From the spin room

nuanced — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 16:56:24 GMT

What about the important fashion issue of boxers or briefs? The joke goes that Bob Dole's answer was "depends."

From the spin room

Paul Miller, Woodbridge, VA — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 16:57:01 GMT

Yawn, its Sunday morning in August. Who scheduled this debate?

From the spin room

joe kelly — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:02:17 GMT

yeah but what were they wearing? Uh, Don't you think we want to hear what they said-this isn't about Paris Hilton!

We need to make sure we get an intelligent person truly capable of job this coming presidential election. There is a very big mess to clean up. MSNBC needs to do their job of helping the American people really hear the candidates, starting with the promised debate between just Kucinich, Edwards and Hillary.

From the spin room

Joe — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 17:42:35 GMT

I know you folks are going to say Clinton won the debate. But here in the heartland we know Obama won hands down.

From the spin room

Jerry Smith, Denver, Colorado — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 18:23:50 GMT

Lookie here.... hillaryclinton.com

From the spin room

Diane Walker, Salem, Oregon — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 18:29:25 GMT

Just as I thought Hillary Clinton is the best candidate.

From the spin room

Yiannis, Baltimore, MD — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 18:31:54 GMT

Large focus group **clearly** declares Obama the winner.

http://forum.sonshi.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=31067#post31067

From the spin room

Jeff Hammer, Greenville, SC — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 18:50:37 GMT

I feel that Obama finally had his first debate victory. His line about experience not always being a good thing in reference to Cheney and Rumsfeld was brilliant.

Joe Biden continues to be my favorite candidate and I just wish more people would support him. Joe would be an incredible president.

I've read a few complaints about the format of today's debate, but I thought it was very refreshing. Each candidate had the ability to let us see more of what makes them tick than is usually permitted during the more structured events.

From the spin room

Eric, Novato, CA — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 20:39:20 GMT

What, Obama clearly won in a "focus" group that consists of a Sun Tzu discussion forum? Yeah, that's powerful...

From the spin room

vanreuter, NY NY — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 21:00:44 GMT

"Large focus group **clearly** declares Obama the winner."
Yiannis, Baltimore, MD

He's wrapped up the Sun Tzu vote...lol

Van

From the spin room

Mark Thieme — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 21:08:05 GMT

So what do we want? "Fresh" or "experience"?
Hillary Clinton is about as "experienced" as we are going to get, especially if you count her legendary ability to deflect heat, her savvy staff, and hundreds, if not thousands of outstanding political chits. Even more so if you add in her very active years in the white house and governor's mansion.

Obama is "fresh." He is trying to change the way we think about campaigning, about governing, and about living together as Americans with the rest of species homo sapien on the globe. He's so fresh, he is green. Smart, apparently reasonably honest as humans go, and creative. Light on so-called "experience" but not a whole lot of blood on his hands either. That alone qualifies him as "fresh."
No one else has been so close to power as Hillary Clinton and nobody since Robert Kennedy can move a diverse crowd of Americans like Obama.

So what's the problem? Nominate either or both and America wins by a landslide. The republicans can only dream of such outstanding candidates and such a deep bench to populate a new executive cabinet in January 2009.

The republicans got nothing except martial law on their side.

This time is our time, if we can see that all these candidate "trees" are a verdant forest, a veritable national park full of talent. Take it from Smokey, "Only we can prevent a forest fire."

Don't ever forget, the republicans are just waiting to pave over the forest (again) to make highways to the strip mine farm if we, as we have done so many times, insist on cutting down the trees for them.

This time, let's give the future a chance,let's take America back!

From the spin room

H P Boston — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 21:36:32 GMT

It was Kucinich AGAIN! I really, really may have to vote for him.
Funny thing, watching some sky divers at a local airport this Sunday afternoon, what to my wondering eyes should appear but a banner reading RON PAUL FOR PRESIDENT. lol!

From the spin room

Sara, Cedar Rapids, Iowa — Sun, 19 Aug 2007 22:26:51 GMT

Jeff hammer-

Don't worry about enough people supporting Joe, he has a lot of people supporting him, and 80% of Iowa Caucus goers (which has never exceeded 20% of registered Democrats) have yet to decide on a candidate. At every forum he has participated in Iowa, people have been impressed, and felt he did the best, and is the only one telling the truth. Ignore the polls (which only poll name identification at this point), and even the AP stories that make it appear that this is a 2-3 candidate race. It is wide open in Iowa. AP has a story on MSN politics section which claims that there were all sorts of empty rows after Edwards (the second of 6 candidates left)What the story didn't say was the first 10 of 40-50+ rows (I didn't count) were reserved for Sponsors, or people who paid more than 25.00 (which included a meal)Hillary's campaign bought almost half of the reserved seats, and as a strategy most of her people (many but not most-paid campaign staff) left after Hillary spoke. Hillary got to speak first, and had first choice of sign location in the hall, because she donated 10,000 to the labor council for the event. Hillary's campaign has done this before (In early June at the much more expensive Hall of Fame dinner she had ten tables, at a cost of 15-20,000 and they were all paid staff, who left immediately after Hillary was done. Most of the grass roots people who support Hillary did not leave after she was done, and I did not see a single Edwards of Obama supporter leave until the program was completed. However, Hillary's paid staff, and volunteers who received the free premium tickets did leave after
Hillary was done, which meant 3-4 of the first 10 reserved rows became empty after Hillary was done. I was in a reserved seat, because my office was a sponsor of the event.(which was a labor PAC fund raiser)

Last night after the forum I drove to Des Moines for debate. I had tickets (from the IA Democratic Party) in the 5th row. I sat between a British guy from the British Embassy who flew in from DC, and former Iowan who now works as a diplomat, and is headed to three years in Nigeria. All the candidate, except Hillary, came out 15 minutes before the debate started (we had to be seated an hour before it starred). They took their place at the podium, and then had the pre -debate photo, and everyone wondered what was up, was Hillary sick, and then finally she came out alone. Only about 25% of the audience clapped, because everyone felt she had been rude.

From the spin room

diane — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 00:21:06 GMT

I don't see any similarities between Dean's campaign and Obama's. Dean is his own person and 04 was a different year. obama is his own person and it is now 07.
But, I know this is why the media has been trying to make him seem so much less than he is. They cannot accept that this guy beat the Clinton machine.
So, now, instead of reporting on his policies and the fact that his speech was amazing they make it seem off the wall. They are trying to make him look like Dean and the character they made him into.
Dean is the man who saved the democrats and beefed up the party and wrenched it away from the DLC. That is not crazy.
Obama is an 8 year state senator, a constitutional professor before becoming US Senator and the author of 2 books that were written by himself.
But, the media is trying to undermine his campaign by making him into Dean because Obama has not flamed out like the pundits all predicted

From the spin room

Larry Wigman — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 02:15:07 GMT

This debate was live? I thought it was a summer repeat. These Democrats are really, really, boring. Poor field to choose from.

From the spin room

va. — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 03:04:58 GMT

jeff: I agree with you, Joe Biden would be a great president!!

From the spin room

Jake Meyers, Cedar Rapids, IA — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 03:22:14 GMT

Wow, was Hillary off this morning or what? That had to be one of her more pathetic debates to date.

WHY won't she just answer the questions posed of her !?!?!

I didn't realize until they began the debate with the current poll numbers that Senator Obama is leading all candidates here, but after witnessing this debate, I can see why!

Edwards did fairly well too, but Obama absolutely rocked the house!

I am as of today fully supporting Senator Obama! I'll tell you what, if you could hear the buzz, you'd realize that a ton of Iowans feel this way!

From the spin room

diane — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 04:27:03 GMT

Someone on another blog attended the debate today.
She said the comments in the audience were that the pundit class has already picked out the winner before the debate even begins as always. Hillary.
And today Hillary was late and people said she did not even need to show up and she would be declared the winner by the media.
So, the media's over gushing of Hillary is being noticed by the average voter. They are cynical over the way the media acts about Hillary. Apparently they feel that regardless of what the people feel or who they think is the winner, it's discounted and the media pushes their own agenda.
It also tells me that the average voter is not as gullible as the pundit class is.
The commenter also said the people in the audience were most impressed by Obama and Edwards.
I don't know if the msnbc people read the comments but, I think they need to. they need to know how average people feel and that there is a sarcasm and anger over the way this race is being reported.

From the spin room

Garbage Man, Refuse-en-Vosges, FR — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:08:56 GMT

Garbage in; garbage out.

From the spin room

Independent, Texas — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:36:03 GMT

Hey Jerry in Corpus - are you taking hurricane precautions?

Hope you and yours stay safe!

From the spin room

Independent, Texas — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 05:38:07 GMT

Scott in South Texas

Hope you are safe from Hurricane Dean!

"Git while the gittin' is good"

From the spin room

MK,MO — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 13:26:28 GMT

Mark Thieme / hillary nor obama can win the general election, hillary is as dirty as any republican candidate and part or the washington establishment , hell the same pacs and lobbyists that back the repub candidates are feeding her money as well, obama also seems to be comfortable hob knobbing with some suspect characters from the wealthy elitist community, fact is edwards is the only candidate that refuses to embrace the powers that be in washington, his healthcare plan is the only one that addresses the real issues with a workable plan, thus the media which is controlled by corporate america is executing a very well organized campaign to silence edwards, which would be as good a reason as any to support him, he's not as glamorous or trendy as hillary or obama, and he does have the problem of being a white male, but he does care about the american citizen and he can defeat whom ever the repubs come up with, let's not fall into the trap the repubs have planned, too much is at stack this time round

From the spin room

Sara, Cedar Rapids, Iowa — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 14:10:20 GMT

Diane,

Hillary was late coming into the auditorium. The candidates walked in together, and went to the podium, and Hillary was no where around. Everyone was whispering , asking each other where she was. They even took the pre-debate picture before she arrived. Finally five minutes after the rest had arrived and been standing on stage Hillary arrived. Few people who were not already her supporters clapped for her. The late entrance did not endear her to those in attendance.

I don't know that people in the audience were most impressed with Obama or Edwards. Most people in the audience are already supporting a candidate. I do think most people thought Obama did better than he has in some earlier debates, and that John was a bit off. Not bad, but when asked if there was a difference between what Obama said about Nukes off the table, and Clinton's statement a year prior, the correct answer would have been no, but he didn't say that. Many were very impressed with Sen. Biden, especially given everyone asked whose right Joe or Richardson, said Joe's right.

From the spin room

Delaware Republican — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 18:54:30 GMT

Biden is a gas bag w/hair plugs.

From the spin room

tx — Mon, 20 Aug 2007 19:44:10 GMT

"There were a lot more people in general and candidates themselves in the spin room for the Democrats than there were for the Republicans." Re-packaging socialism takes a lot of spin....

From the spin room

Sara, Cedar Rapids, Iowa — Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:35:30 GMT

Delaware Republican-

I understand why you don't like Biden, if I were still a Republican I wouldn't like him either. In 1972 at only 29 he beats a GOP incumbent that everyone thought was unbeatable. He was only even eligible to run, because he turned 30 a few weeks after the election. Biden is unbeatable in his Senate seat, and I'm sure that is disappointing. However, despite all the pundits writing Biden off because he "talks too much", has a tendency to out his foot in his mouth etc. He is not mentioned in the AP story on MSNBC.com titled "Candidates develop foot-in-mouth disease" And in every debate he has remained within his time, often having time left over.

From the spin room

grover — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 02:47:45 GMT

why is borac & hillrey in the center