The fight in Philly

Elizabeth Sullivan, San Diego, CA — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 13:58:21 GMT

HOW MANY CANDIDATES IN HOW MANY DEBATES NEED TO SAY "JOE IS RIGHT" BEFORE YOU GET IT?

JOE IS RIGHT!

BIDEN/OBAMA '08

The fight in Philly

--NSMSNBC — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:13:01 GMT

Clinton said the Supreme Court gave the Presidency to Bush, but common sense dictates that Clinton hindered Gore by scandal and perjury.

I disagree that Biden’s history is what is holding his candidacy back. Rather, I propose that Obama is mostly stalling his campaign. They both come off as the honest candidates both willing to rationally look at a situation an approach a solution through non-partisan means. Obama simply is newer during a change election, a rockstar. But that’s my opinion. That is why I think that between Obama’s idealism, realism, wisdom and vision; and Biden’s experience that they would make an excellent Obama-Biden ticket.

If Richardson doesn’t wants to be POTUS, he should stop running!

The fight in Philly

FACT # 1 /AZ — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:27:24 GMT

Fact # 1.

Clinton, a confused ""LIAR"!

The mis-representation of position which has caused imporper use of our military, continued switching a vote only to be self serving!

Out rage is not fitting, we the People are paying for these Washington self serving Paper Hangers! Shame is more the word than rage!

The fight in Philly

vanreuter, NY NY — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:35:25 GMT

What does this mean, if anything, for Edwards' campaign?
What do Obama's supporters feel about him being upstaged yet again? Can Biden break through? Will the mothership be back for Dennis? So many questions and only nine weeks until they really don't matter at all...

Van

The fight in Philly

jerry/corpus christi texas — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:36:55 GMT

NSMSNBC:

Would have been easier for Gore for him to win his own home state. If he had won that, Gore would have been dealing with 9-11 instead of President Bush and that is a scary though in itself.

The fight in Philly

Class Warrior, D.C. — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:37:41 GMT

I didn't see the debates, but I DO hope they talked about Clinton's electability; the Swiftboat people have already made a video on her! She's going to be torn to pieces by the GOP Propoganda Machine, and will lose the White House if nominated, aned Rudy G, the Bush clone, will be our next president.

The fight in Philly

Class Warrior, D.C. — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:37:42 GMT

The fight in Philly

squintz, philly, pa — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:52:49 GMT

NSMSNBC - got to say I agree about Richardson. I mean, you have to appreciate the cajones of someone like Kucinich (who I think will run every cycle until he heads off to the big space ship in the sky) he doesn't have much of a shot but still stands up there and takes the hits, makes his crazy left-winger "I'll cancel the WTO" statements, and obviously is running to win. There are too many serious candidates up there for him to be taking up space running for VP.

The fight in Philly

vanreuter, NY NY — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:04:05 GMT

he MSNBC on-line poll, which is always skewed young and favoring someone like Edwards or Barack, has Hillary winning. Whatever your opinion, it shows that the general opinion is that she did more than OK and reflects the fact that even an effective attack has a blow-back factor on the attacker. If the opposition is reduced to the kind of attacking that goes on here, it could ultimately result in having the opposite of the intended effect.

Who stood out from the pack? Clinton-26, Obama-26, Edwards-20

Who showed the most leadership qualities? Clinton-29, Obama-28, Edwards-15

Who was the most convincing candidate? Obama-28, Clinton-26, Edwards-18, Biden-14

Obama has won these on line polls pretty big in the past, so this is a surprise to me.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21528788/

Van

The fight in Philly

diane — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:05:58 GMT

what many overlook is that Obama wants to change politics. For 20 years it's been nasty and ugly. but, little substance. What he is doing is pointing out why she is wrong without going personal. If he goes nasty he gets the blowback of being a hypocrite or resorting to business as usual. He needs to expose without being tawdry.
I think he really did it very well. And he did show that he cannot be swiftboated.
The democrats treat the swiftboating like the gop treats Hillary. As some big bad monster. Kerry got swiftboated because he did not answer back. obama has shown many times that he doesn't let insults go unanswered. It's a strawman to build that up as Obama will not be kicked around. The problem he answered last night was exposing Hillary without looking like a bully. Unfair as it is, when a man attacks the woman it looks like bullying. He got her on issues and substance and dealt with her very well. You don't need to be nasty or to shout to make your point and expose a person.

The fight in Philly

Mamie Glorioso — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:07:50 GMT

Hillary was right Gore won the popular vote, he did not lose because of her husband, he won, but was turned down by the republican supreme court or should I say out numbered. She did a good job last night, however all the dems, did was give more amo to the republicans, what fools. Thanks Tim and Brian.

The fight in Philly

Jim Solmner — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:11:43 GMT

Would have been easier for Gore for him to win his own home state. If he had won that, Gore would have been dealing with 9-11 instead of President Bush and that is a scary though in itself.

It would have be dealt with by Gore much quicker then Bush dealt with it. Surrender would have taken only minutes.

The fight in Philly

Mamie Glorioso — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:21:16 GMT

You know I have something to say about I feel Hillary doesn't answer the question are you sorry you voted for the war. First of all she didn't. But lets all remember with the information given she actually voted to defend our country, who in their right mind would take back that vote? I hope she never says she is sorry for her vote, what she should say that she voted to defend her country and anyone that takes back that vote doesn't deserve to be president of this great country. I mean to make a statement and take back your defence just to win an election is very scary. Let's face it Bush lied to the country about weapons of mass distruction and needing to go to war now, but the vote again was actually to give Bush the go ahead to get approval from the UN not to acutally go to war. However the Media also overlooked this one and went along with Bush as well, so look at who's throwing stones. We all know that this counrty isn't mature enough, and that the men of this country are such as they would never allow a women as president. This country is not as mature as Europe or India or other countries that are mature and have enough confidance to elect a women to run their country.

The fight in Philly

--NSMSNBC — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:26:18 GMT

diane: "The problem he answered last night was exposing Hillary without looking like a bully. Unfair as it is, when a man attacks the woman it looks like bullying."

Just to add something to that, a black man attacking a white, blonde woman. You can't get better than that!

I'm not really sure if people see it like that, maybe, I really don't know. I don't, but I try to look at them more as people than men and women. Others, I'm sure see the sexes moreso.

The fight in Philly

FACT # 4 / AZ — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:28:30 GMT

FACT # 3

Mosses came down from the mountain only to find the people had placed their trust in a false idol!

The American People placed their trust in the Clinton's, Yet we are again being seeing this self serving Washington Paper Hanger using false hope ""bond"", ""who will end up paying """"YOU"""!

The cost of Clinton, In dollars and cents America has paid over 10 million just for one scandal, How many hidden agenda's never made it to the Media???

The Issues of current being are not Addressed as Clinton has not the leadership to address them, Poverty, homeless, starving, jobless, 12 million Illegals ""PLUS"", another destroyed industry ""Trucking". The track record stands as time is running out! The effects of Clinton's past record is failure of leadership. Her desires are false and to keep pounding on same subject matter is like a worn out record!

This debate showed Clinton is not electable. Joe Biden ""A professional Washington self serving paper Hanger showed Leadership traits""! But again ""WHO"" wants another Washington self serving Paper Hanger as President ??????

The fight in Philly

--NSMSNBC — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:36:39 GMT

Mamie Glorioso--maybe Gore won the popular vote, but he lost the electoral college, and since our country uses the electoral college he lost, and the Supreme Court (liberal at the time?) was correct in their decision. Kerry won neither. Maybe if it wasn't for the Clinton's, Gore would have won more electoral votes; thus winning the election fair and square. In a future election, the electoral college could work in the dems favor.

1984: Reagan won 525 of 638 electoral votes and 58.8% of the overall vote--pretty much a landslide. By you logic, he would have needed 82.3% of the vote to have won so many states.

The electoral college balances out the nation so that not only big cities like New York, Chicago and LA dominate the election, but rural folks get to have a say too. I mean who would ever go to Iowa if only the most populated states controlled all of the elections. I think it's a fair system.

The fight in Philly

Hotdog on a Stick — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:40:43 GMT

It all comes down to this... you can ALWAYS divide the democrats by placing a black man and any woman in front of them. They have a need to vote for what they see as a minority. The sad thing is that both Biden and Edwards are 100x better for the job than either the African-American or the Vagio-American yet odds are neither will get the nod because both are "white men".

The fight in Philly

Hillary Clinton — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:40:57 GMT

Hey, does anyone know if my EPO order has gone thru yet? I really need it BaaaaD!

The fight in Philly

Paw Paw, NC — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:48:53 GMT

Accept it Clinton will be the next President, as for Obama the deal has been made and he will be the next Vice President, his turn comes when Hillary is finished. His job right now is to be Clinton's shield drawing votes that might go to the other candidates but when they join forces the ass whipping begins. Together their war chest vastly over shadows all the other candidates and like I've said before call off the primaries and the general election run the polls President Clinton and Vice President Obama against any other combination of candidates and they will walk away with the stats. President Bush, the GOP, Big business, The Stock market, the Dems, it's over all ready they have made their choice. Heaven forbid but we are in for another (8) years of the last (8) years the legacy continues. War is a very profittable business! I'm beginning to think Ron Paul will be my choice!

The fight in Philly

jerry/corpus christi texas — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:54:27 GMT

When Dennis was here in Corpus Christi in 2004, he kept looking up at the sky while we were talking, so this nothing new to me.

The fight in Philly

Republicae, Charleston, SC — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:22:07 GMT

Hillary is nothing more than Bush in a RED SOCIALIST skirt.

The fight in Philly

Tiffany, Illinois — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:25:23 GMT

To Van regarding the poll, yes Clinton and Obama are close in the positive polls, with Clinton winning in about half. However I think the more important issue if how far out ahead Clinton was with the negative ones. 65% feel she avoided the questions, and 58% felt she had the most rehearsed answers. If Hilary wins the nomination the Dems can say good-bye to the White House. Obama/Biden '08

The fight in Philly

Sara, Cedar Rapids, Iowa — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:30:27 GMT

HOW MANY CANDIDATES IN HOW MANY DEBATES NEED TO SAY "JOE IS RIGHT" BEFORE YOU GET IT?
JOE IS RIGHT!
BIDEN/OBAMA '08
Elizabeth Sullivan, San Diego, CA

Don't worry Elizabeth First read, MSNBC, etc won't be participants at the caucuses, but mere observers. Iowan will (and many already are) give the candidates a full evaluation. And if history is any indication of the future, and if Buzz on the ground continues you will be happy Jan 3rd.

The fight in Philly

Mark, Des Moines — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:34:28 GMT

vanreuter, NY NY So many questions and only nine weeks until they really don't matter at all...

In your dreams, but you often appear separated from reality, so the above probably applies in your waking moments also, but that doesn't mean you're right.

The fight in Philly

jerry/corpus christi texas — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:36:44 GMT

this is from the transcript from the debate last night......

Russert: Senator Clinton, I'd like to follow up, because in terms of your experience as first lady, in order to give the American people an opportunity to make a judgment about your experience, would you allow the National Archives to release the documents about your communications with the president, the advice you gave?

Because, as you well know, President Clinton has asked the National Archives not to do anything until 2012.

Clinton: Well, actually, Tim, the Archives is moving as rapidly as the Archives moves. There's about 20 million pieces of paper there. And they are move, and they are releasing as they do their process. And I am fully in favor of that.

Now, all of the records, as far as I know, about what we did with health care, those are already available. Others are becoming available. And I think that, you know, the Archives will continue to move as rapidly as its circumstances and processes demand.

Russert: But there was a letter written by President Clinton specifically asking that any communication between you and the president not be made available to the public until 2012. Would you lift that ban?

Clinton: Well, that's not my decision to make, and I don't believe that any president or first lady ever has. But, certainly, we're move as quickly as our circumstances and the processes of the National Archives permits.

Again, there must be something in those papers if Hillary is going around the question......

The fight in Philly

--NSMSNBC — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:39:16 GMT

Paw Paw, NC ...

Accepting and voting are two completely different things. After all, I accept that Bush is our current President, but I did not vote for him. I prefer to vote on principle, whatever and whoever that may be. Not just because the rest of the crowd is jumping off a bridge.

The fight in Philly

jerry/corpus christi texas — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:44:43 GMT

Here is Hillary Clinton and her answer about Social Security last night......

Russert: Senator Clinton, I want to clear something up which goes to the issue of credibility. You were asked at the AARP debate whether or not you would consider taxing, lifting the cap from $97,500, taxing that, raising more money for Social Security. You said, quote, "It's a no." I asked you the same question in New Hampshire, and you said "no."

Then you went to Iowa and you went up to Tod Bowman, a teacher, and had a conversation with him saying, "I would consider lifting the cap perhaps above $200,000." You were overheard by an Associated Press reporter saying that.

Why do you have one public position and one private position?

Clinton: Well, Tim, I don't. I have said consistently that my plan for Social Security is fiscal responsibility first, then to deal with any long-term challenges which I agree are ones that we are going to have to address.

We would have a bipartisan commission. In the context of that, I think all of these would be considered. But, personally, I do not want to balance Social Security on the backs of our seniors and middle-class families. That's why I put fiscal responsibility first, because we have to change the Bush tax cuts, which I am committed to doing.

We have to move back toward a more fair and progressive tax system, and begin once again to move toward a balanced budget with a surplus. You know, part of the idea in the '90s was not just so Bill would have a check mark next to his name in history, but so that we would have the resources to deal with a lot of these entitlement problems.

George Bush understood that. The Republicans understood that. They wanted to decimate that balanced budget and a surplus because they knew that that would give them a free hand to try to privatize Social Security.

I am not going to be repeating Republican talking points. So when somebody asks me, would something like this be considered, well, anything could be considered when we get to a bipartisan commission. But personally, I am not going to be advocating any specific fix until I am seriously approaching fiscal responsibility.

Russert: But you did raise it as a possibility with Tod Bowman?

Clinton: Well, but everybody knows what the possibilities are, Tim. Everybody knows that. But I do not advocate it. I do not support it. I have laid out what I do believe, and I am going to continue to emphasize that.

I think, for us to act like Social Security is in crisis is a Republican trap. We're playing on the Republican field. And I don't intend to do that.

Russert: You call it a Republican talking point. Georgetown University, February 9, 1998: "We are in a -- heading to a looming fiscal crisis in Social Security. If nothing is done, it will require a huge tax increase in the payroll tax or a 25 percent in Social Security benefits," Bill Clinton, 1998.

That's recent history. Only two years to go in his term. Is that a Republican talking point?

Clinton: No, but what he did was to move us toward a balanced budget and a surplus. And, if you go back and you look at the numbers, they really took off starting in '98, '99, 2000, 2001.

And that would have given a president who actually believed in Social Security -- which George Bush does not -- the resources and the options to make decisions, but not the kind of draconian decisions, and certainly not the move toward privatization, which is what the Republicans have been advocating for as long as I can remember.

I wish Hillary Clinton was an honest person and give an honest answer, but asking a Clinton for honesty is a bit much to ask.......

The fight in Philly

CitizenJ — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:55:38 GMT

"What does this mean, if anything, for Edwards' campaign? What do Obama's supporters feel about him being upstaged yet again? Can Biden break through? Will the mothership be back for Dennis? So many questions and only nine weeks until they really don't matter at all..."

vanreuter, NY NY (Sent Wednesday, October 31, 2007 10:35 AM)

Van,

For Edwards, it likely means nothing. He is akin to a third-party candidate: he comes up with ideas that might work, and the two big candidates adopt them. He may see a rise in support for a week or two, but it will go down - again.

For Obama, the perception that he was "upstaged yet again" is incredibly subjective. Any Clinton supporter doesn't want to see him do well, whereas no Obama supporter (I know that is an assumption) will say that he was upstaged.

Biden, well, I have liked him all along. Frankly, I think he probably just scares the hell out of people by being almost TOO honest. As a result, he sometimes says things that maybe he shouldn't. Otherwise, he is - and will remain - solid.

Dennis and his mothership? For the second time in two days, we agree. This guy is a nut. Although, I hope he keeps going because he is so entertaining to watch.

The fight in Philly

U2 — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 17:24:14 GMT

How come the Hillary campaign didnt use(or paraphrase) the line that the AP used "in the city of brotherly love, there wasnt much for a sister" - it would have been an absolute gem of a one-liner!! .. and would have gotten a lot of the headlines.

The fight in Philly

HMT-MI — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 17:51:50 GMT

Russert really goes after Clinton-----he is one sly guy.The powder puff interview he did with George Bush pales with his attacks on Clinton.as for Matthews he detests the clintons---adored George(until the real george became impossible to even like) and seems to root for Rudy---course everone hears and sees different.