Obama: The turning points

LB, Virginia — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:29:39 GMT

I am sorry, but someone needs to check Pfleger's bank account. Either the Republicans or the Clintons bought this guy off. Why in the world would he want to yet again rub salt in Obama's pastor wound? Nope, he's a plant, and it's no surprise to us that he's come out on THURSDAY before a primary. This smear campaign has to stop, and we need to get to the bottom of this. The guy spoke on Sunday, why didn't it come out Monday? Because Hillary is so desperate to win, and the right wing media is also so hoping for her to win that they are now buying people to smear Obama. Sorry, this is 2008, and we know that nothing, I mean nothing, happens by accident in a political race.

Obama: The turning points

Ron, California — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:29:55 GMT

Women Scorned
By E. J. Dionne

WASHINGTON -- How much anger is there among women about how Hillary Clinton has been treated during this campaign? Some of the nation's leading female politicians will tell you: quite a lot.

"From the beginning, she's been treated very badly," says Therese Murray, the president of the Massachusetts Senate. "No woman would have run with Obama's resume. She wouldn't have been considered." But Clinton has been "demonized by the press and the talking heads. How do you get away with that?"

Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D-Fla., says she is regularly approached "by women of all races, of all ages, of all faiths. They stop me, grab my hand and say, 'Look what they've done to her, we were so close.' They wanted this for their daughters and granddaughters. ... It's so heartbreaking."

For Rep. Darlene Hooley, D-Ore., the symbol that "sexism reigns supreme" was in the wide availability of offensive anti-Hillary paraphernalia in stores and on the Internet. For Barbara Johnson, president of the Minneapolis City Council, Clinton may have been the victim of "ageism" as much as sexism. The message, she said, was: "Your time is past, it's time for somebody new to take your place."

Many women, said Rep. Ellen Tauscher, D-Calif., "knew we had made many strides. They asked, 'Aren't we past this? What's going on?' They're not happy with what they see as sexism, permitted by the media and in some cases encouraged by the media."

If there is good news for Barack Obama in any of this, it is that the rage felt by Clinton's female supporters is directed in large part toward the media. "The anger is aimed much more at you all," said Lt. Gov. Elizabeth Roberts of Rhode Island. Added Murray: "Obama wouldn't have gotten to where he got today if it weren't for the bias of the male media -- no offense."

It's true that campaigns and political movements use anger as a bargaining chip. The message is: Appease us or we will cause trouble. The Clinton campaign is hoping that such rage will strengthen its hand in the battle to seat pro-Clinton Michigan and Florida delegations at the party's national convention, even though those states held early primaries in violation of party rules.

But the conversations I had this week with prominent female politicians from around the country who support Clinton suggest that the fury and disappointment is about more than short-term maneuvering. In many cases, it is rooted in the empathy of women who themselves broke gender barriers at various levels of politics.

Murray, for example, is the first woman to lead the Massachusetts Senate. Hooley was the first woman on the City Council in West Linn, Ore., and the first woman elected as a commissioner of Clackamas County. Johnson says proudly that she is the second woman to serve as president of the Minneapolis City Council. Her mother was the first.

"She (Clinton) is striking a chord among women who have been involved in politics for a long time and who have been waiting for a long time," said Nancy Kopp, Maryland's treasurer.

Female politicians feel for Clinton as someone who regularly faces questions male politicians would never be asked. When a reporter queried Roberts about "my brand of lipstick and what color was it," she revealed the vital information -- "Revlon Number 235" -- but noted that "some of my supporters were offended that she asked me."

These are professional politicians, so they know that Clinton is on the verge of defeat because of her campaign's organizational mistakes, its failure to take Obama seriously early on, and the difficulties created by her husband's presence. Roberts points to an age split among women, noting that her 19-year-old daughter Kathleen is a staunch Obama supporter. Obama, Kopp said, clearly has a strong appeal "among younger women, though that's true among many older women, too."

Indeed, Obama has the support of many prominent female elected officials, notably Sens. Claire McCaskill of Missouri and Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota, and Govs. Janet Napolitano of Arizona and Kathleen Sebelius of Kansas. He won significant female support in the primaries, carrying a majority of the women's vote in 13 states and splitting it evenly with Clinton in Wisconsin.

Nonetheless, even these very pragmatic female politicians who very much want a Democrat to win the White House are looking for signs of "understanding and respect," said Kopp.

"It's a campaign, someone wins, someone doesn't win, that's life," she said. "But women don't want to be totally dissed."

postchat@aol.com
Copyright 2008, Washington Post Writers Group

Page Printed from: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/05/women_scorned.html at May 30, 2008 - 06:30:33 AM PDT

Obama: The turning points

the Pajama Pundit — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:29:56 GMT

Give me a friggin' break. THIS IS NEWS?!!?!

War. Economy. Health care. Education.

Talk about REAL issues here - you are better than this MSNBC! (I'm looking at you Mika)

http://thepajamapundit.com/

Obama: The turning points

Neighbor to the North — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:30:01 GMT

++++++++++ Important Question

Could someone please explain to me why it is Sen. Clinton quotes an actual Associated Press article where she refers to white working class voters --and is suddenly being accused - from multiple sides - of playing the race card? And now, we have Sen. Obama’s church back in the news with vile, hatred rhetoric coming from the pulpit and this is not racist?

When Sen. Obama, who I might ad, was not even quoting any report (simply spoke from his heart) stated ‘typical white people’ in his interview while explaining his relationship with Rev. Wright – was not accused of a racist statement. Also, his remarks of “bitter, small town, gun totting – bible clinging voters with antipathy toward people who are not like them” - this is not racist? It is OK for Sen. Obama to refer to fellow people this way? I am really not understanding the double standard here. 98% of African Americans in the state of PA voted for Sen. Obama…. That wasn’t racist? And it is the Clintons who are being accused of playing the race card? Something is seriously wrong with this picture here.

Has anyone who actually voted for Sen. Obama --read his books? OR (more importantly) noticed several rather disturbing inconsistencies within the past several months? Which, I might remind readers include:

1. Stating that he was completely ‘unaware’ of Rev. Wrights views of America
--only to change his story three days after saying this to “Yes, I was aware but I do not agree with his points of view”

2. Regarding Tony Resko’s association and Mr. Resko’s contributions to Sen. Obama’s campaign. Sen. Obama first stated, “Mr. Resko’s contributions were insignificant” only to change this story to “Yes, during my Senate campaign it was a higher amount than originally reported – however this was merely an ‘oversight’

3. Association with William Ayers – admitted terrorist. First Sen. Obama stated – “We live in the same neighborhood, so naturally I know him from the neighborhood” - only for his campaign to state – “yes, they know each other and are on very friendly terms.”

4. Meeting with the Canadians (which BTW was widely reported here) on NAFTA prior to the Ohio primary. First Sen. Obama denied anyone from his campaign spoke with Canadian officials; only to change this several days later to “Yes, we did in fact meet however it was at the Canadians request”.

5. The latest on Iran. May 18th Sen. Obama stated that Iran is NOT a significant threat only to change this two days later on May 20th – to “Yes, they are a significant threat”.

So I do not understand the back and forth -consistency of Sen. Obamas inconsistencies?

It is rather disturbing to see. Have Americans become so desperate for change that they simply could care less about habitual – reparative patterns of inconsistencies (out right lies?). Rev. Wright himself stated in his interview – “Sen. Obama is a politician and as a politician he simply says what he has to say in order to be elected.”

Just curious about the decision making methodology (judgment) of the American voter. Turning points?? What about "Facts"?

Thank you,
Alice
Toronto Canada

Obama: The turning points

Pete - Albany, NY — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:30:49 GMT

...so I made the mistake of turning on Morning Joe this morning. You folks and MSNBC disappoint me.

What was the top story...more on Scott McClellan after his interview with Keith Olbermann last night...tomorrow's all-important RBC meeting?

No...so nice to see that Senator Obama's critics can count on you to pick up the ball and run with any stupid story like this!

THIS was your top story on Morning Joe today?

Is this REALLY all anyone can find? Grow up.

Obama: The turning points

Lisa, New Britain, CT Passionate about Obama — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:31:27 GMT

I certainly have no quarrel with Axelrod.

As for this latest preacher...can I say that I am just so sick of preachers and pastors and regular church-goers and outloud Christian folk acting very un-Christianlike.

That is why I judge people on actions on not on whether they go to church regularly or wear a Crucifix or cross or Star of David or flag pin.

Some of the most unChristianlike people I've met go to church regularly and wear crosses. I have never understood that.

But for preachers to say that garbage...is just ridiculous. That's the problem here. This is not a Barack Obama problem, this is a religion and Church problem.

Obama: The turning points

Will the REAL Obama please stand up? — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:32:03 GMT

Ok Obamatots, here we have Pastor Pfleger as a visiting minister in Obama's church. The culture of the church is such that Pfleger feels comfortable to make outrageous racial statements, denigrating remarks about HRC and promoting "white supremacy". Do you STILL really believe BO had no idea about Irreverent Wright's beliefs? Do you STILL really believe he NEVER heard such things in that church? And, to top it off, this is ANOTHER hate-filled pastor who until just days ago was on BO's religion committee. I saw an interview last night confirming that Pfleger and BO have known each other 20 years and have a close friendship. I suppose you'll believe BO if he says he didn't know these things about Pfleger either. People, wake up and smell the coffee, throw out the koolaid. Obama is DECEIVING you about his beliefs. He hangs out with racists, crooks, Hamas followers. Is this REALLY what you want in a President?

Obama: The turning points

Eric, Salinas, CA — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:32:13 GMT

Obama: The turning points

Bobby H., Miami, FL — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:35:06 GMT

Isn't Michael Pfleger Catholic. If so, why the not-too-subtle attempt to say that he's part of the Trinity Church body by MSNBC? Look, this sermon was given this past Sunday. OBAMA WASN'T EVEN THERE and hasn't been involved in that church for Months! Yet, the Media now want's Obama to be the guarantor for every that's said after he's effectively left the Chuch? Perhaps the Media should go to Obama's barbershop, dentist, pharmacist and doctor and see what they (or the patients, customers) are saying.

This is ridiculous, honestly.

As it pertains to Rev. Wright, anyone who says that Obama received political or social advice from that man is a fool. Obama's friends with Colin Powell, Nunn, Carter, Robert Reich, Dick Lugar and a whole host of who's who in politics, to suggest that Wright shapes Obama's political views is simply naive.

Obama: The turning points

Linda. Boston, MA — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:35:08 GMT

People have been commenting on Hillary's perceived sense of entitlement since this whole thing started. Her campaign was based on the premise that she had already won, and that Obama has no business trying to take what's rightfully hers.

Even Young Hillary had that same sense of entitlement.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAu39I5QOUc

So I really don't see anything inaccurate about his core message. Where he went wrong was mocking her and making fun of her.

Obama: The turning points

clairton, pa. — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:35:08 GMT

I find no fault with Pfleger. Speak about it brother, 'er, father!

Obama: The turning points

Carrie in Texas — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:36:08 GMT

Pfleger, Hagee, Wright, Parsley, Roberston, Falwell, etc. I have 5 words:

SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE.

This campaign on both sides has been all about guilt by association. Enough is enough. Let's talk about the issues. There's a reason the founding fathers wanted to keep religiosity (and all its characters) separate from governance. Let's move on.

Obama: The turning points

Dave, NYC — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:37:36 GMT

I don't know why this new pastor thing is an issue. I'm tired of the six degrees of separation thing going on with the media. You in the media are really letting the American people down with flaming these non-stories.

Obama: The turning points

J. Ellis, Virginia — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:42:56 GMT

I fail to understand how or why this clergyman's actions should impact Sen. Obama and his campaign one way or the other. Many people make the dual argument that we don't know enough about Sen. Obama, so he has to be like all the people he knows that behave badly. Sen. Obama has been campaigning and in the public eye for well over a year now. Yet, these same Obama-haters say they know all they need to know about both Rev. Wright and now Father Pfleger from just a few seonds of sound bites. It makes no sense. This guilt by association thing is tired and weak.

Senator Obama has been very complimentary and kind to Senator Clinton, who has not returned the courtesy. Instead she has whined and complained and has done her best to wreck the Democratic party and mortally wound Sen. Obama. But it won't work---NOT THIS TIME!

GO OBAMA 08/12

Obama: The turning points

Mark Forcelledo — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:43:12 GMT

This morning on 'Morning Joe', David Axelrod downplayed this incident.
Shouldn't the real question of concern be,
"If Senator Obama finds these types of comments and statement devicive and detrimental, and these comments seem to be coming from this one particular church, that the Senator and his family attended for YEARS, why does he continue to associate with this church who have shown they not only embrace these types of comments, but believe them at the core?"

Lets look at it from what we know from this point.

Senator Obama joined this church when he was looking to start a political career in Illinois, because it was the largest church in his district and a good political operative will tell you that getting into a large community based organization is the first organization you join when trying to get elected.
So, he choose a church based on what was in it for him, not a philisophical kinship with the message.

Doesn't this open up the issue of decision making abilities in an individual?

Obama: The turning points

Bobby H, Miami, FL — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:44:30 GMT

To "Will the Real Obama please stand up":

You don't know what you're talking about.

HRC doesn't have any skeletons in her closet? She doesn't associate with unsavory characters? In the waning days of the CLinton presidency, she and Bubba allowed her brothers to sell pardons for profit. In other words, she pimped the presidency. The reason this hasn't been reported is because she hasn't been the frontrunner for months. This, among others, is the reason why the Repubs have been chomping at the bit to have her win the nomination. And "no," White Middle-Class Americans would not like that.

Hillary has a lot of dirt since leaving the White House. She hasn't been fully vetted for her acts for the past 8 years. Look at all the pardons Bubby granted in the last days of his presidency; you'll be sickened.

Obama: The turning points

Class Warrior, D.C. — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:46:56 GMT

Look, people, I'm an Obama supporter, and I believe those uneducated whites in WVa and Ky are knuckle-dragging, retarded inbreds. The only virgins in those 2 states are girls who can outrun both thier daddies AND their brothers. Ok. I said it. Having said it, though, I realize, and hope you do as well, that Obama definitely does NOT share my distain for Appalacian whites. Just because I say those offensive things doesn't mean Obama shares my views. Let's get real here, Faux News, every stupid, offensive thing someone's supporters say does NOT necessarily mean the candidate agrees with it. (Unless of course you're Faux News, the propoganda arm of the Bush Administration. You can be forgiven, because you were never in businesss to tell the straight, unbiased truth.)

Obama: The turning points

will the REAL Obama please stand up — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:47:34 GMT

Actually that pastor was 100% correct that "Desperate" Hillary thought she was entitled to be the nominee because she was white and a woman. She didn't think she had to win by playing by the rules because she thought she had the party elders wrapped around her little finger.
*********
So, Eric, can we assume you attend Trinity with Obama? Sounds like you believe the same crap he does. What kind of person believes it's ok to say that trash in the pulpit? I'll bet you're one of those, too, that calls people "racist" when they question Obama about substance and issues. I bet you're one, too, that thinks it was okay to call that reporter "sweetie" and refer to his grandmother as a "typical white person." And, it was probably okay with you that Obama called small town mid-Americans bigots. IF BO gets to the White House, I see nothing but a huge division in this country. Seems odd to me that a man who preaches "unity" set in a church for 20 years that obviously taught him whites are evil and to keep separate from them.

Obama: The turning points

Class Warrior, D.C. — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:48:14 GMT

Look, people, I'm an Obama supporter, and I believe those uneducated whites in WVa and Ky are knuckle-dragging, retarded inbreds. The only virgins in those 2 states are girls who can outrun both their daddies AND their brothers. Ok. I said it. Having said it, though, I realize, and hope you do as well, that Obama definitely does NOT share my distain for Appalacian whites. Just because I say those offensive things doesn't mean Obama shares my views. Let's get real here, Faux News, every stupid, offensive thing someone's supporters say does NOT necessarily mean the candidate agrees with it. (Unless of course you're Faux News, the propoganda arm of the Bush Administration. You can be forgiven, because you were never in businesss to tell the straight, unbiased truth.)

Obama: The turning points

siCK OF THE LIES — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:51:47 GMT

This Pastor Pfleger is WHITE. Do you all think he is racists against white people?

Please people. Has everyone forgotten about Hillary's little "hardworking people, WHITE hardworking people". I mean these words actually CAME OUT OF HER MOUTH. Yes, she was quoting the AP, but she didn't quote them correctly, she added the WHITE part.

So it is okay for Hillary to insinuate that only white people are hardworking, and WHITE people will only vote for her-WORDS OUT OF HER OWN MOUTH-yet people are in a fit about some guy at Obama's church saying that Hillary thought she was entitled to the Presidency because she was white.

WHO CARES.

And Obama HAS denounced and rejected these statements and Pflege has apologized.

WHich is more than I can say for HRC after her little ASSASSINATION remark. She DID NOT APOLOGIZE for saying this.

Can't wait until next week when HRC is out of the picture for good anyway.

Obama: The turning points

voter — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:52:26 GMT

to neighbor of the north: your comment about Hillary quoting the AP article is not correct. The article never said that white people are hardworking. the article stated that she received the white working class vote. Her comment was divisive and it did not receive the media attention it should have received. I still believe she has received prefential treamtment. Point take, the current priest making a comment is news. Where is the story? Obama should apologize for every single comment people make about Hillary. He cannot control other people's actions, only his own. When you have Hillary making divisive comments and assassination references, it is turned on a blind eye. It is ludicrious. Judge someone for what they do no what a priest, pastor, store clerk, etc says. If not, than candidates should be held responsible for the comments their supporters/voters make. After awhile, it becomes silly season.

Obama: The turning points

Jeremy KS — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:52:50 GMT

I met a guy once, played pool with him regularly. Years later I read that he had killed his wife and was naturaly shocked. I suppose that if I were to run for President, I would obviously be a murderer as I had some oblique knowledge of his existence...

Obama: The turning points

twinoftwins, WA — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:53:05 GMT

Obama is not responible for what people say. All he can say is that he is against it and he did that already. I can not believe people of God can talk this way. Not just this church all churches that say similar things, it is not how God would like us to behave. But don't blame Obama for this as you will be doing a great wrong, he is not like that, his actions speak for him not the people around him

Obama: The turning points

infogiant, austin, tx — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:55:15 GMT

Mika can only talk about issues she can wrap her brain around. How she has a job is beyond me...other than someone who's actually dumber than Joe and isn't capable of going toe to toe with him and make him storm off the show like Rachel Maddow does.

They covered Haggee for one day...Wright for two months. Why, trying to get the Fox Crowd to switch over, just like they did during the run up to war (they being all networks).

http://infogiant.wordpress.com/

Obama: The turning points

gmhussein, Jupiter, Fl — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:59:50 GMT

Of course the guest pastor was right, thats exactly how she thinks and thought she was entitled.

For me, I thought it was hilarious (pardon the choice of word) I am so tired of HRC and her rabid followers spouting nonsense about sexism. They seem to see it everywhere. Ladies! She is the wrong candidate for POTUS. Just because she is a woman does not qualify her, go find someone else with a better moral compass and a better disposition.

As woman she disgusts me, and as for being a Democrat, well the DNC and their state and county arms will never see a nickel of my money again.

Obama: The turning points

James Lawton, OK — Fri, 30 May 2008 13:59:55 GMT

The way the pastor mocked Hillary was the problem i had with the sermon not what he said because as many people have said the same thing before. Her thoughts were probley not she was white so she deserves it, it was more like I'm HRC so i deserve the nomination. Look back at her interviews before super tuesday were she says this will be over by then, is that not just a little presumtious, she did not even plan on the campaign going all the way as you can see by her current money problems. Then after she lost 11 in a row then she wants to come out and say she has been discriminated against, as if to say where did this guy come from and he has no right to even still be in the race. To me this is her own doing had she not been so cocky she would have most likely been the candidate that was picked as i was once an HRC supporter. The other thing about Obama not being qualified for the position because of his lack of experince in the beginning should have been a plus for HRC because even the black vote was on her side in the beginning. bottom line is she ran a poor campaign and has lost because of that know everyone wants to play the blame game. Unbelievable!

Obama: The turning points

Roy Williams, Chicago Illinois — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:02:50 GMT

>> LB Virgina:

I am sorry, but someone needs to check Pfleger's bank account. Either the Republicans or the Clintons bought this guy off. <<

Sorry to burst your bubble, but Pfleger is a long time supporter of the types things he preaches, and is a good friend both of Obama's church, and of Obama. Pfleger is as nutty as they come in the Chicago area and works closely with Jesse Jacskon, Louis Farrakhan, and the rest of the black separatists in the Chicago area.

Obama: The turning points

Joyce — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:04:08 GMT

BTW since when are "Priest" call Rev. I'm not catholic but I didn't think they were addressed as "Rev" or are you trying to make a tighter link. Bet you're really sad he's white and not black....then you could have really made it an issue of "black rage".

How about the message...plenty of people do feel like she thought and ran her campaign as though she was entitled. Now that's she's lost sexism is the reason...maybe she was just a "poor' messanger for women's causes..duh!!! As I remeber a year ago she was suppose to have this locked up...all women would rally to her side ( she played the gender card enough). If that was the cases HOW did she lose. Why don't you ask some of the women who ARE NOT supporting her why they are not. If they had (there are more women) then surely she would have won...right?

Obama: The turning points

Rachel Sumners, Mobile, AL — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:06:12 GMT

Chicago is a hot-bed for the type of politics Pflager and the rest of crew, Wright, Jackson, etc., preach. How they stay exempt from the tax laws that say you can't do politics in churches is a real mystery. Obama is no different then these people. In fact, he his those people. He just puts a veneer over it to fool the masses.

Obama: The turning points

jdobson — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:10:24 GMT

(YAAAAWWWWNNN!) Sorry, no tossing and turning tonight! I'll sleep well knowing Obama will be the next POTUS.

Obama: The turning points

Andrea, New York City — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:10:25 GMT

Why do Black folks have to constantly denounce and distance themselves from everything that white folks don't want to hear and white folks can say and do anything they want.

Do I see a double standard here ????

Also what did he say that was wrong?

Obama: The turning points

OhioWantsRevote — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:14:18 GMT

This man isn't even the pastor at the church...so Obama is responsible for everything anyone says to support him and negative agnist Clinton now?

Hope they don't get wind of what I said.....

Obama: The turning points

MI Chick — Fri, 30 May 2008 14:18:58 GMT

Will the REAL Obama please stand up? (Sent Friday, May 30, 2008 9:32 AM)

The priest is WHITE - or didn't you see that? Is what he said not true?