Negative ads?  Obama?  How will he be able to whine about his opposition's negative ads when he's doing the same thing?

I should have posted Donna’s comment in it’s entirety before commenting on it.

Donna wrote:

Equal pay is an example of something that sounds good, but isn't. I majored in economics, and learned the REAL meaning of 'equal pay'. Take two jobs: both require a high school diploma, proficiency in arithmatic, and an ability to pay attention to detail and work independantly. One job, dominated by women workers, pays $12 per hour, the other, dominated by men, pays $20. Sounds unfair; however, job number one is a bank teller, job number two is a warehouse packer/shipper. Job number one is considered 'white collar'; job two, 'blue collar'. Morever, the bank teller works in a climate controlled environment, while the packer/shipper in a warehouse subject to extreme temperatures. The difference in wages is called by economists the 'opportunity cost'. You choose the higher wage and difficult work environment, or the lower wage and more pleasant work environment. If you legislate skill/pay scales, you will have no shipper/packers, because people will not do jobs that are less pleasant without the extra money. Legislating skill/pay scales will leave us with no trash collectors, (who are very well paid), fork life operators, etc. Letting the marketplace set the wage has made us the most productive country in the world. Socializing this will destroy the marketplace, and ensure that many are unemployed. You have to THINK, people.
Donna, Lincroft, NJ (Sent Monday, August 18, 2008 4:59 PM)

I responded:

The equal pay legislation that McCain voted against giving women the right to sue their employer when they receive unequal pay, was in reference to doing the ‘SAME’ job, in the Same field, in the Same warehouse, for the Same employer, with the SAME job description as others earning more money.

You rant with all the illiterate zeal of a true Limbaugh toadie.  
*****************************

Donna, your original comment had nothing to do with the debate between McCain‘s, and Obama’s supporters over the recent, ’equal pay bill’, struck down in Congress by the Republicans with McCain’s help, and you know it.  Your post was a deliberate stretch on the current conversation. You pushed your point in order to disparage Obama, and his supporters as stupid Socialist sympathizers. There is backlash when you insult your fellow Americans.

You challenged my correctly nuanced use of the term ‘illiterate’: (as in unenlightened).

illiterate   adj. 1 unable to read.  2 uneducated  
illiteracy n.   nonreader; lowbrow, ignoramus.
adj.  1 unlettered.   2 unschooled, untaught, benighted, ignorant, unenlightened.
As defined by ‘The Oxford’; American Desk Dictionary and Thesaurus; second edition

and seem to address the anxiety among some Democrats that Mr. Obama has not answered a volley of attacks by Mr. McCain with enough force."

Judging by his ads, he still has a long way to go.

And the negative ads all hit McCain with key issues.  Economy. War. Energy.  It's about time that Obama hit back.

http://thepajamapundit.com/

bout time.  Obama and especially his surrogates need to be on the attack.

DNC Ad Hit McCain 4 $5million Blunder Pictures
http://sensico.wordpress.com/2008/08/19/dnc-ad-hit-mccain-4-5million-blunder/
or
http://sensico2.blogspot.com/2008/07/my-blogs.html

I love it, stealth campaign ads!  Obama was perfectly willing to run a gentlemanly, civil campaign until Mcshame broke his promise and went on the attack first.

as bad as he did sat night he needs to change something. i was very disapointed.

It's about time!

Barack O-Shark's fin is in the water. McCain dumped the chum. Obama's eyes have had no choice but to roll over white on the McCain campaign.

Obama was forced to start the negative stuff before he wanted to, I believe, by the onslaught of McCain's early descent into all-negative, all-the-time campaigning.

This isn't the John McCain of eight years ago. Or maybe it is, and we didn't know John McCain eight years ago.

McCain wrote six years ago that his run for the presidency in 2000 wasn't based on a patriotic desire to bring reforms or anything like that, but instead on McCain's own ambition to president. Okay, its interesting a politician would admit that about himself - truly a little straight talk.

But to then turn around in 2008 and attack your opponent for presidential ambition as opposed to McCain, who always "puts his country first," is so completely shameless it leaves me stunned.

Maybe McCain is what the emerging picture tells us - the worst of the worst, who occassionally to his credit admits to being the worst of the worst.

The POW story on Military Times has been BLOCKED or removed.

People need to get on this

What did you expect. I new that eventualy he would have to climb down into that slime pit that the Republican's call home. They remind me of the schoolyard bullies of childhood. They just keep pushing till someone bloodies their nose and then they cry foul. I think the Repugnant one's underestimated how far they can push Obama without getting their nose bloodied. I sure hope I am right.

Obama is going to have a problem going too negative after his promises to run a "different kind of political campaign."

UNLESS, he can have an easy bridge to get there without looking like "just another politician."

Here's what i think would be a good play.

During a town hall or stump speach, Obama says:

"Now recently, you've all hear my opponent, John McCain, running all sorts of negative attack ads on my character and my positions that are misleading, and many of them just flat out lies. I wanted to run a different kind of campaign, and according to Mr McCain and his wife, well they promised to run a positive campaign, too. Apparently, they either changed their minds or they aren't really in control of their own campaign."

"Either way, I want Mr McCain to know, that he has a LONG history of making the wrong decisions, both on the job the last 25 years, as well as in his personal life for the last 40 years. There is PLENTY of dirt to be thrown around, but i would rather be taking the high road."

"HOWEVER, the gloves have come off, and things have gotten personal. I'm going to give Mr McCain one more chance to run the campaign he promised. If i see another misleading ad on TV, on the radio, or on the internet, I will be forced to unleash my knowledge of the real McCain on the internet, TV, and radio. .......and trust me, i've had 100 professional staffers digging for the last year, and there is PLENTY to talk about. ....and the BEST part is, it's all verifiable FACT."

Bingo. One statement, and then he can let all of the voting against troops, women's rights, infidelity, treason.... let it all come out with the gloves off.

We all know that they've been digging into McCain's background since he became the Repub nominee, and this way he can cut McCain down and still kinda look like the good guy.

The best part is, by using the ultimatum, it becomes McCain's decision for the negativity to start from Obama.

What do you think?

War Monger(Oil Baron wanna be) John McCain sure lays out the future scare tactics ...Why do we believe this lobbyist kiss butt, Bush hugging, fire breathing liar?
I wish Obama could say this but he's to nice a guy to say what we all see...

I think Obama's doing the right thing, not rubbing everybody's face in his negative ads. Just put them out to the right audience and let the pundits twist in the wind.

http://www.rodneyhopper.com

What's with Obama? I thought he was Mr. Positive? The Democrats have built this guy up to be just short of being the messiah. Pelosi calls him "a gift from God". Yet, when he was nearly on the same stage with McCain with Rick Warren the other night, Obama looked small and insignificant. He is really out of his league now.

McCain did not do good during the forum.He was pander and lair in cheif right from the start.Teflon John was not called out by the press on his lying preformance.McCain voted for every judge that he said was against.He does support torture.When a bill came up to call water boarding torture.McCain voted against it because he did not want to tie the hands of the CIA.McCain did not vote for the GI bill.McCain thought it was to good and would bring down re-enlistment rates.Go look at McCain,s voting record on all of these issues,McCain,s words do not match his actions.

Please do NOT confuse negative ads with the need to address unfounded offensive accusations head on-The time is now!  No longer can Senator Obama allow Senator McCain's juvenile antics culminating in subliminal messages parading Brittany Spears or Lindsay Lohan alongside a true learned leader, presumptive Democratic nominee Obama.  

Now is the time to strike back with the truth and thwart the silliness Senator McCain attempts to mascarade as political discourse.  Bush and Carl Rove ad are nonsequitur as we need a clear thinker who how to make a point, knows when to brush it off negativeness, negotiate and/or stop the madness when appropriate- That's called good judgment and experience is obsolete without it!  There will be no opportunity for "swift boating", "bait and switches" to get the heat off the real problems (failing economy, war, energy, etc)" and stealing the election.  Let's regain our respect domestically and internationally and elect a president that won't send the masses to the poor house, our children to their funerals and our country to its demise.

Obama 08, 12  

Well Obama has to do it himself since the Clintons, and the other dems seem intent on not helping him......Where are the Pelosi's, the Edwards, Clintons, the Clarks, the Nunns, etc?

McCain/Hitler has Leiberman, Romney, Pawlety, Jindal, Rove, Gingritch, Limbaugh, and the rest of the idiots.

Obama's group has left him to dry.

First off, it's not a negative add when the facts are true. As long as Obama keeps responding in thoughtful, truthful, respectful ways, I'll keep on supporting him. Secondly, he's got to respond to Mccain's tactics. If not, then we're all screwed. But don't step out of line. You represent a light far brighter than yourself. We are the future. We will follow you, but don't stray from yourself. We need a win badly Mr. Obama, but we also need integrity -- something John Mccain cannot provide. YES WE CAN!

It does seem about time that there was a return by Obama.  Sometimes it is regretable that the only way to counter negative ads are with other negative ads.  Given who McCain is and how he has voted in the Senate in the past, there is plenty of material.  

Ads by Obama that expose the direct, intentional lies of mccain are not negative!  They are an essential part of campaigning in order to inform the lazy people who will not seek out information, but sit on the couch waiting to be fed their political diet!  

By the way, I believe mccain cheated and was prepped for the Warren forum.  Let's see how long the stolen gains last in his polling.

McCain did well... and he should have... he had all the questions prior to getting asked.  He was prepped well ahead of time.  We'll see how well he does when he's got to deal with the moderator in real time and Obama exposing his plans for the economy.  

McCain has yet to provide numbers that he'll be able to give the middle class.  He'll be on stage trying to bash Obama on raising taxes and Obama will be able to provide the breakdown the two candidate are looking to give america.  

McCain is going to get cooked in the debates.

Ads by Obama that expose the direct, intentional lies of mccain are not negative!  They are an essential part of campaigning in order to inform the lazy people who will not seek out information, but sit on the couch waiting to be fed their political diet!  

By the way, I believe mccain cheated and was prepped for the Warren forum.  Let's see how long the stolen gains last in his polling.

Just play enough clips of McCain with his face in Bush's armpit. That will do it.

Clearly, the hand wringers in the DEM party misjudged Barack "toughness" and his ability to learn and modify his strategy as needed. It is still early in the game. The 24-hr news cycle distorts reality just as it did in the primary by implying that Hillary still had a chance after Feb.

Like most if not all successful politicians Barack is pragmatic. He wants to win, to bring the changes we know are needed. He will not play in the GOP snakepit very openly, but he will use the well focused "negative" ads strategically as that is his style.

If you saw his speech or parts of it at VFW meeting yesterdy, it is clear that he had put McCain on notice. Don't fret DEMs. Barack is no weenie. Anyone with is background who has come as far and and fast as he has should realize that. He is a ferocious competitor. Do not let his cool style fool you! He can also hit the 3-pointers without fear, but he does not waste his energy. He is a leader and a winner. McCain beware! You have started a fight with someone that you have vastly underrated.

Obama-(still)Biden '08

Why was Obama Forced to run Negative adds?Seems that since all the Bomber has to say are negitive things about Obama, thats all the msm has.Bomber hasn't come foward with any real change unless The team of Rove, Chaney, Bush, say he can.The media seems content and almost joyous every day the bomber talks,another attacks,more lies,more warmongering,saber rattling,(that msm eats it up)so sad,you would think that there is nothing else execpt this to talk about.But i guess if you intend on running that Bush /Chaney type of campaign rather then talk about issues,there is really nothing to report execpt the trash Bomber talks.Comming from a guy that has a plane full of skeletons in the closet(Keating 5 bank scandel,Leaves first wife for the rich beer baron,she had a drug issue(stealing drugs from her own family sponsered clinic)and becomming a addict, as a fly boy skirt chaser,)and still the msm can;t figure out why he has limited them (fewer gaffsreported that way) to question him,much the way that Lil Bushie did it.It has started to occur to me that the msm thought Obama would come and go and that Hilly would be there target,so now they feel it is there duty to keep the race close (got to sell papers and commerical time some how)I guess that these folks are part of the middle class ( making 5 million a year)to them they see them selfs doing just fine like they have planed it all along.The truly sad part is that there are many issues that need to be addressed that are treated like dirty laundry,kicked in the corner and left stinking.just like the msm coverage.

The Don,
   Very well put. I don't know why but it is true, that the other dems seem to be backing off on their support! That moron Pelosi should be fighting for Obama, instead of complimenting McCain. Think she plans on running in 2012? The dems are not standing behind or in front of their candidate and they need to NOW! Now is the time to really put the heat on the Republicans and show them how solidified the Democratic party is, but they aren't! It is a darn shame! I hate pelosi.

Is Obama really going to be using Slip Sliding away as a theme song? You know the the nearer your destination the more you're slip-sliding away.

From Countdown last night:

Read this quote from McCain's 2002 book titled "Worth the Fighting For"...also on audio tape:
"I didn't decide to run for President to start a national crusade for political reforms I believed in or to run a campaign as if it were some grand act of patriotism.
In truth, I wanted to be President because it had become my ambition to be President. I was sixty-two years old when I made the decision and thought it was my one shot at the prize."
Hmmm...just one example of lies and hypocrisy.

Please stop giving McCain a free ride and report on this!!!!

http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,164859_1,00.html

Why have the Dems not learned anything about the way to run an effective campaign. Polls indicate McCain has gained and Obama lost voters. McCain is running a negetive campaign. Duh! Start off with the old "swift-boat" attack. Johnny was a captured aviator who spilled his guts to the Cong. There a ton of people who know him as a bounder and a cad. Johnny dumped his wife when she need him the most, to fool around with another woman. It is time to drag out the dirt.
At least these stories are not fabrications. Wecome to the NFL.

I think Obama has lost his mojo. He is so wimpy,masochistic, absorbing all the punches that McCain throws at him. So he is not going to win this game of politics - he's tooooo nice. Better stay out of politics and be a professor instead.

John McCain-Ready to lead us down the road of destructiion.
John McCain-Ready to lead you to the poorhouse.
John McCain-ready to sell your jobs to other countries.
Now that's a negative commercial.
Oh that's the premise of McCains ads against Obama,
and instead of just running them in the areas he needs votes, he passes them on to the media for extra air time, and the media plays the game and we get nothing in return.

The coming years will be far more complex and challanging than the last. We need a president who is up to the task, not another simplistic, second rate pol with a low IQ who is no better than his predecessor,

Obama.  

Obama.

       

The LA times say 'the ads are not on his website' yet the NYtimes article says they are. why lift passages from news papers? why not do your own research?
This is lazy journalism.

Wake up - the alarm is ringing and this  is a 3-alarm fire! The media - except perhaps MSNBC are all repeating the idea of doubts about Obama that are raised by McCain. I am appalled over what I hear on the network news and on CNN never mind Fox. There is a subtle question about his leadrship and ability all the while thhey are saying that he gets more coverage! Also hear the tornado siren - that is Talk Radio - where I live it is nonstop Rush Limbaugh and Shawn Hannidy slamming Obama. Do people rally want another Republican administration! NO WAY I think that the biggest thing we can do is send a message to the major media - do they want to turn another election into a disaster for America! Brenda in Iowa

ENOUGH OF REPUBLICAN CORRUPTION !

this time,

DEMOCRATS FOR '08 !!

 There is nothing negative about an ad if it is purely factual. The Obama ad which shows John Sydney McCain III in his own words telling us that the economy is not so bad and that economic progress is being made is factual to its core. It also shows individual Americans who are having major difficulties during this economic downturn. THEY see and feel the pain that John McCain has yet to recognize. So, it is fair to ask "How can John McCain fix something that he won't acknowledge is broken"?

 Nothing negative there. Its a fair question that all Americans need an answer to.

McCain started with negative ads. Obama ads are not low like McBush. REPUBLICANS FOR OBAMA

look here people, when it comes down to it, in november,this country will NOT vote no black man into the whitehouse period !!! this country does not have the will nor the courage to do so. john mccain will be your next president,and we the people will suffer some more while john and his big oil friends make more money. i will vote for obama, but he will NOT will this election, and i'm black

Bingo. One statement, and then he can let all of the voting against troops, women's rights, infidelity, treason.... let it all come out with the gloves off.

We all know that they've been digging into McCain's background since he became the Repub nominee, and this way he can cut McCain down and still kinda look like the good guy.

The best part is, by using the ultimatum, it becomes McCain's decision for the negativity to start from Obama.

What do you think?
BD in WI (Sent Wednesday, August 20, 2008 9:36 AM)

I think it is a good idea although I too did want BO to continue on the clean side. But, we are trying to get this country back on the right path and it can't be done if we don't win so I say what is good for the gander is good for the goose.

Let ur rip...

You have to play fire with fire Barack decided to run a positive camp until McBush showed his true colors. The real McBush is out it was a matter of time. It's about time Barack!!with the way things are going in this country, we do not need another McBush in the White House. Bush did not have experience when he went in the White House nor did many presidents before and the results now speak for themselves. l can say if Barack can run a very well organized camp that says alot what he can do we need change.

I believe it's crunch time for Obama, now, not later. I support Obama as the Presumtive Democratic Nominee, but I'm so tired of seeing him fail at debates or anything where he's not allowed to hold an audience captive.  Obama's people and in particular his wife, need to push him to get debate lessons or something like it.  His stutter and hesitancy when he answers questions tells me he's being too careful not to say the wrong thing.  It's painful to watch.  Well the heck with that Obama, quit holding back, you are attacked no matter what you say or how you say it, go for it, make us proud.  As it is I cringe when I hear the word "debate", knowing you will get creamed.  You said you will stand up for us Americans, well this is what I want you to do.  You're making us all look bad for supporting you.  Swallow your pride, accept that you're not always right, that you could use some self improvement and take my advice, because I know there are many more of your supporters who feel as I do.  I don't want to lose hope, to think I've made a mistake but you have to do your part as well or you will lose in November.  Fight back and fight hard, act like you want a better Country for us Americans as you continue to tell us!  I don't see you doing that right now, but it needs to happen.  Don't make me regret the time and money I've invested in you.  

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