Biden Iraq plan passes

M. Boley — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:32:32 GMT

Now it starts... about time. The wheels have been set in motion. We are on our way out.

Biden Iraq plan passes

American Voter — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:41:20 GMT

Big deal. Nonbinding means nothing. How about manning up w/somthing binding?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Amazed, Atlanta GA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:42:05 GMT

Let's see Bushie boy veto this one... OVERRIDE

Biden Iraq plan passes

Gary Schear, Bozeman Montana — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:42:51 GMT

Good on Biden. Any progress toward the exit is good progress. I don't care now how it happens but behold the spectacle of the Conqueror dividing the conquest and remaking the borders for the little brown people.
It was not ours to do. It was up to the Iraqis to cut the throat of their own oppressor and then through War or negotiation settle their own fate. We stole that legitimacy from them.
Will we practice in the future what we have learned here?
LOL Right!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Nicholas, Minneaps, MN — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:43:41 GMT

McCain would have voted no anyway, no big deal there. But where was B.O.? This was an important non-binding vote? As a supporter, I have a difficult time letting that slide. I bet that'll hurt him in the debate tonight, too. How sad. Biden certainly has the best Iraq strategy.

Biden Iraq plan passes

MK,MO — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:45:08 GMT

I believe it would be hard for anyone to argue that bidens plan was not feasible, but I also know that president bush and the war machine will have no part of it, nice to see the congress coming to it's senses though, a nice bit of news for a change

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dave, Tn — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:53:40 GMT

Why not just sponsor a rock concert, and have U2 and other bands play? After all this is all about making Liberals "feel" good about themselves, and not saving lives.
Anyone watching the WWII special on PBS? I worry about a time when losing 3800 troops in one day could be considered a good one.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jackie in IL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:59:40 GMT

How about that: bipartisanship! Biden can work with others and is the most qualified candidate. He should be the frontrunner and may very well be before this is all over. Don't believe what the media is telling you. (Look toward the Iowa voters; they are the only group that is standing between big money and influence completely taking over the election process and somebody like Biden having a shot). Biden is going to shock people with his Iowa showing.

Biden Iraq plan passes

pat, huntington, ny — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:59:47 GMT

American Vote - a lesson in civics and govt procedure would do you good...the very nature of the relief sought in the bill makes it non-binding. Congress cannot legally compell another country to divide itself up...idiot!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jael, downstate IL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:03:59 GMT

Glad to see it. I hope this gets the ball rolling. Of course, Bush & Co. won't like it, but it at least makes sense, rather than "more of the same"

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:06:02 GMT

Whether it was nonbinding or not, it represents the first time Republicans have gone against Bush in any significant number on the Iraq issue.

I also wonder where Obama was. Is this part of his strategy? I know he won't go to non DNC debates and forums, so maybe he is not going to vote on any nonbinding legislation either. Any Obama supporters out there that know why he missed it. (This is not an accusation, btw - there are lots of reasons legislators miss votes. I just wonder if it is a "statement" on nonbinding resolutions, similar to his refusal to vote on the MoveOn resolution.)

Biden Iraq plan passes

Kelly Garrett — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:08:47 GMT

Obama has now missed this vote and the vote on the moveon.org ad. Is that Edward's opening to define himself as the real Clinton alternative?

Biden Iraq plan passes

M. Boley — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:08:58 GMT

I'm eagerly waiting to hear the Righty psycho-talkers' reaction to this BIPARTISAN vote. Of course, they will probably scream at the top of their lungs but that's cool... they know the time for Their Man and His Plan are running on 'E'. Death screams from the Right are fun to hear.

Biden Iraq plan passes

nuanced — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:10:31 GMT

Even if it is a good plan and a good bill Bush will veto it because he didn't direct that it pass. It's a decider war president kind of thing.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lee Holmes — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:11:02 GMT

Gary: How do you think that the borders of Iraq were originally formed to begin with? [By conquerors with surveyors chains and pencils who cut up the Middle East out of the tossed out Ottoman Empire].

Biden Iraq plan passes

Virginia — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:11:03 GMT

Great leadership by Biden. This is the kind of leadership we need in the Whitehouse.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Brian, Cedar Hill, TX — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:12:59 GMT

Way to go, Joe.

Biden Iraq plan passes

frank farmer columbia tn — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:18:27 GMT

This is a good example of why Joe Biden may be the best answer for president. He at least has a plan that all parties should be happy with.

Biden Iraq plan passes

S.B. Stein E.B. NJ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:21:06 GMT

This is something Biden has talked about since the beginning. I guess it could be something that he thought would work. It could also be a way to get at the president who said early on that there would be no splitting up of the country of Iraq.

I remember that Sam Brownback talked about this as one of his own ideas during a Republican debate. How laughable is that... At one point Biden didn't fully attribute something to someone else and now it is happening to him with his Iraq plan.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carmen Colorado — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:21:27 GMT

About time. Now lets keep it going.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Texas Democrat - Fort Worth, TX — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:23:03 GMT

I would LOVE to see Bush veto this bill. I say that because doing so would be an even bigger nail in the proverbial coffin that will be used to carry the rotten carcass that his presidency has become out of office. Nancy Pelosi may say that impeachment is "off the table" but a tattered nation will only live in denial amid so much before it decides "victory is the only option" in correcting it's electoral mistakes.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Glenn Nash, St. Paul MN — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:23:32 GMT

Another non-binding resolution?? What's next? A vote on whether chocolate or vanilla ice cream is better?

And, as usual, Obama is nowhere to be found. What's he do for a living anyway?

And the Hillary lovers will think this is a conspiracy by the Republicans to make Biden look good. How dare they do that to the next Queen, ehh President.

Certainly this congress will go down as the biggest do nothing congress in history.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lewis, Cincinnati, Ohio — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:24:01 GMT

Although, I'm a little concerned Obama didn't vote, I'm not sure I agree with the senate wasting their time with non-binding resolutions, I'm sure this will come up tonight....

Biden Iraq plan passes

H P Boston — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:29:10 GMT

Why did Obama not vote for this. Did he feel it was useless?
We will find out tonight for sure!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jessica, Wisconsin — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:29:23 GMT

This was just a nonbinding vote - it really doesn't mean anything. Obama has already said that in the end we might end up with a divided Iraq but it should be their choice and should not be imposed by us. I would have to agree with him here. Feingold voted against this and I have complete faith in his judgement.

Biden Iraq plan passes

karlos — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:30:41 GMT

while this is a non-binding resolution please note the 75 votes, 8 more than needed to overide. this is about time biden be recongized as having the best iraq plan, not hillary,obama,or mccain plan, biden plan. if this doesn't vault him to the top tier in this campaign i don't know what will.

Biden Iraq plan passes

scott wilcott, marshfield, wis. — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:32:49 GMT

I don't think this is imposing a separation that "is not ours" to do. It's more the opposite. These 3 groups were forced together by the British after WWI by drawing lines in the sand.
The Czechs and Slovaks were, too, but now, 90 years later, they have separated as they wanted. Likewise, the Balkan states were stitched together into a "Yogoslavia". Now they've separated (bloodily) as they wanted to.
I wouldn't be in favor of sending troops to Central Europe or more troops to the Balkans to force ethnic/religious groups to live together in one political entity because Lloyd George, Wilson and Clemenceau said they had to. I'm not in favor of doing it in Iraq.
Let's find an arrangement these people are willing to live with.

Biden Iraq plan passes

ray salgado — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:33:01 GMT

It's past time the Senate agreed on a sensible solution to the Iraq war. This should be a clear message to the Bush administration, the country wants solutions with clearly understood policies. "Biden" should be commended for pushing this resolution through the Senate.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Deb, Largo — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:36:39 GMT

Biden Iraq plan passes

Deb, Largo — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:37:49 GMT

Biden's the man when it comes to Iraq. He's had the most viable plan all along.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jessica, Wisconsin — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:38:28 GMT

The only reason there are 75 votes (enough to override a veto) is because this was nonbinding. Easy to vote for something that doesn't really mean anything.

Biden Iraq plan passes

SG, NJ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:40:00 GMT

Four yrs ago I believed this was a tribal region where religionand politics will not cohabitate. I called for 5 independant states then. I give Biden high marks for taking this stand.Now they have a concept and need to deveop the Logistics to make this reality.The difficulty is to share the wealth they all want to control.This is not all about religious freedom but greed and monitary gain.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Ellie Mae Johnston, Eau Claire WI — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:41:41 GMT

This is truly the model that we should use in the future. All aspects of running wars should be done by the legislative branch, not the executive branch.

This vote is ground breaking.

Biden Iraq plan passes

ki houston — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:41:42 GMT

while it is not a good idea it may be the best one . What people are forgeting is that it may not end the fighting and it will almost certianly cause another war with turkey. Not sure why Obama did not vote , but does it really matter considering this president and the fact that it is non binding . You think hes going to say "cool great idea i will do it "

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:42:35 GMT

Uh, Pat? You might want to rethink that statement and look back in history. WWII, for example. The Allied Powers divided Germany up between them - they divided Berlin as well. You remember the Berlin wall, right?

The U.S. is occupying Iraq, having defeated them in battle. If we want to burn the whole place down, we could do that. It'd be stupid and wrong, but we could do it. That's what happens when you "win" - and I guess, at least as far as eliminating Saddam's regime, we did win.

That being said, I do have issues with forcing partitioning on an unwilling Iraqi people. At the same time, however, they are unwilling to make the tough choices themselves. It's a very murky issue to me. I do, however, like Biden's plan.

Biden Iraq plan passes

SG, NJ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:42:49 GMT

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lewis, Cincinnati, Ohio — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:43:03 GMT

I have a question... if the republicans aren't going to vote with the dems on binding resolution what's the the purpose of voting with the dems on non-binding resolutions?? The president is NOT going to change is mind and the war is going to continue until the end of his term. Wasn't that vote just last week?? When did this take place? Today?? This is what drives people crazy about congress!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

jt,okc — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:44:33 GMT

You know most areas of iraq isn't as clear cut as Biden suggests. Many shiites and sunnis live among each other. Kurds have their own territory.
Even in this case it all depends on the Iraqi Government. The Americans can't force anything on the Iraqis, what are we going to do force shiites and sunnis to live seperately? This vote is just a ploy to make the antiwar crowd happy.
Things would be a lot better if us as Americans can unite behind our troops and ignore the distractions brought by the terrorists and insurgents. They are winning the media and information war, if we can't win that we can't win the actual war itself.

Biden Iraq plan passes

jerry rolak , hudson,mich. — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:45:21 GMT

congrats to mr joe biden.congess moving in right direction.watch out for veto bush and he's not even italian.but he is the first moron to become president twice.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Gary Schear, Bozeman Montana — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:45:37 GMT

Lee Holmes--No shit Lee, That worked real well didn't it. Lets do it again.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Nicholas, Minneaps, MN — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:46:15 GMT

This measure gots me thinkin'. Would partitioning Iraq really work? It's one of those ideas that hasn't had its feet held to the fire. What happens after the partition? Will Turkey invade the Kurds? Will Iran gain a foothold in the Shia section? I find it unlikely that Iran wouldn't sponsor a Shia terrorist group like Hezbollah or Hamas. Will Al-Qaeda regain a foothold with Sunnis as protection from the Shia terrorist organizations? This plan would most certainly tone down localized sectarian fighting, but I doubt that the fighting among regions or in-fighting would stop altogether. Which begs the question:

Is leaving Iraq truly the best option? Of course a lot of bad things would happen immediately, but would it be best in the long run?

On another note, why does the “There will be chaos if we leave argument have any merit?” There is already chaos and civilian deaths on the large-scale. Once again, this is a short-term vs. long-term issue. I don’t know why the Demos don’t attack this as short-sided, and have some vision to the future. Instead, they avoid the topic, and that gives Repubs an edge. How silly.

Biden Iraq plan passes

John, SF Bay, CA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:46:16 GMT

Biden Iraq plan passes

Amazed, Atlanta — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:46:23 GMT

Let's find an arrangement these people are willing to live with.

That's the trouble, Scott. It seems the only real solution is to split them up to keep them from killing one another. The great irony of ironies, is Saddam, for all his many evils, knew this. Oh, but we the great America can go in and just "make" a democracy happen.. out of the blue. What a ridiculous notion that was from the beginning.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Kato in Des Moines — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:47:43 GMT

Biden's plan provides the best opportunity for bringing stablity to Iraq. The US military alone cannot win the peace in Iraq. Peace can only come about through diplomacy and the implementation of a political solution that is acceptable to all three factions in Iraq. And yes, many of you are correct when you say that we cannot and should not impose this plan on the Iraqi people. Biden's plan merely provides the framework for a political solution which, in the final analysis, must come from the Iraqi people. This general framework (of a decentralized federal state) eventually worked in Bosnia where you had the Bosnian Serbs, Muslims and Croatians in armed conflict for years. In many respects Iraq is the "Yugoslavia" of the Middle East. It's a fictitious nation-state borne of the British Empire. The only way to avoid a bloodbath when the US leaves Iraq is to try and implement a political solution that gives the Sunnis, Shia and Kurds all some degree of autonomy within a decentralized federal system. It worked in Bosnia. I say it's worth a little effort on the part of the US to try and broker a similar political solution in Iraq. Absent a political solution, peace will only come to Iraq when one sect wipes out the other two. Go Joe!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Kathy France, Rockville, MD — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:48:04 GMT

$50 billion divided between the Kurds, Sunni and Shites (not counting the corrupt officials involved on both sides) should go along way in setting up the individual governships. It will never fix the basic differences which are beyond my understanding.
It amazes me that in this country we assimilated Protestants, Catholics, English, Irish, Scots, gave women the right to vote, yes it has taken years to do this, but it wasn't necessary to kill, maim disrrupt cities and or the country while we work through it. Of course it not to say that we are not still working on racial prejudice and immigration and healthcare and education for everyone. We really need to get back to taking care of our domestic issues.

Biden Iraq plan passes

nuanced — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:49:42 GMT

I have been against the Biden plan from the beginning because it guarantees we will be in Iraq for several more years. That could be why some Republicans and even the White House might favor it; not because they think it is a good plan but because it keeps us involved in the next administration. My preference is to get out now, which, for the nuance challenged, does not mean precipitous withdrawal.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Butch, Pine, Colorado — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:50:24 GMT

Guys, any chance you could link to the roll call vote?

Biden Iraq plan passes

John, SF Bay, CA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:50:37 GMT

Iraq is still it own country regardless of how it was formed, and has the right to decide for itself. Resolutions like this just continue to make us look like we should decide how others live.
Mostly I am just tired of all the playing politics with real issues rather than doing thier jobs. This is another non binding, non 'anything' statement that means they are not working. Normally a do nothing congress can be a good thing (no damage) but this getting old and pointless.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Sierra, SF — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:54:55 GMT

This is as important as the MoveOn vote !!

WHAT is the point ?

Vote on GETTING OUT OF IRAQ !!
Make it a binding resolution.
Not this mindless crap !

Has Jumpin' Joe TALKED TO ANY IRAQIS about this ?

An election ploy by a guy who VOTED FOR THE WAR !!
I can feel the Joememtum !
(Get excited)

Biden Iraq plan passes

ye ye ye — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:56:02 GMT

WHERE IS THE STORY ABOUT HILLARY CLINTON'S GQ COVERUP MSNBC???????? CMON GET WITH IT!!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

James — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 19:59:50 GMT

The real question is what affect will this non-binding resolution do make into law some political solution in Iraq? A non-binding resolution cannot be made into law,its just a statement made by the Senate on what they or they do not disagree with. There maybe a reason why OB did not show up for the last two bills. Do you think its because they cannot be make into law in the first place?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lee Holmes — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:02:45 GMT

Gary:Why? You people forget that this Partition of the Unwilling is going to have exactly the same effect as the partition now being effected between the Palestinians and the Jews. And this time,Biden will deal with several differant players all angling for Iraqi supremacy with no ''honest brokers''[forget the UN.They can't even keep the Bekka Valley in Lebanon safe], to keep the warring factions from tearing at each other. And as with Korea,there remains a very real danger that the factions will draw in outside players to act for the Sunnis and the Shias,widening the conflict,with the Kurds left isolated,trapped between competing Turk and Iranian ambitions. How Biden deals with all of these issues is anyones guess.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Pacheck, Huntington Beach, Ca. — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:05:23 GMT

Non-binding, what the hell is that! What is the purpose of saying anything if you don't mean it. Besides, we have no legal power to partition someone elses soveriegn country. We better be careful as all we have is a small defeated army and the history of shooting our self in the foot.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Like It Is — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:16:36 GMT

75 to 23, that's pretty lopsided. That means that half of the Republican Senators voted with Biden. Very impressive. The tide may be turning.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Margaret, NYC — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:17:08 GMT

Hillary Hawk bow$ to Repubs and war profiteer$ - funding her campaign!
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/9/26/133755/160

She refuses to apologize for her last war vote - and now IraN?? Yikes!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:17:18 GMT

Pacheck - Again, Iraq is not a sovereign country. If it was, we could hightail it the hell out of there and leave them to clean up their own damn mess. It is an occupied nation - occupied by the U.S. and the coalition of the willing. It's just too bad the coalition of the willing doesn't include Iraqis.

Biden Iraq plan passes

1i, Atlanta GA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:18:45 GMT

Partitioning is a cumbersome solution that only continues our amoral nation-building exercise. Partitioning invariably results in perverse difficulties and given our past and current mismanagement of Iraq, one can only assume a partitioning would be equally mismanaged in the future.

Further, a partitioning will not improve stability, even remotely. It places existing oil fields directly in Iran's sphere of influence (which is bound to be demonized by the west), undeveloped Sunni oil territory at the disposal of foreign development (which is bound to be demonized by the middle-east), and Kurdish Iraq at the mercy of Turkey/Iran.

Biden Iraq plan passes

john, Lancaster, Ca — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:21:48 GMT

"The problems in Iraq are bigger than one man. Iraq needs a new Constitutional convention that would include representatives from all levels of Iraqi society - in and out of government. The United Nations should play a central role in convening and participating in this convention, which should not adjourn until a new accord on national reconciliation is reached. To reconcile, the Iraqis must also meet key political benchmarks outside of the Constitutional process, including new local elections and revising debaathification.

Now the Iraqis may come out of this process choosing some kind of soft partition into three regions - one Sunni, one Shia, one Kurd. But it must be their choice. America should not impose the division of Iraq.

While we change the dynamic within Iraq, we must surge our diplomacy in the region."
This is a quote from senator Obama speech in Iowa september 12, 2007
Full speech here:
http://www.barackobama.com/2007/09/12/remarks_of_senator_barack_obam_23.php

I'm leaning toward him but I'm still shopping around. However on this point i'm ashamed of what this country has become. This country was born on a fight against colonialism. Today we are not better than the European colonial empires of the 19th century who ended up failing. Why not a vote on a referendum where the Iraqis will have to decide on the future of their country. Why representatives of US citizens from the states of Delaware or New York will have to decide for Iraqi in Basra, Kirkuk or Mosul. Sure our taxes are spent there but we were never invited there.
I'm a moderate ex-republican who has given up on the GOP. But I'm not sure that that i'll vote for the democratic party on the next election. It seems like there is no voice of reason left in Washington.
Anyone who is interested in History, particularly the middle east history knows that all colonial empires have failed to impose their will in this area for centuries.
Neo-conservatism is to conservatism what radicalism is to moderation.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Elizabeth Sullivan, San Diego, CA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:23:38 GMT

You can certainly tell who are Clinton, Obama, and Edwards supporters. They are the ones dismissing this vote.

At least Biden has the balls to put his name on something, put it to a vote and live with the consequences.

Non-binding means that Biden is offering what he believes to be the best solution to the situation in Iraq. What is significant is that 75% of the Senate agrees with his plan.

If the vote had gone the other way supporters of Clinton, et al, would not be downplaying the vote. They would be throwing it in Biden's face.

Where is your candidates plan?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dondi Reyes — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:25:42 GMT

this is what girlie-men do. ( A non binding resolution)

Biden Iraq plan passes

Richmond, VA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:26:03 GMT

I am a die-hard Republican, but Biden has shown his strenghth here by passing something that is bipartisan and a stark alternaive to the Bush plan. Good for Joe!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dondi Reyes — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:28:49 GMT

this is what girlie-men do. ( A non binding resolution)

Biden Iraq plan passes

Rick, WS, NC — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:29:32 GMT

Such courage from the left...yack yack yack...a non binding resolution that means squat diddly...when are these clowns going to do something meaningful like cut off bush's war funding?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:30:45 GMT

Biden Iraq plan passes

Sprout, Portland, Oregon — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:34:18 GMT

Would all of you idiots talking about the "non-binding" issue stop and think for a moment? If it had been binding does that mean the US congress would go over to Iraq and force them to start splitting up into seperate states? We can't "bind" another nation to divide their country. That's why Mr. Biden also brings up the point that this solution is a viable option per THEIR constitution. This is a solution, that if they choose to do it, is constitutional under their law. We cannot pass a law in America that "binds" the Iraqi government to do anything. We can vote to bring troops home, fund them, defund them, but we can't make them divide their country up anymore than we can make homosexuality legal in Iran.

Biden Iraq plan passes

John Paone, Mashpee, MA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:34:33 GMT

Sen, Joe Biden is one of the few who understands the history of Iraq, its people and the consequent reality that exists today. Thank you to Joe Biden and Sen. Brownback for having the common sense, intelligence, historical perspective and courage to sponsor this legislation. Kato in Des Moines (above) is right. Iraq has been and remains a fictitious state. President Bush does not seem to have understood this or he has mistakenly chosen to devalue its significance.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Glenn Woodruff, Castroville, Texas — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:35:39 GMT

If this plan goes through expect to see increase violence as each group trys to grab as much area as the can for themselves. I am suprised more of you do not see that.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Mo Williams — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:37:09 GMT

Even if it was binding, and passed with veto proof majorities, it would be ruled unconstitutional. Separation of powers and all that stuff.

How much are we paying these people to do this?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Kevin, Olympia, WA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:37:20 GMT

When Saddam was in power, ethnic rivalries and conflicts that went back centuries were subdued by force. Not a nice guy, admittedly, but he did contain the problem. Then the "coalition" comes along, tosses Saddam out of power and has the temerity andarrogance to think they can impose a western style democracy onto a fundamentalist Islamic state that has just
had the lid lifted off a boiling cauldron of ethnic distrust and hate. What did they think was going to happen? Well, they didn't think. Too many people have died in this war; too many potentially productive lives have been lost on both sides. If we were to stay there five more years, we would only see more dead bodies. We would not see Shiites, Sunnis, and Kurds working together for a free Iraq. It hasn't happened for centuries; it won't happen now.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Gary Schear, Bozeman Montana — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:39:32 GMT

Lee Holmes--I was being sarcastic Lee. Damn keyboard is missing it's Semi Sarcastic Colon.
I am very dubious of western powers drawing maps. I have had my fill of so called leaders who disregard history. That is why we are in this forum today.
I am dubious but at this point I only care about reducing the amount of blood shed in this idiot waste of blood and money. Any progress out of the swamp is good progress and may God Damn and take the next President, who leads so poorly, to his reward.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:41:51 GMT

Elizabeth - You shouldn't rush to judgment about people based on their favored candidate. I am more a Clinton supporter than any other candidate at this point, although I have not fully made up my mind. I applaud Biden for putting forward a plan, and I think the vote was an important step, nonbinding though it may have been.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lewis, cincinnati, ohio — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:42:58 GMT

ummm...Sprout..we forced Korea to split into two separate nations..didn't we?? Why not Iraq? Carrie's right they are not a sovereign nation they are an occupied nation. I like Biden's plan--I really do, but it seems to me that the US Senate has more pressing things to do than vote on non-binding resolutions. PERIOD.

Biden Iraq plan passes

mr philly pa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:45:01 GMT

Joe Biden has had this solution all along. This is why many more people should be looking at him as the clear choice for president. He has a clear and coherent direction for america.
Now lets split the U.S.!!!!!!! Let the republicans destroy humanity as they wish, and they alone shall suffer the inevitable consequences. Let them fear gays, let them go on with out stem cell research, let them self destuct....I want no part of a self serving government again. This BUSH/CHENEY/PELOSI/REID/RUMSFELD/BOLTON/SCHWARTZ/RICE/
GONZALES world is sick. HARVARD should be closed if only for GIVING most of these people degrees. The SYSTEM is clearly broken.
My fix is a FLAT 25% tax on all people and businesses headquartered in the us. Any business existing outside of the US should be taxed at 40%. No hiding funds like in the hedgefunds, if they do this they should be taxed at an even higher rate. Oh and to stop the ceo's from their compensation game, it simply would be that they have a salary only and anything beyond that is still taxable. Stop the B.S...

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dickie Flatts, Charlotte, NC — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:45:03 GMT

Hillary Clinton supported Joe Biden and his measure today. Good for her. Obama on the other hand must have been out playing basketball.

Biden Iraq plan passes

t. hill, carrollton, tx — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:48:57 GMT

"While the amendment is nonbinding"

worthless resolution.

nothing more to say.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Gray, DC — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:49:27 GMT

I do not dismiss the vote and I am an Obama supporter. Obama was out of town. He was told by Reid that there would be no votes today and that particular vote was tabled indefinitely. They changed and brought it to a voice vote within minutes. He could not get back in time.

He also missed another vote too unfortunately that they didn't tell you about, per the blog sites :

HomeDiariesBreaking BlueE-Wire 2008BREAKING: HILLARY CLINTON VOTES YES FOR WAR WITH IRAN!!!!
by DerekLarsson, Wed Sep 26, 2007 at 03:25:05 PM EST

She's done it again, folks!
She has shown her true colors and true loyalties once again.

By a vote 76-22, the Senate passed the Joe Lieberman-Kyl amendment, which threatens to "combat, contain and [stop]" Iran via "MILITARY INSTRUMENTS." Sen. Jim Webb (D-VA) called the amendment "Cheney's fondest pipe dream" and said it will be "read as a backdoor method of gaining Congressional validation for military action."

Hillary Rodham Clinton voted "YES" to pass this admendment

Everyone else Biden, Dodd, Kerry voted No.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jeffersonian — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:50:18 GMT

The plan sound good ,but where are you going to draw the imaginary lines ,and whos going to do it. Then who's going to abide by it.I've said from the start this engagement is like having a foriegn country come into America and tell us we can no longer have Baptist ,church of Christ , mormons , Catholics , etc etc. as we are all Christians. We can have one church only .Now all the ministers etc. get together and decide where it is going to be headquarterd ,whos going to be the big cheese .I'll bet you would see a WAR!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dot, Illinois — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:51:16 GMT

Carrie, Eastern Iowa ----well said! I agree!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Hans J, San Diego, California — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:53:06 GMT

"We the people..." are being heard. Those that represent us are moving in many possitive directions. Forward momentum in discussions, problem solving, learning, caring and actions (small and large) all culminating at once. Steps to show we too care and support "The people of Iraq" and in Iraq.
Isn't this a good message to the world?
Does the USA, only have the right answers for Iraq (and the World)?
We don't have the right to be the only people to question our actions as a nation.
A Bipartisan resolution that is a good step forward.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jeffersonian — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:53:09 GMT

By the way .I keep hearing the words "non binding " and "we have no right imposing our will on foriegn soil". Well we already have by invading a country without provocation!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Venki, TwinCities, MN — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:53:40 GMT

This is not going to work. I think this will add further instability in the Gulf region.
Its like dividing India and Pakistan based on religion. The two countries still have lots of difference even after 60 days.
The option should have been explored before the conflict involving the Iraqi leaders (all groups) who were opposed to the Dictatorship.
First mistake was going to War and this will be the second mistake.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Sara, Cedar Rapids, Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:54:21 GMT

Republican Senator John Warner, instrumental and influential in almost all things related to Iraq, called the vote an "extraordinary moment because it marks the high-water mark of all the many debates and resolutions we've had in terms of bipartisanship."

That is high praise. Sen. Biden proved, once again, that he has the ability to build consensus in DC, not an easy feat, and not something many accomplish.

With respect to the claims that this is meaningless due to it being "non-binding" how many non-binding Iraq related measures have there been? This is not a resolution to re-name a post office, this is a resolution regarding the Senate's belief that their should be a federal system for Iraq. Referring to it as a partition of Iraq is actually wrong, a soft partition with in a federal system, or decentralized federal government would be the accurate characterization.

In any event, Biden has a plan, it may not be perfect, but he's had the guts to not merely claim he knows what to do, and provide no details of how he accomplishes it. Go Joe!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jim Mansfield, OH — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:56:15 GMT

Dear Amazed in Atlanta, I am amazed you passed Civics. A non-binding resolution is not anything let alone something President Bush could veto. It is even more useless than a UN resolution. The arrogance of Biden and the other Senators. Let's partition Iraq. Do they want to use our troops to force that?? They do not want to use troops to hunt down militants in Iraq. Do they think the Iraqis will say "Oh thank you for splitting up our country. We will carry out your wishes immediately."

Biden Iraq plan passes

Phil, Memphis, TN — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:56:42 GMT

Thank You Joe.....

Something that makes sense coming out of the Senate with more than 55 votes, Maybe all is not lost.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Aiden — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:57:25 GMT

The stage is now set for the Iraq people to wage war on themselves. A country divided can never stand together without bloodshed.

The sons will pay the price of our foolish and selfish fathers/leaders.

Biden Iraq plan passes

t. hill, carrollton, tx — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:57:44 GMT

Amazed you're not! Do you need a definition of nonbinding? Even if it was binding, is it the US authority to spit an independent nation? This is no more than Republicans throwing the Democrats a bone.

Biden Iraq plan passes

JIrby, Colorado — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:58:30 GMT

This looks better than I first thought. The rednecks on this thread don't like it, so it must be good. What does Jerry of Jesusville think? Come on, please, lets have a few more idiots weighing in.

Biden Iraq plan passes

MarkH, Huntington, WV, USA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:59:09 GMT

With Bush acquiescing to "reduce troops" and with the effort to get Blackwater out of Iraq it is becoming clear that any and all efforts to get us further out of Iraq have finally gotten majority support -- except for Dubya.

It isn't entirely clear that enforcing a 3-province division upon Iraq is best. So far our efforts to enforce things on them haven't all proven wonderful and beneficial.

There are regions which are primarily of one ethnicity or sect. We've seen reports about the "Kurdish" north and the Sunni Anbar Province. Maybe the whole country will divide naturally on these lines without our involvement. Maybe Biden's plan is simply to say we're doing the dividing up rather than allowing that it's naturally occurring.

What about the mixed areas? What does the Biden plan do about that?

At some time (soon) we will need to accept that there is a limit to what good we might be able to do on our way out -- and at that time we simply need to recede into the deserts and eventually out of the country altogether.

The only thing that could keep us there is to protect people rather than to kill them or if al Quaeda types follow our troops and we need to fight them. What else could we do that wouldn't continue the disaster?

Does Biden call for withdrawing troops from dangerous areas? Does it call for ONLY fighting al Qaeda types?

There is more work to do to get this done right and we don't yet know whether Republicans will join in those steps.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Sprout, Portland, Oregon — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:59:31 GMT

Lewis, India made the Korean proposal and the United Nations accepted. I'm not aware of any senate resolution, binding or otherwise, that directly impacted Korea the way this bill suggests doing in Iraq. I support this solution but the Iraqi's have to jump on board with it too.

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Korean_Armistice_Agreement

Biden Iraq plan passes

mr philly pa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 20:59:43 GMT

excuse me it should read ... SHULTZ/ROHATYN...these names are synonomous with stealing from the US treasury...please look them up and see what the press says about them, then look further and filter the bs and see what they really are

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dan Nixon — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:00:01 GMT

It is unclear whether or not Biden's plan would promote a situation that ultimately reduces or increases the probability of terrorist "safe zone" formation within Iraq.

What is clear is that we cannot IMPOSE this plan upon an unwilling sovereign Iraqi government. I have seen no indication of any support for this plan by anyone in Iraq - except the Kurds and Muqtada El_Sadr.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Fernando, Miami , FL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:01:37 GMT

OLD W. will use a SOLID GOLD Pen given to him by the Saudi's to VETO this one BOYS!!!!!!!!!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Fernando, Miami , FL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:01:38 GMT

OLD W. will use a SOLID GOLD Pen given to him by the Saudi's to VETO this one BOYS!!!!!!!!!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Bee — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:01:52 GMT

Another symbolic vote that is meaningless. What they heck is a vote that is non biding? This vote is all about politics as usual.

In fact, i am happy Obama skip the vote. I think it demonstrate his fraustration with the system.

Why would U.S want to divide a country that is one into three, without getting a buy in from the iraq people? If the country is going to be divided, let it come from the people of Iraq and the international community.

Enough of imposing our will on a soverign nation. Lets put our self in their shoe for a minute; say we are invaded by a country, how would we feal if pertition is imposed on us as a country? Since we don't agree on all issues, would we prefer the invader to divide us into Red and Blue states.

If you answer yes to my questions then imposing pertition on the iraq will definetely work. If your answer is NO, then it is not right to impose our will on them. Let them decide what kind of country they want.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Fernando, Miami , FL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:03:05 GMT

OLD W. will use a SOLID GOLD Pen given to him by the Saudi's to VETO this one BOYS!!!!!!!!!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

paul Seattle — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:03:31 GMT

Sad that the Demo's don't get it. Demo power play, tto bad they can't see the future with their moves to chicken us out.another nail in the coffin of the U.S.........

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john, Lancaster, Ca — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:04:10 GMT

Lewis, Carrie

Why not a vote on a referendum where the Iraqis will have the possibility to say what they want for their country or how they want it to be? Sure Iraq has never been a national entity but who gave to the American legislators a mandate to decide for millions of Iraqis?
Iraq may not be a nation but during the Iran-Iraq war which last more than eight years, Iraqis Shias fought along with Sunni and Kurds against Iranian Shias.
History is much more complex than many in our congress would like us to believe.
Does anyone in our lawmakers ever heard about Arab nationalism? Again I'm asking is there any voice of reason left in Washington?

Biden Iraq plan passes

J.W. nichols, Jamesburg, NJ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:15:42 GMT

Does the U.S. government have the right to determine
the form and substance of Iraq? Does the U.S. Senate
intend to help Iraq or is the partition of the country for our own convenience?

Biden Iraq plan passes

CJ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:19:00 GMT

Lee Holmes you are either receptive to Biden's plan or you fully accept Bush's weak centralized gov model(ripe for being overtaken by Al-Sadr). While I agree this isn't the golden egg...it's not like there are a host of options to consider in this ill planned occupation. And Dave you seem to care more about liberals looking bad than congress making some progress on finding some semblance of a solution. Just pretend it's Brownback's idea.

Biden Iraq plan passes

CJ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:20:48 GMT

It's going to be several years before our troops leave Iraq...what can be done is reducing our footprint and our heavy role in security.

Biden Iraq plan passes

NonDem ForSure — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:23:25 GMT

For all you Democrats that voted for change, are you happy with the change?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Red Neck, from a Red State — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:28:16 GMT

Well, I guess I'm one of them there 'rednecks' you speak of, and I absolutely love the vote. Once again the Democrats show how toothless they are with Yet Another Non Binding Resolution (YANBR for short).

Maybe we can send all the Dems a non-binding paycheck. Lets say we make it out for a billion apiece.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jimmy White, North Muskegon, MI — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:28:43 GMT

This vote is just proof that Joe Biden WILL be the next President of the United States.
Have no doubt about it; this race is about Iraq. Joe Biden has the ONLY plan for Iraq, as evidenced by today's vote encompassing 25 Republicans.
Barack has to defend why he missed this critical vote, and Hillary has to explain why she will vote for this Bill if her plan for Iraq is better.
Either way, Joe Biden comes out on top, the fundraising dollars go through the roof, and he blows through the roof to win this nomination, and in turn become our next President.
Well done President Biden.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Doug, Rochester MN — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:30:11 GMT

Biden's plan will not work, all three groups want the oil

Biden Iraq plan passes

JOHN CRIVARO ,DESMOINES, IOWA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:31:00 GMT

I KNEW ALOT OF OUR DEMOCRATIC LEADERS IN CONGRESS WERE BRAIN DEAD, AND NOW SOME REPUBLICANS HAVE JOINED THEM. WHAT GIVES BIDEN AND THE REST OF THE IDIOTS WHO VOTED ON THE NON-BINDING VOTE TO DECIDE THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO SLICE UP IRAQ INTO THREE COUNTRIES. ITS A SLAP IN THE FACE OF ALL OUR MEN AND WOMEN WHO HAVE DIED OR BEEN WOUNDED IN IRAQ TO SURRENDER NOW. LETS ALL WORK TOGETHER TO WIN THIS WAR AND COME HOME WITH HONOR. SURRENDER SHOULD NOT BE AN OPTION

Biden Iraq plan passes

David R. Haight — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:35:38 GMT

Partation:
Well he may not be president but , heren is a plan from this very brief article a good sensable plan. We may not have to shoot our way out afterall !

Biden Iraq plan passes

JULIAN STURTON — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:35:55 GMT

The only way you can form any kind of constitution is to know what seperate constitutional parts you have to begin with, this is the only plan that will give the Iraqi people a means to an end, to recognise what are the seperate parts they have to play with, to even begin a constitution.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Mickey M., Orlando FL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:38:18 GMT

Any word on Kuncinch's plan to divide Iraq similar to all the countries represented at Epcot?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Kato in Des Moines — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:39:28 GMT

The Biden plan does not "force" anything on the Iraqi people. The plan merely provides the framework for a possible political solution to the problems in Iraq. The plan is feasible because the Iraqi Constitution already allows for the creation of a federal system. Ultimately the Iraqi people will have to decide whether they want a decentalized federal state or not. Selling the plan to the Iraqi people will require diplomacy and leadership on the part of the US and that is what Biden offers. The Iraqi's will have to fill in the details -- they will have to draw the boundaries for the three main states; set up a federal city and government for Baghdad; come up with a viable system for distributing the oil revenues; and develop plans for state-wide elections and governance.

Biden is trying to use the UN solution in Bosnia as a blueprint for what needs to be done in Iraq. If you recall, the Bosnians didn't want partition either, but eventually diplomacy and reason prevailed. Today, Bosnia is free of conflict. And not a single peacekeeper has been killed in Bosnia in the last three years. Look there are no guarantees with this plan, but I see nothing wrong with using US diplomacy to help broker a political solution designed to resolve the problem of sectarian violence that has plagued this region for centuries?

Biden Iraq plan passes

John Paone, Mashpee, MA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:41:44 GMT

Biden Iraq plan passes

William Jacobs, Pasadena, TX — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:44:03 GMT

It is very hard to divide a country's wealth, someone will get a lot and some little. Otherwise I believe Joe has made a respectable effort. We sure need our
people and resources out of Iraq.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Al, KS — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:46:52 GMT

It's a workable plan...just the wrong way to go about it. We look like we are forcing our will on a sovereign nation. This is something that should have gone on behind closed doors in Iraq...not in the US Senate. And I'm sure that the Turks will go balistic. Let's see which way those 25 or so Republican Senators go when it comes to overriding a veto. I'm sure that there will be a lot of arm twisting by the White House on this one. I wonder if it's non-binding, does Bush even need to veto it?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Scott in South Texas — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:48:52 GMT

In the beginning, our Viceroy of Iraq, Jerry Bremer, ruled by decree and supervised how the Iraqis would "write their own" constitution and form their government. Of course, all that had to meet with out approval and fit our design. The Iraqi election, however, was not completely to our liking, and bush and them do not appear to be pleased with the way the Iraqis are governing Iraq.

Lee is right that the current Iraqi borders were drawn on a cocktail napking by meddling imperialists (the Brits), and if he is suggesting it would be unwise for the U.S. to force a partition, against Iraqi wishes, into three separate countries (Sunni, Shia and Kurd), I would tend to agree.

Having said that, however, I think the Iraqis will do that on their own, sooner rather than later, and perhaps Biden's resolution is directed more at allowing them to do that, if they indeed want to do that, rather than continuing to try and tell them how to run their own country. It is my opinion, however, that bush and them do not care what the Iraqis want, and would prefer to treat Iraq as a virtual colony and rule through permanent occupation.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Christian Alan, Silver Spring, MD — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:51:02 GMT

Let me start off by saying how dumb of so many of you to think this plan is right or feasible. First no one in America, least of all in the US government, has a right to promote a partition plan for another country. You fools! First this war was based on the most blatant and obvious set of lies that I'm sure a lot of you believed. And yet now that it is clear how perjured testimony, deceit and fraud got us there, somehow it is our right to tell them how to break up their country. Get out of Iraq and let them determine their own future. If Iraqis were so smart as to have developed WMDs, aren't they smart enough to solve their problems if left alone and not interfered with? Yes. It sounds so condescending and flippant and down right supremacist to go around dictating what others do, how they are governed or how their country is fashioned. This is the great White Man's burden writ large. And it amazes me to think how easy the liberals are always quick to try to rule over others and tell them what is best for them.

How about the majority or near majority Hispanic population in TX of CA decide to separate from the USA and either go back to Mexico or declare its independence. Would you support that? I think not. But Iraq is different.

Lastly, this is not Biden's plan. This is the plan the Council on Foreign Relations proposed and he as the chairman of the Senate foreign relations committee is merely working to implement their agenda. Learn how to think for yourselves. Biden is a front for the CFR. And this is the same plan proposed by the Neocons in 1996 called a Clean Break: http://www.irmep.org/Policy_Briefs/3_27_2003_Clean_Break_or_Dirty_War.html

See also: http://www.thornwalker.com/ditch/snieg_conc1.htm

Finally, see the following link which shows this plan is part of Oded Yinon's "A Strategy for Israel in the Nineteen Eighties". The desire to break up Iraq and the other states of the M.E. into smaller and more controllable and weaker states has been the goal for decades. Divide and Conquer. The Trotskyite Neocons or Zionists and their allies such as Biden have conned you guys again, have bankrupted America to achieve their dream, done it with the blood of our nation's youth, and killed more than 1-2 million Iraqis if you count the 1990-2007 war against that country from Bush I - Clinton - Bush II.

http://www.geocities.com/alabasters_archive/zionist_plan.html

Friends start reading, thinking and critically evaluating information. Stop trusting the scheming liars in the District of Criminals.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dick Russell,Lakeville Ma. — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:53:50 GMT

Joe Biden has been working in the trenches in the Senate and in Iowa and N.H.to put this vote together it shows his wisdom leadership and courage.Good work Joe keep it up.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Stacy S. Medford OR — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:55:25 GMT

Way to go Joe! That's the sort of leadership we have been lacking in this country for far too long!

Biden08

Biden Iraq plan passes

Dave, AZ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 21:59:53 GMT

ye,ye, ye -It was on Hardball yesterday. If you are going to complain, get your facts straight first.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Matthew, Tucson, AZ — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:03:58 GMT

Here is the link to the video that contains Sen. Biden's heartfelt, passionate remarks about this amendment and his Iraq strategy:

http://www.c-spanarchives.org/library/index.php?main_page=product_video_info&products_id=201086-1&tID=5

Since this is the C-SPAN taping of the entire Sept. 20 Senate session, you can fast-forward to about the 1 hour, 48 minute-mark for the start of his remarks.

Several other Senators also spoke on the amendment that passed today, including Sen. Barbara Boxer. Her Sept. 25 comments, beginning at about the 9-minute mark and ending around the 16-minute mark, can be heard in this C-SPAN archive video:

http://www.c-spanarchives.org/library/index.php?main_page=product_video_info&cPath=6_12&products_id=201149-3&tID=5

Biden Iraq plan passes

Ben, Chicago IL — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:12:33 GMT

I'm surprised at how many people think this is 'new'; the split up of Iraq was planned before the invasion ever happened. Biden is just playing along with the game.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jewel L. Tatom Jr — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:13:42 GMT

We won the war in a week and now it has been four years of us policing the whole country while we thought they would reconcile with each other. Didn't happen, now is time for a direction such as Biden has put before congress.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Gary, Franklin, WI — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:15:05 GMT

Biden is to be commended for his efforts. The purpose of the resolution is to express the sense of Congress on federalism in Iraq. While the resolution is "non-binding" it is attached to the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2008. For Bush to veto it, he must veto the entire Act.

What is striking is that within the list of 11 cosponsors are four Republicans - Sam Brownback, Arlen Spector, Gordon Smith, and Kay Bailey Hutchinson. Perhaps more important is the actual vote on the resolution of 75 to 23. For the first time a significant number of Republicans (26) broke ranks with the President on Iraq policy.

Many of both parties will find it hard to explain this vote if they continue to provide Bush a blank check in support of his failed Iraq policy.

Voters often find the politics of policy change to be frustrating and too slow for their likely. But the train on ending this war has finally left the station, and Republican incumbents running for reelection in 2008 will find it hard to satisfy voters if they point to this vote alone as there only effort to leave Iraq.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Hopeful, Ventura, Ca. — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:17:03 GMT

I am with naunced this administration would vote for this just so they could stay in iraq, I never wanted this war and now we all know they don't want us there either, so we need to get out now!

I can't stand it when the Repubs act like they care more about the Troops than the Dems do. We are not winning anything, and we are not making our country any safer. So bring our Troops home NOW and spend $50 Billion on making our country safe from the inside out. For $50B we could send our nation TO SCHOOL we would all learn the real reasons why there is so much unrest in the middle east and what part our nation has to do with it. And we could come up with a better foreign policy. One that brings people together and lets them embrace differences, by respecting one another and realizing what is best for one person is not always good for another, and compromising so that not all the advantages are on one side and none on the other. Then MAYBE we won't be targets anymore.

Biden Iraq plan passes

J. R. — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:26:53 GMT

Biden is the only one who is talking about the war at all. I live in Iowa and I have seen most of the top tier candidates. All of them are talking about health care, education, and all the usual election time feel good positions that get dropped like a bad habit once the election is over. In my 40 plus years of candidate interviews I have never heard anyone talk about issues with such passion a Biden. He alone has the guts to tell the truth that health care, education, social security and all the other election promises won't be addressed until this war is over and we have a handle on the budget. I will cacus for Joe and urge other Iowans to look at him and hopefully join his cause.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Richard Weed, Excelsior Minnesota — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:36:02 GMT

What does Iraq parliament think of such plan?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Richard Weed, Excelsior Minnesota — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:37:52 GMT

What does Iraq parliament think of such plan?

Biden Iraq plan passes

Edwardian, Bar Harbor, ME — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:44:32 GMT

This is exactly why there should be much more support for Joe Biden to win the Democrate nomination, rather than all the ridiculous spin about a wholly unqualified and thereby dangerous woman, who simply cannot win a national election, even if the Democrats are stupid enough to allow her that nomination. Biden is exceedingly more experienced and truly a thinking, decent person who deserves the presidential job, and not the plastic distaff side, who neither thinks nor is decent, of a relationship with a convicted felon and known serial rapist, who when himself in power could not help win a seat for a single Congressman while on the job, but in fact lost both sides of the Congress to the Republicans. Some influence and popularity, right? We need to get out of Iraq commonsensically, but under the leadership of grown-ups and men of experience, rather than some corrupt fraud from a third-rate state like the HillBillery, which is why Mr. Biden's plan has true resonance with the majority of the Senate's more intelligent members. Now, let's help turn this resolution into a bill so that it can be signed into law, as soon as possible. Bush would probably sign it, after a bit of grumbling perhaps, because he has no other option, if he wants the war issue mostly off the table, as it were, during the next election cycle. Go, Joe!

Biden Iraq plan passes

fl — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:47:09 GMT

Hmmm...how many votes is that now that Obama has missed...This guy can't even fulfill his senatorial obligations, what makes him or anybody else think he could fulfill the obligations of the presidency. I wish Obamamaniacs would quit trying to make excuses for this guy...there aren't any. GO JOE!!!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Baltimore, MD — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:52:14 GMT

We had no right to go into Iraq in the 1st place. What in the world made us think we could take our way of life, which we love, and impose it on another people? "We don't like your way of living; our way is better ...". Well, maybe they don't agree that they like our way better - different value systems. And the "glue" that kept Iraq from totally falling apart, Sadam, has been desolved, and now the different factions can't find a peaceful solution (or do they even want to?). Some of the religious zealots believe that they will fight until the enemy is dead or comes over to their way. Does this sound like we will ever be out of there?

As things stand, I think that Joe Biden's idea - let each faction have its own "piece of the cake" and let them live in "peace". A good goal for which to strive.

But, let us get our boys out of there!!! George W. went in where he didn't have a way to get out; or he had some very, very bad advice!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:53:27 GMT

Christian - Ever hear of the Civil War? The southern states decided they wanted to form their own country, and the northern states did not take too kindly to it - thus, they fought. The situation in Iraq is different.

However, that being said, I have stated before that I am not entirely comfortable with us forcing a solution such as this on the Iraqi people. I also am not comfortable with American troops paying the price for the Iraqi sectarian wars that predated our invasion. If the Iraqis are not going to take responsibility for themselves, it seems that it is falling upon us to take responsibility for them. I don't like it, but there it is.

Biden Iraq plan passes

bob harrer,sr robinson Twp — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 22:55:26 GMT

Biden has been pusuing this bill for a long time to correctly divide Iraq into the states they were, and I know Bush WOULD not have veteoed the bill, because he wants a free and Democratic Iraq? . if Mcclain is for the war, why did he not vote. Barack, a not voting , is understandable, but what about 2-way Hilliary

Biden Iraq plan passes

Paul Childress — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:01:59 GMT

This is an exciting first step in getting Senate support for something that will change direction. Now, call your Senator and ask him/her to go the next step.

Biden Iraq plan passes

mad in Madtown — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:02:13 GMT

Thank you for your post, Kato. Well reasoned, educated and not just some shoot-from-the-hip reasoning that seems to prevail here. The repubs bitch because the Dems never come up with better ideas than their savior, President Bombsalot. Well, here's an idea, and one using diplomacy over bombs, and you STILL bitch! Me thinks the repukes just want to bitch! You don't want solutions. You don't want our military people home safe. Mr. Biden is a true statesman. I sincerely hope that he's our next president. Intelligence over idiots - what a concept, America.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Mike Saunders — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:06:40 GMT

Hey Pat from Huntington, NY - while your theory may be accurate, history recalls a different saga - or don't you remember Korea, Viet Nam, hell, even this nation for a while ( remember who was here first !)

Biden Iraq plan passes

Jimmy White, North Muskegon, MI — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:09:37 GMT

"Biden's plan will not work, all three groups want the oil"

Doug,
The plan calls for the EQUAL sharing of all oil revenues amongst the three major sects, the kurds, the shia, and the sunni. Biden has been there 10 times now, and talked to leaders of each of these parties. He knows what he is talking about when he says that if we give them equal sharing of oil revenues, that will keep them happy. They fight right now because what they have is NOT equal.
With that in mind, it IS Biden's plan that is the only plan worth mentioning.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Scott H — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:12:42 GMT

Biden showed the leadership needed to get BI-Partision support for a responsible end to the Iraq trevesty.
I am proud to support Joe Biden and happy to see his efforts pay off.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lee Holmes — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:29:18 GMT

CJ:Not at all. Yet going as far as claiming that a general ''cooked books''and ''betrayed''his nation when not a scintilla of evidence exists to support this crass assertion,is to create an environment solely to make people ''look bad''. Biden has earned my kudos before as being the sole,only liberal with a plan that does not entail sudden,total withdrawl or moving our soldiers to Okinawa. Biden,of every single Democrat in Washington save the lone Tom Lantos,sees instinctively how the Kurds will be sold down the river by his own party in the event of our retreat. Thus Biden gets props here as well. He appears to be a sort of ''third way in Iraq'' advocate,eschewing the Feingold left and the Cheney right. His plan,is nonetheless fraught with peril.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Elizabeth Sullivan, San Diego, CA — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 23:55:36 GMT

All you screamer on both ends of the political spectrum:

You are showing your true colors - you dismiss anything that might help the situation because you love to scream about it. You don't want a solution you want the problem to remain as evidenced by your ridiculous ravings.

Biden knows more about foriegn policy than any of you freaks. You can't argue that. Maybe you should run for office, get elected, and put forth your plans. But, you won't because you don't have the balls.

Way to scream on the sidelines. You are like those annoying soccer parents who think they know more than the coach but never get out there and coach a team yourselves.

You hate that he is right on this issue.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Bill Franklin, Pomona, California — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 00:18:28 GMT

Typical liberal symbolism. A Sense of the Senate resolution is as relevant as Sean Penn. It makes all the kiddies swoon, but it's just a way for gutless politicians to trick the foolish into thinking something is being done.

The war will continue on the present track until Bush is out of office, and his successor will continue it as well.

As sad as it is to liberals, we've won this war.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Terry Gain, Peterborough, Canada — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 00:49:30 GMT

Every survey has shpwn Iraqis don't want their country broken up. Any attempt to break up the country would cause a real civil war. What we have now is low level sectarian violence -which is decreasing each month.

Iraq is being pacified. September's casualty counts will be the lowest in over a year.

The Democrats have politicized the war throughout. Republicans who don't challenge them are throwing away their only chhance at victory in 08.

The progress in Iraq is now so palpable none of this will matter but there is a reason why they call him slow Joe and the Republicans who went along with him on this aren't much brighter, if at all.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Lyman Yankton SD — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 00:50:24 GMT

This is far from over let me tell you........A non binding resolution means that the president only has to listen and can still be as stubborn as he has been in the past.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Johnny G — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 00:55:44 GMT

hahahahaahhahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. we've won this war? that is hilarious. seriously man, you are killing me over here. we've won this war?
www.cbs.com/lateshow
I think they take submissions, however there may well be a qualifier that you have to have a brain that functions to submit though, I'm not sure.... check the rules of the contest.
Oh yeah, and do us all a favor and stop talking. ANYONE that continues to believe this war is a good idea needs to have their citizenship revoked.

And the Republican party prides themselves on patriotism? Give me a break, patriotism would be impeachment.

Idiots....

Biden Iraq plan passes

Christian Alan, Silver Spring, MD — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 01:14:37 GMT

Biden Iraq plan passes

juandos, Overland, Mo — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 02:35:28 GMT

Well what a shock - NOT!

NOthing like breaking up an unstable country to make it easier for the individual pieces to fall...

Clueless libtards from the party of the Seditious & Sleazy (a.k.a. Democrat party) and some spineless R.I.N.O.s have got together to make fools of themselves...

Good one!

Biden Iraq plan passes

J J MacGillicudy — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 10:49:47 GMT

Yeah, now watch Turkey massacre the Kurds just like they did the Albanians.

Biden Iraq plan passes

John S. Alexander, Edinboro, PA — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 12:58:25 GMT

Go Joe, at least somebody is thinking about things, it is non-binding but it is a beginning. We can have change of thinking or we can continue to have Alice in Wonderland hopes that come out of the empty hole that is now where bushs brain(Karl) used to be. We all know that Bush has taken the pill that makes him bigger than life. Will he next compare himself to John Wayne? Neo-conservatives are the new hippies, idealistic and unwilling to see reality.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Joe — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 14:01:07 GMT

Well sounds great and all but what about the area of the amendment that was taken out at last minute with a paragraph added :

“Secretary of Defense Robert Gates stated on September 16, 2007 that “I think that the administration believes at this point that continuing to try and deal with the Iranian threat, the Iranian challenge, through diplomatic and economic means is by the preferable approach. That the one we are using. We always say all options are on the table, but clearly, the diplomatic and economic approach is the one that we are pursuing.”

Seems to me like not all is clear.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Cameron, Mattoon, IL — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 16:38:47 GMT

Actually, I'm not really surprised Obama didn't vote. Though this non-binding agreement isn't bad, it's non-binding, and doesn't really do all that much from everything I've read. OK, it actually doesn't do anything, it's non-binding. I'm sure that we'll know why within a day or so why he didn't. I'm guessing it's a problem with another non-binding waste of time. Can we get some action? Something that MAKES A DIFFERENCE???

Biden Iraq plan passes

Ibo SA, Nashville, Tennessee — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 21:04:45 GMT

Joe Biden, has been on the political for long long long while now; he has held very respectable positions at different times. I have been in Iraq for since the war started. I have seen first hand the demographic changes in Baghdad (Shiites moving into areas where they feel they belong, for Sunnies it has been no different. As for the Kurds and tha Christians, many of them have moved into the Kurdistan Region) and other ethnically mixed areas. Since it's creation by the British in early 1920's, Iraq has never been at peace with its people-three very ethnically and religiously different peoples..the Kurds, Shiites and the Sunnies were forced to live together and always be governed by a Sunni dictator that was never acceptable to either the Shiites or the Kurds...which both never really felt to be part of an Iraq anyway. After the overthrow of Saddam, all hell broke loose...besides the hatred the shiites and the sunnies held against one another for over 14 centuries now, the was no dictator to keep them together after 80 years of forcefull rule. Now, starting with Kurds going there own in 1991 (many genuine thanks to the USA), the shiites were going to dominate the Iraqi political scene for the fist time with 505-60 percent majority and take their anger of 80 years out on the sunnies after the collaps of the sunnie throw.

Finally, to keep all parties from eating each other out, and maybe keep a loosely united (federated) Iraq together, Sen. Biden is heard by some of his peers. Sen. Biden has been in Iraq and Kurdistan severaly times since the war (probably the senator that has visited the country the most) and has seen the realities in the ground and has called for this carefull, controlled and soft partition of the regions-not the country. And I for one agree with him that is one of the best ways to leave a healthy Iraq behind and bring our brave men and women in service home once and for all!!!!!

Biden Iraq plan passes

Kyle, Centerville, Utah — Fri, 28 Sep 2007 23:44:32 GMT

And Biden is the one who knows the most of what he's talking about? This is sad. http://www.swp-berlin.org/de/common/get_document.php?asset_id=4150

Biden Iraq plan passes

Simon, Washinton DC — Sun, 30 Sep 2007 07:46:57 GMT

This move is reminiscient of the UN deciding to seperate land between Israel and Palestine. It is also similiar to the re-establishment of the mandate system in the middle east and southeast asia. Both of these actions resulted in rampant terrorism and horrendous loss of life. This measure would only make it seem as though the bloodshed is not be our fault, that is the result of overzealousness. If this measure is adopted by the Iraqi government it will result in another Israel/Palestine situation.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Supporting Biden — Sun, 30 Sep 2007 17:25:09 GMT

How interesting this so-called second tier candidate has better ideas and more experience than any other one running! How shameful that the media sheep have all rushed to crown a golden child! There's a great article on the FAIR website about so-called second tier candidates getting "in the way". It's up to all of us who think that Joe Biden (or whomever you support) is the right one to lead our great country to let the media pundits know WE WILL DECIDE THE ELECTION, NOT RUSSERT, BLITZER, ETC.

Biden Iraq plan passes

Abdulaziz Al-Wandawi — Sun, 30 Sep 2007 20:03:21 GMT

If Iraq is broken in 3 sections, why the fighting continues in every sector between the people of that section? Biden had no idea of Iraqis when he thought of this. Shias are fighting shias in the south. So, why don't you break Iraq in 4, 5 or may be 6 sections? Do you think you have any idea what the Iraqis think? I doubt it.
http://libdemiraq.org

Biden Iraq plan passes

Pete,Houston,Tx — Sat, 13 Oct 2007 03:41:07 GMT

So a lot of you think that Biden's "Plan" for Iraq is something grand and new. This is just a reprint of the Iraqi Constitution. All this has done is make the Iraqi's feel like we're interfering in their political process. Maybe Biden will come up with a "Can't you all just all get along" resolution.