First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Ron Indiana — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:28:46 GMT

Courage:

Friday I commented about the CIA engaging in unlawful activities and the important role of Congress to monitor those activities. Without citizen review, we would be no different than those countries who have unmonitored agencies like the KGB.

Through Cheney’s self-admission, we already knew that the White House had authorized waterboarding and illegal wiretapping. What we did not know was the extent to which the White House broke the law. Through Congressional inquiry and through investigating reporting from the media, we learn that the Presidential Surveillance Program has compromised the civil rights of the American people. We also learned that unlawful wire tapping did not lead to an arrest and conviction of…anybody.

To then CIA Director Ashcroft’s credit, while recovering from an operation, Ashcroft would not sigh off on Bush’s Presidential Surveillance Program. So Bush told AG Gonzales to essentially sign away American’s civil liberties. Bush and the CIA had no legal justification to support their activities.

Additionally, the Bush White House falsified the CIA intelligence report by adding their own paragraph in an attempt to strengthen their White House position.

In short, the White House and CIA have engaged in a litany of crimes that cannot be ignored. Yesterday CIA agents report that Cheney told them to withhold information from Congress (Obstruction). Upon reading this, every American, conservative or progressive, should be outraged. But this was done by a conservative Republican President and the conservatives want to protect their own. McCain does not want this matter pursued.

So the question is, Do the Democrats in Congress and the President have the courage to do what is right: Not just disclose, put prosecute. The point is that it’s not about Bush/Cheney: It is about sending a clear message to all future presidents not to even think about violating our Constitution.

It is our integrity; honesty and courage that are being tested.

Special shout-to MSierra, SF for his comments to me on Friday.

I would likely be writing about this all week, but for the next four days I will be visiting relatives. Someone else will need to be pounding the tom-toms to keep this story alive.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Ron Indiana — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:30:51 GMT

BTW: Who is Ali Weinberg? Is she new to FR? Would you guys give a bio on Ali? Thanks,

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

pat huntington ny — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:32:26 GMT

Wishing Jill Biden the best on her surgery.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

GOPer — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:35:11 GMT

For further proof that the Bush years aren’t going away anytime soon, NBC’s Williams confirms the story, first reported by Newsweek, that Attorney General Eric Holder is considering the appointment of a special prosecutor to look at whether post-9/11 detainees were illegally tortured.

=============

What a bunch of losers in the White House.

You can hear Rahm Emanuel behind the scenes, "Lets see, health care is tanking, crap and trade is dead, the stimulus isn't creating any jobs, the Jackson funeral is done, Palin quit, and the Sanford thing is quieting down. We need a distraction, I know! Let's bring up Cheney."

Losers.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Anita, Birmingham, Alabama — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:35:44 GMT

Reaganomics: GOP History Speaks-- Supply-Side Economics:
Supply-side economics is a school of macroeconomic thought that argues that economic growth can be most effectively created using incentives for people to produce (supply) goods and services, such as adjusting income tax and capital gains tax rates, and by allowing greater flexibility by “ reducing regulation”. Consumers will then benefit from a greater supply of goods and services at lower prices. Reducing regulation , repubs…did this work?
Ronald Reagan made supply-side economics a household phrase, and promised an across the board reduction in income tax rates and an even larger reduction in capital gains tax rates. When vying for the Republican party presidential nomination for the 1980 election.

George H.W. Bush derided Reagan's supply-side policies as "voodoo economics". However, later he seemed to give lip service to these policies to secure the Republican nomination in 1988, and is speculated by some to have lost in his re-election bid in 1992 by allowing tax increases. "Read my lips: No new taxes."

Many critics of supply-side economics are actually critics of politicians and pundits who misunderstand the Laffer curve, typically claiming that every tax cut will increase revenues. For example, in 2006 Sebastian Mallaby of The Washington Post quoted George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Bill Frist, Chuck Grassley, and Rick Santorum misstating the effect of the Bush Administration's tax cuts.

On January 3, 2007, George W. Bush wrote an article claiming "It is also a fact that our tax cuts have fueled robust economic growth and record revenues”. .Andrew Samwick, who was Chief Economist on Bush's Council of Economic Advisers from 2003-2004 responded to the claim by stating:

“You are smart people. You know that the tax cuts have not fueled record revenues. You know what it takes to establish causality. You know that the first order effect of cutting taxes is to lower tax revenues. We all agree that the ultimate reduction in tax revenues can be less than this first order effect, because lower tax rates encourage greater economic activity and thus expand the tax base. No thoughtful person believes that this possible offset more than compensated for the first effect for these tax cuts. Not a single one”. What say you Repubs??

More generally, traditional economists point to the "overhang" of deficits from the Reagan era, the S&L bailout, the effects of a ballooning federal budget deficit, the defense budget cuts which began in earnest in 1989, and the expectation of a lack of continued fiscal discipline as the source of the recession. These arguments blame the legacy of Democratic Deficits forced upon Reagan, rather than deficits created by Reagan's own administration.

Critics of supply-side economics often argue the inflated government deficits that accompanied the arrival of supply-side economics are of greater concern than the economic and stock market success of supply-side theory.

It took Reagan a total of “eight years” to get unemployment from 7.1% to 5.5% and this is how he did it:

Unemployment peaked at 10.8% percent in December 1982—higher than any time since the Great Depression; Reaganomics was the subject of debate with supporters pointing to improvements in certain key economic indicators as evidence of success, and critics pointing to large increases in federal budget deficits and the national debt. His policy of "peace through strength" resulted in a record peacetime defense buildup including a 40% real increase in defense spending between 1981 and 1985.

In accordance with Reagan's less-government intervention views, Reagan cut the budgets of non-military program including Medicaid, food stamps, federal education programs and the EPA. He protected entitlement programs, such as Social Security and Medicare, however, his administration attempted to purge many allegedly disabled people from Social Security disability rolls. Reagans answer to “MEDICARE REFORM”… kick them off.

Reagan was a great President you partisans cliam… he “increased the deficits. Yet he is the only great “hope” for the credibility of your party today. You people skipped all over Poppy Bush who is “still alive” to lift Reagan up who is long dead. You have no “new” soloution other than “dead Tax Cuts” and it’s been proven, time and time again…they don’t work.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:37:20 GMT

Let's not forget this is a live hearing.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Keep the Change — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:37:24 GMT

Obama meets with labor leaders. Yep - the UAW is there to kiss his behind and thank him for stealing GM and Chrysler from the secured bondholders and giving the UAW more than their fair share.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

jeanne spivey New York NY — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:39:57 GMT

I hope you're not trying to say that the reason Senator Gillibrand is introducing Judge Sotomayor during these hearings is merely to boost her own name recognition, because as New York's Junior Senator, and one of the people who brought Sotomayor to the President's attention, this is part of her job. Putting this in parentheses suggests the writer was frantic for an excuse to question her motives.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Saba, NYC — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:40:40 GMT

Why aren't Palin stories going away?!? 46% of American voters have a favorable opinion of her. More: http://www.governmentalityblog.com/my_weblog/2009/07/another-palin-poll.html

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Andy A., NJ — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:41:39 GMT

Isn't it nice that a Soros backed group is going after, are you ready for this, the firefighter that brought the case against CT town that discriminated against him! Yup, it's time to tear that guy down for even bringing up the subject.

This is how the Democrats play. Identity politics, and the politics of personal destruction. Hope they have fun, they only have until the next election.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Teresa Wallace, MN — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:42:47 GMT

Wishing Jill Biden the best on her surgery.
pat huntington ny

Lets hope she has a baby girl!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Brian, Cedar Hill, TX — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:43:09 GMT

The Bush/Cheney Evil Empire is finally unravelling. I hope these criminals and their cohorts are hounded continuously for the rest of stinking lives until someone makes a charge stick - just like these Nazi war criminals.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Eric, Salinas, CA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:43:24 GMT

Hey no joe no bo no job - Sorry to disappoint you but I didn't stub my toe or spill my beer this past weekend. Aren't you the petty little crybaby!

That's a funny bit of trivia that Senator Al Franken did an SNL skit where he interviewed a Supreme Court Justice. Considering it was Uncle Tom Thomas it must have been a hilarious skit. Today we'll see that Senator Al Franken has a serious studious side and I bet he'll ask more intelligent questions of her than all of the repugnant ones put together.

Hopefully Conservadems are too smart to allow Quitter Palin to campaign for them. She's be the 5th Column Quisling Tory Traitor who will do nothing but sink their chances at winning over Liberals and Moderates. Just Say No to Sinner Sarah coming to campaign for any Democrat. She's nothing but a liar and a loser and we don't need her scumming up our society anymore than she's already done.

Just Say No to Quitter Palin!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

no joe, no bo, nj — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:43:29 GMT

This CIA kerfuffle is more evidence that we elected an idealogue to be president of the United States. As in, have game plan, will not change it.

The actual news about this CIA 'program' is confusing at best. On one side, we have those who say that no one in congress was briefed on a program that was in development, but not implemented, and, lately, scrapped. This side puts forth the argument that it was former vice president Cheney who intructed 'them' not to tell congress about the program. On the other side, we have those who state, categorically, that congress was, in fact, briefed that a program was in the works back in 2001, but not briefed on its implementation because it was not, in fact, implemented.

From my vantage point, it looks as though this issue arose because of Obama's falling approval numbers. Running against Bush helped get him elected; ergo, remind people of what they did not like about the Bush administration.

Unfortunately for Obama, the last time he took on CHeney, it was, at best, a draw. He will not accept that the former vice president will sit idly by and take the potshots in silence.

Meanwhile, the independents are leaving him in droves=here in NEW JERSEY he is in negative territory with them-congress is slowing down the health care disaster, worried about their re election chances if they pass it; Barbara Boxer has tabled Cap and Trade until September, hoping, on supposes, that the stimulus will have provided those 600,000 jobs Obama promised, (down from 3 million, I hasten to add), and the charm offensive has lost its lustre.

Russia refuses to help with Iran, NOrth Korea continues to test long range missiles, there was a cyber attack on the government over the Fourth of July weekend, and, to put the icing on the cake, in less than two weeks, GDP numbers for the second quarter will be coming out. Here's a hint-they look bleak.

Obama needs to go back to the venue to which he is suited-academia. There, you can be an idealogue and cause no lasting damage.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Bad Chihuahua — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:45:18 GMT

For Mark in Seattle:

Last Friday you stated "I remember 'clearly' the morning of Dr. Tiller, you 'plainly' stated that he got what he deserved."

Again, Mark, your liberal extremism is clogging your brain. Here is what I said.

"We all have a 'choice' in life. Someone 'chose' to rub out an abortion doctor who's 'choice' was to rub out life in it's most innocent form. Sometimes what goes around comes around." Look it up. (June 1)

This is why I don't respond to you and those like you. I have no use for those who are void of common sense. There is clearly nothing "plainly stated" in my post. Take the high road and offer an apology. Nah, I'll play the liberal on this one. No apology will be accepted because your ideology, like so many others on this blog, is that liberals don't lie, they just forget to tell the truth.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Democrat Lies — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:45:24 GMT

Sure, lets have the White House and Congress go on at heir little witchhunt and investigate Bush. It's a lot easier and a lot more fun then say, getting a cap and trade bill, or a healthcare bill through congress. The Democrats and liberals can kiss those two items goodbye if Obama green-lights the investigation.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Obie will get his paged turned soon enough — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:46:17 GMT

Obama: "Lets turn the page".

Forwards, or backwards Barack.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

jawillie Philadelphia, PA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:46:59 GMT

>>>Sotomayor’s confirmation might not be contentious, but the news -- via the Sunday New York Times -- that the CIA withheld information from Congress about a secret counterintelligence program on orders from former Vice President Cheney certainly is. Today’s Wall Street Journal says the program “was an attempt to carry out a 2001 presidential authorization to capture or kill al Qaeda operatives, according to former intelligence officials familiar with the matter.”
==========
I've been following this one all weekend. Mr. President, is this enough for you to finally start prosecutions? I know you'd rather look forward and not backwards, but this contry's future will be tainted as long as these acts by your predecessors are allowed to stand unchallenged. The time for you to act is NOW!

>>>the soon-to-be-departing Alaska governor, who revealed that she might stump for conservative Democrats. "I will go around the country on behalf of candidates who believe in the right things, regardless of their party label or affiliation,"
==========
WHO'D HAVE HER? Republicans are dropping her like a bad habbit (NJ's Christie wants nothing to do with her), and I doubt that any Democrat (blue dog or otherwise) will come within 10 feet of her. Even John McCain can't bring himself to endorse her. She's become a political Black Plague, to be avoided at all costs.

http://jawillie.blog.com

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

R. Eset — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:47:01 GMT

Time to hit the 'Reset' button on the Obama administration.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Mark Murray — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:47:21 GMT

Hey Ron -- Ali is the newest addition to our Political Unit. She helps us with First Read and (primarily) assists Chuck. She just graduated from NYU.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Just'Askin — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:47:44 GMT

How do you brief Congress on a spy program that doesn't exist?

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Left Wing Loons — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:49:05 GMT

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Bill, Fairfax, VA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:51:08 GMT

The CIA story is a tempest in a teapot. Both the Wall Street Journal and the Washington Post are reporting that while some planning and training may have been conducted, the program was not operational. On that point the Post further reports "...the program remained in the planning stages and never crossed the agency's threshold for reporting to the administration and congressional overseers."

This is a key point. You can't very well withhold information from Congress about a program that doesn't exist. If Cheney told the CIA not to inform Congress about a project that was only in the planning stages, so what? At such time as the program became operational, then it would be appropriate to inform Congress. But that threshold was never reached, so this 'cable catnip' as FR calls it is just more hysteria directed to those big bad Bushies. And hysteria that is most helpful as a smokescreen to cover Pelosi's butt.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Robert Olmsted, Rochester, MN — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:51:45 GMT

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Eric, Salinas, CA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:52:32 GMT

I sure hope that Eric Holder has some cajones and appoints a special prosecutor to investigate and prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney and their bunch of bad apples that stunk up the White House for 8 years. I'm disappointed that President Obama has tried to steer clear of investigations because he wanted to create a bipartisan atmosphere in DC. He needs to recognize that bipartisanship has failed because the dopes of nope don't want to do anything but Whine Baby Whine. Barack needs to crack the investigation whip on the dopes of nope because if the tables were turned and a repugnant one was in office after a Democratic administration that did what Tyrants Bush and Cheney did they wouldn't hesitate to pull the trigger on an investigation and special prosecutor. We all saw that they would stoop to wasting $66 million taxpayer dollars on their politically motivated Whitewater/Monica investigation.

Are the tough talking repugnant ones chickening out after all that tough talk, ofcourse they are they're just bullies who are cowards in the end. They'd be smart to keep civil tongues while questioning Sotomayor or they'll face the wrath of the Latino voters.

I'm glad that President Obama is meeting with labor leaders today to show some support to the blue collar crowd who has been villified by the evil elephant party. Time to show some support for the real workers of America instead of the lazy deadbeat CEO crowd that has been given too much money and too much credit for their pitiful excuse of job performance.

Prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Anita, Birmingham, Alabama — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:53:21 GMT

Pallin’ around with Palin: Today’s New York Times also has an Anchorage dateline. "Ms. Palin had returned to her home state from the presidential campaign as one of the hopeful prospects in her struggling party… Standing before the Legislature in January, she vowed to retake her office with 'optimism and collaboration and hard work to get the job done.' But interviews in Alaska and in Washington show that a seemingly relentless string of professional and personal troubles quickly put that goal out of reach."
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

This is how she vows to retake her office as Governor by resigning? Palin is nothing more than an opportunist. She doesn't care about anything except her own advancement potential and it doesn't matter how she achieves it...even by using her family to accomplish it.
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Holder’em: Instead, the investigation would be limited to a small number of what are described as "egregious" cases that appeared to have crossed far over the line.
&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Something is better than nothing. After all those would be the people that "did" create acts of torture. It would be nice to see something being done to those that violated the laws of the Geneva Convention...Cheney, Gonzales (sp) and Bush...by their orders.

Dr. Jill Biden, get well wishes to you.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Monkberry Moon — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:54:39 GMT

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Jody, Iowa — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:54:54 GMT

Gotta wonder about why the GOP continues to rally behind Cheney. Despite Mika's Morning Joe comment that a high level source says it wasn't a real program, you don't have something in the works on again/off again since 2001 without there being some substance to it. My guess is the high level CIA official Mika quoted is trying to cover their collective backsides. The very fact that it was kept from Panetta for nearly 6 months and he immediately stopped it, tells me this was and is a dangerous concept. This is just another example of the games played by Bush and Cheney. I'll have to watch CNN in the morning because the thought of Liz Cheney and her justification of her father's lies will interfere with my breakfast.

Glad FR noted that Eric Holder is looking at a narrow investigation into torture exceeding even the bogus Bush administration's justifications for ignoring our constitution and international law. Most media chatter made it sound as if the whole program was being investigated and the pundits and republicans were pouncing.

Wishing Dr. Jill Biden good luck with her surgery and a speedy recovery. Speaking of that how is SOS Clinton's broken arm.

Gotta just love the Palin version of people being tired of partisan politics. No kidding, but she has no problem attacking the Obama administration and democrats for their opposing views. It is time both parties stop the 24/7, 365 day campaigning and get down to business. That's what Americans are tired of, the constant election attacks to fuel speculatiion of 2012 when Pres Obama has nearly 3 1/2 years on his first term and it is a good year before the average person pays attention to 2010 midterms.

Planning to head outside and enjoy this beautiful sunny day.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Frankie M., Atlantic City NJ — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:55:56 GMT

Let's not forget this is a live hearing.
s

Then someone better get Lautenberg off the stage.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Obama, One and Done/Atlanta — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:56:23 GMT

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

matt — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:56:52 GMT

I am fully primed for a GOP meltdown at today's hearings. Sessions will surely blow up in a racially-based tirade...

http://www.political-buzz.com/

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Ninja Nick — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:57:56 GMT

Wishing Jill Biden the best on her surgery. -- pat huntington ny

Joe better watch out, that's Jills' "Whacking" shoulder.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

jesse St Paul MN — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:58:15 GMT

Fr,,,will you start showing Al Franken some respect.The guy is a Harvard Grad,with honors,now how many FR employees are Harvard Grads?My guess is Zero.Dead eye back on the front burner,when will some one put some heat to the fire and shut this war monger down for good,the guy has done enough damage and still runs around trying to defend his record,torture he approved it,wire taps,his baby,death squads that report to him,and his miss use of power,and as far as not telling Congress,Sooooooo!To bad McCain had to become the spinner with the truth about Fallin,even the campaign staff told the truth.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

eagle1776 — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:58:56 GMT

The Republicans will try and use the Sotomayor hearings to deflect their unwillingness to cooperate on health care and so on. They will posture, harrrumph, ask snide questions meant to be gotchas, and will grandstand. In the end, however after all the song, dance and pony show Sonya Sotomayor WILL be confirmed with both Demorats and Republicans voting for her confirmation.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

cindy, las vegas, nv — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:59:07 GMT

So answer me this, why is it Palin can just up and walk away from a job she was elected to do for the people of Alaska, and we can't get rid of Ensign here, or Sanford over there? Boggles the mind!!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Juan,Ft Lauderdale, Fl — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:00:22 GMT

Lets send the Dick to Gitmo w/o telling Congress as he basically has no respect for laws, checks and balances and our constitution. Furthermore, Nancy Pilosi was right when she said the CIA misenformed congress on numerous occasions. Lets not forget that Tenet was the wimp/appeaser that it was a slam dunk that Sadam had WMD'S. If you are an avid reader and/or history buff you would have known that Sadam had no WMD'S because of the world arms embargo, the U.S. n/s no fly zones, and logic. The Neo-cons and cheney knew they just had to manipulate 911 for their nefarious right wing agenda and the rest of the ignorant masses who were too caught up on revenge and others on American Idol would love Shock and Awe. Cheney and his goons need to be held accountable because if not it makes a mockery of our historical relevance as a democracy. Obama should allow his attorney general to start active investigations and the hell w/ sweeping it under the rug and focus on the mess the GOP left. The GOP had no problems going after Clinton's lies about consenting sex while the GOP rationalized Reagan was clueless about what Oliver North was doing illegally in the basement of the Whitehouse. THROW THE BOOK AT THE MEGLOMANIAC CHENEY!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Cjake — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:00:39 GMT

Listening to ABC news during the evening I would have thought the Sotomayor hearings would have been alot more controversial than they actually will be. Pretty much repeated GOP attacks on her verbatim and even featured (Fox News favorite) Wendy Long. I would feel alot better if some in the GOP prominently vouched for her...but even if she's confirmed her seat on the SCOTUS will be a flashpoint for conservatives because not enough Republicans went against the dogmatic rhetoric now. As I always say, I like Obama in the background as long as guidance ins't desperately needed from him; it means we don't have to be subject to the GOP's rediculous attacks on him.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Dottie Swarthmore PA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:02:10 GMT

The Sarah Palin story is not going away because, the newspapers and magazines are in a free fall. Her picture on the front page is a sure fire seller. Never mind that she is a quitter and an embarrassment to the Republican Party, they still defend her. What else do you expect the Republicans to say. They surely will never say publicly what they say behind her back that she is a joke and they would rather not talk about her at all. I did not see Meet The Press yesterday but, I am told that Senator McCain looked uncomfortable when talking about Sarah Palin.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Eric, Salinas, CA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:02:42 GMT

I'm sure looking forward to hearing more about this new secret CIA program that Leon Panetta was just informed about. So where is Torturer Cheney shooting his mouth off about this secret program that he ordered the CIA to keep from Congress? I guess he doesn't want to talk about this new revelation because he knows he's done wrong and stands to be investigated and prosecuted for his War Crimes against humanity and our secular democracy.

As always the dopes of nope are lying about the stimulus not working. The Mission Accommlished crowd is yet again declaring premature victory and once again they'll be proven to be the lying fools that they've always been. They would sacrifice our nation's welfare for their petty partisan political safety but will learn that they are just pushing more people away as the people understand that they have been habitual liars for so long about so many issues. Their constant fear mongering is part of the problem for the markets downward slide lately as they try to spook the markets for their political advantage. As always party first country last.

Where's the Wealth? After touting how repugnant ones create wealth I have to ask where's the wealth at? Oh it went poof because it was all phony wealth built upon a foundation of lies. I'm still laughing that last year we saw just how phony wealth of the bushwacked economy was and that it blew up in Clueless George's face just as his pal McNasty was trying to fool America into 4 more years of lying cheating economic programs.

Prosecute War Criminals Bush and Cheney!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

never expected a rose garden — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:03:24 GMT

From my vantage point, it looks as though this issue arose because of Obama's falling approval numbers. Running against Bush helped get him elected; ergo, remind people of what they did not like about the Bush administration.
---------------------------------------------
No reminders needed. Unlike those of you trying so hard to rewrite history in favor of the GOP, those of us living in the real world face the damages done by the Bush Administration daily.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:04:52 GMT

Sorry... I'm late to the game this Monday morning...

WHO'D HAVE HER? Republicans are dropping her like a bad habbit (NJ's Christie wants nothing to do with her), and I doubt that any Democrat (blue dog or otherwise) will come within 10 feet of her. Even John McCain can't bring himself to endorse her. She's become a political Black Plague, to be avoided at all costs.
jawillie Philadelphia, PA (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:46 AM)
***************************

No truer words were spoken... now IF the cable chatter would step away from the catnip & drop their obsession with Grama Grizzly - she'd disappear into the great Alaskan wilderness once & for ALL!

When you have the likes of Kathleen Parker - Maureen Dowd & Peggy Noonan telling you like it is...she's starting to stink like her precious dead salmon tanning on the beach at her secret squirrel fishing location!

ps: SPOT on about the rabid rat! I'm done! Bought me some rabid rat repellant over the weekend... hey were running a special - buy 1 can of Republicant repellant get a can of rabid rat repellent FREE!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Cjake — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:05:31 GMT

About Cheney's CIA secrets, does this mean Nancy Pelosi has been vindicated yet again? Next thing you know we'll have discovered a real life Bourne Conspiracy.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Terry, Disabled Vet, Des Moines, IA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:09:29 GMT

Let's run with this scenario----The trial against former Pres Clinton was do largely because he lied about an extra marital affair (I don't condonce what he did) and the Repukes spent millions of dollars for this trial.--------Now we are becoming aware of lies from Repukes who have committed extra marital affairs and we must be forgiving of them, and lies that the former dunce in chief's administration lied about the many different reasons for invading Iraq, and we are hearing about secret CIA operations that Congress may or may not have been briefed on that the VP may have or have not ordered the CIA not to tell Congress and yet the Repukes are saying that this is all because the current administration is trying to provide a smoke screen? The situation about lying for invading a country and witholding information from Congress is far more worse and harmful to democracry than lying about an extra marital affair! The DOJ should do its job regardless of who was involved---if people broke the law---they need to prosecuted------just like the soldiers that the former dunce in chief's administration tried to portay as rogue elements or acting on their own!!!!!!If soldiers are doing time then by God so should anyone else that was involved!!!!!!!!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Cjake — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:12:28 GMT

They funny thing about no joe's posts is that he actually applies some sort of lose reasoning (and time) to his comments but when you read them it's nothing but unfactual/biased hot air and Freeper style rhetoric. Atleast I can appreciate Bad Chihuahua for keeping their comments short and more to the point...it achieves the same effect.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

The - Democrat Soldier — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:13:24 GMT

no joe, no bo, nj - Really? How in the hell do you equate some activity by the CIA in 2001, which was directed by Dick Cheney, to the modern days of 2009.

Freaking amazing, you numb skull republicans are so anxious to create falsehood and dirt for President Obama that you some how tried to logically connected this scandal to President Obama.

Freaking Delusional - my question to you is - how much money are you losing because of the stock market and it's continued inability to rob U.S. off anymore.

Something is really motivating people like you to be so adamant about creating innuendos and false connection to the current administration and I can only image it to be greed and the thought that your instance and easy paydays are numbered and you fault our current administration for your current down fall.

Really, none of your ranting is logical or prudent; if all fictional.

It's as if you are living on a planet other than earth and your hatred has blinded you to realism of daily life.

I pray for you and people like you - cause you all have really lost your way and money and wealth has destroy any since of self responsibility.

May god be with you in your lost world and may realism come back and you begin to see life the way it really is.

Thank you and GOD BLESS AMERICA

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

OBAMA & SOTOMAYOR FOLLOWING THE PATH OF 'FASCISM' — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:14:02 GMT

OBAMA & SOTOMAYOR FOLLOWING THE PATH OF 'FASCISM' --

USING THE JUDICIARY TO PUT A STAMP OF APPROVAL ON THE GOVERNMENT'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL ACTIONS IS WHAT LEAD UP TO WORLD WAR TWO.

HISTORY DOES REPEAT!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:14:10 GMT

Hey Ron -- Ali is the newest addition to our Political Unit. She helps us with First Read and (primarily) assists Chuck. She just graduated from NYU.
Mark Murray (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:47 AM)
**************************

Thanks Mark... Welcome Ali! We can use a bit of the feminine 'touch' around FR! :0)

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Anita, Birmingham, Alabama — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:14:16 GMT

Obie will get his paged turned soon enough
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President Obama will be re-elected as President. You people still haven't got any solutions or original answers to this cluster f*** that was created by your party that believes solely in "supply side economics" and it's just a theory, a theory that has been proved to fail time and time again. After all Reagan had 8 years to get unemployment down from 7.1% to 5.5%.

It took dumb ass Bush eight years to screw this country up...I have more facts to come...especially on GWB and the Bank De-regulation --Fannie Mae--Freddie Mac & CRA under Bush's watch.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Jonathan, Flint, MI — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:17:37 GMT

Ron,

Regarding the CIA and the unconstitutional sanction of torture I agree wholeheartedly with you. Although I think to go after Bush is impractical simply because it would dominate the news for months, and people would lose focus on the more pressing issues (still I wouldn't be angry if he was taken to court). You said all presidents should be prosecuted for unconstitutional behavior. While again I agree but that is a loaded statement.

I could make the argument that our current President is behaving unconstitutionally. Hell, he isn't chiming in to repeal the Patriot act wouldn't he be guilty by association? Especially if he utilizes any of the unconstitutional powers it gives his office. To be clear GWB was an awful and criminal President, but Obama has not gone very far to make amends for the transgressions of the Executive. On top of that our President wants to expand the power the Fed has over us which would be a violation of our civi liberties and its an illegal institution that prints money outside the guidelines laid out in the constitution (only gold and silver shall be legal tender). So is it that you want Bush prosecuted or that you feel people holding office should have an unshakable fidelity to the Constitution?

Just Wondering?

Anita,

Your right to say that tax cuts are useless, but only in their modern use. No one (including Reagan) managed to cut the budget to match the cuts. Tax Cuts do work and have created sustainable growth but they have to be matched with similar cuts in the Federal Budget. This is the instrumental step that is always missed. Tax Cuts without budget cuts will cause inflation. There is no way around it. The current plan under our President works on the same principle but in reverse. Budget expansion without revenue increase will cause inflation as well. The modern Democrats and Republicans propagate the same problem, they just do it with different means, and then convince us to argue or who's method for sinking the ship is better.

I would like to see a constitutional amendment passed that doesn't allow a budget to go through congress if it isn't balanced.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Gerald Garett, Buffalo NY — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:19:25 GMT

Terry, Disabled Vet, Des Moines, IA - Let's run with this scenario----The trial against former Pres Clinton was do largely because he lied about an extra marital affair

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. . . . under oath, an impeachable offense. Plus, there are EEOC laws against sexual harrassment at work. Clinton violated those too.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Now You Know — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:20:49 GMT

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

cindy, las vegas, nv — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:22:06 GMT

Obama is scared to death of the auto union. Time for Obama to stand up and be a man.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Jeff Gollin, Holmdel, NJ — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:24:11 GMT

Nice opening "reading the tea leaves" para on Sottomayor.

Lots of things buzzing through my mind re the CIA flap:

- The Obama people may wish it would go away. The Bush people (& those who love them) may want it to go away. Military hawks may hope it will go away. But there's too much out there to make it go away. The Obama folk might be well advised to accept this fact and address it head on -in the hope they can work through it and move past it. Otherwise, it could fester for years if not months.

- What seems to be confusing the Obama people is the question of "how can you hang CIA people out to dry because they accepted legal advice from their Bush superiors that they thought was valid? It seems as if everybody is diving for the bushes (pardon the pun) on this one.

- Logical answer would be that there had to be a "first domino" - i.e. someone who set this whole phony operation in motion and directed underlings to concoct bogus legal opinions to support illegal actions. That lead-domino appears to have walked, talked and quacked like VP Cheney. If so, one might conclude that he initiated a criminal conspiracy designed to mislead Congress and the American people. If true, he should be prosecuted and serve jail time.

- I understand the threat that political retribution can mean to our tradition of peaceful transition from regime to regime, but sometimes the reason for regime change is because the old regime did things egregious enough to warrant a shift in power and, as such, must be held accountable.

That Cheney was VP of the US should make it more/not less imperative that he be held accountable for any illegal actions he may have been responsible for because (a) his position of power could and did have an enormous impact on a variety of fronts - both domestically and globally and (b) because in society, no person - however powerful - is above the law.

Sometimes lancing a boil hurts really really bad for an instance, but is a necessary first step for making the infection go away.

That's what I'm thinking.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Anita, Birmingham, Alabama — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:25:39 GMT

So answer me this, why is it Palin can just up and walk away from a job she was elected to do for the people of Alaska, and we can't get rid of Ensign here, or Sanford over there? Boggles the mind!!
cindy, las vegas, nv
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Good morning Cindy, The answer to your question is because the GOP is a dying breed. They "need" Ensign and Sanford regardless of their sordid affairs. It is a sad day in America when people such as Ensign that committed such a grievous crime as bribery to his mistress are still left to represent a State. Shows just how desperate they are.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

no joe, no bo, nj — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:25:53 GMT

Anita-if you are so gung ho on going after those who violate the Geneva conventions, get ready to the trial of none other than-Barack Obama.

You do know that putting prisoners of war on trial is a violation of the Geneva conventions, don't you?

Read 'em and weep.

The fact of the matter is, those being held as 'enemy combatants' are getting more leniency than they deserve. Not because they are not signatories to the conventions, (they are not, therefore, they are not protected by them), but, in fact, it is a greater violation of the conventions to engage in acts of war while not in uniform. This is why you don't see American and/or German soldiers in the other side's uniforms in the "War movies" from World War II.

I might behoove those of you who speak so freely about the Geneva convention rules to actually read them sometime.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Cicero — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:25:54 GMT

The fact that Sotomayor views race as important in legal decisions (Ricci case) has me concerned. There is a reason that Justice wears a blindfold.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Clara Kansas City, MO — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:26:20 GMT

In the Cable Catnip section - just when I thought Liz Cheney had completed her "...daddy's all right, he just needs a little sleep..." tour - we see she will need to start round two of the 'circuit'. Good grief.
--------
“Here's one for you crack reporters to run down, cbs is reporting Justice Ginsburg Says She Originally Thought Roe v. Wade Was Designed to Limit 'Populations That We Don’t Want to Have Too Many Of'.
Yikes!
Robin Hollins, PA
-------------------------------------------

This is true. Abortion is used as a method to terminate many different minority pregnancies in the US. Just another way for white people to stay in charge and keep the minorities in their place. Ginsburg is right, and I totally agree with her. Clara Kansas City, MO (Sent Friday, July 10, 2009 5:14 PM)”

I didn’t post this,…in case anyone thought otherwise. I still think stealing someone’s moniker is the height of immaturity; but I don’t get mad about it. I have only to look at that last week of the election when someone swiped Full Moon’s moniker and you would literally read conflicting posts often stacked one on top of the other. Sorry, moonie, I still think it was wrong; but you have to admit – it was a little bit funny.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
and, not to live too deep in the past - but this one struck me as classic hypocrisy:

“…You’ve been called on this before, but you still keep repeating the lie. The unemployment rate under Reagan peaked at 10.8% in 1982 – and then declined dramatically throughout the remainder of his term. Get your facts straight and stop with the lies.” Bill, Fairfax, VA (Sent Friday, July 10, 2009 1:45 PM)

Is it fair to say that Reagan inherited a mess from Carter and the unemployment actually RAMPED UP on Reagan’s watch? I mean that’s how I read the history of it. So how is that different from where we are now? I’m curious how this gets twisted back around to Reagan GOOD, Obama BAD. Your team simply can’t have it both ways and then claim some credible foothold on the issues.

But go ahead, the world loves a good story – type away.
^^^^^^^^^^
“…And if it hadn't been for Bush funding stem cell research with federal money for the first time, we might not have artificial sperm cells today, an advance that is truly breathtaking and will undoubtedly bring Christopher Reeve back to life…” Richard, Washington State (Sent Thursday, July 09, 2009 2:12 PM)

I was wondering who would be the first to show their fear that the male species has almost been rendered ‘obsolete’ this week. You do not disappoint, Richard, you simply do NOT disappoint.
^^^^^^^^^^
Yes, they are correct - Their stimulus was a failure. President Obama's stimulus has paid out 7% -let's chat again when it is around 50% paid out. Or better yet, let's don't. The only Epic Fail I see here is the G"NO"P. They are nothing and yet they ARE consistent.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Matthew, Houston, TX — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:27:56 GMT

This is how the Democrats play. Identity politics, and the politics of personal destruction. Hope they have fun, they only have until the next election.
Andy A., NJ (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:41 AM)
===================================================

Amazing how the right conveniently forgets the same type of attacks the Republicans carried out. Rmember when they vilified the 'poster boy' for CHIP? They lied, they misled and they attacked a 12 year old boy and his family. And there are many, many, many instances that can be cited by many who post on this board.

No one on either side has the right to claim the other side has a corner on hypocrisy.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Go Dick Go — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:31:24 GMT

I guess the Democrats didn't have enough of Cheney in Round I. Dick will have to tear them another new one in Round II.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

The GOP just gets lamer and lamer — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:36:02 GMT

What a bunch of losers in the White House.

You can hear Rahm Emanuel behind the scenes, "Lets see, health care is tanking, crap and trade is dead, the stimulus isn't creating any jobs, the Jackson funeral is done, Palin quit, and the Sanford thing is quieting down. We need a distraction, I know! Let's bring up Cheney."

Losers.

GOPer (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:35 AM)
__________

Right, so, if crimes *were* committed, they should get away with it, is that your contention?

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

you have ZERO credibility — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:39:22 GMT

This is why I don't respond to you and those like you. I have no use for those who are void of common sense. There is clearly nothing "plainly stated" in my post. Take the high road and offer an apology. Nah, I'll play the liberal on this one. No apology will be accepted because your ideology, like so many others on this blog, is that liberals don't lie, they just forget to tell the truth.
Bad Chihuahua (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:45 AM)
___________

What a total lying loser you are. Last Friday, you were talking about how, unlike liberals, you castrate your own, and were condemning Sanford. Yet, for days after that story first broke, you were including him in your asinine "thank you" lists. You cannot even keep your own lies straight from day to day. It amazes me that your posts are immediately deleted as soon as the moderator sees your lying name at the bottom of them.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

I love the smell of GOP hypocrisy in the morning. — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:42:25 GMT

re: *** Introducing Sen. Franken: The sideshow highlight of the hearings this week: Al Franken's debut on the national stage as a Senate questioner. Of course, he once PLAYED a U.S. senator questioning a Supreme Court nominee on "SNL." He was the late Paul Simon questioning Clarence Thomas.

This freak is still PLAYING the role of a U.S. senator. As responsible, rational Minnesota citizens, we apologize to the Nation for our state's sending this anencephalic dwarf to the Senate.
Robert Olmsted, Rochester, MN (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:51 AM)

______________

The man has been in office a few days and you are already condemning him. You know, I guess according to the "you bash sarah because you fear her" rhetoric, what should we make of your comments? Afraid he is just that good are you? Or will you hypocritically only allow that logic in one direction and not both?

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

I love the smell of GOP hypocrisy in the morning! — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:46:41 GMT

Palin will be out of politics in a couple of weeks.

The Huffington Post will have to make up stories about some other conservative beauty or lose readership. Palin was a help to them because they only chew on the GOP. They are void of true and fair political reporting or they would have cut Obama up for breakfact, lunch and dinner since he was elected.

<> <> <> <> <> <> <> <>
Monkberry Moon (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:54 AM)
__________

You mean, in that same way that Fox News challenged Bush/Cheney on their war crimes? Oh wait, they didn't do that, did they? Does that make *them* "void of true and fair political reporting"?

You're not even *trying* to hide your bias, are you?

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Bad Chihuahua — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:47:35 GMT

Jaw Willie is pleading for you libs to ignore my rants, as he calls 'em. All my so called rants are short and to the point.

You have to copy his and take them out on the porch and read them with your lunch they are so damn long and uniformative. A singular waste of time. He's all Jaw. And that's his new moniker ... ALL JAW.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Mo — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:01:14 GMT

"We all have a 'choice' in life. Someone 'chose' to rub out an abortion doctor who's 'choice' was to rub out life in it's most innocent form. Sometimes what goes around comes around." Look it up. (June 1)
Bad Chihuahua (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:45 AM)

Bad you are plainly saying Dr Tiller got what he deserved by saying what goes around comes around. You neo-cons are really dump, you don't even understand what you are saying, man think before you speak I know that is hard for neo-cons but at least you don't look like and idiot. You need to learn the saying "better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all dought"

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

CMSgt P — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:02:03 GMT

It's obvious the republican party is in a downward spiral. Who do they have left? Gov Palin was going to be there sacrificial lamb for 2012 and then once Pres Obama was term limited, Jindal was going to resurrect again. The problem is that every day the repubs either prove to be complete hypocrites, immoral buffoons, actually anti-American when it comes to establishing programs that actually HELP Americans, breaking the law and even the constitution, etc., etc. It used to be drip, drip, drip but lately it's been a gusher.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Ted, Mid Michigan — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:16:11 GMT

Nice to see that Jill Biden gets to choose where she will have sugery and who her ortho surgeon will be. Good luck to the rest of you if you need such services in the next few years-take a number, we will call you in a number of months when a time slot in the OR opens up. And don't worry that he/she is not Board-Certified, quality doesn't matter in the Public Option Plan.
Obama, One and Done/Atlanta (Sent Monday, July 13, 2009 9:56 AM)

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Anyone else notice the lack of critical thinking skills evidenced in this post?

Jill Biden, spouse of the VP of the USA, gets to choose her doctor and where her surgery will be performed. All this while utilizing the tax-payer funded, government run, healthcare plan provided to the administration, congress, and the senate. The very same plan that the public option will be modeled after.

doom and gloom is sooooooo 2004

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

afisher — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:19:41 GMT

The poll that lists the favorability of SP is only significant when you look at the those pesky little thing called details. The 46% is attained by averaging the GOP impression and the Dem and Independent opinions. So when you look at a 70% favorability (GOP) with the other groups, then that makes the numbers look good, but actually skews the numbers. I suppose those that support her are heartened, but when a poll has to skew the numbers to come up with that number, one has to wonder about the motive of the pollster. Just saying - details matters!

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

John B, Des Moines, IA — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:27:26 GMT

Hey FR, how about some attention to reports that detainees suffocated while being moved in unventilated shipping containers? http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/dec/12/afghanistan The Bush administration has sullied the American reputation for at least a generation and many people died as a result. This isn't just politics, it's law, it's life, it's the very basis of our society we're talking about here.

First thoughts: A fight that fizzled?

Mike, Texoma — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:39:51 GMT

Let me just suggest that a stiff-necked debate over judge Sotomayor's qualifications, having negative racial overtones, is exactly the last thing the Republican Party needs, and probably was never really in the cards except in the minds of those of tabloid mentality who seem to be holding sway in the press.

I would say to the press that if you are worried about the internet replacing you as a news source the way to analyze it is to appreciate what it is that the internet does better and what it is that legitimate news media does better, and concentrate on what the legitimate news media does better. Like, bringing us the legitimate news.

The internet does not do a better job of bringing us the news. It is just that you have not. You chose to adbicate your territory to the internet. You will not out-blog it, and instead of attracting readers, drove them away. But, with dedicated professional reporters and a sacred trust, you are prepared to out news the inrternet, no question.

No need to tabloidize the Sotomayor hearings. Let me suggest you go back to what you do best, and if you have to downsize then do so as quickly and intelligently as possible. It is a new day.