these uncontrolled rants?
Is it just me or has MSNBC become EXTREMELY PRO-MCCAIN?  How come we are never reading about McCain's problems or issues....all I keep reading here is what the GOPERS have to say to deceive the Obama Supporters....Have a little bit more class MSNBC.....please be fair and balanced....not like FAUX NEWS..... :O(
"But NBC’s Ken Strickland spoke with a Democratic aide at the Senate Budget Committee who said there was never a budget vote that said: Let's raise taxes. What the budget vote did do was estimate how much additional revenue would be needed, and then it would go to the Finance Committee to determine how to raise that amount (raise taxes, close loopholes, etc)."

*rubs eyes*

Did someone at NBC news do some investigative journalism to research a claim BEFORE printing a McCain talking point as truth?

Wonders never cease!
No change from Obama when it comes to taxes. It's the same old liberal 'tax'em tell they bleed' ideas that we've all seen in the past.
"You don’t raise taxes when the economy is in trouble” and claimed Obama would tax “anything that moves or breathes in this country.” McCain “believes the way to get economy moving is to cut the tax burden.”

So we keep spending 12 billion A MONTH in Iraq and CUT the revenues to pay for it? And the media doesn't say A WORD?

I think I'll quit my job and go shopping . . .
Steve Forbes, the champion of small businesses. Ha ha haahahahhhhhahaah.
The Numbers: Obama vs McCain on Taxes - Watch This!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNyNv_UfFUo

CNN Crunches Obama and McCain Tax Plans
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fbxpMw4mco&eurl

Non-Partisan Tax Center: McCain Plan Favors The Wealthy
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/12/1136892.aspx?CommentPosted=true#commentmessage

Tax Progressivity Discussed on CNN !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9fbxpMw4mco&eurl=http://www.daily
Obama babbles endlessly how he's going to "Tax the rich". Trouble is, there are not enough rich people in the country for him to tax to support all of his social programs. So if Obama is every elected, he'll redefine "The Rich" as anyone with a job.
I have spent almost 10 years as a legal resident of USA.  I'm not really surprised to see Obama's comments get far more scrutinized than McCain's, even when their statements carry the same weight.

My professional experience so far in USA has taught me to know that whenever you see an individual who does not 'fit the mold' in a position, that person is twice better than a counterpart who 'fits the mold'.
I think the McCain campaign is miscalculating on this issue.  Yes, American families are in trouble financially.  Yes, we are in a recession.  But are American voters going to trust the same crowd of yahoos whose fiscal policy got us in this mess to begin with?

In my view, Obama is encountering a similar situation as Bill Clinton in '92.  The 'public mood' favors the righting of the balance sheet.  Recent history has proven we cannot go any longer with out of control deficit spending and the dollar down the tubes.  Republican monetary policy has really led us down a bad path here, and as every American family knows, sometimes you have to bite the bullet and do the work to improve your situation.  There is no free lunch.

Republicans say "they'll raise taxes".  I hear "they're advocating fiscal responsibility."

No more BORROWING to pay the bills, people!

http://ilfamilypolitics.blogspot.com
In a word....DESPERATION! The smears against Obama are getting old. The McCain camp at some point will have to give some real and specific solutions for correcting the issues that we face as a nation. Out of touch is probably a real good description of McCain and his campaign for POTUS.
Again the McCain campaign has gotten the facts wrong.  Another instance of stepping on your message when the facts come out.

As for the tax cuts Obama is suggesting, he would eliminate the Bush tax cuts which would raise taxes for people making over $230,000 a year.  There is a slight increase in the capital gains tax, putting it back to the rate it was under the Clinton administration.

As for Forbes, he's run for President at least twice and we all know how receptive the people were to his candidacy.  The flat tax is a concept introduced by Barry Goldwater in 1964.  Talk about ancient ideas.
Is it just me or has MSNBC become EXTREMELY PRO-MCCAIN?  How come we are never reading about McCain's problems or issues....all I keep reading here is what the GOPERS have to say to deceive the Obama Supporters....Have a little bit more class MSNBC.....please be fair and balanced.
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Are you kidding me? Have you tuned into that bozo Olbermann lately?  Or listened to the female Olbermann, Rachel Maddow?  They wouldn't know the meaning of the term fair and balanced.  MSNBC is the worst example of the media's love affair with Obama.
WOW... and the Republicans have done such a great job at making the rich richer and the middle class poorer. I know I feel so much better each time I head to the grocery store or fill up the car.

Thanks Republicans, you have tons of credibility on this issue.

What gives First Read? Are you now the mouth piece for Republican talking points... how about a tiny bit of research and analysis. Yikes!

http://laststopmidwest.blogspot.com
Is it just me or has MSNBC become EXTREMELY PRO-MCCAIN?
------------
Sure, Matthew. On Morning Joe, they had two BO supporters on in a row and then another later in the program.  Yep, that's really pro-McCain!
Did anyone else read this article from Forbes Magazine?

US OIL FIRMS SEEK DRILLING ACCESS, EXPORTS SOAR
“While the U.S. oil industry want access to more federal lands to help reduce reliance on foreign suppliers, American-based companies are shipping record amounts of gasoline and diesel fuel to other countries.

A record 1.6 million barrels a day in U.S. refined petroleum products were exported during the first four months of this year, up 33 percent from 1.2 million barrels a day over the same period in 2007. Shipments this February topped 1.8 million barrels a day for the first time during any month, according to final numbers from the Energy Department.

The surge in exports appears to contradict the pleas from the U.S. oil industry and the Bush administration for Congress to open more offshore waters and Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to drilling”.
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………………
U.S. oil companies and administration officials have been telling Americans that the price of gasoline is a function of supply and demand.  Americans have been told to use less, to conserve. Senator McCain (and the administration) is advocating drilling for oil off the outer continental shelf. We would not see results from off-shore drilling for or more 10 years. Americans have been told that there appears to be no real, viable, short- term solution to this crisis.

While all Americans are suffering from the economic impact of the price of oil, the major domestic oil companies are recording record profits with no windfall profit tax that could be used to cap, subsidize and reduce the price of gas.  There are no plans to build additional refineries to convert crude into usable fossil fuels.

Now we find that domestic oil companies are EXPORTING record amounts of gas to other countries, further reducing the limited supplies of oil we have on hand for consumption.  The export of domestic US oil has added to the ever increasing profits reported by oil companies each quarter.  While domestic oil companies have reported tens of BILLIONS of dollars in profits, average Americans are struggling with pocket book issues, largely the result of the trickle down effect the price of oil has had on a variety of US industries.

Oil companies are EXPORTING OIL to increase profitability.  I find it absolutely incredible that Congress has done nothing to stop this practice.
Hmmm. First off, we're supposed to believe Forbes' mischaracterization of Obama's policies?  I'm certainly not that gullible.

As for the basics of Obama's tax policies, we've already seen them implemented before in the 90s. Devastate?!?  Yeah right. We have the proof from the 90s, where taxes on the rich were up, but they were down on the middle and lower income groups and we actually started balancing budgets.  Very few people look back on those times as a rough financial patch for the country.  And even with the higher taxes, the rich got richer because the  middle class was growing and average Joes and Janes actually able to buy all those goods and services the rich were selling.  
McCain is getting desperate.Grandpa, sit down & shut up we all know that you support the Bush tax-cuts which have not benefited anyone in the last 8 years.Your tax plan only benefits the rich(Cindy McCain).This is just a bunch of hog-wash you bumbling fool like the gas tax hiliday & your supposed upcoming jobs proposal.Another farce, action speaks louder than words Caney-Cane, Nafta(which you support) is the reason for job loss.Fool me once shame on you.Fool me twice shame on me.  
When Steve Forbes talks, "Nobody Listens".  Wasn't he the rich Republican who ran for POTUS about 8 years ago and hardly got out of the gate.

I hear McOld plans to be in Denver this week.  I wonder if he is planning to rent the Bronco's stadium?  Doubt it.  Doubt if he could fill the end zone.

Some new state polls are showing Obama beating MeOld in several states carried by Bush: Like Indiana.  Bush won by 20 points, Obama is ahead by 1. Obama will win by 5 come November.  Huffington Post is suggesting the GOP is already looking to 2010.  Guess they realize they can't turn things around in the next 4 months, regardless of the conservative evangelcals or Steve Forbes.  They have GW Bush to thank for their troubles.  
I was about to become concerned about Obama's position in this article, until you made it clear that he voted on a referendum to a finance committee concerned with how to raise revenue.

When it comes back to Congress, they will hash out the exact language, and new tax burdens on which taxpayers.

Fundraising suggestions painted with a broad stroke, and an actual vote for more taxes on the lower middle class is two differnt things.

The red tape in Congress is thick, and slow. Obama was right not to bog down the process too soon, with premature bickering.

Bills are shuttled around Congress like dry leaves in a tornado. They are edited, and rewritten to death before they come up for a final vote. McCain, and his toadies are grasping at straws here.
Interesting in McCain's press release signed by his economic advisors, the press release left out any mention of the gas tax holiday and bush tax cuts.  Even the economist didn't want to lie so boldly.  And after a quick Google search only one economist came up with anything because she worked for Enron, Wendy Graham.  McCain and MSNBC are full of it.
The President cannot cut or raise taxes.

Conress can.
So Obama's plan will devastate the economy.  Tell me, is cutting taxes and starting a war good for our economy?  Well that's what these dunderhead conservatives have done, and just look at what a mess they have given America.
steve forbes is worried that obama may want him and his wealthy investment class buddies to pay their fair share for a change, mccain and forbes are lying about what obama wants to change in the tax code, although it was explained here by first read all that you will be hearing else where is how obama is going to beat down people making 32k a year, I hope people are paying attention, one thing is for sure mccain and steve forbes don't intend to lift a finger to help people making less than 200k a year that can't afford to play the stock market, it's time the less fortunate got thrown a bone, obama intends to do just that, the wealthy will still be wealthy just required to kick in the money that they should
Did someone at NBC news do some investigative journalism to research a claim BEFORE printing a McCain talking point as truth?

Thank you, Nashville. So far, I take it McCain and Forbes are lieing. No, the reporter says, the committee staffer I asked was a Democrat, so I can't say for sure it's a lie? Can you do your own research? Please, reporters, don't give us hesaid-hesaid when all you need to do is check the record.
.....And how much is 100 years of war in Iraq going to cost american taxpayers?ohn McCain gets a free ride again Geezzzzzzzzzzzz!
The McCain plan to balance the budget:

Cut taxes, stay in Iraq and sprinkle magic fairy dust over the Congressional Budget Office.
When I think of all the good but gullable people who bought the lies and exaggerations of Cheney/bush and voted for them!  The same style of lies and exaggerations are now being given through the Rove slime throwing machine and (unfortunately) will again convince a number of good but naive individuals.
Factcheck.org: Miscounting Obama's Tax Votes
http://www.newsweek.com/id/144518

McCain keeps lying about Obamas positions on issues, and argues against the false ones.  He's a WACKO!
Okay, wait a minute, I just thought of something . . .


Why do we have a post about John McCain and taxes, but no mention of those 4 year delinquent property taxes on house number seven (or was it six - I can't keep count)?

Hmmmmm, John McCain and the economy . . . kind of reminds me of the Keating 5 situation . . . clearly John McCain is just the guy we need in troubled economic times - he knows all about creating financial nightmares.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keating_Five

http://www.wmsa.net/People/john_mccain/ariz-republic_chap_V_1999.htm
typical game already label obama as tax and spend why dont they just find a new slogan this is a change elections anyways
http://sensico.wordpress.com/2008/07/05/hillary-supporters-back-obama/
I have to agree with Matthew.  For the past week, I have seen information that leads me to believe MSNBC...besides KO....is rallying behind McCain and his tainted message.  I am so sick of hearing him bash Obama.  Everything has been bash Obama.  From his supposed changes on irag...wrong...to his religious views.  MSM...don't believe the hype.

Obama '08
Just more proof that Obama is not what he appears to be. He is a down right fraud!
Can I ask how we are going to realize this saving of 12b a month on Iraq when even BO admits he has no intention of withdrawing until stability is achieved?

Don't count your chickens
Rich guys against taxing the rich.  Hey, there is a suprise.  Lets see the repubs get an average working middle class person to come out against taxing the rich, then maybe they will have some teeth.  Otherwise, shut up
Herbert Hoover?  McCain/Bush/Cheney war cannot invoke Herbert Hoover unless they understand history. This administration is worst than Herbert Hoover; which shows how inept they are. Sending tax dollars to a stupid needless war is an example.

Btw; is the reason McCain didn’t pay his taxes is that his were too exuberant?

=======================================================
to BarACK and FORTH (Sent Monday, July 07, 2008 10:39 AM)
Good.  Expose BO for what he is.  No more passes. This man must have a backache from all the flips he's doing.
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The person should really get to know better is the old, cudgeller, Duel Personality, McCain. We know he flip-flops. But what we don’t know is …does he really forget/lie … or forgets because he may be experiencing early Alzheimer’s disease. And that is a problem!
It would be political suicide if Obama limited himself to campaign finance and not a 50 state approach. Swift boaters, smears, and the fear factor are/will be the only talking points.



News flash Mr. Forbes-- It is the Bush tax-plan that has already devasted the economy!  McCain wants to continue the devastation with extending the Bush proposals.  
The media and republicans can keep repeating the lie 'Flip-flop' for Obama which is so ludicrous that I get a big belly laugh every time I read it! Thanks for the humor.  

Senator Obama outclasses McCain in speech, conduct and implementation of every campaign aspect in my opinion.

Senator Obama has the good judgement and vision for the US and he has the ability to execute the organization to get it done.  

Obama 08
I am 50. I nver thought I would be so upset with the credibility of a leader as I was with Richard Nixon. But now Obama, charm and all, breaks Nixon's mold.By "shifting to the center" Obama revelas that he doesn't have core beliefs.

Obama lacks core beliefs because he's inexperienced. Obama has never "felt for years" about anything---because he's never had to.

I doubt Obama loves America. The presidency to Obama is a head trip to impress his fromer law professors.

Obama will be a disaster.

McCain 08/12  
News flash Mr. Forbes-- It is the Bush tax-plan that has already devasted the economy!  McCain wants to continue the devastation with extending the Bush proposals.  
The media and republicans can keep repeating the lie 'Flip-flop' for Obama which is so ludicrous that I get a big belly laugh every time I read it! Thanks for the humor.  

Senator Obama outclasses McCain in speech, conduct and implementation of every campaign aspect in my opinion.

Senator Obama has the good judgement and vision for the US and he has the ability to execute the organization to get it done.  

Obama 08
I read somewhere that the cost of oil/gas is really increased for Americans due to the devaluation of the dollar.

Our economic precipice of 'borrow and spend' is as much to blame for the current plight.  I don't see where McCain has a plan to change direction.  Which from basic polling about 80% of the electorate feels is necessary.  So I ask you, more of the same?  Or change?  I am still startled by the Bush hugging McCain has pursued.  AND I am still convinced that Obama knows that if he isn't elected, there simply will be NO CHANGE (in the country - or in your pocket).  As he has proven by beating the Clintons, he is smart about playing this 'game'.  I trust his judgment and I am confident the ship will be righted under his leadership.
Open mouth insert foot....what a record ...
McNoEconomy is the cham-pee-on of Depends Brand
underware...

I find it amusing that the campaign that is now supportive of the Bush administrations fiscal policies is attempting to question the tax policy of another candidate. Americans can plainly see where the current policy has led us. So the lies and spin begin from the Republicans in '08...   BTW latest issue of Fortune magazine has a nice little chart in it showing that people making less that $112,000 dollars would keep MORE of their money under Obama...something to think about when the Republicans try to make something out of nothing
First read prints releases from both campaigns so it's no bias of them to post these type of articles. The problem comes when MSNBC's talking heads begin to pontificate RNC talking points by debating them without pointing out obvious falsehoods and misstatements. The AP and NY Times have recently began injecting a pro McCain slant into their articles as well. I'll give credit to Chuck and staff for atleast getting to the bottom of the daily fluff from this election.
CBN's Brody reports on an effort by The Christian Defense Coalition, hitting Obama on abortion. It labels Obama "the abortion President" and uses and image that is sure to offend -- it's a depiction of a black "Uncle Sam," saying, "I want you to pay for abortions."

*******

And people say there are no fundementalist in the US..that we are so much better than...say...Iran.  Ladies and gentlemen, radical fundamentalism is alive and well in the US...the just shave and wear suits.
This is the first balanced post for a while. It's been like FixNews around here lately.

That said, last president to balance the budget, Bill Clinton.

With a powerful Dem house, McCain would be a lame duck from day one. If he's lucky enough to win, it will be by the slimmest of margins, so none of his mandates will get done.

Again, this is an important point the media doesn't seem to think worthy of sharing with the public.
The President cannot cut or raise taxes.

Conress can.
The Truth


Excellent point. So what do you think Reid and Pelosi will do, raise or lower taxes? What do you think Obama would do if he was President - veto or sign the bill?
Nobody's less objective on the issue of taxes than Steve Forbes. He and his buddies would have the most to lose if they had to pay a fair portion of the national tax burden, instead of either shifting that burden to middle-income voters, or worse, putting it on our kids' tax bills by running up the deficit.
Thank you Fee....I am on here everyday....and I have been feeling that lately....Yes I know First Read does some good for Obama....but hasn't it been a while?  Olbermann and Maddow see the real picture folks....I am just afraid we still have too many others out there that can't listen to those two...2 of 10 or so for Obama...doesn't seem like it is all that Obama-Lovin'......Just my OWN observation...still love you all bloggers!!! :o)

P.S. Where is Bobbi?  Waiting on here comments~!
As usual McCain is grasping at straws. He just doesnt get his facts straight. The press wont call him on this as they are so enamoured with him!


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