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First Read is an analysis of the day's political news, from the NBC News political unit. First Read is updated throughout the day, so check back often.

Chuck Todd, NBC Political Director

Mark Murray, NBC Deputy Political Director

Domenico Montanaro, NBC News Political Reporter



Obama agenda: Pragmatism vs. ideology

Posted: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 9:18 AM by Domenico Montanaro
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The New York Times writes, “Democrats have displayed a striking degree of pragmatism in seeking to push the health care bill through Congress, embracing or rejecting ideological considerations as needed to keep the legislation moving. But if the flexibility shown by party leaders on issues like abortion and the proposed government-run insurance plan has kept the legislative process on track, it has also left many liberals off balance and risked alienating the party’s base as the midterm elections approach.” 

“President Obama suggested Monday that he was not comfortable with abortion restrictions inserted into the House version of major health care legislation, and he prodded Congress to revise them,” the New York Times also notes. “‘There needs to be some more work before we get to the point where we’re not changing the status quo’ on abortion, Mr. Obama said in an interview with ABC News. ‘And that’s the goal.’”

More: “On the one hand, Mr. Obama said, ‘we’re not looking to change what is the principle that has been in place for a very long time, which is federal dollars are not used to subsidize abortions.’ On the other hand, he said, he wanted to make sure ‘we’re not restricting women’s insurance choices,’ because he had promised that ‘if you’re happy and satisfied with the insurance that you have, it’s not going to change.’”   

Bipartisanship? Who needs it, says Democratic strategist Paul Begala. He points to former president Bill Clinton’s passage of his 1993 economic plan, which Begala writes was the “first piece of major legislation in modern history to pass without a single vote from the party opposite.” Begala compares the Republican predictions made then with those of today, with Dick Armey saying Clinton’s bill was a “job killer,” and House Minority Leader John Boehner saying the health care bill is “the greatest threat to freedom that I’ve seen in the 19 years I’ve been in Washington.”

The president and first lady head to Fort Hood today. President Obama will meet with family members of those affected and make remarks. The AP says this "is his time to take on the healer-in-chief role that can help shape a presidency at a time of national tragedy."

Per the San Antonio Express-News, ”Plans call for a traditional military memorial, with a prologue, prayers, speeches, a sermon, music, a ‘roll call’ tribute to the 13 dead, and a rifle salute. The post commander, Lt. Gen. Robert Cone, said at a news conference Monday that he expects up to 5,000 people to attend the event.” 

"President Barack Obama is nearing a decision to add tens of thousands more forces to Afghanistan, though probably not quite the 40,000 sought by his top general there," the AP reports. "Administration officials told The Associated Press on Monday the deployment would most probably begin in January with a mission to stiffen the defense of 10 key cities and towns. An Army brigade that had been training for deployment to Iraq that month may be the vanguard."

As we mentioned in First Thoughts, however, the Obama White House disputes this report, noting that the president has yet to make up his mind.

"A survey of troops who served in Iraq and Afghanistan concluded that having gay or lesbian soldiers in fighting units has no significant impact on unit cohesion or readiness. The data raise new doubts about the underlying assumption of the congressional ban, namely that military discipline will fall apart if gays and lesbians are permitted to serve openly… RAND and the University of Florida found that '40 percent of the military members surveyed expressed support for the [current] policy, while 28 percent opposed it and 33 percent were neutral - less support than seen in previous surveys,' according to a release from RAND, which also advises the Pentagon on a host of security matters."

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OBAMA JUSTICE DEPT. IS PROTECTING MUSLIM TERRORISTS.

TODAY'S HEADLINES:

Fort Hood Suspect Warned of Muslim Threat Within Military ... !

Was under FBI probe in 2008 ...

RADICAL CLERIC TIED TO SHOOTING ...

Officials: U.S. Aware of Hasan Efforts to Contact al Qaeda ...  

•Alleged Fort Hood Shooter Frequented Local Strip Club (sounds familiar to the 9/11 terrorists?) ...

Alleged Fort Hood Shooter Tied to Mosque of 9/11 Hijackers ...

ATTORNEY GENERAL WILL SPEAK TO CONTROVERSIAL MUSLIM CIVIL RIGHTS GROUP ... ! ("speaks to controversal Muslim group"  --- What the Hell is Going On?)

A survey of troops who served in Iraq and Afghanistan concluded that having gay or lesbian soldiers in fighting units has no significant impact on unit cohesion or readiness.
*****************************************************

Shocking. Absolutely shocking.  /sarcasm

http://thepajamapundit.com/
FR: Because he [Obama]had promised that ‘if you’re happy and satisfied with the insurance that you have, it’s not going to change.’


That's not pragmitism, that's an outright lie. If you work for a company and have insurance through it, and that company decides to through you under the bus by paying the 8% fine and no longer offering insurance, then you are thrown into the government plan. You have no choice in the matter.

So it's not about Pragmistim or Ideology for Obama and the Democrats. It's about lying.
guess you forgot, Obie, that you said no federal $ would pay for abortions. Another of your lies and broken promises.
Glad to see President Obama speak out against the Stupak amendment.  He also reminded legislators and the rest of us that this legislation is a health care bill not an abortion bill.  He is right, this is not the time to throw in bombs like the Stupak-Pitts amendment.  The Hyde provision already in place does not allow federal tax dollars to be spent for abortions; that is sufficient.  If pro-life legislators want to further restrict women's reproductive rights then they should do that as  stand alone legislation and not try to sneak it through on HCR.
I think the more important aspect of all healthcare is the provision of birth control as a medication covered under a prescription plan that is fully funded.
I do not want abortion as a part of healthcare.
 Period.

It is a legal option for the first tri-mester as I understand the Supreme Court ruling.  It can be paid for with private money.

We should be providing birth control at no cost to all women who seek it.
The health care bill is all the Dems have to do.

They obviously don't give a damn about the economy, jobs or anything else.

The will be re-located to flip Big Macs in 2010.
Because the Democrats have moved more toward the center and pragmatism and the Republicans, sadly, are still ruled from the extremist right we will need only Democrats to pass landmark legislation. Obviously the Repulbicans are only out to obstruct anything and everything with their desire to return to the stone age we have no choice but to exclude them. Imagine the history books of the future when they will point out that in the House version only one Republican voted for it (bipartisan?) and that the Senate had none (if, indeed that happens). Then when the affordable healthcare being enjoyed by those on the left, the right, and center is going strong I can see some reminiscing from the right with how they were a part of the Congress that passed the landmark bill that got healthcare affordable for everyone. It happened with SSI and will happen with the HCR bill too. No doubt in my mind. But that's okay, we'll let them brag as long as they are finally on board who will care?


The Obama does send all those troops to Afghanistan it will be due to a well reasoned and well thought out plan and not some knee jerk reactionary who doesn't think but just reacts like some wild animal.
I love the hypocrisy of the media and the left.  When they want to promote something, they speak of their "values" (such a positive word).  But when they want to demonize Conservatives and Christians, they tell us we're infringing our "idealogy" (mean sounding word) on others.  Such obvious hypocrisy.
President Obama will never be comfortable with abortion restrictions because he's the most radically pro-abortion president we've ever had and pro-abortion lobby money lines his pockets so he's sold his soul to these groups and will always put their interests above the country, babies, or what's right.  This man as a candidate promised pro-abortion lobbyists that his first act as president would be to sign a "Freedom of Choice Act" (FOCA) which remove all current restrictions on abortion (partial birth abortion ban, parental consent laws...etc).  His FIRST act as President...how radical is that?  For a man who claims it's "above my pay grade" to know when life begins, he's pretty arrogantly confident based on his record and rhetoric that a baby isn't a human being until after it's born.  Anything short of that is "OK" to terminate in his world view.  So forcing taxpayers to fund abortion is automatic for this man and those like him.  Remember too, the pro-abortion groups like to be sneaky and hide abortion under the nicer sounding "Reproductive services" category so that it inconspicuously mixes right in with mammograms and pap smears.   But we know your tricks and killing innocent babies and forcing me to pay for it is WAY DIFFERENT than getting a pap smear or mammogram.  The major problem the left has on this issue is the TRUTH.  They don't have truth on their side.  And their lies and deceits are becoming less and less effective.  Here's praying our repesentative leaders have the guts and integrity to do what's right over just "passing a bill".
Yeah, lets derail reform over a pet cultural issue of the loony right. 3,000 years of religious based ignorance and still the religious can't stop trying to cram their admas family values down our throats.

We shouldn't be forced to pay for ED pills like viagra for randy old republican men who have difficulties performing with their spouses either.
"FR: Because he [Obama]had promised that ‘if you’re happy and satisfied with the insurance that you have, it’s not going to change.’


That's not pragmitism, that's an outright lie. If you work for a company and have insurance through it, and that company decides to through you under the bus by paying the 8% fine and no longer offering insurance, then you are thrown into the government plan. You have no choice in the matter."

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So now you're holding President Obama responsible for the choices your employer makes?  In the context of the original statement, he meant that you will not be forced to leave an employer plan.

Is The President supposed to force your employer to keep your plan?  Wait -- that would be socialism, wouldn't it?

I'm not totally crazy about reform yet; but it's incremental.  
Thank God for a smart, pragmatic leader like Obama. We have had enough of liars, war-mongerers, and those that mislead the public rather than dealing with facts.As a former Republican I can no lobger vote GOP because there are NO real Republicans there.If you listen to the extremists like Boehner, Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck, etc, you are listening to extremist lies. Independents will not support sich far-right extremists views, as seen in the NY and CA Congressinal elections last week.
"guess you forgot, Obie, that you said no federal $ would pay for abortions. Another of your lies and broken promises. "

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Where oh where in the bill is there a repeal of the Hyde Amendment?  You want TRUTH -- why don't you look for it in your mind-numbing rhetoric that was tired in 1979?  

You don't want fundng for abortions, which the Hyde Amendment forbids, then you don't want coverage for birth control because that's a form of abortion.  All you advocate is no sex before marriage.  It's that simple -- just chew ice and take cold showers.

One of the true hypocrisies is that the "religious right" is further from Christian, religious, or spiritual than we can imagine. There is no listening, no real caring for the poor, no plans for the desperate...just totalitarian government rules that completely enter our lives...while hypocritically claiming that they want the gov't out. The far-right is becoming a non-Christian witch group.
What amazes me is conservatives say they don't want government involved in their healthcare.  They don't want government telling them what they can and cannot have done.  Oh!  But they DO want government telling people they can't have procedures (that are LEGAL) in this country.  In fact, you want it so much, that you support the Stupak Amendment which says, in the U.S. of America, you are not ALLOWED to purchase insurance with your own money if it is part of the exchange program, if it offers to cover abortion, whether you have one or not.  So, you only want government telling Americans what they can and cannot do if you agree with it?
No federal dollars for abortions? Then I guess anyone working at any financial institution that received TARP funds can't have an abortion, huh? Or in the military, or defense contractors, student loan, etc., etc.

It's perfectly acceptable to be against abortion on principle, and to try to discourage it in practice. But it can't be at the expense of reason. I'm against war on principle, but federal money goes toward that.
That's not pragmitism, that's an outright lie. If you work for a company and have insurance through it, and that company decides to through you under the bus by paying the 8% fine and no longer offering insurance, then you are thrown into the government plan. You have no choice in the matter.

So it's not about Pragmistim or Ideology for Obama and the Democrats. It's about lying.

Pate, NH (Sent Tuesday, November 10, 2009 9:29 AM)

And just what would you do now Pate if as you stated "your company through you under the bus"? Go with out health insurance I suppose. Your company can take your insurance away any time they choose, there is no guarantee they will continue to offer you insurance, that's where the public option comes in.
I thought this health care for all was so everyone can stay healthy through necessary and mandatory procedures.  Abortion is elective, taxpayer money should not be used.  ED drugs are elective and should not be paid for.  All electives should not be paid for.  If you are going to throw in abortion and ED drugs why not plastic surgery for ugly people or breast implants so that we build self-esteem in women.  Birth control is different.  Sometimes women and young women have medical conditions that can be treated and corrected with some forms of birth control.  Also, correct distribution and education of use will help with social health and not just personal health.
Pate -- I honestly don't think many companies will pay the fine.  I believe they only have to offer health care to not be fined.  They will simply raise the premiums so high most people won't be able to afford their company plans.
One of the true hypocrisies is that the "religious right" is further from Christian, religious, or spiritual than we can imagine. There is no listening, no real caring for the poor, no plans for the desperate...just totalitarian government rules that completely enter our lives...while hypocritically claiming that they want the gov't out. The far-right is becoming a non-Christian witch group.
C.Myles/Oak Hall, Va. (Sent Tuesday, November 10, 2009 10:47 AM
Where have you been its the Dems that are stating you must have med ins. My understanding is that when plan goes into effect that you will loose the "choice" to choose a private plan. If this is incorrect please let me know. I'm sorry but I have a horrible fear of the government! I believe that this fear was shared by our founders. If you remember medicaid and medicare were to be totally self sustaining too. We all know how that turned out! Fix the system do not throw out the good with the bad! Above all do not take away the freedom of being stupid! Not everyone makes the right decisions, government should not be able to force its idea of right! The left has made this claim for as long as I can remember why now do you think it should have that power? As Americans we must be able to fail, without that right we can not have the right to succeed!!!!
If you are going to pay for viagra and ciallis then you should pay for the abortions all this extra activity by older men cause - you can bet they are not only taking it with their spouses, probably a bunch of dirty old men, and guess who they want to impregnant - more than likely a young, fairly innocent girl (remember those rogue mormans and their cults?).
Don't want abortions to happen?  Neither do i, so pay for birth control, let the loosers who need viagra pay for it themselves, and if you can pay for the bone marker blood test for women to detect abdominal tumors (especially effective for early ovarian cancer diagnosis), then stop paying for the psa prostate bone marker blood tests for men.
Federal Law prohibits federal dollars paying for abortion, so federal law should agree to pay what ever it takes to make sure abortion is not needed.
Exceptions should be to save the life of the mother, incest, rape, or if a certified medical panel acknoledges there is no quality of life for the fetus. I've seen some of these children who were born, it is devistating for the parents and other family members.  Don't forget that baby if it lives will grow and often outlive the parents, who is gonna love and take care of that person once the parent's are dead?  One family aborted because they knew they would not outlive the child and did not feel it was fair to leave that burden to their other children, not to mention the financial drain which would leave their other children without some of the basic necessities needed to grow up and be good, responsible adults who can contribute to our society.
it was their choice, as it should always be - the parents choice, not the church, not the government, not the insurance company, but the parents who know the situation.
Sarah palin may have the money to leave in a fund to take care of her down's baby, but not everyone else does, and it matters when you think about their future - will they be in an institution that does not provide good care?  Will the regulations govorning that institution be enforced? With budget cuts you can sure count that out.
As a Christian, I know there are things much worse than death.
Obama is obviously not listening to the people of America.  Unmemployment is of much greater concern to them that health care reform.  Ironically, his health care reform would cost this nation another 500,000 jobs.... many of them highly-paid ones.  Until Obama deals with the rising unemployment problem, anoything else he accomplishes will be a non-factor with Americans.
C. Myles Well said

".just totalitarian government rules that completely enter our lives...while hypocritically claiming that they want the gov't out. The far-right is becoming a non-Christian witch group."

That GOPER MOC's could join that loony tunes charade on the Capitol steps in stead of voting on an amendment that was narrowly defeated (by their absence), clearly shows just how far that have their heads up their a***s

Pragmatism is clearly the President's style. I recall concerns by some "pundits" that the DEMs would overreach. With the President in charge, that seems unlikely. We should also appreciate the political skills of the Speaker who delivered a bill with board support in spite of the last minute abortion snipping
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That's not pragmitism, that's an outright lie. If you work for a company and have insurance through it, and that company decides to through you under the bus by paying the 8% fine and no longer offering insurance, then you are thrown into the government plan. You have no choice in the matter.
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Pate, (sigh) now tell me, how is it a "lie"? Under any plan in consideration now, you are not being forced by that plan to change your insurance if you like it.
Even now, if your employer decides to drop your insurance you will need to make other plans. The difference being that now you really have nowhere economically feasible to go. If you have a safety net available, a good Public Option, then you will at least have insurance you can afford.

Please, try to think through what rush and glenn are telling you before you regurgitate it back to us.
A lie? no, it's not.

Please, try thinking for yourself.
With unemployment, "true" unemployment at 17%, what idiot would believe this monstrous piece of Pelosi garbage won't bust the budget?  Hint to the Dems:  In order to buy health insurance, one must have a job.  Maybe that's too difficult a concept for Dems to comprehend.  One must be employed, bring home a pay check, have money.  So the government can steal it and provide for the fat, lazy, stupid people.  
"guess you forgot, Obie, that you said no federal $ would pay for abortions. Another of your lies and broken promises."

Sorry to have to inform you, but just because this amendment was proposed and passed does not mean federal funds were ever going to be used for abortions.  A 1977 law, known as the Hyde Amendment, already prevents use of federal money to fund abortions.   This whole Stupak thing was just a ruse to stir up emotional outrage and muddy the waters.
"Obama is obviously not listening to the people of America.  Unmemployment is of much greater concern to them that health care reform."

Did it ever occur to you that if an employer cannot afford to provide health insurance to the employees he has, he is unlikely to hire more employees?  Think!
The house bill is $1.2 trillion over 10 years.

$120 billion per year.

$4,000 per year for 10 years for every man, woman and child, legal or illegal, in the United States.

Can someone tell me what it is that we're getting for the money?

Is it on top of the $7,666 per man, woman and child that we spend on health care now?

"Maybe that's too difficult a concept for Dems to comprehend.  One must be employed, bring home a pay check, have money.  So the government can steal it and provide for the fat, lazy, stupid people."

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25 Years of Reaganim has left a mark, eh?  Let's see, all welfare recipients sit around all day, watch free cable TV, go the liquor store and buy booze and smokes with food stamps.  You want reality?  he vst majority of recipients are under working age or senior citizens.  Not quite the nice, neat argument that Glen and Rush and Sean hand you -- but they have never been big on reality.

Sorry -- in the last twenty-five years, I don't see the beauty and grace of the "free market."  Can you imagine what social security would look like if the neo-cons had privatized it?  Last fall's meltdown would have taken billions -- and where would people turn?

While government isn't the answer to every problem, those who claim that government can't run anything -- could it create an Enron or World.Com or AIG?  Could it invent a Madoff?

William Cohen, a republican and vital public servant said it best: "Government is the enemy until you need a friend."
In all of my years of working in Florida in Healthcare, I cannot recall a time EVER when Abortion was covered by Insurance.  Who are these providers that cover Abortion?  It has always, always been a cash on demand procedure.  It should stay that way.
Health care reform should create lots of new job openings, if they keep the provision that allows 55-65 year old retirees to purchase affordable health insurance you will see quite a few job openings, we don't want to work til we are 70 (we did not stay drunk and stoned til we were 40 like George W so we don't want to work until we are too old to enjoy being retired), that is a win win for everybody, employers get to rehire and pay the new folks less than what we who have been at our positions a long time make, plus more people will go to the doctor, which means he/she will need more nurses, more receptionists, more people booking appointments - I see a huge growth in the medical field of employment and that has got to be a good thing for the unemployment numbers.
I guess it bothers some folks they may have to re-train for a position or change their profession - too bad, boohoo, not one bit sad for you, I've done it several times (things were not very rosey when Regan was president, actually jobs were not just scarce, they were darned near invisible - I cleaned houses while he was in office) and anyone needing to work can do the same, you just have to be honest, respectable, and reliable.  Sure would not hurt my feelings one bit to know a health insurance CEO had to clean toilets for a living.
guess you forgot, Obie, that you said no federal $ would pay for abortions. Another of your lies and broken promises.
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Dear Liar-Liar:  There is something called the Hyde Amendment passed back in 1978 that prevents any federal funding being spent on abortions. The LAW hasn't changed, nor will it change.  To the contrary, the Stupek amendment goes too far in restricting the choices of women by not allowing them to purchase private health insurance with their own money if the policy allows abortions; and, it may be unconstitutional as it relates to privacy rights and choice.  You may call President Obama a liar, but I call you a blubbering, sniveling moron who doesn't know what you're talking about.  
FR: Because he [Obama]had promised that ‘if you’re happy and satisfied with the insurance that you have, it’s not going to change.’

That's not pragmitism, that's an outright lie. If you work for a company and have insurance through it, and that company decides to through you under the bus by paying the 8% fine and no longer offering insurance, then you are thrown into the government plan. You have no choice in the matter.

So it's not about Pragmistim or Ideology for Obama and the Democrats. It's about lying.
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Apparently, you can only remember Repub talking points. If your COMPANY decides to throw you under the bus (not Obama) and you are forced to get your own insurance you will be able to choose from any of the insurance options in the exchange.  One of those OPTIONS could be the public/govt plan.  All of the others choices will be from your precious do no wrong private insurance companies.  Choose one of those and stop complaining about gov't healthcare. It's an OPTION!!!
Abortion/Pro-Choice:
 Everyone needs to be pragmatic-for a little bit longer. Hold your fire and keep your powder dry.
  36 million people need health care. If a Dem. Liberal from San Francisco can get it done,
everyone else can.
Then go after the opposition.


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