ABOUT FIRST READ

First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



First thoughts: Referendum on Obama?

Posted: Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:18 AM by Mark Murray
Filed Under:

From Chuck Todd, Mark Murray, Domenico Montanaro, and Ali Weinberg
*** A referendum on Obama? Deep down, a political reporter’s first instinct is to nationalize off-year and special elections. Why? It’s the best way to try to make sense -- at least initially -- of a handful of races across the country. It’s also the best way to sell a local race’s importance to editors and producers. We all do it. So it shouldn’t be surprising that almost everyone is nationalizing today’s gubernatorial contests in New Jersey and Virginia, and even the NY-23 special congressional election. And the chief question they’re asking is: Are they referendums on President Obama’s first year in office? Yesterday, the New York Times wrote that the New Jersey race was “one of several [contests] likely to be viewed as a barometer of the president’s popularity.” And here was the AP: “A Corzine loss would be seen as a political embarrassment for the White House.” 

*** Remember that candidates matter: If Democrats lose in New Jersey and Virginia, that certainly would be a shot in the arm for a Republican Party that hasn’t fared well in the in the past two election cycles (losing control of Congress and the White House). That outcome also could give Democrats pause that the voter coalition that propelled Obama to victory last year (liberals, young voters, minorities, independents) appears dormant or is no longer intact. But is that a referendum on Obama? Not so much. For starters, how much does Creigh Deeds losing in Virginia say about Obama, when the president’s approval rating in the state is at 57% among registered voters and 54% among likely voters, according to the most recent Washington Post poll? And if Jon Corzine’s favorable rating in the Quinnipiac poll was at 38% back in March (near the height of Obama’s honeymoon), and it’s at 39% now, how does that say much about Obama and his popularity/presidency? Likewise, if Democrats are able to split the races by winning in New Jersey or even pull off the upset in Virginia, does that mean Obama’s presidency is on easy street? Absolutely not. In short, these races say much more about Deeds/McDonnell or Corzine/Christie than they do about Obama.

*** But issues matter, too: By the way, even Republican Governors Association Chair Haley Barbour said today's races are NOT a referendum on the president. But Barbour argued that the policy climate they've set is on the ballot today. Evan Tracey, the campaign TV ad analyst for CMAG, points out that in just the D.C. market (read: Northern Virginia voters), more than $10 million in TV ads have run this year on various issues the president and his party are pushing. Did it set up a climate in Northern Virginia of government doing too much opening the door a tad more for McDonnell?

*** Bellwethers for 2010? Here’s another question people are asking about today’s contests: What do they say about the 2010 midterms? Again, it’s hard to say. As we pointed out last week, Democrats won both the NJ and VA races in 2005 -- right after Hurricane Katrina -- which was an early sign of their success in 2006 (when they took back control of Congress) and in 2008 (when they won the White House). Yet in 2001 -- right after the 9/11 terrorist attacks -- Democrats also won the NJ and VA contests. But a year later, Republicans picked up seats in the House and Senate, and George W. Bush won re-election in 2004. Here’s one other bit of history that’s hard to dismiss: Since 1977 (so the past eight elections), the party that controls the White House has lost the Virginia gubernatorial contest. And since 1989 (the past five elections), the party controlling the White House has lost New Jersey.

*** Lessons learned: Still, these contests do tell a national story. But here’s the thing: The lessons are already known, no matter the outcomes. Win or lose, Corzine won't get 50%, meaning more than half of the state voted to oust him in a very blue state. We know that the Republican Party has to deal with both an ideological and an establishment-vs.-grassroots rift. We know that not being associated with either political party is a net plus with many voters -- from Michael Bloomberg's expected victory, to Chris Daggett's influence in New Jersey, to Doug Hoffman's rise in NY-23. And we know that the president's coattails have gotten shorter. As one of us wrote, “So it isn't about whether or not Tuesday's elections matter. Tuesday is about which party learns the messages voters are sending. And which party over-interprets or under-interprets those messages.”

*** Other races to watch: Besides the NJ/VA/NY-23 contests, Maine is voting on a ballot initiative whether to overturn the state’s law allowing same-sex marriage, and the outcome could go either way. Also, New York City, Boston, and at least a dozen more big cities are holding mayoral elections. Polls close in Virginia at 7:00 pm ET; in Maine, New Jersey, and Boston at 8:00 pm; and in New York at 9:00 pm. One final thought here: What should the House GOP leadership (read: Pete Sessions) worry about more -- a Hoffman loss in NY-23 or a Garamendi (D) victory by less than five points in CA-10? Folks, the special election in blue CA-10, which Ellen Tauscher represented before heading to the Obama State Department, might be closer than many people expected a week ago….

*** How would a recount work in NJ? New Jersey is shaping up to be the closest election tonight. So what if it’s so close that the winner is unclear? Well, there’s no automatic recount. In other words, no vote margin triggers an automatic statewide recount. Instead, a candidate would have 15 days (Nov. 18) to request one. (They'd file in New Jersey Superior Court). There is a fee that the petitioning candidate has to incur (the Secretary of State’s office didn't know how much), but all other costs are incurred by the counties. Candidates have 30 days to contest the election if they feel it was fraudulent. Once a candidate files, that would trigger an investigation. Impress Your Friends at the Water Cooler Alert: The last time a candidate requested a recount was in 1981 by Democrat Jim Florio, who in the end lost to Republican Tom Kean by 1,797 votes. The closest gubernatorial elections since ’81 were in '93 and '97, when Christie Todd Whitman won by fewer than 25,000 votes. By the way, our exit poll/ballot counting experts in the NBC News boiler room tell us as many as 100,000 votes won't be counted tonight in New Jersey. If we haven't called this race by midnight, could it be we won't be able to call it for days?

*** Turnout watch: Turnout in New Jersey’s last gubernatorial contest, in 2005, was 2.3 million; in 2006, it was about 2.25 million for the Menendez-Kean Senate race; and in last year’s presidential, it was around 3.8 million… Turnout in Virginia’s last gubernatorial contest, in 2005, was about 2 million; in 2006, it was about 2.4 million in the Webb-Allen Senate contest; and in last year’s presidential, it was about 3.7 million.

*** Obama supporters disappointed? This New York Times piece is indicative of what we’ve seen/heard from some Obama supporters lately: They are disappointed with Obama, discovering that campaigning is a lot easier than governing. “Interviews with voters across Iowa offer a window into how the president’s standing has leveled off, especially among the independents and Republicans who contributed not just to his margin of victory in the caucuses here but also to the optimism among his supporters that his election would be a break from standard-issue politics.”

*** Abortion returns to the health-care debate: It has been a while since the talk of “death panels” or abortion has dominated the health-care debate. And it’s probably not a coincidence that the prospects for reform now seem better than they did during that crazy August. But the issue of abortion has returned for the Democrats. The Washington Post: “While House leaders are moving toward a vote on health-care legislation by the end of the week, enough Democrats are threatening to oppose the measure over the issue of abortion to create a question about its passage… ‘I will continue whipping my colleagues to oppose bringing the bill to the floor for a vote until a clean vote against public funding for abortion is allowed,’ Rep. Bart Stupak (D-Mich.) said… He said last week that 40 Democrats could vote with him to oppose the legislation -- enough to derail the bill.”

*** The GOP’s health plan: Meanwhile, House Republicans plan to -- finally! -- unveil their health-care bill this week. And it doesn’t look anything like any of the Democrats’ legislation. Two big differences: Their legislation won’t prevent health insurers from denying coverage to those with preexisting conditions, and it won’t provide money to help those without health insurance. House Minority Leader John Boehner said “that the measure would not include language banning insurance companies from denying coverage to consumers with preexisting conditions, a prominent feature of Democrats' bills in both the House and Senate,” the Washington Post writes. “And while some Republican health-care proposals have called for giving individuals tax credits to help them buy insurance, that idea won't be included in this week's GOP bill because it would cost too much.”

*** Obama’s day: The president meets at the White House with German Chancellor Angela Merkel at 9:10 am ET (Merkel also addresses Congress today). At 2:40 pm, Obama participates in a U.S.-E.U. summit. And he meets with Defense Secretary Gates at 4:30 pm and with Arkansas Sen. Blanche Lincoln (D) at 5:15 pm (both of which are closed to the press).

Countdown to MA Special Primary: 35 days
Countdown to MA Special Election: 77 days
Countdown to Election Day 2010: 364 days

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Comments

Why Republicans Can’t/Won’t Negotiate or Compromise:
The answer can be found in NY 23, (Hoffman v Owen); Pennsylvania, (Specter defection); Florida, (Crist v Rubio).  Conservative continue to want to purify their brand and if a seating Republican wants to be reasonable the conservatives will find a candidate to run against them.  Boehner, Cantor, run-of-the-mill elected Republicans all know this. Boehner will say he supports moderates, but his actions clearly say “moderates need not apply.” So congressional Republicans will remain the Party of “NO”.
Fear of not being reelected is the cloud that hangs over every elected Republican. Look what’s happening in NY 23.  Don’t argue with Rush, agree with Glen, stay off Palin’s radar screen and continue to vote “No”.  To compromise means the Tea Baggers will run a conservative against you in the primaries and deplete your financial resources so you will lose in the general.  The use of fear is a strategy conservatives use on their own.  
The battle is fascinating. Fox News tea baggers, (you know the players) are fighting to strengthen their hold on the GOP by weeding out any remaining moderates, and what is amazing is the elected Republicans continue to embrace the extreme right-wing due to FEAR.
By moving further to the right, the GOP will lose more and more elections; until someone has the courage to stand up to Limbaugh and Beck and say, “Enough! We can only win when we move to the center.” The person who has the courage to overcome his or her won fears will be the real leader of the GOP. As yet, that person has not come forward.
McDonnell is an outlier as he is a conservative, but during his campaign, he moved to the center. He ran a strong campaign. It is noteworthy that today’s election results are not about Obama or his administration.  They are about McConnell being a better candidate than Deeds.  They are aout the people of NJ making some judgments on Corzine. When pundits (on FR) talk about this election being a referendum on Obama, IGNORE THEM!  In statewide elections, it is he quality of the candidate that matters.
Obama and the White House got their grubby fingerprints all over each of the races. And the Dems will ose everyone of the races. Obama even sent the VPOTUS to campaign in a backwater district in northern NY. A district that voted for Obama last year, but will vote for the Conservative this time around. How the mighty have fallen, but then again, was Obama every really "Mighty"?
This is ONLY the begining! It is going to be extremely enjoying to watch the american voters right this ship! Ronald Regan and the founding fathers of this great nation would be proud. You can follow or you can watch, but don't get in the way. I think these elections will REALLy motivate the voters and make Real common sense change for america. Not the Obummer hollywood (socialistic change) that everyone is growing to hate.
Clean sweep for the Republicans today Democrats. This after Obama campaigned heavily in NY, NJ, and Virginia. Just like with the Olympics though, Obama will lose again. Obama is turning into more a ceremonial President rather any kind of leader, either in the world, or in the US.
Is amazing to watch the MSM talk about the Republican/Conservative "Civil War". It's amazing because if there is any kind of civil war going on, it's with the Democrats. The Democrats are split at least in two, and probably in many more pieces. On the far left fringe, you have the Democrat leadership that consists of Obama, Pelosi and Reid. Then you have the more moderate element of Congress with the Blue Dog Democrats. Then you have the neo-Marxist "Caucuses" of the House that consist of the Congressional Black, Asian, Hispanic, and Gay Caucuses. The Democrats are so split up that the only chance they have on winning on big legislation like Health Care Reform and Cap&Trade, is partnering up with the moderates in the Republican party, like that will ever happen.

It is amazing to watch the Democrats, with their significant majorities in the House and Senate along with  a very liberal President, that they have managed to grid-lock the entire country.
Looks like the fix is in for New Jersey with the sudden appearance of ACORN on the scene. Not by name, mind you, as their reputation is so tarnished that even New Jersey Democrats don’t want to be associated with them. No, in New Jersey ACORN sought cover behind its big brother, SEIU, specifically SEIU Local 32BJ. Need more ballots with Corzine's names checked? Not a problem for ACORN. Same operating procedure they used on the Minnesota recount for Franken.
Joe Wilson was right - Obama is a liar. He lied through his teeth in front of the American people. He lied about illegal immigrants being covered. He lied about death panels. And he lied that abortion isn't covered. But don't take my word for it, take the word of a House Democrat that talked to Obama directly regardintt the
Rep. Bart Stupak (D.-Mich.) told CNSNews.com that President Barack Obama told him in a telephone conversation that when he said in his Sept. 9 speech to a joint session of Congress that “under our plan no federal dollars will be used to fund abortions” he was not talking about the actual bill drafted in the House but about the president’s own health care plan—which has never been written.

“I don’t know if it is a game of semantics or what,” Stupak said of Obama’s nationally televised declaration to Congress that the health-care plan will not allow federal funding of abortion.

Both the House and Senate versions of the health-care bill permit federal funds to pay for insurance plans that cover abortions.

In his speech to the joint session of Congress, Obama directly rebutted the claim that the plan would fund abortions, calling it a “misunderstanding.” But in his later telephone conversation with Stupak, according to the congressman, Obama said that when he claimed in the speech that the plan would not fund abortions he was not talking about the House plan, he was talking about his own plan.
What plan?
The platitudes he trots out? His ever-changing rhetoric? HE HAS NO PLAN!
Jeffrey: “When President Obama came and spoke to the joint session of Congress on September 9th, he said, quote: ‘And one more misunderstanding I want to clear up: Under our plan, no federal dollars will be used to fund abortions” unquote. Is that a true or false statement?”

Stupak: “That is exactly what he said.”

Jeffrey: “Okay, that is what he said. But is it an accurate statement?”

Stupak: “I called him. I called the president--had a discussion with the president. And I read exactly what you just said. And he said: ‘What it says is “under my plan”’—meaning the president’s plan. And I said: ‘With all due respect, sir, you do not have a plan. The only plan we have out is the House plan.’ So, I don’t know if it is a game of semantics or what.”

Jeffrey: “So President Obama did not tell you, Congressman Stupak, that the plans that have been drafted in the House—the bill that actually came out of your committee—does not fund abortion.”

Stupak: “He did not say that.”

Jeffrey: “He did not assert that. He said that ‘his’ plan--”

Stupak: “His plan.”

Jeffrey: “Theoretically, some different plan than the one you actually drafted in committee?”

Stupak: “Correct. Correct. And when I pointed this out, he said: ‘Go back and work with the people on your committee and get this matter worked out. Work with the speaker. Work with us, would you?’ And I said: Yes, I would. And we have tried. But we haven’t been able to resolve our differences because we do not want public funds going for abortion.”

Jeffrey: "Did President Obama indicate to you that he supports your amendment?"

Stupak: "He is supportive of what I am trying to do. However, we are getting down to crunch time. And I would call upon the President to help us out here. The speaker has told me I will not have my amendment. It will not be made in order. It will not be part of 3200. So the Capps language—which [means] citizens would have to start using their funds, public funds, to pay for abortions--will be part of 3200. And I will not have an opportunity on the House floor to delete that language or put the Hyde language in there to supersede the Capps language."

What a bunch of crap. Obama lies through his teeth to do evil.
This should come as no surprise under a radical pro-abortion President who himself has voted 4 times for infanticide - the murder of a conscious living baby after it was born.
Obama's actions during his entire career speak far louder than the pathetic and deceitful lip service he's been giving the pro-life community. Once again, for the umpteenth time, on Obama and abortion, it is indisputable that in his very short time in office, the most viciously pro-abort zealot to ever sit in the Oval Office did the following:
• signed an Executive Order opening up taxpayer funding for destroying embryos for research, even though the effort is moot
• directed the Department of HHS to overturn regulations that protect medical professionals from being forced to perform or refer for abortion (more here)
• second act in office was to authorize US dollars to fund abortions oversees (more here)
• voted against the Born Alive Infant Protection Act, thereby outright condoning infanticide (this was before he was elected President, but something that no one should forget). Not just once but 4 times!
• signed an Executive Order authorizing taxpayer funding for the destruction of human embryos for research and overturned a prior administration EO pressing for forms of stem cell research that wouldn't require embryo destruction. Even though destroying embryos is likely already moot at this point
• announced $50 million for the UNFPA, the UN population agency that has been criticized for promoting abortion and working closely with Chinese population control officials who use forced abortions and involuntary sterilizations.
• defunded all abstinence-only education, instead going with contraceptive-only education that is proven not to decrease pregnancy or abortion
• Signed a new budget calling for taxpayer-funded abortions in Washington D.C.
The multiple pro-infanticide votes is the most egregious of the above egregious acts, and he did so without any pity for those babies born alive only to be left in soiled linen closets to die. Recall that Obama considers abortion essential/basic care:

And this agenda is to be foisted upon now, through hook and crook. And of course semantics
Obama says he's still "weeks away" from deciding what to do in Afghanistan. Of course he said the same thing several weeks a go. And how are those inspections going of the nuke facilities in Iran? Recall that Hillary and Obama were in great form telling all of us how wonderful they were to get those agreements on inspections from Iran. The agreement was that those inspections were to take place in late October, correct? How'd they go? And that uranium Iran had, that was supposed to go to Russia, and then France, for enrichment so that it could only be used for peaceful purposes. Those shipments arrive in Russia yet? No? Gee, why not?

I guess at Thanksgiving, Obama will tell us he'll get right back to us on the Afghanistan solution after the holidays. He has lots of shopping to take care of you know. Busy guy.
I like how the Dems shut out the Republicans from their closed-door meetings, refuse to look at any of their ideas and Obama even tells them to shut up....then they say the Republicans have no ideas and "finally" present a version.

The American people are getting wise to the childish games that Obama and his Democrats play.  It will show in the next few elections.
NEW YORK: The top-ranking House Republican told reporters on Monday that he regrets having supported former GOP House candidate Dede Scozzafava… "This lady clearly has as agenda that's different than most Republicans; she was out there promoting herself," House Minority Leader John Boehner (R-Ohio) said.”
____________________

The ‘lemmings’ are on the loose again…

And then there’s Simple Sarah… ‘Governing’ from her social networking account(s)… lol lol lol

What’s more appropriate than a ‘twit’ twittering…?

And they claim the GEENOPEE train wreck er… brand is going to be meking their GREAT come back? If that’s the case… full speed ahead… lol lol lol

*** But issues matter, too: By the way, even Republican Governors Association Chair Haley Barbour said today's races are NOT a referendum on the president.
_____________________

Quick!  Toss him out of the GEENOPEE as WELL!

Why do Republicants so closely resemble cannibles? lol lol lol
Ron Indiana: By moving further to the right, the GOP will lose more and more elections;

Pure fantasy. The Democrats went hard left in recent years, and now they have solid majorities in Congress and the most liberal President in over a hundred years. And we see the result, tax and spend, borrow and spend, and run up up the debt at record rates. America liked Obama, he seemed like a nice enough kind of guy. The media followed him around like the little puppies they were. They loved the guy. So they didn't make a big deal over how extreme a liberal he was, and now we the results.

To counter that the Republicans will go hard right, and they'll win. America is tired of the Democrats hostile takeovers of every aspect of their lives. The Democrats, now exposed for the socialists they are, will be the minority party soon enough.
I am sure that the local elections in New York and Virginia are very important to people in New York and Virginia but they are pretty irrelevant and meaningless everywhere else, it is ridiculous how the media is trying to make these local elections some sort of major national issue, there are plenty of legitimate national issues that could be covered like how the insurance industry is about to have Congress make every U.S. citizen a slave to them, or how Afghanistan is our new Vietnam, or how Congress continues to let credit card companies rape people after those same people bailed them out, but instead we will talk about two local elections in the beltway, go figure.
Yesterday, the New York Times wrote that the New Jersey race was “one of several [contests] likely to be viewed as a barometer of the president’s popularity.”
--------------------------------------------------

Uh, I thought all those job approval polls that Gallup does were supposed to be the barometer. I guess the media isn't satisfied with those polls, because almost all of them have consistently shown President Obama's approval rating above 50%, so they have to find something else negative to throw at him.

So what's the nontroversy of the week, guys? CNN seems to think it's Obama not playing basketball with the women in his administration. It has something to do with job discrimination according to some corporate media "logic" that totally escapes me.
Regarding whether or not abortion and death panels are in the bills.....just the fact that it's 2000 pages with incomprehensible language should be cause for alarm.  The corrupt Congress will sneak anything in there and lie to the people they are supposed to represent.  
First Read, you're showing your disdain for Republicans again.  It's McDonnell, not McConnell, in Virginia.
A referendum on Obama?
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No!!!!! A referendum is on the fringe, lunatic, "Dopes of Nope" thanks to irrational, "Going Rogue" Sarah. A really good shrewd idea of the President Obama was to pick the Republican guy in NY for the WH President Obama is helping you idiotic, angry,"Dopes of Nope"  pluck off.

How many more Republicans can the President help you "Dopes of Nope" purge yourselves of, I wonder?
Obama and the White House got their grubby fingerprints all over each of the races. And the Dems will ose everyone of the races. Obama even sent the VPOTUS to campaign in a backwater district in northern NY. A district that voted for Obama last year, but will vote for the Conservative this time around. How the mighty have fallen, but then again, was Obama every really "Mighty"?

Kelsey Evans, NY (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:23 AM)

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Try not to overthink this one...President Obama won in NY 23 but the district still elected John McHugh, the Republican, as its representative.

NY 23 hasn't been represented by a Democrat since 1871.

Still think it's a referendum on the President?

PS - I'm sure the folks up there appreciate you calling them "backwater"!
Virginian -- thanks for the catch. Fixed the typo.
Clean sweep for the Republicans today Democrats. This after Obama campaigned heavily in NY, NJ, and Virginia. Just like with the Olympics though, Obama will lose again. Obama is turning into more a ceremonial President rather any kind of leader, either in the world, or in the US.
Fired Up and Ready to Kick Some Dem Butt (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:25 AM)

-----------------------------------------------

I guess you weren't paying attention...a Republican is not going to win NY 23 because she dropped out of the race.
A Republican Healthcare Plan? What a joke that would be. We have seen the previous efforts of Fake Bake Boehner in this regard and the 19 page fairytale they produced was laughable.

Republicans have no plan for anything that would help this country to recover from the mess they helped to create. All they do is bellyache and moan about what the President is doing wrong and do nothing to fix the problem. If the shoe were on the other foot, they would be calling the Dems unpatriotic. It seems as if the Rethugs are the equivalent of the American Taliban with their thoughts and actions (inactions).
And we see the result, tax and spend, borrow and spend, and run up up the debt at record rates. America liked Obama, he seemed like a nice enough kind of guy. The media followed him around like the little puppies they were. They loved the guy. So they didn't make a big deal over how extreme a liberal he was, and now we the results.

To counter that the Republicans will go hard right, and they'll win. America is tired of the Democrats hostile takeovers of every aspect of their lives. The Democrats, now exposed for the socialists they are, will be the minority party soon enough.

Jensen, Oklahoma (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:34 AM)
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Actually Jensen, You're wrong
Republican leaders are a "wholly owned subsidiary of the Insurance companies" as Alan Grayson said. I prefer to express it another way Republican leaders are being sucked into a giant vacuum  into the as**es of the lobbyists and the insurance companies.
Lynn Wheatly is an idiot who is showing her true RIGHT WING HATE MONGERING AND FACSISTS BELIEFS by calling certain minorities Marxists when they do not lock step to the white only need to apply. God forbid if we demand equal protection under the law. Get use it lady because demography will make Hispanics the MAJORITY in 15 to 20 years. So I guess you can found your own lsland with your leaders being Sarah Palin, Lou Dobbs, Beck, Druggy Limbaugh, and justices of peace like the rascists in LA.
The cost of House bill for HCR is now up to $1.2 trillion and going up fast. Pelosi keeps adding billions to the bill, to pay off certain Congressmen for their votes no doubt, and then stands there and lies to us by saying it's still costing "only" $900 billion. The country is waking up to this nonsense though because now there are rumblings that the health care bill will go well into 2010. If the Democrats try spending and taxing people in an election year, they may not win many elections next year.
"We can say she is guilty of widespread bestiality. She has screwed every RINO in the country."

Way to keep it classy, Rush!
Pete - Albany, NY (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:33 AM)
______________

Shame on YOU Pete!

You should know by now to NEVER insert Rush & class in the same sentence!  :0)
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A lot of 'crowing' going on around here today... we'll see who'll be coughing up the feathers when all is said & done!
Any particular reason Reverend Jeremiah Wright recently visited the White House? Bill Ayers too. You'd think the media would want to find out, but they were too busy telling us Oprah and George Clooney showed up.
Osie Wade, Chicago (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:27 AM)
=========================================

And don't forget all those visits from the SEIU.  
Still think it's a referendum on the President?

PS - I'm sure the folks up there appreciate you calling them "backwater"!
Pete - Albany, NY


If Obama has his senior administration officials contact the "Republican" and get her to endorse the Democrat, if you send the VPOTUS to the district to campaign, and then you lose, then yes it is a referendum on Obama.
Actually Jensen, You're wrong
Republican leaders are a "wholly owned subsidiary of the Insurance companies" as Alan Grayson said. I prefer to express it another way Republican leaders are being sucked into a giant vacuum  into the as**es of the lobbyists and the insurance companies.
Beverly in Chicago

And who owns the Democrats? The lawyers! The unions! And last, and certainly not least, George Soro's!
If Maine votes against marriage equality, the blame can almost be placed at the steps of the white house for their refusal to stand by the gay rights side in the battle for equal rights. The attorney general let them know that Obama didn't care one way or another so why would those Non-White voters who said they supported Obama but would not vote for marrage equality because of their religion. "So why should they change their vote." Obama gave those voters the OK, and that was devastating for gay rights.
Just my two cents here, but my guess is that the elections today will tell us 2 things:

1.  How the voters view the candidates in each election.  Candidates matter.  

2.  How much of an "anti-incumbent party" mood exists.  A large part of the reason President Obama won was because the electorate blamed Republicans (the party in power) for the state of the economy.  Now, we have 2 states having governors elections where the Dems have been in power for 8 years.  Economy is still poor, so I think the results (a GOP win in Virginia and Corzine getting well below 50 in NJ) will tell us if an anti-incumbancy mood persists.
Wow ,,,the tea baggers are out early today.Nine out of the first ten post,must have been waiting with Gallo breath to be the first chest pounder.This is not a big deal the msm has made it a big deal,they admitted in this story,so most of the hype is made up for print and TV.The elections in Virginia have been the same for the last 8 elections,and the party that is out of power has been elected,a pre schooler could have packed this one.And Corzine is a wallstreeter,and has a target on his chest for those made at the bailouts,so baggers wallow for today,try not to get twisted to tight today this will pass,the tea hangover will also pass,and the crap you pass in your fear and smear game will be front and center,enjoy your two governorships you may gain,that will shake things up,RIGHT?
Regarding whether or not abortion and death panels are in the bills.....just the fact that it's 2000 pages with incomprehensible language should be cause for alarm.  The corrupt Congress will sneak anything in there and lie to the people they are supposed to represent.  

American Joe (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:36 AM)
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Un-American Joe
In order to comprehend you need a functional brain to read. I have a suggestion let cone head Glenn Beck or that stupid Hannity read it to you or any FOX FREAK on FOX NOTHING Channel. Oooooops I forget; they are too stupid to read it too. They have have the Producers whisper incomprehensible language in their ears to you.  Haaaaaaha
GOP Health Plan Unveiled and it doesn't prevent insurance companies from denying coverage to someone with pre-existing conditions and it doesn't help anyone pay for the Insurance.

So basically the GOP plan is worthless.

When are you people going to wake up!

Hopefully when you see your Health Insurance premiums go up again in 2010 by an average of 10% you will get behind the public option that the true Democrats are trying to propose.

GOP posters - Dont bother because everything you say is a talking point and makes no sense!
A Republican Healthcare Plan? What a joke that would be. We have seen the previous efforts of Fake Bake Boehner in this regard and the 19 page fairytale they produced was laughable.

Republicans have no plan for anything that would help this country to recover from the mess they helped to create. All they do is bellyache and moan about what the President is doing wrong and do nothing to fix the problem. If the shoe were on the other foot, they would be calling the Dems unpatriotic. It seems as if the Rethugs are the equivalent of the American Taliban with their thoughts and actions (inactions).
J. Ellis, Virginia

------------
The constant whine form the lefties gets annoying. Listen libs, you won an election last year. You wanted to solve all the problems, because you had all the answers during the campaign. Now, a year later, you haven't solved a damn thing! The only thing you can do is point at the minority party and say "Hey, they don't have plan either". You have your candidates run on that platform next, see where that gets you.
On the repuke health plan, the slogan should be, as in all policies of the repukes - "Got Money, get all you can; No Money, tough sh$#, get out of line."
Lynn Wheatly is an idiot who is showing her true RIGHT WING HATE MONGERING AND FACSISTS BELIEFS by calling certain minorities Marxists when they do not lock step to the white only need to apply. God forbid if we demand equal protection under the law. Get use it lady because demography will make Hispanics the MAJORITY in 15 to 20 years. So I guess you can found your own lsland with your leaders being Sarah Palin, Lou Dobbs, Beck, Druggy Limbaugh, and justices of peace like the rascists in LA.
Juan, FT Lauderdale, FL


When all else fails, claim racisim.
RUNNING AMOK

Too bad the Stimulus and even the Healthcare Bill are really politically motivated to get the Dems what they wanted for the past 20 years. Look through
the 2000 pages and only about half of it is about healthcare. More lying and cheating and scheming from the left-wingers and more reasons than hell to vote thier corrupt little a$$e$ out starting today and piling on in 2010, eventually routing the Chosen One and all his merry little tax cheats and Chicago "Thug Rule" in 2012.

~~~~~

We won't forgive the Clintons, Bill and Hill, for buying into this Obie formula for drowning America into socialism and burying it's future for now.

~~~~~

Palin still on the prowl and proving once again, she is more of a threat in her current position than ever before. Palin could teach Obie a few things about political experience. He's still can't make a decision on Afghanistan and the possibility of sending more troops in at McCrystal's request. Let's not forget that McCrystal was Obie's choice in the field. Still, he blames Bush. Weenie.

~~~~~

The big deal in Ohio is whether to allow Casino gambling in Cincinnati, Columbus, Cleveland and Toledo. At present, casino gambling is against the law in Ohio.



Bad Chihuahua
Tombstone Shadow
Bad Moon ... and the rest.





Democrats - the Dopes of (No)Hope.
Jasen Oklahoma: Good to see Republicans on FR who don't know what they are talking about. You may wish to begin reading an American history book, or realizing that Oklahoma is a Republican outlier. You guys have a pretty good football team, but that's about it.  Thanks for playing.
It seems as if the Rethugs are the equivalent of the American Taliban with their thoughts and actions (inactions).

J. Ellis, Virginia (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:46 AM)
____________________

Bingo!  I've come to think of them as nothing more than Domestic Terrorists!  

After all they 'rule' by fear!  Keep the masses either scared sh!tless, stuck on stupid or both...  

No wonder they're so AGAINST choice!
What a bunch of crap. Obama lies through his teeth to do evil.
What_you_Selling

Ok are you talking about the president or the terrorist.
you are a very mad angry person, did the government take you farm or guns away.
did you get mad like this whe we found out that three major initiatives under Bush -- tax cuts, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and a Medicare prescription drug bill -- are projected to add $6 trillion to the nation's deficits."
talk about lying through his teeth, man get a life and look at what your guy the former president did when he was in office.
after you read this
shut the F--k up and get off the crack, remember crack kills.
Clean sweep for the Republicans today Democrats. This after Obama campaigned heavily in NY, NJ, and Virginia. Just like with the Olympics though, Obama will lose again. Obama is turning into more a ceremonial President rather any kind of leader, either in the world, or in the US.
Fired Up and Ready to Kick Some Dem Butt (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:25 AM)

-----------------------------------------------

I guess you weren't paying attention...a Republican is not going to win NY 23 because she dropped out of the race.
Pete - Albany, NY

Don't see where he/she said a Republican would win. He said a Democreatin would lose, which is true.
Ron, Indiana excellent post. Historically the Hamiltonians (today's Republicans) have fallen apart when one wing of the party gets too powerful and that is usually the conservative. The Federalists didn't last long as the nation became even more liberal after G. Washington and J. Adams. The demise of the Federalists led to the formation of the Whig party. More conservative than Jefferson's National Republican party and far more conservative than the Republican party today. With the election of Andrew Jackson the Democratic party was modified, and modernized changing from National Republican,Democratic Republican finally to Democratic party. Meanwhile the Whigs were starting to crumble. In 1856 the newly formed Republican party, an anti-slavery party, ran their first candidate for president, John C. Frémont. That election was won by uberliberal and very weak President James Buchanan, a Democrat. Fortunately for the nation former Whig and now Republican, Abraham Lincoln followed Buchanan.

There were more Hamiltonians in the North and more Jeffersonians in the South so with the civil war the Hamiltonians (Republicans) dominated the national political scene for decades. Broken by Grover Cleveland the drought ended for the Democrats. Those Republicans, although more conservative than the average Democrat were still far more liberal than their Hamiltonian counterparts.

We may be witnessing history today as we see the uber right wing extremists take control of the Republican party. The once grand old party will go the way of its ancestors and fall totally to pieces replaced by a more liberal party. What will it be called? American party,perhaps, or could it be called something no one has yet coined?
Just my two cents here, but my guess is that the elections today will tell us 2 things:

1. How the voters view the candidates in each election. Candidates matter.

2. How much of an "anti-incumbent party" mood exists. A large part of the reason President Obama won was because the electorate blamed Republicans (the party in power) for the state of the economy. Now, we have 2 states having governors elections where the Dems have been in power for 8 years. Economy is still poor, so I think the results (a GOP win in Virginia and Corzine getting well below 50 in NJ) will tell us if an anti-incumbancy mood persists.
Frank "Grimey" Grimes, Springfield, USA (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 9:55 AM)
____________

My GOD!  How did that happen…?

We have a Republican who makes sense on board here at FR!

Point #1 = totally agree!
Point #2 = this one's a split!
Keep the Change has this selective/convient memory when he espouses the garbage about how the Democrats lock out Republicans. How about Cheney's secret meetings w/ Hallibutin, oil and steel corporations who came up w/ our energy policies? Or the State Attornies being fired becaused they were not loyal Bushies and/or towing the rightwing agenda by not bringing bogus charges against Democrats. Keep the Mantra up w/ your kool-aid drinking.
Since you're the Guest Book, you should know that neither Reverend Jeremiah Wright or Bill Ayers were in the White House!!
Beverly in Chicago

===================

http://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/disclosures/visitor-records
Keep the Change has this selective/convient memory when he espouses the garbage about how the Democrats lock out Republicans. How about Cheney's secret meetings w/ Hallibutin, oil and steel corporations who came up w/ our energy policies? Or the State Attornies being fired becaused they were not loyal Bushies and/or towing the rightwing agenda by not bringing bogus charges against Democrats. Keep the Mantra up w/ your kool-aid drinking.
Juan,Ft Lauderdale,Fl

So you're saying Obama is like Cheney?

Change you can believe in!
I've said before than this election is not a referendum on Obama; only political junkies are discussing it.  But political analysts try to put some far-reaching meaning on off-year elections.  What meaning did Virginia, NJ and other elections in 2001 have on Bush's presidency?  None.  Still say the most interesting one is NY23 just for the drama and the weirdness of the whole situation.  As Rachel pointed out, for the first time since around the Civil War, NY 23 will not have a republican win.

Haley Barbour at least makes some sense.  But I disagree with the GOP stand that this is a referendum on democratic policies--it's the economy, stupid.  The worse economy since the Great Depression and people are worried.  Suddenly the deficit spending and national debt are on their radar screens but they should have been worried about those things for the last 8 years.  Barbour and other republicans moan and groan about focus on HCR but they just don't get it,  they fail to grasp:  health care costs rise three times faster than inflation and that has a huge impact on our economy.  It means employer profits decrease, employees have less discretionary spending; fewer profits and less spending impacts the economy.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out health care costs are a drag on the economy and it will only get worse.

I see impatience exists in Iowa, too.  It is frustrating to think that people could actually think that in 10 months, Obama could solve every problem and the world would be wonderful once again--that disappoints me and is naive.  There's also a failure to recognize that then candidate and now President Obama operates in a different zone from previous presidents.  I'm an Iowan and considering the massive problems inherited, I think Pres Obama is doing just fine and I will be patient.  Unlike instantaneous results on computers, getting things done in Washington is on slow speed.  That's the way the founding fathers set up our system.  But in this world of instant connectivity, people lack patience.  There's also a bit of selfishness involved--it doesn't suit ME, it isn't what "I" thought, it must be public option all or nothing because "I" say so, "I" think he should focus on gays in the military, "I" think he should do jobs first, "I" think he should leave Afghanistan now.  "I", "Me" are great talking points but Pres Obama is everyone's president and his decisions impact this country and the world.  Time, take all you need to get it right, Mr. President.
In other words, the GOP's health care plan is status quo, don't change anything.  Why bother Boehner if it doesn't change the status quo.  Wonder if the written plan will look like that 4 or 6 page stimulus plan Boehner and Cantor rolled out.  
Democrats - the Dopes of (No)Hope.
____________

Like I said... I'll take HOPE over NOPE anyday... but go ahead and 'carry on'!
Un-American Joe
In order to comprehend you need a functional brain to read. I have a suggestion let cone head Glenn Beck or that stupid Hannity read it to you or any FOX FREAK on FOX NOTHING Channel. Oooooops I forget; they are too stupid to read it too. They have have the Producers whisper incomprehensible language in their ears to you.  Haaaaaaha
Beverly in Chicago

So Beverley what part of the HRC do you like?  The fact that pre-existing conditions are now covered?  How will this be paid for?  The limit on FSA accounts that will hit middle income families?  The limit on "cadilac" plans that will mainly hit union workers.  The mandate to buy insurance that mainly hit the young just out of college? (unless they stay with their parents until 27....guess no one will be starting a family before then).  If you think a bill with 1900 pages is a clean piece of legislation then you are a lawyer.  For the rest of us we know it has loopholes and exceptions that pick winners and losers.

HCR is a good thing, this bill is a piece of crap.
Keep the Change has this selective/convient memory when he espouses the garbage about how the Democrats lock out Republicans. How about Cheney's secret meetings w/ Hallibutin, oil and steel corporations who came up w/ our energy policies? Or the State Attornies being fired becaused they were not loyal Bushies and/or towing the rightwing agenda by not bringing bogus charges against Democrats. Keep the Mantra up w/ your kool-aid drinking.
Juan,Ft Lauderdale,Fl (Sent Tuesday, November 03, 2009 10:06 AM)


================================================
Juan, it wasn't right when the previous administration did it.  And it's not right when Obama does it.  Obama campaigned on change and nothing has changed, except for the worse.  Your lame and worn out excuse of "Cheney did it" or "Bush did it" is NO EXCUSE at all.  Two wrongs don't make a right.


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