First thoughts: Showdown over security

Ron Indiana — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:17:00 GMT

When I was a kid, I thought Memorial Day always fell on a Sunday. My grandma and I climbed into the 1940 (something) Dodge and off we went to the cemetery. It was the day we decorated the graves of local and family heroes: Fallen service men and women from the Civil War, WWI and WWII. After a while I would become bored, go to the car and turn on the radio; just in time to hear the announcer say, “Gentlemen, start your engines!” Back then it took about 4 hours for race cars to complete 500 miles. Our family was as poor as a clod of dirt and I never thought I would get to see the Indy 500. By Sunday evening the cemetery was transformed into a sea of freshly cut flowers and American flags. Wall-mart wasn’t around yet to sell silk/plastic flowers.

Years passed and I began to realize that Memorial Day was not just the unofficial beginning of summer, but a holiday as important as Thanksgiving and Christmas. It is a day when liberals and conservatives, together, can reflect on the soldiers who gave their lives for our country, a time to pray for America, a time to pray for our President, a time to visit a WWII veteran in a nursing home, a time to say thanks to a Viet Nam vet, a time to thank a vet who returned from Iraq or Afghanistan. It is, indeed, a special holiday.

Did I ever get to an Indy 500 race? I did, the year I received my doctorate degree I treated myself and my new wife to Grandstand seats looking down on Pit Row.

Have a safe Memorial Day everyone.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:18:44 GMT

First thoughts…

Holy Smokes! Ed Schultz has been on FIRE the last 24 hours! First the ‘cage match’ with Ron Paul last night and then the beat down he put on Joe the Schmoe this morning! Can’t tell you how refreshing it was to see a guest on that show that doesn’t back down and let Joe yell over them!!! Being a ‘lefty’ myself I have to admit that I don’t always agree with Ed – but he did a hell of a job this morning. **Stand & Applause**

Which brings me to my next point – I’m sorry but Mika has to be adopted! How can a father as brilliant as hers produce such a lip pouting camera mugging clueless twit like her?

Another thing that has come to mind is that Dickhead Cheney is really Joseph Mengela (sp?) reincarnated! Open a dictionary & look up evil – you’ll see a 8x10 full color photo of the Dick!

So the RNC wants to pass resolutions on name calling? Then the Republican Taliban seems fitting! Dontcha think?

And my LAST thoughts on that flea ridden ‘Bad Chihuahua’ from a previous post from yesterday:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

FR: Bad Chihuahua should be banned from this site for hostile and racist statements. While many of us put up with these for a while, he/she went way too far today. Please consider banning this poster.
LB, Virginia (Sent Wednesday, May 20, 2009 5:02 PM)
I whole heartedly agree with you LB – having said that it would be impossible to ban the little ba@stard as he would just show up under a different moniker (which I think he already does). I do think a good neutering is in order – maybe he wouldn’t lick himself so much!

And I cannot wait to hear our President today on the Guantanamo debacle! Should make for an interesting afternoon…

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Timeless — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:20:03 GMT

Another Obama (Michelle) on the cover of Newsweak. Imagine that. Is grandma sure to follow?

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Pat, Boston, MA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:21:39 GMT

Dick Cheney - Too Little, Too Late. Actually, 7 Years Too Late.

As you all know, it is coming up now to the 65th anniversary of the landing in Normandy. I've been going back in time these last few weeks thinking about our own history since WWII ended in 1945. Our fathers and grandfathers gave all they had so that we could defeat nazism. They did it for us, for our future. I have been struck and quite moved by the reporting in recent weeks by Keith Olbermann, Rachel Maddow, Chris Matthews, Ed Schultz & David Shuster and all of their guests. They get it. They get what our country is supposed to be all about.

I think back to the McCarthy era with Edward R. Murrow's reporting and Eisenhower literally doing nothing about the witch hunts; I think back to Richard Nixon and Watergate and his enemies lists; I think about J. Edgar Hoover and his spying on MLK and JFK and many others. I think about Ronald Reagan and the Iran/Contra affair. I think about Newt Gingrich's own hypocrisy as he tried to bring down President Clinton. I think about Tom DeLay and his phony religious culture wars. I think about Hannity and O'Reilly and Limbaugh. The similarities between them and Jos. Goebbels I'm afraid to say is stunning. They're not reporters. They are propagandists. And I think about GWB and Dick Cheney and their leadership since 9/11. The neo-cons it appears made all the important decisions. All wrong decisions.

The GOP ruin everything they touch when they are in powerful positions. They are not more patriotic than democrats. It is something they have tried to sell us whenever they come upon someone who disagrees with their own immature childish outlook.

Most of us are not far left wing anything. We're just Americans who want some answers as to why we went into Iraq. I don't expect President Obama to push for investigations. He has said as much. What I do expect is for the media to continue looking under every single rock and bring to light what they uncover.

We owe it to our fathers and grandfathers to take a moment this weekend to remember and be thankful for their courage, and their dignity. These were men who never bragged. This is because they knew first hand the real horrors of war. They never thought of themselves as heroes. We owe it to our troops to get some answers as to why they had to go on 2, 3, 4 tours of Iraq. We owe it to the family members who lost loved ones in Iraq. We owe it to our troops who are there now. These same troops who just 8, 9, 10 years ago we as family members were making sure we could take these kids to Fenway and Yankee Stadium to see Pedo and Roger and Randy pitch; to see to it that they got an opportunity to see a playoff game in October. These are the "kids" who are now in Iraq and Afghanistan. We as well owe it to the Iraqi civilians for the deaths they have had to endure.

This is the United States of America. And we cannot learn a damn thing unless we get to the truth as to what happened in the months leading up to March 2003. It is the least we can do as citizens. As American citizens. And if you look on the internet, you will see that there are thousands of citizens fighting every single day to keep the pressure on. It's what being an American means.
______________________________

MSNBC - Thank you for the great reporting we continue to see day in, day out. Your on air hosts are professional, intelligent, progressive and hell bent on getting to the truth, even if it means holding President Obama's feet to the fire. It is critical that we never again have another Iraq. Your hosts know this. You can hear it in their voices and their guests' voices.

This is what the media is for. This is what Congress is for. These are challenging times. Senator Whitehouse, please don't back down. We have had too much backing down in our history. And we have paid a huge price because of it.

We caught Saddam Hussein but not Osama Bin Laden. It makes no sense. We can thank Dick Cheney & Co. for that as he gives yet another national security speech. btw, there wasn't much of a debate over the Iraq invasion. It just wasn't allowed. We were considered unAmerican. As usual. And so now Cheney wants a debate? That's a laugh.

Have a safe Memorial Day weekend everyone. I'm off to Normandy today. 65 years. Wow.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Beverly in Chicago — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:21:40 GMT

Inert C-4 explosives proves our country is not as vulnerable as Cheney will explode over the air waves today. Individuals who want to "something to America," should be given their day in court just like the detainees should be given.
At least the individuals who were caught in New York will be innocent until proven guilty. If the United States is to fight global terrorism then it should set example so that the international can follow suit.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Cal Blakemore, SC — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:22:29 GMT

First Read: (“That is what the president thinks about every morning when he wakes up and every night when he goes to sleep”);

When Barack Obama wakes up in the morning, and after he lights up his Marlboro, he thinks about the problems confronting him for the day, and says to himself: "What would Dick Cheney do?".

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Steve Biko, NY — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:23:49 GMT

Cheney seems lost .. like a world war II Japanese soldier from the jungle appearing in the 50s still thinking thAt war is going on.

Dick, you should have run for pesident with your torture doctrine ... but you didnt.
You uttered two words to the press in 8 years, why should we pay attention to you now ?

Its a shame to watch a man lose his dignity, creating a legacy that TORTURE is good for America .. its a crying shame !

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Rick,Ky — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:24:06 GMT

Yesterday was a Sad day for American's! Fear, once again was used as a Tool to scare American's. I do agree that a plan needs to be put in place to close Gauntanomoe, however Fear should never be used against American's by the people they elect to serve.

As a result of yesterday's vote, President Obama & Attorney General Holder, yersterday evening showed who's calling the Shot's. The 1st detainee is being brought to New York for Trial.

Take That, those who still wanna use FEAR to scare American's !

FBI director Mueller needs to be Fired. His use of Fear is Unacceptable to American's. We voted that Fear tactic out of office, however some still have'nt received the memo. When the Top law enforcement officer can No longer do his job because he's Scared, replace him !

Does he really think that Radicals are gonna come enmasse on our shore's & Attack Our Prison system to get their Virgin loving buddies released ? How Incompetent is he ? Moral issues which are OK for the Military, are ignored for our Prison Officer's.

Moussai(20th hijacker) has been detained in Our prison system since 2002 ( i think)without a single incident.

Chicken George was Hailed for staying true to his Conviction's (Right or Wrong), President Obama is gonna stay true to his also, whether some of ya like it or Not.

Harry Ried had better grow a backbone, because his Leadership is in question. America overwhelmingly gave Barack Obama a Mandate last November, & the Senate Democrats had better step up soon or we will replace them also.

Letting an incompetent Minority rule the Government Process is Unacceptable !

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Suburban Mom paying attention, IL — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:24:06 GMT

"But we get the next-best thing today: a debate between the two over torture and security policies."
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Huh? What is the matter with you people- THIS IS NOT A DEBATE!!! President Obama is going to speak- and then Former VP Cheney- who no longer works for us (if he ever did) gets to respond in front of a bunch of neocons. How does this resemble a debate in any way? They aren't even the same room for crying out loud. Somebody tell Chuck Todd to go sniff out a real story. His breathless excitement over this false equivalency is downright amateurish.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

A.Powers — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:24:10 GMT

Obama is being upstaged by a former VP! More people are interested in what Cheney has to say then what Obama is going to babble about. So where has Barack's Mo-Jo gone?

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Nataile Wood — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:25:05 GMT

We need a little more wood on the Supreme Court.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Capt. Jack — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:27:40 GMT

First Read; Very quietly yesterday, the Obama administration did something the previous Bush administration could never do: issue a memo to all federal agencies to be mindful of states rights.

The wording of this memo may seem contradictory to those on the right who want to believe that the Obama administration wants to concentrate MORE power with the federal government.

----------------------

A memo!? Ohhhh, a memo! Too funny. Obama also put out a memo talking about closing Gitmo. That's not happening now either is it?

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Joe T, Alexandria, VA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:28:37 GMT

So, the Congress has voted to deny Obama the funding need to close Gitmo. Congressmen are falling all over themselves to convince their constituents that Gitmo detainees will not be held in their districts. The director of the FBI has stated publicly that bringing detainees to the USA could pose a number of risks. And our fabulous allies have mostly spurned our requests to send detainees to their countries.

Hmmmm, I wonder what all the commotion is about? Could it be that the Gitmo detainees are bad people, ideological fanatics who are determined to do harm to freedom loving folks, and therefore no one wants them in their back yard? Yup, that sounds about right. But these are the same people we’re supposed to bend over backwards for to ensure they are treated in a manner that is consistent with our ‘values’?

Give me a freakin break, the only value these thugs understand is that killing Americans is the most honorable thing for them to do on this good earth. All of the bleeding heart liberal idiots on this blog who think we should treat this garbage with kid gloves should be required to house one of these guys in your own home. Then you can regale the rest of us with stories about what really decent, misunderstood human beings they are. Assuming, of course, that you’re still alive to tell us the tale.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Brandon Coy, Oregon — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:29:26 GMT

Nice bi-partisan vote to keep Gitmo open. A strong message to the world that the United States will fight against terrorism and will not roll over to the whims of some leftist leaders.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

BJ, CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:29:39 GMT

The repukes are in for a long draw on the pipe they packed for the last eight years, now that they lite this torture issue in their own backyard...If they don't find a compass to guide by, they'll walk in darkness for a long time...
And Rush Limbo you ain't no pointer...

First thoughts: Showdown over security

To Dumb To Fail — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:31:05 GMT

Has California made it's government programs cuts yet? Or are they waiting for Obama to bail them out? But Obama can't so that, right? Didn't he just issue a 'memo' that talked about 'states rights'.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Pat Owen — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:31:44 GMT

WILL SOMEONE PLEASE TELL CHENEY THAT HE IS NO LONGER THE SHADOW PRESIDENT!!!!!

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Nashville_fan — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:32:49 GMT

I am really enjoying watching the media prop Dick Cheney up as some type of "competitor" for the President.

Former Vice President Cheney is known for two things: being wrong and being deferred.

Based on this track record, why is it that anyone should care what he has to say about anything, especially national security?

In the media's desperate attempt to find a foil for President Obama and Dick Cheney's equally desperate attempt to be something other than the punch line of jokes, WE THE PEOPLE are forced to hear the Cheney family telling lies unchallenged in the corporate media 24 hours a day.

I guess we should be used to it by now after the lies the media pushed for the Cheney Administration about Iraq over the last 8 years.

President Obama is going to do what he thinks is best for our nation. Period.

What Dick Cheney says in soft ball interviews with friendly "reporters" only serves, as ususal, to benefit the former Vice President's deluded sense of importance.

Dick Cheney was President of 8 years, and he left nothing but problems and heartache in his wake. For the first time in his adult life, he could do something that BENEFITS his country: he could go back to his undisclosed location (and take Eliot Spitzer and daughter Liz with him).

P.S. What type of "journalism" allows someone to go on TV and tell lies to defend their daddy? Strange.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Amazing Fact — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:32:56 GMT

Denying funding is the only way Congress can stop a president from doing something. Yet the spineless Democrats in Congress always voted to support Bush's wars. And now they blame Bush for all the problems of the world, even for the very wars they votes "Yes" to.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Anna Molly — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:34:13 GMT

Thumbs way up for Mike Allen. Past IS prologue.

Thumbs way down for Dick Cheney. “Past is prologue only if I get to characterize the past.”

Thumbs way up for President Obama’s speech. The only problem is that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Rice DID use their values as their compass.

Thumbs way down to the American Enterprise Institute. Are they intentionally trying to establish themselves as the Dark Tower, or is that just a fringe benefit?

And finally thumbs way up to First Read for giving me a place for my morning thumbs work out.

I’m glad you’re here.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
To Feisty (from another thread) ~ Sure, maybe some conservatives could be redeemed, but we liberals don’t torture, remember? So, I guess we’ll never know for certain. ;)

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Move On, USA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:34:48 GMT

There is no showdown! Dick Cheney has alot of nerve holding some conference regarding anything. Some speech. His era is over! He had his turn (not even as #1, but #2). He needs to step aside and let the president lead. IMHO I think he is doing this because he has no respect for the African-American president chosen to lead the free world, and I think he thinks the president does not have the hutzpah or the intelligence to rebut him. In addition, mainstream media seems to keep giving him a pulpit to spew forth his bloviations! Who cares! You never even saw this man during his reign (as #2). If he was that smart, he would have been president, but he was/is not. For the love of God and for the peace of the country, I wish he would sit his behind down and let the president do HIS job! The job THE PEOPLE elected him to do! Media, stop giving him a pulpit, there's nothing new here to see. We are going forward! Move On!

First thoughts: Showdown over security

F. Watcher, NYC — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:35:48 GMT

Feisty Redhead --> Holy Smokes! Ed Schultz has been on FIRE the last 24 hours!

Who's Ed Schultz?

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Beverly in Chicago — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:36:16 GMT

The only natural instinct Cheney has is his greed to continue his Military Industrial Compound; and to influence his potential jury pool that he is NOT guilty of war crimes. By no means is he supporting our President to protect our country by pulling out his old blueprints from his desk draw to destroy any country he believes is vulnerable; so his his greed will allow him to build more complexes .

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Ego Trippin,Wv — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:36:35 GMT

First thoughts: Showdown over security

War Policy — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:37:03 GMT

WILL SOMEONE PLEASE TELL CHENEY THAT HE IS NO LONGER THE SHADOW PRESIDENT!!!!!

Pat Owen

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

The way things are going, apparently he still is.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

T. Teleprompter — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:38:39 GMT

Quiet! Quiet on the set!! The Obama is set to speak to us.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Nashville_fan — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:39:40 GMT

To Joe T, Alexandria, VA:

The situation at Guantanamo is a bad one.

If you are comfortable establishing a precedent that government can detain people indefinitely with or without evidence based on a "hunch", then really there is nothing to discuss.

Here's hoping you are always fortunate enough to be unaccused and self righteous instead of sitting in a jail cell because someone didn't like the looks of you.

If these prisoners are as bad as you say, what is wrong with givng them a trial to prove it? Or are we mind readers now?

Seems like all that "rule of law" talk from Republicans only applies to other people, never to themselves.

Just remember: you reap what you sow. Always.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Pete - Albany, NY — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:39:41 GMT

“When President Obama makes wise decisions, he deserves our support. And when he mischaracterizes the national security decisions we made in the Bush years, he deserves an answer. The point is not to look backward. But a truthful telling of history is necessary to inform our choices going forward.”

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Once again, Cheney misses the point...the national security decisions of the Bush Administration should not require a speech today for justification...the record would speak for itself.

By the way, the record does speak for itself...

We've fought a war fabricated by lies. It's taken us longer to deal with Iraq than it took for us to deal with Hirohito, Hitler and Mussolini in WWII. Osama bin Laden has not been brought to justice.

That's the point...Cheney has to attempt to justify the Bush Administration's decisions as "correct" in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary...there's your "truthful telling of history".

First thoughts: Showdown over security

T. Gibbs, Oakland CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:40:14 GMT

I imagine listening to Obama speak about the county's safety will be pure torture.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Eric, Salinas, CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:40:24 GMT

Johnnie Rawlinson sounds like a good choice from the San Francisco values 9th Circuit Court. Anyone Obama picks will be better than those two abortion opposing bozos the bushwhacker appointed.

That's funnny that Obama has issued a memo to agencies to be mindful of state's rights, something that Tyrant Bush never did because he thought he was god's gift to America and proved he was the Antichrist of Economic Apocalypse. Just shows the secessionist crowd how wrong they are that Obama's federal government is so totalitarian towards the states.

My how the chickenhawk repugnant ones flip flop around on issues like Gitmo. Before the last election they were ready to close Gitmo as it has become our national shame and is a big recruitment tool for al-Qaeda. Don't count your chickens before they hatch evil elephants because the Democrats are just doing due diligence in asking Obama for a plan before they vote for funding closing Gitmo.

Hey big shout out to Hardin Montana who has a brand new prison facility that's empty, an empty prison in our country with overcrowded prisons? The brave folks of Hardin would rather have 100 terrorist prisoners in their midst than have an empty prison as putting in prisoners will mean jobs for these fine folks.

Prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney!
Go Magic!
Go Lakers!

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Rogue Nation,Wv — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:41:18 GMT

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Nashville_fan — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:42:41 GMT

Happy Memorial Day to you to Ron from Indiana - great post! :)

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Beverly in Chicago — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:43:18 GMT

Cal Blakemore, SC (Sent Thursday, May 21, 2009 9:22 AM)

When Barack Obama wakes up in the morning, and after he lights up his Marlboro, he thinks about the problems confronting him for the day, and says to himself: "What would Dick Cheney do?".
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Cal Blakemore in SC

Show some respect. First of all, that's President Barack Obama. Secondly, Cheney is someone very easy to read. War, cover my heartless a**, and greed which everyone right, left, and center knows; including you.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

BJ, CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:43:32 GMT

Commodores - Too hot ta trot 1977..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJ8A1QOAQ68
1977 a flat year in the economy too..
..

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Rush To The Right — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:44:28 GMT

So the voters of California reject the governments idea of raising taxes to close their budget gap. My, my, wasn't it Colin Powell that said "The people of the country want more government and are willing to pay for it". Well now I guess Gen. Powell is wrong about that now isn't he?

First thoughts: Showdown over security

katiec — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:47:05 GMT

Since the unwarranted, lie supportive attack on Iraq the number of terrorist and terrorist groups have risen drastically. The hate, anger, disrespect the republicans have brought to our country are at a level never before faced by our country.
And, after all the diasters, Cheney has the nerve to try and tell the American people that they were successful??
Only an idiot would give any credit to or respect what this dishonorable man has to say.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Coincidence - I Think Not — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:47:08 GMT

Obama's speaking, markets are tanking.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Pete - Albany, NY — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:47:29 GMT

Quiet! Quiet on the set!! The Obama is set to speak to us.
T. Teleprompter (Sent Thursday, May 21, 2009 9:38 AM)

---------------------------------

Of course...another "teleprompter" joke.

Is that really the best the G-NO-P has?

...and you wonder why you are the minority in government.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Juan,FT Lauderdale,FL — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:47:31 GMT

Cheney war criminal/meglomaniac states "When President Obama makes wise decisions; he deserves our support....Truthful telling of history is necessary..." He would not know the truth if his pathetic evil life depended on it. For this man along with his apologists, co-conspirators and law breakers to have in 8 years destroyed our ideals as a country that respected due process, laws, customs and respect we had earned. On 9/12/01, the whole world was grieving and backing our initial war against the Taliban and Al Quida. It took the nefarious Cheney and his lackies w/ no conscious to turn the whole Middle East into a caldron of anti-American recruitment tools. For him to say that we were safer under their administration would be laugable if not for the simple fact thats thousands of innocent people had to die for his sick/self absored EGO! His refusal to accept any repsonsibility for his mistakes is truly pathalogical, SCARY and CRAZY for anyone with a rational brain to agree except his wife, Liz Cheney and his coteries of fellow war criminals.

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Brian, Girard, OH — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:47:38 GMT

Bad Chihuahua will just satisfy his need to hear himself by creating another name. FIRST READ....PLEASE.....don't over hype this so called "showdown" between Cheney and Obama. Simply let Cheney rally his base...thats all he's got. Don't just milk yet another "story" for all it's worth.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Eric, Salinas, CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:48:29 GMT

Marquis de Sade Cheney is at it again lying to the people. Ofcourse he has to do it in front of that disgusting unAmerican cabal of conservative blowhards because he's too afraid to do a townhall like Obama in front of Mainstream America. Coward Cheney is terrified that his incompetent illegal immoral legacy will be forever cast in stone. Let's face it this liar has never told us the truth, hey where's the WMD in Iraq at? Let's never forget or forgive that 9/11 happened on his watch because he was too focused on that nonsensical star wars missile defense garbage that's been a waste of taxpayer money. He didn't care about the August memo that bin Laden was poised to strike in the US because they wanted an excuse to invade Iraq. No he did not keep America safe from terrorists until after they did their damage.

I'm so laughing that blowhard Lush Limburger is crying for MSNBC tv to stop attacking him because he's a wimp with hurt feelings. I so loved Keith's WTF!?! Moment last night as he trashed the blowhard crybaby but good. So funny how the round mound of crybaby can't take the pressure as his crowd of buffoons is shrinking as people realize what a total waste of skin he is. Keep up the great work of exposing Mount Lushmore for what it is, a big fat idiot just like Senator Al Franken said. I love the way Ed Schultz calls him the Drugster.

The repugnant ones wimped out calling the Democratic Party socialist, what a bunch of limpwristed conservative crybabies if they can't follow through on their threats. Seems there are still some evil elephants with a modicum of sensibility but not many as the party of clueless lemmings will follow their leaders over the cliff without thinking.

Prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney!
Go Lakers!

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Nashville_fan — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:49:04 GMT

"Letting an incompetent Minority rule the Government Process is Unacceptable ! " - Rick,Ky
===============================================
Amen Rick, amen. Great post!

P.S. Great post as usual Pat . . . have a great time in Normandy.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Sandy Linmore, Indiana — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:49:15 GMT

Have any of you received any stimulus money yet? Anyone that isn't a bank, insurance business, or car maker that is.

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J. Ellis, Virginia — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:49:17 GMT

The overstated "Gitmo rebuke" that the President suffered yesterday will only cause him to rethink his strategy. He is like a general in that regard and the end result will only be delayed but not denied.

Cheney--a legend in his own mind. He has had his hand up GWB's butt the past 8 yrs and is guilty of more wrong doing than any other person on the planet. He is a lying war criminal and credence is only given to him because the media forces it down our throats. I care nothing about what he has to say because it's all lies cloaked in deception, with a little torture thrown in for good measure.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Houston — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:49:34 GMT

Has the corporate media stopped flogging the Pelosi/CIA nontroversy for some reason? Maybe it's because it's started to become an embarrassment to the Republican Party.

Wednesday night, Keith Olbermann reported that there was a serious anachronism in the record of the briefing in Sept. 2002 that supposedly said Nancy Pelosi was told that waterboarding had already been used. The record said, according to Olbermann, that the term "EIT" (enhanced interrogation techniques) was used in the briefing record,but the Bush regime didn't coin that euphemism for torture until 2006 -- 4 years after the briefing took place. If Olbermann is right, this should be an explosive story -- assuming the media doesn't cover it up because it doesn't fit with their "narrative" that Pelosi must be lying because everybody knows the CIA would never ever lie.

Olbmerann also mentioned a fact that doesn't fit with the "CIA never lies" line: A REPUBLICAN in Congress is investigating whether the CIA lied to cover up the shooting down of a plane in Central America, killing a missionary and her child. The CIA agents involved mistakenly thought the plane was being used to run drugs.

Outside of the corporate media, most everybody knows that the first response the CIA makes to any problem or embarrassment is to lie. We probably won't hear anything much about this investigation, either, from the media. They're just too busy echoing the Republican party line.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Tzalaran — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:50:29 GMT

Joe T, Alexandria, VA (Sent Thursday, May 21, 2009 9:28 AM)
**************************************************
your entire argument is a staw man. no one is talking about releasing detainees into the general population, but moving them into federal prisons which house mass murders, gang members, child molesters, and all other criminals who have inflicted violence upon their fellow man.

to think that we have to have Gitmo in order to house these men is absolutely ridiculous, as we have countless others who have performed crimes against citizens of this nation that were just as bad, if not worse.

and there is a facility in Montana that will take 100 of them tomorrow if they could. they have space, can guarantee security, and need the boost to their economy that filling this state of the art prison facility would spark.

The status quo is no longer acceptable to the majority of americans, and the conservatives are still fighting the results of the last election which proved this.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Good Cop — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:50:33 GMT

Seeing we're cheering each other on today:

To all the liberals - great posts today! To all the conservative - bad posts today!

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Beverly in Chicago — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:53:46 GMT

Eric, Salinas, CA (Sent Thursday, May 21, 2009 9:40 AM)

Hey big shout out to Hardin Montana who has a brand new prison facility that's empty, an empty prison in our country with overcrowded prisons? The brave folks of Hardin would rather have 100 terrorist prisoners in their midst than have an empty prison as putting in prisoners will mean jobs for these fine folks.

Prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney!
Go Magic!
Go Lakers!
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Hi Eric. I had hoped to see you with our Bulls in sunny California. Go Lakers!

You are so correct in giving props to Hardin Montana. What some people and the GNOP Party aren't looking at are the jobs that would would be created. But then again the GOPers are good at looking forward. These prisons are state of the art. Ain't nobody breaking out of those prisons. (L)

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Amy B Portland, ME — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:53:56 GMT

I just want to say, I love First Read, and First Reader posters. Believe it or not, we are finally having a summer day, here in Maine. I wish I could (virtually) send the First Read team the fresh lilacs outside my window.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

MSierra, SF — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:54:30 GMT

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL :'...FR: Bad Chihuahua should be banned from this site for hostile and racist statements. While many of us put up with these for a while, he/she went way too far today. Please consider banning this poster.
LB, Virginia (Sent Wednesday, May 20, 2009 5:02 PM)
I whole heartedly agree with you LB – having said that it would be impossible to ban the little ba@stard as he would just show up under a different moniker (which I think he already does). I do think a good neutering is in order – maybe he wouldn’t lick himself so much!...'

Bad Chihuahua is also MonkberryMoon, MoonDawg, Polyethelyne Pam and a host of other names. He even posted under my name for a while (cute)
He's afraid to identify himself while making nonsensical posts or lately quasi racial posts.

Any time there's ignorance being spouted, Bad Chihuahua will be there

First thoughts: Showdown over security

jAYjAY — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:57:34 GMT

How fast we forget that in the last 6 months of Bushs presidency he moved closer to what Obama was saying on national security.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Eric, Salinas, CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 13:57:53 GMT

Douthat is an idiot of the biggest dimensions if he thinks that War Criminal Cheney would have been a better candidate than the more moderate McCain. President Obama would have wiped the floor with Marquis de Sade Cheney as the titular figure head of the repugnant ones. Nope even more real "Americans would have voted for Obama to ensure that the torture creep was sent packing.

I'd love to see President Obama expand his presidential powers just to hear the repugnant ones flip flop on their insistence on their flawed failed unitary excutive garbage that allowed Tyrant Bush to think he was above the law. Obama has learned that being in the White House is harder than getting in, but he's been too easily fooled by the creeps in power that keep insisting that he must follow Tyrant Bush's lead. He's got to realize that we the people did not elect him to further the bushwhacker's illegal immoral legacy.

Hey how about Dianne Feinstein just saying that CA could house some terrorists here. Along with Hardin Montana, which has an empty brand new prison, we'll see brave Americans stand up to the call to host terrorists in our prisons. Oh and now Obama will be trying a terrorist here in federal court, better grab your guns and go hide under your beds limpwristed conservative crybabies.

In Obama We Trust!
Go Lakers!

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Houston — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:00:53 GMT

Suburban Mom: "Somebody tell Chuck Todd to go sniff out a real story."
-----------------------------------------

Olbmermann's report that there was a very suspicious anachronism in the CIA's supposedly "contemporaneous" briefing report is a real story that needs to be followed up. (The term "enhanced interrogation technique" was in the briefing report, but Olbermann said that term wasn't used until four years after Pelosi's Sept. 2002 briefing.) That leaves open the question of whether the report was prepared in the last few weeks in order to contradict Pelosi AFTER said she hadn't been told waterboarding was being used back in 2002.

Unfortunately, most of the media don't do investigative journalism anymore. The journalists are mainly just political gossip columnists nowadays.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

The - Democrat Soldier — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:02:38 GMT

Dick Cheney thinks that because he talked Americans into starting a war - he can continue to talk U.S. into not putting his ass in jail.

Not this time - the only people that don't want you behind bars and will be listening to your BS will be the 10 -17 % of the people you made rich off of the blood, sweat, pain and death of our American service men and women and for that - we will never forgive you or forget what you have done.

Talk and explained all you want - incriminate yourself and appease the media and your neo-con friends with your rhetoric - because no true, real patriotic American - really give a "f".about what a coward and a traitor like you have to say.

By the way how many of your 9 lives to you have left; just curious..

Thank you and GOD BLESS AMERICA

First thoughts: Showdown over security

JohnnyU, WA State — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:04:57 GMT

Cheney should be in prison for war crimes, much less given a forum to spout more venom. Prosecuting OUR war criminals is the best way to diminish terrorism.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Ron Indiana — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:05:03 GMT

Pat: Have a safe trip to Normandy. I look forward to reading your comments when you return.
Ron

First thoughts: Showdown over security

jesse St.Paul Minnesota — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:05:20 GMT

My hunch has been answered,you guy's at fr are high on something.Dick Cheney has a approval of 17%, now to republicans that may seem like a good number, but stat boy Chuck should know that 17 % ain't going to win you many elections.Cheney and his boggie man scare tactics seemed to scare more then a few panty waist Democrats,on the gitmo vote,verrrrrrrry disappointed,you gave Cheney what he wants,a platform to spew from,you nilly knees just showed how bad you want to keep your gravy train seat.The torture center at gitmo has fueled the hate being waged against us,it pissed a few of our allies off also.But to let Cheney come out weekly and spin the MSM in circles with his big words,his fear and smear tactic has been a republican calling card for 50 years,why does MSM just suck up what he says and acts like it's some how the truth.But I guess after 8 years of being led by the rind in your noses,it becomes a challange when allowed to walk by yourselfs.Is anyone shocked that Little GW didn't send out e=mails to all the federal agencys.The guy was a just a tad to busy cutting brush to bother with any memos.Or running the country ,he had Dead Eye Dick at the trigger.To all of my retired republican follow americans,please return all social security checks at once,return so it can be used on real Americans.You un-employed repubs same thing,you don't need no damn government giving someone in need ,a helping hand.Same to all those farmers who rape us with there paid to not farm program,buy some land get a check,send those checks back so we can give the help to people that are not millionairs.And for goodness sake stop calling the police when you have a issue,or the crib is on fire,stop being so weak, put the fire out yourself,catch the crooks yourselfs.And the next cane that blows thru,build a arc,grab the wife and the dog and float around until the water dries up.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

The Last Laugh — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:06:43 GMT

I'm so laughing that blowhard Lush Limburger is crying for MSNBC tv to stop attacking him because he's a wimp with hurt feelings
------------------------------------------------------As usual, Keith Olbermann doesn't get it. Limbaugh challenged MSNBC to quit talking about him and actually talk about lawmakers. They seem to forget he hosts a radio show for entertainment. But that bozo can't go even one show without mentioning him.
I sincerely doubt Rush Limbaugh cares one whit about what someone like Olbermann thinks of him.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Anita, Birmingham, Alabama — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:06:59 GMT

Showdown over security:
This is rich. Cheney to have a showdown with the President over national security? I will be watching this comedy tour. He has been quite vocal lately over polices that "he" put in place to terrorize this nation in his continued efforts to envoke fear. The far right party of the republicans will use anyone and anything at this point, they are desperate.

Republicans making hay out of Gitmo:
The division amongst the Democrats around the closure of Gitmo is most disapointing. I am reserving my opinion until more details are relseaed regarding this issue. The last administration that got us into this mess has left this country in a dangerous situation. My instints warn me that that there is more to this than meets the eye.

Pot meet kettle:
These clowns need to take their butts some place and sit down. They will do anything to stay in the media. Imagine... the talikng points of spending, debts and cars. didn't Bush and Poulson nationalize the banks when they forced banks to take our tax dollars? after all they invented this mess and we are sitting in it.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Paul Miller, Woodbridge, VA — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:07:19 GMT

Why are Republicans so afraid of everything?

Yes, its a dangerous world. Always has been and always will be. It takes courage to be an American.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Claire — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:07:55 GMT

Any time there's ignorance being spouted, Bad Chihuahua will be there - MSierra

And any time there's a Huffington Post article to cut and paste, MSierra will be there.

First thoughts: Showdown over security

BJ, CA — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:08:23 GMT

Commodores - Too hot ta trot 1977..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJ8A1QOAQ68
1977 a flat year in the economy too..no down
..

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Linda, Montgomery, AL — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:08:50 GMT

Exactly how many elections is Barack Obama required to win before he is treated as the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES??

I'm 64 years old, and I've never, absolutely NEVER seen the media treat any US President as they are treating President Obama.

His every word, gesture and belch is constantly weighed, analyzed, and reanalyzed. Then any opposition to those words, gestures and belches is given full, and almost instantaneous full media coverage.

It is pass time, this country treat our new president as a PRESIDENT.

Afterall, he wasn't appointed by the Supreme Court, he was elected.

And

First thoughts: Showdown over security

Anna Molly — Thu, 21 May 2009 14:09:56 GMT

Please don't ban the Chihuahua. Just throw him some snausages.