ABOUT FIRST READ

First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



First thoughts: Obama vs. Cheney

Posted: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 9:28 AM by Mark Murray
Filed Under:

From Chuck Todd, Mark Murray, and Abby Livingston

*** Obama vs. Cheney: In the past week, a series of thorny national security issues -- all dating back to the Bush era -- has clearly frustrated Team Obama. First, the president angered liberals and human-rights groups when it announced it was opposing the release of those detainee photos. Then his administration said it was keeping the controversial military tribunals, although with some revisions. And now congressional Democrats have rejected Obama’s funding request to help close Guantanamo Bay. These things all set up Obama’s big speech tomorrow on Gitmo and national security. But get ready for a fascinating national security showdown tomorrow, because Obama isn’t the only one speaking on Thursday. Dick Cheney gives a speech tomorrow -- about an hour or so before Obama’s -- at the American Enterprise Institute, a neoconservative think tank. No doubt Cheney will try and respond to the criticisms the Obama administration and other Democrats have been leveling at the former vice president and other Republicans. Of course, Obama's speech comes with a lot of expectations. Many in Washington are already expecting him to somehow calm the critics down on both the left and right with a speech that 1) makes a clearer case why his administration doesn't want to look backwards on interrogations; 2) why Gitmo has to be closed; and 3) and where the Gitmo detainees should be moved. 

*** Just askin’: By the way, we have this one question for the GOP straw-man argument on Gitmo: So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists? Discuss.

*** How to win friends and influence enemies: One thing supporters of the White House are pointing out this week is that, despite the rhetoric from some opponents, the president has had a remarkable early track record at getting long-time opponents to negotiate with each other and with the White House. The examples: yesterday’s emissions announcement (where industry and labor groups stood besides the president), health care (industry folks pledging to reduce health-care costs), and even financial regulation. Obama supporters point out that leading business leaders have showed a willingness to work with the White House, and he's used that to his advantage by getting major compromises early on. Can he keep this up?

Video: Surrounded by leaders from the auto industry, President Barack Obama announces a national energy policy that is designed to boost car and truck mileage, while decreasing fuel consumption and emissions.

*** Steele’s combative speech: Talk to those close to the RNC chair, and they'll tell you the most important takeaway from his speech to GOP state chairs yesterday was the following: The party plans to more directly confront Obama. As inviting a target as other Democrats may be (see Pelosi), Steele made the case the party won't make progress without starting to inflict political damage on the actual leader of the Democratic -- er, “Democrat-Socialist” -- Party: Barack Obama. “We aren’t going to be silent,” he said. “We are going to speak up, and we are going to show that we have the courage of our convictions.” But for those looking for something substantial, issue-wise, Steele's speech was lacking. It had one too many clichés, and didn't seem to get into exactly what the Republican Party stands for. But remember who Steele’s audience was yesterday: members of the RNC. And the chairman is still trying to win over the trust of these folks. So he needed to throw them some red meat and didn't need to get into the weeds. Steele's goal yesterday was assert himself as leader of the party, and he probably took a step forward with these party insiders. Still, it raises an interesting question for all Republican leaders: Just what does the party stand for? It seemed to be a struggle for Steele yesterday.

*** Move along, folks, nothing to see here: Also in his speech yesterday, Steele boldly declared that the Republican Party has turned the corner. “The time for trying to fix or focus on the past has ended…The introspection is now over. The corner has been turned.” But when Steele and other Republicans cite spending and the ways of Washington as the only reasons why they find themselves out of power and at all-time lows in polls, we're not so sure they've learned the lessons from 2006 and 2008 -- which also included Iraq, Hurricane Katrina, the U.S. attorneys scandal, Harriet Miers, and Terri Schiavo. What do those things have in common? Ideology and favoritism trumped competence and governance; confrontation was more important than compromise. And Republican leaders often stood by and didn’t raise objections. To win elections, you have to win the middle, and right now the middle is breaking Obama’s way, with Arlen Specter joining the Democrats and Jon Huntsman about to work for the administration. One other thing: As Adam Nagourney recently wrote, tone matters in politics. Are RNC members really going to pass a resolution today calling the Democratic Party the “Democrat-Socialist Party”? We’ll find out, although the meeting isn’t supposed to be begin until 5:00 pm ET.

Video: Speaking at a party meeting, RNC Chairman Michael Steele says "the two-party system is making a comeback'" and he intends to make Democrats live up to their "arrogance of power."

*** Pelosi’s job is safe for now: As we noted yesterday, Democrats began rallying around embattled House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. At yesterday’s White House event on his new fuel standards, Obama went out of his way to praise her. And in his pen and pad session, Pelosi’s No. 2, Steny Hoyer, said he believed her in her dispute with the CIA. Still, Republicans are smelling political blood, with former Speaker Newt Gingrich (who knows a thing or two about pushing speakers out of office -- see Jim Wright and himself) writing in Human Events, “The person who is No. 2 in line to be commander in chief can't have contempt for the men and women who protect our nation. America can't afford it.” But let’s get one thing straight: Pelosi isn't in danger of losing her job -- yet. Gingrich stepped down after a poor GOP showing during the 1998 midterms, as well as receiving an ethics reprimand. And Trent Lott, after his remarks about Strom Thurmond, was expendable for a Bush White House that didn’t trust him. Pelosi doesn't have those problems. In fact, the White House likes her because she takes so many arrows for Obama. But has her margin of error with DC Democrats been slightly eroded? How much does she need to watch herself, for instance, on the John Murtha story and make sure she doesn't get dragged into that?

*** The Terminated: As expected, the budget ballot measures that California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger championed went down to defeat yesterday. The only ballot proposition that voters passed was a measure freezing state officials’ salaries when California faces a budget deficit. Schwarzenegger -- who remains in DC and has a media avail with HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius today at 10:45 am ET -- released this statement last night: “We face a staggering $21.3 billion deficit and in order to prevent a fiscal disaster, Democrats and Republicans must collaborate and work together to address this shortfall. The longer we wait the worse the problem becomes and the more limited our choices will be. That is why tomorrow, we will come together to begin to develop a budget solution that gets our state back on track.”  Everything the governor seriously campaigned for went down. With this election now behind him, it's now the second serious attempt at government reform Arnold's attempted that's failed. Is the Arnold experiment now essentially over? Does he have ANY political capital left to attempt anything for the remainder of his term, or is he a lame duck governor thanks to the startup already of the 2010 campaign in that state?

*** Meet Carlos Moreno: Our latest SCOTUS profile is for Carlos Moreno, who currently sits on the California Supreme Court… Pros for Obama: Moreno is Latino, and Latino groups are pressing Obama to select the first Latino Supreme Court justice… Cons: He’s male, and the court is stacked with men with Justice Ginsburg now the only sitting woman. He’s also 60 years old, which might concern some liberals about how long he would be able to serve on the court… The New York Times today breaks down his ideology: “A moderate whose opinions deftly blend matters of the head and heart, he is admired on the political left and right — part of the reason Kenneth W. Starr, the former independent counsel who investigated President Bill Clinton and is now the dean of Pepperdine University School of Law, said ‘he is genuinely revered here in California.’ … Before joining the California Supreme Court, served as a federal district judge (appointed by Bill Clinton)… Also served on the Los Angeles Superior Court and the Compton Municipal Court… Received his law degree from Stanford (1975) and his undergraduate degree from Yale (1970).

Countdown to NJ GOP primary: 13 days
Countdown to VA Dem primary: 20 days
Countdown to Election Day 2009: 167 days
Countdown to Election Day 2010: 531 days

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Comments

It appears there are some conflicting poll numbers out there regarding Pro-Choice vs. Pro-Life!  This ought to get the uptight right wing whack jobs worked up into a tizzy today!  

Let the high & mighty gibberish begin in 3…2…1….

Same chatter…. Different day!  I’m always amazed that they feel they have a right to tell a woman what she can or can’t do with her own body – but are the first ones to deny rights to these children once they’re born! Better yet why not adopt or foster a few?  Put up or shut up!  My absolute favorite are the fat old white guys screeching about the sacredness of unborn – know what fat a@@  when you can get pregnant than you can have a seat at the table!

Ironic thing is… us on the ‘left’ aren’t trying to take away your rights to have 10 – 12 -16 kids… spawn as many as you want…. I could care less!  

However you don’t have the RIGHT to force your beliefs on to people that are able to form an independent thought!  That’s why it’s called choice!  

And BTW it’s LEGAL!  

So it’s looks like it’s going to be another bad day for the whack jobs!  Boo HOO!
Obama vs. Cheney?

Cheney, hands down.

Obie is too much of a sensitive loser to survive "Darth Cheney.
Pelosi The Liar has nothing to worry about.

Obama The Dictator will bail her out.

Damn, another bailout.
The grandstanding that is currently taking place on the issue of closing Guantanamo Bay is just ridiculous.

For the Democratic members of Congress to buy into the FALSE notion that everyone imprisoned at Guantanamo Bay is a terrorist because we say so is just another case of political pandering  to the very worst instincts in us all.

I will not even get into the legalities of the issues at hand.

Let’s just use basic, garden variety common sense.

Under what scenario can you make a RATIONAL argument for imprisoning someone indefinitely with no trial, and in many cases ZERO evidence against them?

So much for do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

But you know what is even more ridiculous than that?

The concept that if any of these folks step foot on American soil, we will all instantly be “unsafe”.  It’s ridiculous.

Is America really so fragile and pure that we cannot do anything to clean up the mess that we made?

Why should other countries take on any prisoners if we are so very TERRIFED to do so ourselves?

We live in one of the most crime ridden nations on earth, and yet we pretend like these people are some type of criminal masterminds that we have to fear more than all the other serial killers, delusional militias, and various other unstable people who freely walk our streets every day.

I heard Senator Richard Shelby say on Morning Joe-ke how very nice the facility at Guantanamo Bay was and how the people imprisioned there aren’t “like us”.

What is that supposed to mean? So now justice is only for folks “like us”?

So American citizens being imprisoned around the world can be held indefinetly too?

Why have laws or morals at all, since we just discard them when they become uncomfortable.
You have to remember that Obama started this p*ssing match when he continually blamed everything on the previous administration. Bush as the class and dignity not to be the one to speak out against a new president. Cheney is not so kind though. Cheney is the perfect one to talk back to Obama's lies. Cheney's rhetoric has already got the Speaker of the House on verge of resigning. Cheney also brought up what Obama is doing in trying to close Gitmo, and we see the result, even the Democrats in Obama's own party agree with Cheney.

Cheney may not be popular, but he is right. Which is more then anyone can say about Obama.
By the way, we have this one question for the GOP straw-man argument on Gitmo: So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists? Discuss.

Short answer YES.
Cheney, hands down

Well, yeah for the 12% of the voting population that still fall for the kind of crap this guy sells. Tell me honestly, in all his eight years as VP, how many of his predictions/assertions, from the budget to Iraq, was even close to reality?
A few weeks ago I commented that the two big stories to follow are: 1) torture authorized by the Bush administration and 2) the evolution of the Republican Party.  

By focusing on Nancy Pelosi, John Boehner and company are simply trying to keep the spotlight off Bush/Cheney.  What is fascinating to me is that almost all FR bloggers have never met Nancy Pelosi, never met Leon Panetta, never been to the CIA, are clueless about how the CIA informs Congress, yet have strong opinions regarding who is telling the truth. A small amount of research shows that we will never, never know what really happened.  I expect Panetta to support his agency, but he was not there during the Bush administration, so he wouldn’t know the accuracy of the reports.  The Republicans did a good job deflecting the real story of who authorized torture. But this ploy will only last for a few weeks.  Nancy Pelosi’s position is safe now and for years to come.

I’m beginning to think that most Republicans don’t believe in evolution, but their party is certainly going to evolve.  First guess is that it will cross-breed with the Libertarians.  When that doesn’t work, then they will move to the center.

All corporations of any significance have a strong leader.  It’s the nature of the beast.  There is no real leadership in the GOP. There just isn’t.  Steele is only a side-show at the circus.  Bunning predicts that the Senate will lose 4 more seats in 2010.  I predict only 3, which will give the GOP 37 seats.  The House will remain about the same.  Romney will likely get the nod in 2012, but he will be strongly defeated.  It will be sometime after 2012 that some young person, in their late 30’s, will emerge to put humpty-dumpty back together again. In the meantime, it will be a party of old, white-haired men.

Just Askin:  Great question: It is a Republican straw man! The real issue is the safety of the terrorist in Federal prisons.  Terrorists could easily be put in Federal prisons.  
Just Askin: Why not put them in Alcatraz?  Nancy shouldn’t mind.
So glad that Morning Joe-ke finally address the issue of former Governor Eliot Sptizer coming on their program with all his preachy, semi-true rhetoric.

Bravo to Mika for FINALLY standing up and saying what she REALLY thinks for a change, instead of just providing amens for Joe as ususal.

The truth is, Spitzer should either be serving as Governer of New York, where he could have used all his knowledge to help his constituents, or he shoud be serving some time in prison for breaking the laws on prostitution.

Given the fact that he is doing neither, he could stand to mix in a little more humility and actual facts with his opinions, if we are forced to listen to them at all.
Californa can now float out to sea for all anyone east of that state cares. Those whiny citizens of that state finally had economic reality hit them square between their beady little eyes. You can't keep voting for additional programs run by the state and not pay for them. California ran out of "rich" people to tax for these programs, and now they face a $41B deficit. California and it's political leaders are doing exactly what Obama is trying to do for the rest of the country, spend money it doesn't have and rack up huge deficits. What's happending in California will be happening for the rest of the country in a couple of years.

Thanks Arnie and Barack. Thanks for bankruping your state and the country.
Despite the media's fascination with him, Dick Cheney is sooooooo two thousand and late it's not even funny.

He's not even worth refuting anymore.

Some day, he will accept the fact that he isn't President anymore.

P.S. Has anybody thought of anything at all the Dick Cheney has done for the United States of America yet? I'm still drawing a blank.
I like Steele's lets not look back and all I keep seeing is Cheney, Cheney, Cheney.

Nice look foward.  Everything old is new again.

I was reading "40 more years and was suprised to find out that there are nationally more abotions under republican administrations than under democratic ones.

I think the R's can keep purifying thier party with wedge issues.  Forget "Big Tent" and Purify, purify, purify.  All the way down to 35 in the Senate by 2010.
Schwarzenegger might be terminated, but another politician is getting a big relief: Kirsten Gillibrand's road to winning a full term is getting constantly easier as Chuck Schumer and Barack Obama's pressure have gotten a second candidate out of the race, Scott Stringer (the Manhattan Borough President. Details: http://campaigndiaries.com/2009/05/19/stringer-out-in-ny/ )
FR: "Just askin’: By the way, we have this one question for the GOP straw-man argument on Gitmo: So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists? Discuss."
------------------------------------------

A town in a wester state -- Montana, I think -- said they would be happy to take the Gitmo detainees in the local prison because the added jobs for prison guards would be good for their ailing economic situation. That kind of shoots down the Republicans' argument that nobody wants to take the prisoners.

Unfortunately, the Repubs are trying to mislead the public into thinking that President Obama plans to just release "terrorists" so they can run amok in people's neighborhoods. I doubt very many people are dumb enough to believe that, with the exception of the Repubs' wingnut base, of course.
First Read: "One thing supporters of the White House are pointing out this week is that, despite the rhetoric from some opponents, the president has had a remarkable early track record at getting long-time opponents to negotiate with each other and with the White House. The examples: yesterday’s emissions announcement (where industry and labor groups stood besides the president),"


Hate to burst your little love bubble you got going with the "Young President", but the government now owns that very companies that got together with the president yesterday. And if the execs of those companies didn't agree with their lord and master, Barack Obama, then they'd be finding themselves looking for a job today. And if reports are correct, the very labor groups that were in Washington yesterday will get a majority share of GM when it is sold to the government after going bankrupt, so you know they won't say one negative word when they're getting the company for free.
Cheney is a trouble maker, and a disgrace to our civilized country. [he is one of those people who would be enormously improved by death.]-Quote H.H. Munro (Saki) (1870-1916).
Nashville_fan  - P.S. Has anybody thought of anything at all the Dick Cheney has done for the United States of America yet?

Protect it from terrorist attacks.


Nashville_fan - I'm still drawing a blank.

I imagine that happens a lot for you.
All this optomistic talk from Steele is just him trying to make us believe something that is far from happening. If I had to wager who would lose their jobs first, Pelosi or Steele, the Speaker wins hands down. The honeymoon is over for Steele and is shaking in his boots.

Cheney v. Obama? Cheney is a thug and a war criminal. The sooner a non-partisan committee can be appointed, and report the facts of how the Cheney Administration tortured, the sooner they can be jailed. All this he said/she said junk is tiresome and the public is fed up with it.
*** Just askin’: By the way, we have this one question for the GOP straw-man argument on Gitmo: So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists? Discuss."

Oh I don't know. Do rapist and murders have an organization willing to commit acts of terrorism to spring them from prison? I mean other than the democrat party and the New York media? Put them in Manhattan. Most of the terrorist and thieves in this country are already there.
Frankly, I don't buy the argument "not in my backyard" when it comes to housing terrorists.  Give me a break!  The US prison system houses thousands of serial killers, pedaphiles, etc. As for my own "backyard" I live by a maximum security federal prison, a maximum security state prison, a minimum security state prison, a state jail, and a juvenile facility all adjacent to one another.  My daughter's sorority is one block from the Hunstville prison where death row convicts are executed. Four members of my family work for the Department of Corrections and I don't have a problem with them dealing with a terrorist in addition to the other inmates. I sleep just fine at night and will continue to do so.  Some of you out there need to get a grip.
Obama vs. Cheney?

Fortunate Son (Sent Wednesday, May 20, 2009 9:36 AM)

Cheney, hands down.

Obie is too much of a sensitive loser to survive "Darth Cheney.
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>>
Fortunate Son;
It's unfortunate that are not aware that the slime ball Cheney has a 19% poll rating.

Also yesterday the hypocrite Micheal Steele admitted it was the GOPher's intention to go after Nancy Pelosi. The rats always come out when the light is shone on them.

The CIA lies all the time and so do the GOPers. Remember Nicaragua and Ollie North?


Pelosi will be fine, she'll lay low and continue to push for a truth commission, which I think will help at this point. Her margin of error has narrowed in the short term but as long as the general public doesn't care about who she is or what she does she's fine. And my suggestion to Obama, sometimes you have to throw a few grenades. Democrats failed to send a clear message about Gitmo. Nobody was paying attention to the GOP strawman arguement..it seems like Democrats are so fearful of the GOP gaining any resemblance of traction that they fold on all but the simplest proposals. Harry Reid is good at avoiding fights, but if he is so concerned about his re-election he should step down and allow a Dem with some backbone to push these proposals through. He was good enough to navigate through the former GOP run congress but times have changed.
Excuse me while I don't shed a tear for California's financial mess. First, they got what they deserved by electing another unqualified actor as their governor. And second, the eventual tax hikes that will happen there coupled with massive cuts in services, is just desserts for that state which voted to strip gays of their right to marry via Prop 8.  Who knows...perhaps they could've lessened their financial problems if they let gays marry there, via all the revenue generated from marriage license fees and taxes from a new gay wedding industry.  
The only way to shut the Meglomaniac up is try him for violating countless laws ie., outing a CIA agent by using the same torture techniques at GITMO that they lied about for years. It looks like Fortunate son has taken over the mantal of lead cheerleader kool-aid drinker for sleazy war mongers chicken hawks who found numerous excuses not to fight for this country when their number came up 40 years ago.  
Oh the Republicans have turned a corner alright,...

Into ONCOMING traffic.  They aren't bright enough to take Obama head on.  He has remained at least a few miles ahead for the entirety of his public life against them.  Good thing they aren't looking back any longer....Reagan...not living in the past...Reagan

What a pile of steaming hot hypocrisy.  They really are that out of touch.  PS.  Joe Scarborough is a walking disaster, when he's not sitting on his butt creating nontroversies.  Whatever, Joe, I've got my cheetohs and I'm ready to take you on, you HACK.
I wonder what lies Coward Cheney will spew tomorrow at the unamerican enterprise institute, a neonazi stinktank?  Coward Cheney is afraid his legacy will be tarnished but then he only has himself to blame for screwing everything up on his terror campaign against our secualr democracy.  He's only interested in himself and has no care for anything else.

Wasn't it funny hearing from Keith Olbermann last night what a coward War Criminal Cheney was?  Yeah the 5-time college deferment draft dodger carried around a gas mask and chemical suit because he was afraid of an anthrax attack.  No wonder he had a reinforced bunker in the Naval Observatory so he could stay home and hide behind his wife's skirt.  Him and Coward Bush were intimidated by the 9/11 attacks yet they told us not to be intimidated, remember how Coward Bush flew from bunker to bunker like the coward he is instead of showing he wasn't intimidated by going straight back to DC or even NY on 9/11.

Good Just Asking question First Read, how can we be afraid of muslim terrorists in our prison population considering our own criminal crowd already in our prisons?  I'd love to pit them terrorists aginst our prison population and see how long they last, I'd say not long for sure.  Come on little limprwristed conservative crybabies stop being such fraidy cats about hosting the terrorists amongst our prison population, we have badder bad boys than anywhere on earth in our prisons so let's give them an MSNBC tv reality show called "Lockup: Terrorists"!

Prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney!
Go Lakers!
It simply amazes me that the Republican party which put us in this mess, economically, and with a false war, torture, and numerous deregulation, and they continue to say no and obstruct, believe they can just say we apologized enough and now we're done. They still have not signed on or come up with any solutions. They will continue to spiral downward with this line of thinking. They continue to lie, cheat, and steal. When they seriously move away from these nut jobs they can have  a chance to revive and until then the media needs to stop covering them. One clear example is there undying dedication to creationism over science. I am a religious individual but also retional enough to know that the bible was not written by God, but hundreds of years later by men. It is not hard to have a belief in God and realize that the adam and eve synopsis was a story made up by men. I am happy to see most Americans 53% now associate with the rationale party or Democrats. President Obama is definitely moving the tone to a better place.
Pelosi is taking center stage, but right by he side is that nitwit Harry Reid. The man belongs in a home, not as the leader of the Senate. Reid said Ted Kennedy was in remission yesterday. There is no cure nor no remission for what Ted has. Who does Harry's recon for him to make such a statement? Then Harry gets it totally wrong about the Gitmo terrorists saying "No one wants the terrorists released in the US". No one is talking about releasing any terrorists in the US Harry.

The country is being run by idiots.
"...These things all set up Obama’s big speech tomorrow on Gitmo and national security. ..." FIRST READ

LOL...Barrack Obama wouldn't know what "national security" was if it jumped up and bit him on his 'keester'!

"...*** Just askin’: By the way, we have this one question for the GOP straw-man argument on Gitmo: So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists? Discuss. ....." FIRST READ

LOLOLOLOLOL....could you have POSSIBLY posted anything DUMBER than that?
That is the single most stupid thing I have EVER seen on this website!

".....*** How to win friends and influence enemies: One thing supporters of the White House are pointing out this week is that, despite the rhetoric from some opponents, the president has had a remarkable early track record at getting long-time opponents to negotiate with each other and with the White House. ....." FIRST READ

There you go again! Giving praise to Obama for something he hasn't done! The man has done NOTTA' since he took office...except TALK. But you make it sound like he's resolved the national debt, captured Osama Bin Laden, and achieved sainthood for curing cancer. If it's too early to criticize him, or blame him for anything...then it is likewise too early to give him credit for anything....especially since he has done NOTHING besides talk!

".....Are RNC members really going to pass a resolution today calling the Democratic Party the “Democrat-Socialist Party”? We’ll find out, ....." FIRST READ

(shaking my head).....The GOP is determined to make itself look more idiotic with each day that passes. This would-be the most assinine thing they have done since nominating Bob Dole to run against Bill Clinton in '96'.

".....*** Pelosi’s job is safe for now:....." FIRST READ

I just dunno' about Pelosi. We'll have to see where this whole thing leads us. STAY TUNED FOLKS!

....OH, and one last thing here: AAAAHHHHHHHHNNNNNOLD is a freaking musclebound JERK. (Just thought I'd add that since you mentioned him in your "First Thoughts")

Have a nice day everyone.....it's FLEET WEEK here in NY starting today. Thank a veteran or an active duty service-person if you happen to see one pass by the next few days!

shoot you in the face cheney will say something in the heat of the moment that will cook his goose.  Let him spew as much as he wants because he is running scared and is trying the old mantra of beating the drums of "if you aint with me you're against me" Him and his tea drinking limpbag lover are scared of their own fortunes period!  Face the fact cheney and limpbag are for one thing and one thing only their own well being and no one elses.  If you think they truly care about this country----you are absolutely fooling yourself period.  The facts about these 2 speak for themselves!!!!!!!Can I get a Haliburton or KBR and then can I have oxycoton and any other prescription druug that any other doctor willing to give me while I call others drug addicts who should be locked up!
As for the Gitmo issue...what kind of country imprisons people suspected of a crime with little to know evidence, indefinately without trying them?  The names that come to mind include Iran, North Korea, Iraq under Saddam, Afghanistan under Taliban, the old Soviet Union, oh, and wait, the United States.  
Cjake --> Pelosi will be fine, she'll lay low and continue to push for a truth commission,

Hopefully Nancy will be the first witness. I hear she's going to wag her finger at us through the entire cross examination. Can't wait to see that.
Short answer YES.

What_you_Selling (Sent Wednesday, May 20, 2009 9:42 AM)
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
That is not a disscussion. Again NO solution, NO alternative, NO new ideas.

Just say NO!
What joy! What rapture!  As a Democrat, my favorite political hack of the moment is Steele.  I love him!  long may he reign over the Republican Party. No person in America is contributing more to the unravelling of his party than he is. Then again, the Republicans should be numbed into submission at this point.  They have been lead by incoherent ignorami for many years now...

And just a thought, why not change the name of the Republican Party?  How about some of our readers come up with some new names?  

How about "The Torture Party", or "Hannitarians"
----Hey Feisty (filthy)
I saw that you gave me a shout out yesterday. I’m sorry my comments are still bothering you all these days later. I’ll be sure to tone down the criticism next time. And attacking my grammar, are you serious? Is that really the best you could come up with? Rather weak and pathedic, don’t you think? Since you assume yourself so intelligent (I’m not convinced) then maybe you can answer for Anita. Otherwise, maybe you should just STFU and continue posting your piss ant little rants that get you and the other liberals off.
Cheney is the perfect one to talk back to Obama's lies. Cheney's rhetoric has already got the Speaker of the House on verge of resigning. Stan Garrett, Atlanta (Sent Wednesday, May 20, 2009 9:40 AM)

You really are deeply into revisionist history, aren't you? What has the President lied about, please tell. Cheney lied to all of us with his WMD myth, he lied to Colin Powell so that Mr. Powell can add some credibility to the sham they were cooking up, he lied about being greeted as liberators and the list goes on.

Nancy Pelosi is certainly not on the verge of resigning but you seem to be on the verge of losing your grip on reality.
Bev in Chicago: It's unfortunate that are not aware that the slime ball Cheney has a 19% poll rating.

Stick your ratings where the sun doesn't shine. What, is this some kind of high school thing with you people? Being popular has no bearing on whether you're right or not. Obama is popular - Cheney is right.
Just answerin':

Duh... as long as they're not muslims.
I thought Gingrich held out an olive branch, suggesting that no waterboarding be used on Pelosi when she is further interrogated as to when she learned about advanced interrogating techniques at Gitmo.
And second, the eventual [California] tax hikes that will happen there coupled with massive cuts in services, is just desserts for that state which voted to strip gays of their right to marry via Prop 8. - pat huntington ny

Is God punishing them pat?
The President shouldn't lower himself to that gutless and sleeze level of the "Dick"...put the torture issue outside the dignity of American politics...
The "Dick" will get all free press somewhere else...
OK?

And Gov.S...you just don't listen to the people anymore. and that's a downside look into your future...so they have spoken..do you hear us now?
Ha Ha Arnold's Nightmare Propositions got terminated, well 5 out of 6.  Only 1F, the most despicable of all, passed.  No wonder Arnold went to Washington DC to hide behind President Obama.  Just goes to show how wrong it was to recall Gray Davis and put in a tinseltown flake like Arnold as our governor.  He's been a one man economic girlie man wrecking crew destroying our state's budget and economy.

While Carlos Moreno sounds like a good choice he's the wrong sex.  We need another woman on our court, hopefully a Latino like Sonia Sotomayor.  As long as his choice is a liberal one it will be good to see the dopes of nope whine baby whine in impotence.

Looks like the republic facist party can't get her done when it comes to ousting Nancy Pelosi.  I'm so loving the great job she's doing cramming good legislation down their throats.  Plus she's tricking them into investigating torture just so they can investigate her.  I'm glad that Democrats in the House are standing behind her to show the evil elephants that she won't be going anywhere soon.  I love her being their worst nightmare!

In Pelosi We Trust!
Terminate Arnold's Reign of Terror!
Go Lakers!
Beverly in Chicago:

So nice to read your voice again. Sounds like you're
a little hoarse today. Hope you get back to your own self and feel better soon.
It is hard to remain non-partisan when so many people speak or write without any reference to actual fact.  Pres. Obama has not bankrupted this country.  That was done during the administration of George W. Bush, who inherited a budget surplus and then started the war in Iraq while cutting taxes.  If Sen. McCain had won the presidency, would people say that Sen. McCain was bankrupting the country?  Citizens who don't pay taxes or who refuse to pay more taxes to support things they want (be it war or medicare) are also bankrupting the country.  
So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists?
--------------------------------------------------

NIMBY

(kidding) Compared to keeping our own 'Abu Gharib' open as a reason for young, impoverished, and oppressed kids to join a terroist group, I think it is far better to disperse these guys amongst the American prison system. Besides, if I were a terrorist, I could think of nothing more frightening than being released into the general population of the American prison system. Even American prisoners are likely to have been offended by 9/11.
My hope is that the Government will take up Jesse the Body and let him water board Cheney,and Hannity since that big mouth said he would be boarded.Since it does no harm Dead eye should have no Problem,MR.Patriot.Maybe they could do group boardings,Bush,Rice,Rummy,Dead eye,Wolfie,all could give it a shot.Cheney goes before a ultra conservative think tank,all I can see are the gold fish swimming by them.We already saw how the tin man had to put on his act of Mr.Tough guy.Man just don't get it,being played by a bunch of folks that would not lift a finger to help a black man,or a brown man,or a Red,Or Yellow,or a woman,or a gay person,or a single mother,or a unemployed person.man has no back bone.
Nashville_fan  - P.S. Has anybody thought of anything at all the Dick Cheney has done for the United States of America yet?

Protect it from terrorist attacks.


Nashville_fan - I'm still drawing a blank.

I imagine that happens a lot for you.

SK Bettors, Sarasota FL
===============================================
Everytime I ask this question, I get the exact same answer.

What specifically has Dick Cheney done to protect America from attack? I need a policy he authored, an idea he championed, something that he spearheaded that turned out right.

P.S. You are right, I draw alot of blanks . . . your answer is a perfect example.
I don't see the nonfunding for closing Gitmo as a defeat for Pres Obama.  The democrats who objected to the blank check funding are doing their job.  We just had a president who was given blank checks for two wars.  I am glad they are asking to see the plan first, then the funding.

Carlos Moreno sounds like a qualified candidate.  I'm not focused on woman vs man but more on qualifications.    

As far as Cheney and his speech--neoconservative think tank says it all.  Even Pat Buchanan wrote about how the neoconservatives destroyed the republican party.  They push for war and even today, their answer to every international problem seems to be "bomb them".  

Found it laughable that Steele would say the GOP is done apologizing for the past.  When did they apologize?  I must have missed it.  As for them renaming the Democratic Party to the democrat socialist party; maybe democrats can be as childish and rename the GOP.  I'm sure posters here can suggest some good alternatives.

Finally, FR, someone pointed out how silly it is to think we can't find maximum security prisons to house terrorists.  I've never been able to get my head around the idea that we secure serial killers, murderers, rapists, child molesters yet we can't keep Americans safe from a terrorist in a prison.  According to Rachel Maddow, there's a maximum security prison in Hardin, Montana that says they will be happy to take 100 terrorist prisoners.  It's good for the economy in their town.  Now that's using some economic common sense instead of fear.  As far as this nonsense about releasing them to live in this country, it's just nonsense and more fear tactics.  They would be deported to their own country BEFORE they would ever be released in the U.S.  I liked what Jack Rice said on Countdown that the GOP always wraps everything in an American flag with a pin on it that says National Security; everyone who opposes their ideas is unpatriotic, unamerican, and we should be afraid.  Sums it up exactly.
To those who are hung up on 19%.

What part of "Cheney Hands Down" don't you understand? Obama's a loon and still involved with ACORN.

No integrity here.
"Just askin’: By the way, we have this one question for the GOP straw-man argument on Gitmo: So is living near a prison with CONVICTED rapists or murderers safer than living next to a prison with SUSPECTED terrorists? Discuss."

Does the GOP think we're stupid?  Why do they trot out these juvenile arguments?

It doesn't matter the type of offender who is in the prison, it matters how secure the prison is.  Why can't they be placed in our most secure facilities?  Even beef up security if the surrounding community demands it.

There haven't been any attempts to storm Guantanamo by extremists to break their compatriots out of jail in all these years, do you really think they would storm a US prison to try and break someone out?


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