Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

M. Foley, Florida — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:41:48 GMT

Hillary can't win a national election. Obama is the best hope to defeat the bigots.

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

--NSMSNBC — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:44:11 GMT

Chuck in San Diego: I think there goes your 'only Republicans' support Obama argument, one which I'm not sure why you are making. He sounds like a candidate who is able to gather Democrat, Moderate and Republican support, all while not necessarily being a centrist or a triangulator. Sounds like the perfect Democratic nominee and a uniter.

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diane — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:45:07 GMT

I am personally glad to see the hostage situation resolved peacefully. I am no fan of hillary's but, this is not the time to trash her tonight. 5 young people were in grave danger.
I saw obama this morning and he was on fire. And the rise in the level of noise went up high as soon as his name was introduced.

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Josh — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:48:38 GMT

I do not know if it is a Media created feeling or not, but I really think that Obama is going to win, and I am not sad about that. Every other election year that I can remember there was always a sense of hopelessness.--Of picking the lesser of two evils( A ridiculous situation considering the number of talented people in the United States)

Not this year. We have a hope in Lincoln returned, Obama. Obama. Obama.

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Tammy Granger, Munice IN — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:49:49 GMT

FR: For so long, it seemed that Obama’s attacks on Hillary flew over the heads of his audiences.

Well, they are kind of dense. They are Democrats.

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Richard, Washington State — Fri, 30 Nov 2007 23:53:51 GMT

Obama is indeed a politician. He's able to go negative on his own party and Republicans at the same time.

So, why is this man considered "fresh" or "new"?

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Kevin E., Concord, NH — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 00:24:24 GMT

I live in New Hampshire and belong to several groups of young political Independents who say the tight race between Obama and Clinton will compel many of them to come out and vote Obama on primary day, by a ratio of almost 3 to 1. Just you watch. There is a groundswell of not only young first time Democratic voters but Independents as well who will tip this towards Obama. I've heard similar stories from friends in Iowa and South Carolina. The polls are not reflecting this, but it is out there and it's real.

So be ready America. There will be a big surprise come primary day. Obama'08

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Windy City Girl, Chicago IL — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 00:38:58 GMT

Tammy Granger, you live in Muncie not Munice. And Obama supporters are dumb, right?

That is just wrong, but since you went that far....if Democrats are dumb, then what are Republicans? Brain dead?

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Windy City Girl, Chicago Il — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 00:40:43 GMT

Obama will win this race. Just wait and see.

Just can't tell from these blogs because it is always the same ten people commenting. BORING!

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Johnny McLaurin, Columbia, South Carolina — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 08:54:34 GMT

Barack Obama was indeed electrifying. I cannot think of a better Democratic Nominee for President of the United States. I do see some pieces of Lincoln, and Kennedy inside his heart. The hope of a better tomarrow, and a better future for our children. I do believe Obama is going to win this thing, and he is going to win big!
Also my condolences to the Clinton Campaign in New Hampshire. No one should have to go through that ordeal.
In the light of the 2008 Presidential Elections, I say welcome President Barack Obama!

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Rufus Gibbons, DC — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 10:38:39 GMT

I recall a time in this blog just after Joe Biden had made a speech on his idea of splitting Iraq into a three state federation, three out of five responders were going to support Biden. So trying to get a feel for the race from this blog is useless because most of us have already made up our minds which makes us prejudiced. we cheer when our candidate makes a good speech and remain silent when it is someone else.What did surprise me just after Obama and Edwards piled onto Clnton during the debate, when she retaliated the next day they accused her of attacking THEM. See I am prejudiced toward Clinton.

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katharine, norway — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 11:30:38 GMT

Glad the hostage situation resolved itself peacefully. What a fantastic hope we have in Barack Obama! I am so excited, for the first time in years, to vote for a president of the United States.

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Nick, Austin, Texas — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 11:36:48 GMT

Hillary's been touting her healthcare plan as superior to Senator Barack Obama's, and even went so far as to call Obama's plan a "betrayal" of Democratic values. So let's get real—Hillarycare won't cover any American if it doesn't pass Congress. When universal healthcare is signed into law, it will be the largest expansion of government power since social security passed in 1935. If Democrats in Iowa don't trust her, how is Hillary going to build a bipartisan majority in Congress to pass her plan?

My firm belief, as a Democrat, is that Hillary Clinton cannot pass universal healthcare.

But let's get to this "mandate" nonsense. Senator Clinton is arguing that the only way to get every American covered is if you force every American to buy healthcare. Unfortunately, she hasn't told anybody how she would enforce this mandate. So until she clarifies what exactly she intends to do to enforce this mandate – for example, whether she is going to fine people – her attacks on Obama are more about scoring political points than making a real point.

The truth is, Barack Obama's universal health care plan makes coverage affordable for every single American, he just doesn't agree with Hillary's plan to start by forcing everyone to buy insurance they can't afford.

I think the real question is who can stand up to the special interests, bring Republicans and Democrats together, and actually make their plan a reality? Barack Obama is in the best position to do that because unlike Senator Clinton, he's been standing up to the special interests and bringing people together throughout his career.

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Ray in Maryland — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 12:58:01 GMT

I would like to echo what Josh said. I'm tired of elections where we have to hold our noses when we decide who to elect as our president. Obama is the first candidate to excite me in a very long time (and I've been a voter for 40 years). The thought of Hillary Clinton as president seems like a step backward to me. As much as I want the next president to be a democrat, if we have to choose between Hillary and Rudy or Hillary and Mitt, I may just have to obstain from voting. I pray daily for an Obama victory in Iowa, New Hampshire and beyond.

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Tom, Las Vegas, NV — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 13:04:48 GMT

I was hoping to see a super strong ticket of Clinton/Obama in the national election (in either order), but with all the last few months turns to bashing I don't see that combo happening after primaries.

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rick, from South Carolina — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 14:36:42 GMT

I used to think that my "dream team" ticket would be Hillary in the seat, aand Obama playing secod chair, to gain better sense of the ladscape up their in that rarefied air of the presidency, but the more I hear Obama speak, the more i'm beginnig to feel like he just may be our best, most bold statement we could make about an american posture that needs, desperately, to evolve. Charisma aside, this guy's singin a new tune, and I think I like the hook - "you can dance to it!"

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Shadow, Hamden, CT — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 14:43:51 GMT

Richard - Yes, why is this man who runs both a primary campaign against Democrats and a general campaign against Republicans considered fresh and new? Unless someone refuses to run against Democrats or Republicans, it's just the same old politics. Obama should just give inspirational speeches from inside his home if he wants to get elected. Idiot.

Kevin - Thanks for your post and the on the ground report for New Hampshire, it's the most informative post in this whole thread about the actual state of the race. I have long suspected the same thing in the early states; the in-depth organization by Obama, if it's applied to independents, only needs a fragment of them to turn out in order to shift the Iowa caucus and NH primary results by ten points, given the potential for independents to vote in those races.

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Coatesmoe, New York, NY — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 14:52:59 GMT

Obama is the best choice, but the press is on the side of Clinton. Big money is for Clinton. Do you think democracy has a place here?

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rosy, eelensburg,wa — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 14:58:46 GMT

America, the most openminded country (that's what we say)but we just can't stand the thought of a woman to be our president! Interesting!

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K. Lambert, Schweinfurt GERMANY — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 15:25:02 GMT

Well its all nice and good that you all think that Obama is gooing to win! People just have to remember, Bush is the Enemy and the one who lied to get EVERYBODY to support him on his Campaign to start the war in Iraq. Obama is also not an Angel..we know what Hilary is all about and she is not afraid to say that she made a mistake. But I think that people are afraid to see a woman as President! better an African American as a woman!! I dont agree. Im an African American woman, and becuse i got tired of all the BS in America I moved to Germany with my Fiance. I STILL VOTE!! And in November I will be voting for Clinton.

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ted orlando — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 15:48:28 GMT

Hey Josh

I have felt the same way during the past presidential Elections. trying to choose the better of two "evils" Obama is the only candidate in any race state or federal I have felt will actually do the best things for our country. I am shocked there our people out there who just want more of the same garbage from our politicians. Vote Obama!! he and only him can bring the change and common sense leadership which America is hungry for.

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Jane Doe, anycity America — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 15:57:10 GMT

Obama knows that Hillary's double speak messages
on Iraq, her false concern for the uninsured, her
ambiquity as to how she would enforce (inflict)
her healthcare policies on all Americans (not just
the uninsured), masks a greater problem of the same
kinds of special interest groups serving found in
his own party. While Dems scream at big oil industries, they need to consider looking at their
own party bowing to large GM Manufacturers and Rep. John Dingell, D-Mich., a longtime protector of the auto industry which denied for decades the fact that
we are now at 100% foreign oil dependency. We are
paying for oil in blood in Iraq and reps like Dingell
need to be impeached. Obama is looking at both parties and seeing the shameful complacency which has brought us into this energy crisis over the last
40 years. Look at both parties and begin to consider the need to vote out anyone who has watched our energy crisis cripple our economy over the last 30 years and replace them with men and women of vision for America. While the Clintons place their economic stock in healthcare reform by preying on the uninsured using predatory practices of insurance companies and healthcare industries, Mr. Obama will not allow this to happen. That's the difference between Totalitarianism and real Democracy. One final note: The Clintons have had their chance in the Whitehouse and in the Senate. Their methods of economic survival involve the same kinds of predatory practices to fleece Americans. Are the
Clintons banking on the futuristic methods of Nano Technology to save our energy crisis fifteen years from now? In the meantime, and they seeking to use the healthcare industry as a database to pry into the healthcare history of every American to determine economic forecasts based on each man, woman and child's health forecast? We already have an issue of Genetic Discrimination Laws to be addressed in this nation that has a direct impact
on Employment and the economy. Do we really want
a biased healthcare Czar determining who can or can not contribute to the workforce or economy based on genetic medical forecasts? Democrats and Republicans need to bring themselves into the real world and consider what will happen when all your health information is placed under a biased partisanship leader. It will give you an understanding of how
economic survival will be handed to bias politicans, rouge predatory insurance companies and partisan healthcare professionals in determining your future employment. Trust me on this. I've been the target of bias hatred and you will need a leader who looks at both parties with a vision of hope for all, not a hope for certain races, classes, ethnic backgrounds, political affiliations, or any other classification that will lead to impoverished circumstances based on totalitarianism by either the Democratic or the
Republican leaders. Perhaps Obama, or other leaders, can fit that description, but I know that's what this American is seeking. We need to start with
with protecting the fundamental rights of all Americans and stop thinking along partisan lines. American needs civility and the kind of Leaders who both protect our country, our economy and our future without becoming partisan parasites on our nation.

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Johnny V. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 16:29:13 GMT

Obama is desperate.$$$$ Hopefund $$$$$$

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Paul Miller, Woodbridge, VA — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 16:41:08 GMT

Tom, I don't think its going to happen, but a tough nomination race doesn't preclude making nice to run on the ticket together. Look at Reagan/Bush. Remember the whole voodoo economics thing? And there were other snippets, too.

In fact, thinking back, that's a good description of H.W. Bush - snippy. Still I'll take him over his son. And its a real shame how that family line has steadily deteriorated since Prescott.

Anyway, my point is these candidates all have the capacity for sheer Orwell-turning-in-the-grave forming of new alliances. In this particular case, I don't think Obama would offer the second slot to Clinton, and if he did, I'm not sure she would accept.

I'm thinking he might go with Bill Richardson. A governor with some foreign policy credentials, and the geography couldn't be better. Plus, nobody dislikes Richardson.

When the veep sweeps start, a lot of folks tend to look at other candidates for president, and usually it doesn't work that way. Knowing that, I'm still thinking Richardson.

I was thinking Mark Warner, but it looks like he really wants to be a senator instead and since these questions have evolved about Obama's experience, foreign policy, etc., now I'm thinking he has to pick someone to counter that. I'd love to see him go with Tony Zinni. Or even Colin Powell, if he could be talked into crossing the aisle.

If Hillary wins the nomination, I think she's going with Evan Bayh. That would be a smart pick, and while I'm not sure the deal has already been made, Bayh has known he was on the short-list before anyone else.

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Tom Heights, Chicago, Ill. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 16:44:32 GMT

*** A must Read *** go to hillaryclinton.com, news "press" release, click on New Your Times article dated November 30th. regards to Health Care Plans Clinton vs. Obama. ***This is a must read if you want to be an informed voter.***

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Stephen Powell — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:03:50 GMT

I'm sorry, all this garbage talk about "America would rather see a black man then a woman become president" needs to die in it's tracks.

When Hillary first began, her banner for a while was "Let's Make History" referring to having the first woman president.......AS IF Obama wouldn't have EQUALLY been making history! The bigger difference? While Hillary is teething on that whole appeal. Which IMO, is quite dismissive/bigot-like, implying that Obama isn't good enough to be recognized by history like she.

But wait, has Obama come out with the said banner "Let's have the first black president" or (like Hillary) go with "Let's Make History"? No, he hasn't, he doesn't need to, he doesn't need to rely on such statements. He may make reference to his ethnicity but never has he used it as a reason for people to vote for him....Until Mr.s Clinton who uses her gender.

THIS election of '08 is damned important. Right here we must shed past skins of personal prejudice (be they gender, ethnicity, religious understands) and VOTE for the right INDIVIDUAL rather then sheeple (sheep+people=sheeple). And definately not an self-centered, over-ambitious(the bad kind of ambitious) twit of a republican wearing democrat clothing (i.e. Hillary Clinton).

I will end with a quote from my best friend who was originally going to vote for Hillary.

"You know, for 22 years of my life the country has been led by two families. The Bushes or the Clintons. It's time for a change."

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John Doe, Des Moines, IA — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:05:01 GMT

Wake up people! Obama is not ready for the Big time. He will be in THE FUTURE BUT NOT AT THIS TIME. You speak of Hillary double talking, Obama talks just to make noise. He is young and intergetic, he is not worldly. We need someone who has been in 82 countries and has talked with world leaders. A person who has respect all around the globe. A person who can repair the damage done by Bush.
THAT PERSON IS HILLARY CLINTON!!!!!!!

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:09:05 GMT

i really question the judgement of some of the statements made by hillary supporteres and republican advocates. first of all republicans have caused such a mess of american unity here at home an abroad with the politics of fear and self indulgence in partnership with corporate america. they have taken constitutional rights from americans, invaded the privacy of americans, kept wealth in the hands of the rich get richer, crippled education from the elementary level to the undergraduate level and have taken a surplus federal budget to a negative 10 trillion national deficit. most of that deficit is owed to an adversary that steals american technology and spies on our country relentlesly and you all advocate the ideals of the republican party instead of national unity. if you can show me more positives than negatives that republican party has concerning the benefits your party has bestowed on this country then you present a valid debate or arguement. other wise your stance is purely ideological, emotional and has no substantial or factual reason to weigh your words with serious consideration.

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J. Lyle, Mars, Pennsylvania — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:12:26 GMT

I think it is a good thing that the baby boomer generation will now lead America deep into the twenty-first century. But I have yet to read anything from Ms Clinton or Mr. Obama that clearly states where America will be under their presidency. And more importantly, where will the world be?
John Kennedy 'took' America and the world to the moon.
Where is America and the world going now?

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eNews Reference — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:32:40 GMT

I think Obama's message of hope and personal action is winning in a fundamental and comprehensive way. His campaign strategized to beat Hillary with her words... http://www.enewsreference.com

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Steve, Pensacola, Florida — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:35:17 GMT

Personally, I was a huge fan of Bill Clinton...I think he was one of our greatest Presidents. Look what he did for our economy and deficits. So, If Hillary goes to office, maybe she'll let Billy do his magic again, but I'm voting for Obama. He's JFK material, the natural ability to lead all Americans.

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:40:53 GMT

i sorry that you had to leave your country because of politics lady. if you are going to be a resident of germany and disdain the american landscape so much why are you voting at all? by the way for those who vote for hillary. i hope it would be for their belief in her as a qualified leader and not because she is a woman. to suggest that folks would not vote for her because she is a woman is as prejudice and discriminatory perception as not voting for obama because he is half black and half white. it amazes me that we as americans allowed the biggest mistake in allowing mr. bush to become president. yet, we are committing the same mistake of hating, lieing, believing without fact checking and choosing based upon such narrow minded point of views (practices perfected by the republican party). we really need to be students of this campaign process and not just be emotional, blindly led or possibly biggoted supporters. by the way people none of the candidates are going to be perfect. we aren't and nor will they be.

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:47:14 GMT

on the hopefund issue. this was a planted inquiry that will prove to be a strategical blunder by the campaign that planted it. it will bring attention to the campaign that has a record of representing the corporate health lobby for 16 long years or more. it was an attempt at distraction from non answering of issues and detailing specific plans. the strategy is to deflect attention away from the fact that some campaigns have at least gven details of a plan on some issues and some haven't and won't if they can parse, deflect and say something without saying a thing. to qoute james brown, "talking loud and saying nothing"

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J A, Kansas City, MO — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:52:47 GMT

What is your American dream? Who can best lead you towards that dream? Vote your mind, not your party.

Myself, I'll be voting Obama. He will be wise enough to pick a great staff - and - I believe he has the very best mind for the job - something we citizens need moving foward. America is at a crossroads - do we want fear and radical policies to say who we are to the world -or- do we want strength thru hope and reason to say who we are to the world? Only one person in this race - on both sides - offers hope and strength with vision, that's Obama.

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Chuck, San Diego — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:55:47 GMT

LOL< even this pro Barak article shows it---- "a high school pep rally'

Obama, a true "not ready for prime time" suit

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gravel kucinich paul nader — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 17:55:52 GMT

HDNet Dec 1 DNC debate (Sat 7:30pm ET)
- all eight -

gravel kucinich paul nader

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Katy7540, Cedar Rapids, Iowa — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 18:10:33 GMT

Another day another attack from the Clinton campaign against Obama. Of course he will defend himself. And if someone else becomes the front runner, Clinton will simply attack the new front runner. And you will label the new front runner the attacker. This is not news, it is not journalism. It is not even reporting.

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Rose, Palisade Park, NJ — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 18:28:48 GMT

Hillary Clinton is the best and strongest candidate.

She has the pragmatic wisdom and diplomacy to stand for America's views without allienating America from the rest of the world. She is a consensus builder. As America goes, so does the world. We need to turn around our situation here so that peace, prosperity, respect, will once again be ours here and also, theirs abroad.

She will bring together bipartisanship to resolve issues that need to be tackled for the sake of returning our country once again to great heights economically, educationally, socially, etc.

She is determined to do what is right inspite of what people say - case in point is her resolve to keep her marriage intact inspite of public outcry for her to leave her husband. It takes great courage and focus to overcome a marital crisis and continue to succeed at what you are doing.

She really has compassion for the less fortunate and the middle class. Her health care program and stance on other major issues such as education, social security and the economy show us she is focussed on improving the lives of those who need help. She looking to get us back to a place of no stress and greatness. Hillary is the one who will champion the causes of the poor and also, of the middle class. Do not be driven by emotions. Think seriously before you choose your Commander in Chief. Hillary is determined and capable.

She has the best team, including one of the best American Presidents, Bill Clinton. America had so much respect from the rest of the world during his presidency.

I implore you people to take your votes seriously. Hillary will restore honor to our land with grace and inclussion. That is what we desperately need.

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Pete Caloger Bushkill, PA 18324 — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 18:52:54 GMT

Lose the veil, big guy, and let's get the campaign started. Just keep the challenges to the other candidates relevant and honest.

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Jes — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 18:54:06 GMT

Frankly I'm disgusted with Obama, do people even know what he stands for? He spoke out against the Patriot Act then voted in favor of reauthorizing it, he cannot commit to withdrawing the troops out of Iraq by 2013, possibly later.. He hasn't ruled out using strikes against Iran, not to mention the same vote he criticizes Hillary for, he missed himself and sponsored the exact same legislation designating the IRG a terrorist organization in back in April.. He implied that he would invade Pakistan, without the consent of their government.. He made votes making it more difficult for average citizens to sue big corporations.. He has no consistency on the issues of social security and taxes, in the very beginning he was for raising the cap, then having all options on the table, then appointing a bipartisan commission, now he's back to raising the cap.. He receives contributions from lobbyists, corporations and interest groups

The only two candidates worth voting for are Paul and Biden

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Terry, Ft Worth, TX — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:00:50 GMT

I have always tried to vote for the best candidate, regardless of party affiliation. I haven't seen a Republican in this race that I am thrilled with, and while I don't agree with all that Obama has said, he seems to me to be the best so far.

I would ask of you all to keep something in mind, if Hillary is indeed elected, we will have a minimum of 24 years of Bush/Clinton administrations. That, my friends, is a bit too much!

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:05:21 GMT

katy7540, u r right. he is suppose to defend hisself. i don't understand why the other supporters think that only their candidates should be able to defend themself and it not be negative.

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Terry, Ft Worth, TX — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:05:26 GMT

Oh....and I care not about the gender nor race of the candidate, just that they be the best person for the job

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Terry, Ft Worth, TX — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:05:59 GMT

Oh....and I care not about the gender nor race of the candidate, just that they be the best person for the job

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Mary — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:22:32 GMT

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:25:50 GMT

rose, i respect your point of view. though i don't agree with you. at least you make your point intelligently with convicton and respectfully. by the way, i agree that the clinton's personal life has nothing to do with how hilary would run the contry. it does take a lot to overcome what she did in her marraige, but the fact that she did or didn't stay or leave concerning her marraige is not an indicator of how she would run her presidency either. i agree that bill was a good president for the country at that time and era. however, this is a different time and era. your statement on hillary's potential to bring bipartisan cooperation is being hopeful on your part. there is no democrat that the republican and conservative base dislikes more than hillary at this time. the reawakening of the republican and conservative idealogues has been reignited by the hate of hillary and bill throughout their conservative and misguided base. hillary i don't believe will be a unifier. in her words, she knows how to play the game and fight back. i suggest that every candidate running in the democratic party can fight back. she will have to fight constantly because of the animosty, hate and dislike the republicans and conservatives have for both clinton's. they don't just see hillary as president. they also see it as bill's 3rd term (12 years). i sugest to you that hopeful as you are with hillary back in the white house washington, d.c. is likely to stay in partisan gridlock. i am not speaking with emotion at all. i am being a realist having observed the nature of this ugly relationship between the clinton's and republicans since bill was in office. by the way independents are going to be very ow in number voting for hillary. possibly causing the democrats the general election.

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Lee in CA — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:40:10 GMT

"I'm sick and tired of Democrats thinking that the only way to look tough on national security is by talking and acting and voting like George Bush Republicans."

You tell them, Barack!

I wouldn't cry over a Barack WH, except for the "he's the Manchurian candidate" droolers.

I'd put them:

Biden
Edwards
McCain
Paul (with some work on the environmental issues)
Edwards
Hilldawg
Fred
Huck
Anyone I've forgotten
Anyone who wants it except Guilianni
Guilliani

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 19:58:20 GMT

i respect the hillary supporters. i really do. having voted for bill previously, but i just can't support her because of her history in politics. to many documented scandals. to many corporate lobbyists have paid into her political campaigns. she has to many votes casted in favor of the corporate america agenda. she is very savvy using the media to paint a different picture, but her track record since she has been in the senate doesn't say she is going to do what she is claiming she will do now. why now would she take a different direction in her attitude after so long be who she has been for so long? can someone explain that to me, please? I haven't made up my mind yet. instead of just jumping on someones bandwagon i have been studying there history and voting records for months. can a leapord shange it's spots after so long? as an independent state your cases,please.

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Shadow, Hamden, CT — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:04:14 GMT

But I think that people are afraid to see a woman as President! better an African American as a woman!!

K. Lambert, Schweinfurt GERMANY (Sent Saturday, December 01, 2007 10:25 AM)

Nope, not for me. In the abstract, I like the idea of a female President even more than an African American President. There's something right, and balancing, and completing, about having a female become leader of the free world given the last few thousand years of history.

But we're not voting for abstractions - we're voting for actual individuals. Obama is the strongest African American candidate to ever emerge in politics, while Hillary is not entirely the best female candidate imaginable, as countless other women in politics have risen entirely on their own, and have no such negative baggage with the public. If Obama were to be nominated and lose, the African American community would know they put forth the best candidate they could, and not someone with prior baggage that sunk them; if Clinton were to lose, female politicians who have risen on their own for fifty years will be denied the Presidency, all due to the the arrogance of a former first lady with high negatives never experienced by self-made female leaders like Kathleen Sebelius, Nancy Pelosi, and Carol Moseley-Braun.

I haven't endorsed yet, but if it's between Obama and Clinton, it's a no-brainer. Potentially cheating two generations of women because half the country hates Hillary Clinton is not my idea of advancing women's rights.

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Ken Collins/ Wagoner,Oklahoma — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:23:30 GMT

Senator Obama is like a breath of fresh air !!
I have read to many stories about the Bush and the Clinton's, TOO CLOSE FOR ME !!!!!

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

wordsmith, mid-america — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:25:30 GMT

Where to begin picking apart the fools and the foolish prattle?
PART I
M.Foley: When you start name-calling ("Obama is the best hope to defeat the bigots.") You immediately lose credibility. And when you start dealing in absolutes in such an uncertain world ("Hillary can't win a national election."), you show your lack of clear and thorough thinking.

Tammy Granger in 'Munice' IN: Again, name-calling is a tactic of ignorant and self-indulgent minds. If you are a Republican and want to disparage Obama or Democrats in general, it could all be summed up by declaring yourself a Republican. To lump all Democrats (or Republicans, or Libertarians, etc. into one group, dense or otherwise) is the kind of bigotry that has crippled American politics throughout the ages. Since you do not a sufficient number of Democrats nationally to be able to make such a blanket statement, all of your comments are discredited.

Richard, Washington State: "[W]hy is this man considered "fresh" or "new"?
Well, Richard, you're right. Nothing new there. But there's really been nothing close to "new" in politics since Jimmy Carter, the so-called 'outsider' won the White House - and he wasn't really all that fresh, either. Bella Abzug shook things up many years ago but, with the exception of the skirt, she was still status quo. If people want something new, they have to take control of their own government.

Windy City Girl, Chicago, IL: Your response to Granger was no less demeaning and disrespectful than hers. In which case, in damning her, you damned yourself.

Shadow, Hamden, CT: "Idiot."

Coatesmoe, New York, NY: "Big money is for Clinton. Do you think democracy has a place here?" Only if you let it. Don't pay attention to the media blitz. Read the candidates' own words. Listen to them. Become an active part of the process. THEN true democracy may stand a chance.

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:27:10 GMT

jes, your facts are so very wrong. obama spoke out against the patriot act, but there was legislation tied to it the would have discontinued funding for our covert agaencies. obama and hillary both did the right thing by voting for the patriot act that had certain revisions applied to it at the time of that vote. obama has stated he will bring the troops home in 2008 except for what it will take to guard the embassy and ready reaction force stationed outside of iraq in the middle east. obama also presented legislation to be voted on so it would become law that would prohibit the president from declaring war with iran without congressional approval. it is a matter of fact that he didn't support legislation designating the irg as terrorist organization. he wasn't there to vote because of a prior commitment on the trail as all the candidates have experienced, but was forthcoming to the fact that he wasn't in favor of the legislation. the vote making it more difficult to sue corporation is misinformation and a lie. you can check the voting record on that issue if you have a desire for truth instead of slander. you sir seem to a victim of believing t.v., radio, 2nd and 3rd party campaign slandering, as well as mudslinging instead of taking time to research true factual information. there are serious supporters that are backing there candidates intelligently. they aren't just spewing hate, lies, inuendo and false facts. all of the candidates have good and bad ideas. yes including hillary everyone, but in the end we must decide if we are going to be able to respect, support and congratulate who wins the democratic nomination to avoid having another bush like presidency for 4 to 8 years. If the debate can't be truthful and respectful then when it comes to gether to join as one we won't. at that point we all lose. think about it y fellow americans, please.

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wordsmith, mid-america — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:27:28 GMT

fools & prattle: PART II

Jane Doe, anycity, America: WHAAAAT? Okay, I'm going to try to break down some of your rant to make some sense of it.
"(Clinton's) false concern for the uninsured…" An arbitrary statement. How do you know her concern is false?
"her ambiquity (sic) as to how she would enforce (inflict)
her healthcare policies on all Americans (not just
the uninsured), masks a greater problem of the same
kinds of special interest groups serving found in
his own party." This cluttered mass seems to be a diatribe against Clinton's proposed healthcare plan. You apparently believe that ensuring that ALL Americans have adequate healthcare is some kind of communist plot conceived only to further advance the financial interests of a few, yet you give no concrete evidence to prove that your assertions are anything more than idle ranting. If you make accusations, you need to have something to back them up.
"…consider the need to vote out anyone who has watched our energy crisis cripple our economy over the last 30 years and replace them with men and women of vision for America. " Eight years ago, I was paying 99 cents a gallon for gas at the pump. It was on the watch of one Republican that Americans saw the price of a gallon go up by more than $2 per, the price of a barrel of crude more than double, and the cost of home heating oil increase by more than 100%.
"While the Clintons place their economic stock in healthcare reform by preying on the uninsured using predatory practices of insurance companies and healthcare industries, Mr. Obama will not allow this to happen." … "Do we really want a biased healthcare Czar determining who can or can not contribute to the workforce or economy based on genetic medical forecasts? Democrats and Republicans need to bring themselves into the real world and consider what will happen when all your health information is placed under a biased partisanship leader. It will give you an understanding of how economic survival will be handed to bias (sic) politicans (sic), rouge (sic) predatory insurance companies and partisan healthcare professionals in determining your future employment. " Again, I'm not sure what your basis for these allegations might be. I will, however, concede that insurance companies do tend to be predatory to a degree. But, since you likely do not have the full scope of knowledge of what goes on in the insurance industry, you might not be aware that the cost of insurance is based of an equation of probabilities. Face it, like every other business from the cable company and the video store to the grocery and clothing stores to the guy or gal that cuts your hair, they are in business to make money. Do you complain that the Blockbuster recouped the cost of the video you rent four years ago? Do you call your hairstylist names because they charge to cut your hair? It's a fact of business. My sole complaint with corporate America would be the outrageous salaries and perks offered to CEO's and other top execs. But, if you don't like that setup, go buy a share of stock in the company, go to their corporate meetings and complain; start a grassroots movement among shareholders to topple the hierarchy. Otherwise, you're just another mouth that roars.
"Trust me on this. I've been the target of bias hatred …" This statement gives more perspective to anything else you have had to say. You are angry and your anger has given rise to vitriol.

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wordsmith, mid-america — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:28:29 GMT

fools & prattle: PART III

Johnny V.: "Obama is desperate.$$$$ Hopefund $$$$$$" ????? What makes you think that? Or are you just wishing? Or viewing the race from your own standpoint of hopefulness?

Paul Miller, Woodbridge, VA: How did you get in here? Sounds like you've got more active grey matter than most contributors.
"In fact, thinking back, that's a good description of H.W. Bush - snippy. Still I'll take him over his son. And its a real shame how that family line has steadily deteriorated since Prescott." Had to laugh over this one. I've made similar comments ever since George the Second moved into "The Nation's House".

Tom Heights, Chicago, Ill: RE: hillaryclinton.com - read, don't get your point. The press release is nothing more than one person's or group's attempt to put information in front of their target audience. In this case, it is a political release and is nothing more than one candidate's effort to put their spin on another candidate's platform. This was not something written by the NYT (or, as you so quaintly put it, the New YOUR Times). It was written by someone on Clinton's staff. Take it with a grain of salt.

Stephen Powell: "When Hillary first began, her banner for a while was "Let's Make History" referring to having the first woman president.......AS IF Obama wouldn't have EQUALLY been making history! The bigger difference? While Hillary is teething on that whole appeal. Which IMO, is quite dismissive/bigot-like, implying that Obama isn't good enough to be recognized by history like she." Your argument is without merit. Clinton's cry of "Let's Make History" in no way discounted Obama's ability to do likewise. She was, no more-no less, appealing to a sect of the population whose perspectives are colored by women's rights. If you see more than that, you are just not looking - or rather, you're looking too hard.

John Doe, Des Moines, IA: "Wake up people! Obama is not ready for the Big time. He will be in THE FUTURE BUT NOT AT THIS TIME. You speak of Hillary double talking, Obama talks just to make noise. He is young and intergetic (sic), he is not worldly. We need someone who has been in 82 countries and has talked with world leaders. A person who has respect all around the globe. A person who can repair the damage done by Bush." John, if your comments weren't so sad, they would be laughable. What makes you think that, in order to be president a person must have a passport with stamps on every page? One need not be widely traveled to be worldly aware. Obama is an intelligent, well-respected man. He is known by political leaders around the world. I don't know if he is THE candidate to take the White House, but I do know he is capable, quick-witted, compassionate, fair, and clear-thinking. Outside of campaigning environments, most other politicians, on both sides of the aisle, would admit that he engenders a great deal of respect for these qualities. And, as such, he is a fine and well-qualified candidate for that high office. He is not, however, the only candidate to claim such qualities and it remains in the hands of the voters, both those politically-informed and those ignorant of anything but the commercials, to determine with whom we will be fettered for the next four years. All we can hope is that the majority vote wisely.

ace p washing, d.c.: "…your stance is purely ideological, emotional and has no substantial or factual reason to weigh your words with serious consideration."
BINGO! ace, that pretty much sums it up.

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:35:53 GMT

to wordsmith, kudo's

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Lucia Burne, Florida — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:38:07 GMT

God help America if Obama wins. we will be fighting our friends and allies and embrace our enemies.
Obama is no match for the international fiends.

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H P Boston — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:39:54 GMT

I haven't endorsed yet, but if it's between Obama and Clinton, it's a no-brainer. Potentially cheating two generations of women because half the country hates Hillary Clinton is not my idea of advancing women's rights.
Shadow, Hamden, CT (Sent Saturday, December 01, 2007 3:04
_________________________________________________
Yes definitly an IDIOT! As in IDIOT with no brain.
Wordsmith I concur. You forgot he lies, his blantant statement 1/2 the country hates Hillary is a figment of his confused idiot brain! Only 1/2 the poster here like to perpertrate that lie.
So no biggie I'll be dammed with pleasure.

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:43:12 GMT

i have a question for everyone. if your candidate doesn't win the primary are you willing to support who does win the democratic nomination so the republicans don't win the presidency? this question will reveal a lot about who you are my fellow americans.

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Travis K., OR — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 20:53:12 GMT

I've read all these comments back and forth.... I'm still not convinced of either candidate's suitability. I'm still supporting Kucinich, and now that Obama and other well known Dems have voluntarily withdrawn themselves from the ballot in Michigan, I'm hoping Kucinich can pull ahead of Clinton in that state and sweep the nation. He's got a large base of supporters in my own state, that's for sure.

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Terry John -- E Wenatchee, WA — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:06:56 GMT

Lets have a Q&A about all the major issues like: troops in Iraq and what should be done and when,
health reform
education reform
National deficit
there are to many to list, so, let me just say that I would like it so the other participants can not hear the answers given by the other participants. Let them give their OWN answers to each question. Maybe then we can hear exactly what the issues are and what they will try to do about it. Having a debate is a situation where the other participants can change or alter their answers, while making themselves look better, and is not a true and accurate statement by the particants going after the first ones.

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Suzi, Macungie, PA — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:20:12 GMT

The new Obama "newest young kid on the block" seems to be running his camaign by belittling women. I'll bet his wife can't keep him in his place and so he takes it out on the "fairer" sex. He seems to be running his new found entrance into politics as a woman basher. He will crash and burn soon and find that campaigns are about helping the country not about jealousy and putting women down. Find some issues little man.

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H P Boston — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:21:18 GMT

have a question for everyone. if your candidate doesn't win the primary are you willing to support who does win the democratic nomination so the republicans don't win the presidency? this question will reveal a lot about who you are my fellow americans.
ace p washington, d.c. (Sent Saturday, December 01, 2007 3:43 PM)

___________________________________________________

ace we have been asked that same question over and over for months on this blog. Many have stated as I have that we will support and vote for the Democrat, who ever wins.
So it is time to save our vim and vigor for the big fight against the repukes. (})

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Suzi, Macungie, PA — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:24:21 GMT

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H P Boston — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:28:34 GMT

The 'hostage' situation sounds fishy. Hillary needed a reason to bow out of her DNC speech. She gave a poor speech at the JJ Dinner in Des Moines recently and Obama gave a history making speech and the crowd really responded.
Mary (Sent Saturday, December 01, 2007 2:22 PM)

___________________________________________________
Mary, Mary you must be the virgin Mary and have not been out and about . Getagrip, get informed and come back with your purity and speak as an intelligent voter. Oh and take a peek at the all the debates and see how badly Obama did in each and every one. One speech does not a president make!

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Kay, Jackson Mississippi — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:39:50 GMT

I was taken aback when I read the above article about Obama's performance. Frankly, I didn't feel any heat. My take: John Edwards surpassed all of them. The audience seemed very receptive to his firey speech. Unlike his last run, he shows that he is indeed a fighter.

There is something about Obama I just don't like--he seems stand-offish, even afraid or resentful of the limelight. There is just something strange about him.

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ace p washington, d.c. — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:51:59 GMT

to wordsmith, i must admit that you have placed yourself on a high pedestal. i am undecided and still researching. i give some of your merits credit, but also point out that you are not all knowing nor the only one in this room with intelligence and knowledge. you don't have to call names and rant to show the level of arrogance and self-emulation you are presently displaying. i am an independent that has not made a decision. so you see your ability to read people and what there stance is a gift your given to you and doesn't give you the right to paint yourself as all knowing. your first mistake is self proclamation of self importance.

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perry of Toronto, Ontario — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 21:52:20 GMT

Go Obama!!!!!

Get Bloomberg as your VP and rocket to victory!

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Dot, Illinois — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 22:22:13 GMT

Mary, Mary

I am an independent who has not decided which candidate to support, but I must take exception to your statement that "the hostage story looks fishy."
If you think someone would stage something like that for political gain, I think you really need to try to be more objective in your views. No matter how seasoned or dedicated they may be, I can't help but think that the thought of the danger they face must sometimes prey on the minds of the candidates and their families. The possibilities have to be scary; I can't imagine anyone staging something like that.

I am old enough to have seen the assassination of John Kennedy, M L King,Jr and Robert Kennedy, and would pray that we never see such acts in our country again.

So please, regardless of how you feel about Senator Clinton, try to fair minded in your assessments of situations.

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Stephen Powell — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 22:36:02 GMT

Wordsmith, way to show your intellectual ass my 'friend'.

You do realize you are coming off rather boorish and very much arrogant, right?

You're not saying one thing or another, not saying hardly anything at all but negating everyone else. Knit picking everyone for the sake of....what? Ego? Smells like a different type of trolling, in the end it's still trolling.

Keep it moving, please.

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JB, OKC, OK — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 00:22:16 GMT

K. Lambert, I am a black, educated woman (masters degree in education.) When we (blacks) are able to make history or break through barriers, it is black people like you who still have the slave mentality to keep history from happening or those barriers to be broken through. I would not vote for someone just because he or she is black but if that person is a good representative of not only blacks but everybody, why not vote for him.

It is obvious you have not followed his or Hillary's campaign. What has he lied about? Hillary has lied and double talked every time she opens her mouth. There are many blacks who we call crabs, when one of us are climbing to the top to make a difference, others like you, pulls them down. You need to keep your a-- in Germany. We have enough blacks in the U.S. who believe we should stay oppressed or too jealous to see a black president or black first lady in the White House. It seems that more whites than blacks are ready for this. That tells me that something is awfully wrong with the black race, no wonder we can't accomplish anything. We can't unite because of ignorance or jealousy. Obama will unite all the people, it is time for that. We need to get away from Black America and White America.

Some black women say they are voting for Hillary because she is a woman. I guarantee you if their husband, son, brother,etc. was running for president, whether he was capable or not, they would vote for him and not the woman.

It is time to get over the oppressed, slave mentality. Martin Luther King, Jr. and others have died for us for us to witness moments like this. Obama is just as capable if not more capable than anyone on the ticket. I come from a family of very strong-willed, educated women (some are married and some are single), we are proud of him and we will definitely vote for him. GO OBAMA!!!!!!!!!!!

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Mitchell Feldman, Vestal, NY — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 00:35:20 GMT

Wordsmith, nice post. If you allow me, I'll add. Hillary Clinton's alleged edge in experience is marred by her three votes to give Bush authority to wage war. All of this noise about experience v. inexperience is just a lot of propaganda. No, it's not even intelligeable enough to be propaganda; it's just noise. Hillary's judgment in foreign policy is either non-existent or is compromised by ambition (posturing for the presidency). Either is unacceptable.

I would posit that the election of Obama will have a much more positive impact on the populations of Africa, Asia and Latin America because of what it says about America finally reaching out of its provincial prospective. And the European view of America as an inferior partner in world policy, will be countered; they will see us as maturing into the role of a true meritocracy.

Yes Bill was well liked internationally, but Hillary's superficial visits as a first lady, that had no importance in terms of policy, were of no value for the future (as would be Laura Bush's or even Jacqueline Kennedy - who visited many nations, was loved by all, was very intelligent, but was by no means a potential president). There are and have been women with vast foreign policy experience, Jeanne Kirkpatrick, Madaleine Albright, but Hillary is not one of them.

Hillary's stance on Health Insurance mandates is crafted in a way that is doomed to failure in spite of Paul Krugman's impractical assessment in yesterday's NYT. The benefit of health insurance held by all is in it's ability to better re-imburse the hospital systems. The effect does not improve access to medical care in this country but it is designed to stop the unfair practice of hospital system's (and MD's) overbilling to compensate for non-paying and under compensating (medicaid) patients. By spreading the cost over more insured patients, theoretically, individual bills could be reduced (since this practice of compensation would no longer be necessary). Would this reduce premiums that insurance companies would charge since the amount that they would be billed would be potentially less? Well maybe but, pardon my skepticism, somehow I think that there is an equal possibility that this would just throw more money into the system and drive prices up. The possibility exists that insurance companies would not adjust their premiums downward but keep them the same, hoping to further increase their profit margins. The possibility exists that hospitals and M.D.'s would continue to overbill.

Access to health care at this time in the U.S., is guarenteed (for the most part) as soon as one walks into an emergency room; the problem is all with the distribution of money. And yes hospital bills can bankrupt a patient and that must be stopped, immediately, but again, that is not a problem with actual access to health care. Access is a problem but it is not a crisis.

The most important problem with health care and something that does border on crisis, is the cost of medication. People do make choices between buying medications and buying food and sundries, but this is a problem with pharmaceutical companies and is in a different realm.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that Health Care is a very complex problem and none of the candidates have taken the time (and Mr. Krugman's hysterics certainly don't help) to really analyze the problems and priortize them. This whole thing is not going to be solved in one fell swoop and in order to approach the problem correctly, we must lose the demagoguery and utilize the non-polarizing, consensus forming talents of a president who can lead us through this miasma. As in the actual practice of medicine, making the diagnosis is hard enough, but employing the corect therapy demands a standard that is exponentially more difficult to achieve.

I don't think that Mrs. Clinton and her closeness to the insurance companies or the phamaceutical companies puts her in a position to make the best judgment. I think that the grandiosity of her proposals and her polarizing nature will lead her to the failure experienced in 1993. Unlike John Edwards, I do believe that insurance companies and pharmaceutical companies must have a seat at the table but only as equal partners (not as prime movers as Dick Cheney allowed the Oil Companies to be, in writing an energy policy). Kucinich's proposal for a single payer system will increase the government beaurocracy to a level that will be unmanageable and more importantly, medical matters cannot be handled by a one-size-fits-all government policy (Canada is the prime example). America is a country that may need ground rules (like with any sporting event - in order to prevent mayhem) but it thrives on diversity and competition of ideas.

Barack Obama is the only candidate who thinks with the creativity necessary to appreciate these nuances. He is the only candidate, who I (yes, subjectively I state this) can govern with the consensus necessary to solve problems of the magnitude of health care.
Obama '08

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Mitchell Feldman, Vestal, NY — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 02:46:04 GMT

Sorry for spelling 'perspective' wrong. I guess that there was a good reason that I was a level behind in spelling, in Mrs. Edelman's 5th grade class.

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B. Honest, Portland OR — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 15:39:41 GMT

Personally I would go with an Obama/Edwards ticket for the Presidency. Between the two I think they stand the best chance at toppling the GOP not just in the '08 election but for the next 8 years to boot. It is all too true, from what I have seen for years now, that Hillary is not only just way too close to being a Republican in Democrat's clothing, but at this point she is also appearing like the Emperor showing off his new clothes.....does she really think that we don't read and/or remember everything she has done and said, even when there is a public record of such?? Then again, she is so very studious about not ever Really Saying anything on a subject to begin with!

The fact that Obama is clearly standing for a different way of doing things in Washington makes it just that much more of a contrast to Hillary who is going about the same old things the same old ways.....which, frankly, this is an idea that I think America has finally woken up to: We cannot have a change in the way our government is run if we keep electing people that have proven themselves to be part of "The Machine". It is really just that simple.

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Mrs. Edelman — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 16:29:48 GMT

Sorry for spelling 'perspective' wrong. I guess that there was a good reason that I was a level behind in spelling, in Mrs. Edelman's 5th grade class.
Mitchell Feldman, Vestal, NY (Sent Saturday, December 01, 2007 9:46
----------------------------------------------------
Your typo did not compute, post to long to read and notice you have overstated your opinion.

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Dot, Illinois — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 17:10:30 GMT

Mitchell Feldman, Vestal, NY

I don't mind spelling mistakes or typos in a post that has something informative to say. I think the picking on imperfect grammar, spelling or typing, is a tad petty. If I can understand what the blog is trying to say, that's all I care about. So keep on posting--even if you don't spell every word correctly. Your thoughts are always good ones.

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Ron, Wichita, KS — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 17:15:54 GMT

"We need someone who has been in 82 countries and has talked with world leaders. A person who has respect all around the globe. A person who can repair the damage done by Bush.
THAT PERSON IS HILLARY CLINTON!!!!!!!'

John Doe, Des Moines

John, I strongly beg to differ. THAT PERSON IS JOE BIDEN. Who have world leaders recently called? JOE BIDEN. Not POTUS Bush or candidate Clinton. Joe Biden is the one candidate who is ready from "minute one" (let's not wait til Day 1) to begin rebuilding America's stature and position in the world. When Hillary talks to world leaders in her "politicianese" nuanced as hell gobbledigook, they, like us voters, won't have a clue as to where she stands or what she will do.

With Joe Biden you have both solid experience, judgement and straight talk (the John McCain of the democratic party).

Let's go with the real deal. Support JOE BIDEN.

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Patrick — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 17:22:06 GMT

God help us all. Hillary walks into a room, Republicans run to the right and throw-up. Democratic freeze and smile because of Party politics, but none of her peers like her. Just like she's forcing this health care coverage even on those who don't want it, she's being forced on Democrats. Look, Obama speaks and both Dems and Republicans want to hear what he's gotta say whether they agree or not. Nobody throws up. That's democracy and Dems know it. You watch, it will be a land slide for Obama both in the primaries and the general.

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Katie, St. Paul, MN — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 18:37:56 GMT

K. Lambert states that Hillary "is not afraid to say she made a mistake." You are mistaken. She has NEVER acknowledged her war vote in 2002 was a mistake. For that, I can never forgive her. That was when it was most important to take a stand. Obama did. I'm voting for him.

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Samantha, Los Angeles, CA — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 18:55:45 GMT

I"m so over the repetitious, cocktail talking people who direct their anger and fear at Hillary Clinton. Can't you see that the press are feeding you your lines? And you just say them, ten thousand different ways. You are simply the mouthpieces of the mainstream American media that must maintain the status quo. Wake up!

The anger and vitriol at Hillary never ceases to amaze me... now, people are even blaming her for rallying behind the fact that she might make history as the first woman president? Just cut the crap. Imagine for a second what kind of person it would take and how hard assed she'd have to be to be the FIRST WOMAN president. This is the most powerful, coveted job in the country if not the world. Women have had to be a lot more ruthless than she's been just to climb the corporate ladder for God's sake. Don't buy into the crap that she is hated and partisan and can't win. It's the machine talking and you're all feeding it. She's an ambitious, strong, smart woman. Probably the the biggest threat to the way our society operates today (can you say CHANGE?). She's fiercely ambitious. And? So what. So was Kennedy, so was Lincoln. She is brilliant, compassionate, is respected by world leaders and knows how to win. She also has a realistic health care plan. What good is one that sounds good if it can't pass and doesn't insure everyone? And please stop saying that if you already have insurance you like, she's gonna try to take it from you. Read the plan idiot. Don't just shoot your mouth off about the evil Hillary because you read it somewhere.

I like Obama, but I don't think he has the experience or the savvy to beat the Republicans and I worry that by the time he is up to speed untangling all the corrupt webs that have been weaved by or current administration, he'll be seen as weak and be facing the Republican machine again (at the end of term one) only this time, they'll be ready to win. What would that accomplish?

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Samantha, Los Angeles, CA — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:42:39 GMT

Big, Bad Hillary Clinton... yawn.

Do you also think there was a bomb planted by GWB in building 10 of the trade center? (I refer to the quote below)

"The 'hostage' situation sounds fishy. Hillary needed a reason to bow out of her DNC speech. She gave a poor speech at the JJ Dinner in Des Moines recently and Obama gave a history making speech and the crowd really responded."

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Whitejeans, [JeanneWimbley,Atwater,CA[ — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:44:46 GMT

I,too was excited with First woman Pres. notion. BUT, refusal to apologize for errors--too Bush-like for comfort. More than that,I see shortsighted blind follower of Bush. But, To delegate her responsibility and authority to BUSH--irrespective as to how he woud use that authority--to me is unforgiveable and NOT representative of strong Leader I think this country needs. With Stupid,Sadistic,corrupt Leadership tied to Corporate Dictators means it is no miracle WE the People recognize and embrace intelligent,forward Vision,humanitarian Barack Obama who really CARES for ALL people. War was just too SERIOUS a mistake for any "Monday-nite quarter back" to fix. (IF I had known..)" duh!

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Jeanne Wimbley,Atwater,CA[ — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:59:03 GMT

Ace--seems like you got it right. Like to add, Barack has forward Vision--something that this office sorely needs now, in view of so many "mistakes" whih happens when one does NOT really care. My one vote goes to OBAMA.

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

B. Honest, Portland OR — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 05:19:38 GMT

I am not one to normally use names and point out things, specifically, from others posts, HOWEVER, Samantha, Los Angeles CA, IF we are to have a First Woman President, America, in all of it's glory, can certainly find a BETTER woman to be the first female President. I personally thought that she would make a fine President, clear back when 'rumors' were floated to test the waters about her 'nominatability'. And so I have watched her closely since then and read everything I could find about her. And after watching her for this long I have come to the conclusion that the very LAST thing we need for our next President is an already bought and paid for shill for the insurance and other big businesses that have paid her way from the very start. It is NOT the woman here that is the actual problem, the problem is that the woman is being strictly controlled by her campaign managers and corporate advisors and used in a very cynical ploy to appeal to the feminist movement in America. They are plain Using the fact that "She Would Be THE First Woman President of the United States" very blatantly as a campaign club to beat back opponents with the sexism ploy, saying that it is time for a Woman to be in the Big Boy's Club and to present just that same face to the public as well. But HOW many of her advisors and campaign managers are Women?? Remember back when she said she was not going to run for president, and then she got talked into it, and was instantly made a figurehead for her own campaign: She is running, but does not KNOW what her own platform is (Other than 'Against Bush and For whatever America wants' or what her positions are, not until she is Told what her platform and position is by her managers and advisors. THEY are the very same people that have been supporting Bush Co. in the White House for the past eight years. It may be the opposite side of the coin, but it is still THE COIN that controls the halls of our government presently. To put Hillary in is only to allow the other 'face' of the same COIN.....in other words it is STILL Corporate Money that is driving the campaign, and afterwards the Administration, whether it is Hillary or any of the Republicans. The Republicans are in a way, very honest, with them you get the whole political machine, no matter WHICH one you pick, it will still be the same corporate campaign managers and advisors that are really running things, because, presently, that is all the Republican political party really is, a closely linked group of corporate and financial interests, with interlocking plausible deniabilities in order to cover each others faux pas and so limit damage should any one thread come unraveled. And one has to remember, Corporate America is NOT about following the law, not the word nor the spirit of the law. Oh, they have all the paperwork on the walls saying how good they are, slick ad work that shows them on the Law's side and conforming to the letter of the law all nice and pretty. BUT They routinely break the laws, they hire staff lawyers to tell them How to break the laws and How to get away with it, and, once they have stolen enough money and/or position, How they can CHANGE the laws in their favor, NOT in AMERICA's Favor, but for their own pocketbook's favor.

Are these the people that you really want to CONTINUE to run America?? If so vote for Hillary or the Republicans. If you want a change, or at the very least a President that will Champion a change, in our way of conducting our governance then you should, from all the information that I have been able to find, Vote Obama in 2008. Either He or John Edwards would be a much better President for the hard times that we are facing due to the mismanagement of the Present Administration and the past several decades of Corporate America's thwarting of meaningful governance.

America can certainly do BETTER than Hillary Clinton for the First Woman President, and I feel that we NEED to!

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

JJ Jax, FL — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 17:15:49 GMT

To Rose:

But it's okay to refuse the idea of an African-American being presient?

Hmmmm indeed...

Obama's veiled swipes picked right up

Windy City Girl, Chicago Il — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 19:37:25 GMT

To wordsmith:

"Windy City Girl, Chicago, IL: Your response to Granger was no less demeaning and disrespectful than hers. In which case, in damning her, you damned yourself."

I don't care. Democrats have been rolling over and playing the bigger person for years, and do you know where it gets us? On the floor of Congress banging our gavel saying we will not open the floor again to recount the votes in Florida. Screw that. I do belong to the party of better ideas, but because we are trying to be so damn nice we keep getting our butts handed to us. Didn't happen in the last race for Congress because we didn't roll over, and I will not now or anymore. Just because someone picks on you doesn't mean you have to take it to be the bigger person. You became the bigger person the moment someone made you respond when you did not provoke. Stop taking slaps without giving some back. You just end up being the only one who looks hurt and weak.

I will reiterate my earlier statement that the MSNBC First Read Blogs are getting very, very boring and full of fanatics. Same people, same posts, over and over and over again. Half of what is posted here is blatant lies or shaded versions of half-truths.

You would think that everyone running for the presidency this year beats their spouses, does dirty trades with racially charged groups, acts like they are "Going Wild" when visiting with foreign diplomats and can't spell. Come on now people!

I do not want a Republican to win this election. I do not want to see our country to continue to ruin the advacement of science. I do not want the class divide to continue to deepen. I will vote for any democrat who is elected to run in the general election. I hope that the Democrat who wins the primary is Barack Obama because his views most represent my own, and that is what I find most important when placing my vote. I am turned off by Hillary Clinton because of her support for the Iraq war and her friendliness with the Bush family.

Go Obama!