First thoughts: Eight days out

Shadow, Hamden, CT — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:33:29 GMT

It's never wise to build a campaign on claims of experience that can be so easily debunked.

The summary headline on politics.msnbc.com for that article says it all: "As first lady, Hillary Clinton appears to have learned more through osmosis and goodwill trips than decision-making".

Tremble at the wealth of her experience. I say tremble.

First thoughts: Eight days out

mike oh — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:34:58 GMT

So can we hope that the next article will focus on Barack Hussein Obama's claims that his spending time as a child in Indonesia count's for foreign policy experience?? I'd like to see how playing dodgeball in a vacant lot in Maylasia compares to meeting the heads of 79 nations over 8 years.

First thoughts: Eight days out

John B, Des Moines, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:35:50 GMT

Just an observation, if HRC took part in decision making in the Clinton WH she's the demanding, controlling, witch on heels that the right wing media have always portrayed her to be. If she didn't then she's weak on experience and unqualified to run.

First thoughts: Eight days out

S.K.M. Mass — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:44:52 GMT

It's about time people actually look into(or try to look into) the experience she got from being First Lady(or lack of experience). I never thought I'd say this, being a supporter of privacy, but I REALLY wonder what she has in those classified archives.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Sierra, SF — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:47:25 GMT

From the NY Times:

'...The Long Run
Clinton’s Résumé Factor: Those 8 Years as First Lady
By PATRICK HEALY
Published: December 26, 2007
The Long Run
The White House Years

Hillary Rodham Clinton flew to Uzbekistan in 1997 and was met by President Islam A. Karimov.

But during those two terms in the White House, Mrs. Clinton did not hold a security clearance. She did not attend National Security Council meetings. She was not given a copy of the president’s daily intelligence briefing. She did not assert herself on the crises in Somalia, Haiti and Rwanda.....'

So what knowledge did she have about foreign policy ? What input did she have on Foreign policy ?
More lies from Hillary....

'...And during one of President Bill Clinton’s major tests on terrorism, whether to bomb Afghanistan and Sudan in 1998, Mrs. Clinton was barely speaking to her husband, let alone advising him, as the Lewinsky scandal sizzled....'

Does anyone remember Hillary during the Lewinsky scandal ?
She said it was just a 'vast right wing conspiracy'
She said Bill NEVER HAD SEX with that woman !!

Not very credible...
She doesn't sound like a 'strong woman'.....
She sounds like a woman with low self-esteem.
She's afraid that no other man would want her....

'...In seeking the Democratic presidential nomination, Mrs. Clinton lays claim to two traits nearly every day: strength and experience. But as the junior senator from New York, she has few significant legislative accomplishments to her name. She has cast herself, instead, as a first lady like no other: a full partner to her husband in his administration, and, she says, all the stronger and more experienced for her “eight years with a front-row seat on history.”

Her rivals scoff at the idea that her background gives her any special qualifications for the presidency. Senator Barack Obama has especially questioned “what experiences she’s claiming” as first lady, noting that the job is not the same as being a cabinet member, much less president....'

Hillary can you go cut some ribbons.....
I'll be conferring with my intern, Monica

First thoughts: Eight days out

David Anders Pharr, Tx. — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:51:01 GMT

How can Hillary play experience, her most notables were working for a communist law firm defending the Black Panthers, writing her thesis on a Communist she idolized, trying to get a socialist health care in under Bill, trashing the whitehouse and taking the furniture. Taking drug money from Bill s pardons and criminal money for her Senate Race. She should be running in Russia, China, Cuba, or North Korea, she s a disguised communist, look at her Bio

First thoughts: Eight days out

mark — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:51:34 GMT

35 years of experience is a hoax. most people are not paying too much attention, save outside of the early states. bodes well for surging obama and huckabee

First thoughts: Eight days out

Tim, CT — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:51:45 GMT

"Can any other Republican slingshot as well out of Iowa right now than McCain, thanks to expectations and the length of time it appears that Huckabee's been in the lead?"

Ummm... Ron Paul? And don't underestimate the importance of weather... bad weather benefits who?

First thoughts: Eight days out

George Sears, Cedar City, Utah — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:55:41 GMT

Given that the nomination process may be over in a month, and most of us will never cast a meaningful vote, it was actually an interesting campaign. A couple of months ago it seemed like the media had anointed Clinton and Giuliani. Maybe they would add Bloomberg to really make it all New York. Maybe that happens, but you could sense a month of extreme discomfort for some columnists and pundits, especially when Huckabee surged. The Wall Street Journal can always drag down anyone who rises from the bottom. That route always entails compromise. The question might be, if Huck fails, what that part of the GOP does 'next time'. Huck has proved something.

It seems the immigration issue has been 'settled'. The next prez may have to offer something Draconian. But some states, like Arizona, have already taken drastic steps.

As for foreign policy, it's interesting that Iraq is not much of an issue. It may well haunt the next president. Roger Hearing, BBC, was saying that many people in Iraq fear there will be a 'next phase' in the sectarian conflict, after the US is clearly on the way out.

It's hard to see how anyone changes the health care system. The candidates are quibbling about details. The real crunch would be as Medicare funding fails, or if global recession really hits.

It's curious to watch Ron Paul on Meet the Press. No guy has a more limited vision of America. He's basically rejecting that vast, strong, hegemonic government for something entirely different. But if Iraq were to implode, while the mortgage crisis worsened? With more severe economic hardship, and foreign policy failure, it might be a message that gets co-opted by one of the parties.

Paul seems to be the only candidate to implement an actual policy, based on the notion this is a critical time for America. The rest of the candidates say that, but it's clear they barely do more than nudge the fairly obvious potential changes out there.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Dickie Flatts, Charlotte, NC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:56:08 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

Shadow, Hamden, CT — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:56:21 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

csh, IL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:58:13 GMT

How come there is no mention of the new poll by the American Research Group that shows Hillary leading Obama in Iowa by 15 points – 19% to 34%? Surely this counts as news and reflects momentum for Hillary.

Guess it just doesn’t fit the MSNBC/Chris Matthews storyline/fantasy that Hillary’s campaign is imploding.

First thoughts: Eight days out

David Anders Pharr, Tx. — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:00:25 GMT

tHE TOP THREE IN THE DEMOCRATS IS A JOKE, CLINTON THE COMMUNIST, OBAMBA THE BABY, AND EDWARDS THE MOST FAR OUT LEFT WINGER BACKED BY SEAN PENN, HARRY BELLAFONTE UGGHHHHHHHH.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Richard, Clarksburg WV — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:06:46 GMT

S.K.M. - Like you I am a big believer in privacy. However, when a candidate claims experience they should have to show it, not lock away all the documents but claim they back her. If I can't prove it then I can't put it on my resume, same goes for politicians - they can't claim what they can't prove to have done. It is about time (though kind of late in the game if you ask me) that a newspaper has finally gotten around to looking into the claims made by the junior Senator from New York. Of course don't expect Senator Clinton to acknowledge the substance of the story, it will be yet another "vast right wing conspiracy" that is out to get her. She will go on claiming all sorts of experience (this is called a lie to those that don't understand how these things go).

First thoughts: Eight days out

Maddog, Charlotte, NC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:11:17 GMT

Great article...Hillary needs to stop trying to rewrite history as a co-presidency.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Earl Biegert, Hamilton, Ohio — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:21:19 GMT

Shadow, Hamden, CT...John B, Des Moines, IA...S.K.M. Mass...Sierra, SF
I am a lifelong Democrat who would-have voted for our party's canidate (no matter who it was), before I started reading your vicious, vitriolic, hate filled posts about Mrs. Clinton, and The Clinton Family. (Over the Christmas Holiday too!)
But, now I have to say that I wouldn't vote for Obama to be dog catcher of my town, if you are the kind of people he represents.
In fact, I have never done so before; but, I will vote Republican if Obama is the nominee. There are a lot of other people who feel the same way too.
Obama and you are alienating us.
This is the kind of thing Bush pulled before he was elected.
It isn't, and shouldn't be indicative of how a Democrat conducts himself.
So, there it is. You've turned a lifelong Democrat into someone who'll vote Republican if Obama gets the nomination.
You are mean spirited, pugnacious, and politically-blood-thirsty people with whom I don't want my party's ideology affiliated.
If Obama is the Democratic nominee, I will vote aginst him and I will encourage other Democrats to do the same...and you have nobody, but yourselves to thank for that.
Merry Christmas

First thoughts: Eight days out

sg, michigan — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:22:32 GMT

Hillary Clinton is walking a very fine line indeed.

She touts her experience by association with her husband. If so, would that mean Monica Lewinsky also has experience to run this country? Would Jennifer Flowers have experience to be governor of Arkansas?

But if she really did earn hands-on experience during Bill's presidency, wouldn't the two-term limit apply to her too?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Suzanne, Roswell, GA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:23:14 GMT

OK, it is becoming more and more obvious that all of this talk by Hillary about her vast experience gained from being First Lady is just that - talk. The NY Times points out that she had no security clearance, did not attend National Security Council meetings, and was not shown daily intelligence briefings. She did not assert herself on Somalia, Haiti, or Rwanda. Oh, and the one domestic task she WAS given sole proprietorship over - reforming health care - was a complete flop. She proved she could not bring opposing health care interests together, nor could she bring congressional Democrats and Republicans together. So, what IS this vast experience she gained from being First Lady? Methinks the empress has no clothes.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Pat, Boston, MA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:25:18 GMT

Just an observation from someone who will probably vote for Barack Obama in the MA primaries:

Hillary Clinton is an extremely intelligent, popular Senator in New York. There is no reason why she can't run on her own merits. She needn't run as an ex-first lady or wife of a former President. She's a good Senator and should win or lose on her own. I believe her husband and campaign managers are doing her a great disservice. They are not helping her, they are hurting her.

I have always liked Bill Clinton, but I believe Hillary Clinton can do this on her own. I would admire her more if she did.

Senator Clinton: You are being scrutized much more than any other candidate. Forget about your "experience" as first lady. Run on your experience as a New York Senator. You are a very popular senator there. Talk about that. If possible, rise above the Karl Rove-like campaign. It's hurting you.

I have been watching and listening to you for many years and to me, you are one remarkable woman. Now is the time to show it.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ron, TX — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:25:59 GMT

I'm glad a journalist finally had the strength to come out and expose Hillary Clinton's "experience" claims. What a joke!

Expect Clinton to respond by saying that all evidence of her experience is well-qualified, locked up in the Clinton, but is being released as soon as possible, just AFTER she gets elected!

Im not willing to take that kind of risk. I want to go with someone who has already proven to have GOOD JUDGMENT. Barack Obama is my candidate.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Sierra, SF — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:38:23 GMT

'...“Mrs. Clinton did not hold a security clearance. She did not attend National Security Council meetings. She was not given a copy of the president’s daily intelligence briefing. She did not assert herself on the crises in Somalia, Haiti and Rwanda."...'

WHAT EXPERIENCE ?
Nice try, Hillary
But, the truth is your mortal enemy.....

Maybe you should open up those White House archives and show us what you did as First Lady
What do you have to hide, Hillary ?
15 years of dishonesty, scandals and divisiveness...

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mary Anne, Potomac, MD — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:39:43 GMT

Chuck Todd - Why are you pushing John Edwards chances so much? Is it because your wife is working for John McCain, and now that you see Hillary is slipping and Obama is surging in Iowa, you and she are hoping Edwards wins in Iowa, so that the Independents in NH will go for McCain, and not Obama? You are supposed to be neutral and fair. Your bias against Obama is really showing. I'm very disappointed, as when you announced last spring that your wife worked for McCain, I thought it would be tough for you to remain unbiased and up until the last few weeks you had been. But it is so evident that you don't want Obama to win. Very unprofessional.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Robert Jorgenson, Salt Lake City, Utah — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:42:11 GMT

Mitt Romney,

Or should I say Flip Flopper Romney!

Mitt Romney's Flip Flop Record

ABORTION

From the Left:

Romney ran against Senator Edward M. Kennedy in 1994. During a debate, Romney declared: "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country. I have since the time that my mom took that position when she ran in 1970 as a US Senate candidate. I believe that since Roe v. Wade has been the law for 20 years we should sustain and support it."
- Boston Globe, March 2, 2006

"I respect and will protect a woman's right to choose."
-2002 Questionnaire for the National Abortion Rights Action League (NARAL)
Boston Globe, July 3, 2005

From the Right:

"I am pro-life. I believe that abortion is the wrong choice except in cases of incest, rape, and to save the life of the mother. I wish the people of America agreed, and that the laws of our nation could reflect that view. But while the nation remains so divided over abortion, I believe that the states, through the democratic process, should determine their own abortion laws and not have them dictated by judicial mandate."
- Boston Globe, Op-Ed, July 26, 2005

More from the Right:

"Every decision I have made as Governor in a very liberal state has been on the side of favoring life." – Governor Romney

- Robert Behre, "Romney Gets S.C. Support," Charleston Post-Courier, January 30, 2007

STEM CELL RESEARCH

From the Left:

"Romney has decided to support experimentation on surplus frozen embryos from in-vitro fertilization procedures."
- National Review Online, February 11, 2005

"At a campaign appearance at Brandeis University in June 2002, Romney strongly endorsed stem cell research."
- Boston Globe, December 17, 2006 Read the article

From the Center:

"Governor Mitt Romney set off a storm of criticism yesterday after he declared in a published interview that he favored banning a specific type of stem cell research. Scientists and the leader of the state Senate accused him of trying to block a promising avenue of research, even as antiabortion groups assailed him for declaring that he did not object to stem cell research involving embryos from fertility clinics."
- Boston Globe, February 11, 2005 Read the article

From the Right:

"I studied the issue for many months, and entered into conversation with experts from across the nation who were looking for consensus solutions, like Stanford's Dr. William Hurlbut. In the end, I became persuaded that the stem-cell debate was grounded in a false premise, and that the way through it was around it: by the use of scientific techniques that could produce the equivalent of embryonic stem cells but without cloning, creating, harming, or destroying developing human lives."
- Governor Mitt Romney, Op-Ed, "A Stem-Cell Solution," National Review Online, June 15, 2007

EMERGENCY CONTRACEPTION

From the Left:

"When he ran for governor in 2002, Romney said he supported expanding access to the emergency contraception pill, a high dose of hormones that women can take to prevent pregnancy up to five days after sex . . . On a questionnaire Planned Parenthood gave to the gubernatorial candidates in 2002, Romney answered 'yes' to the question, 'Do you support efforts to increase access to emergency contraception?' "
- Boston Globe, July 7, 2005

From the Right:

"Yesterday I vetoed a bill that the Legislature forwarded to my desk. Though described by its sponsors as a measure relating to contraception, there is more to it than that. The bill does not involve only the prevention of conception: The drug it authorizes would also terminate life after conception."
- Governor Mitt Romney, Op-Ed, "Why I Vetoed The Contraception Bill," Boston Globe, July 26, 2005 Read the article

GAY RIGHTS

From the Left:

"All citizens deserve equal rights, regardless of their sexual orientation. While he does not support gay marriage, Mitt Romney believes domestic partnership status should be recognized in a way that includes the potential for health benefits and rights of survivorship."
- Romney's 2002 campaign website

"Mitt and Kerry Wish You a Great Pride Weekend! All citizens deserve equal rights, regardless of their sexual preference"
- A flier handed out at "Gay Pride" by the Romney/Healey Campaign See the flier here

"We have discussed a number of important issues such as the Federal Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA), which I have agreed to co-sponsor, and if possible broaden to include housing and credit, and a bill to create a federal panel to find ways to reduce gay and lesbian youth suicide, which I also support. One issue I want to clarify concerns [grammar in context] President Clinton's "don't ask, don't tell, don't pursue" military policy. I believe that the Clinton compromise was a step in the right direction. I am also convinced that it is the first of a number of steps that will ultimately lead to gays and lesbians being able to serve openly and honestly in our nation's military. That goal will only be reached when preventing discrimination against gays and lesbians is a mainstream concern, which is a goal we share…"
- Governor Romney letter to Log Cabin Republicans, October 6, 1994 Read the letter here

From the Right:

Lopez: "And what about the 1994 letter to the Log Cabin Republicans where you indicated you would support the Federal Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA) and seemed open to changing the "don't ask, don't tell" policy in the military? Are those your positions today?

Gov. Romney: "No. I don't see the need for new or special legislation. My experience over the past several years as governor has convinced me that ENDA would be an overly broad law that would open a litigation floodgate and unfairly penalize employers at the hands of activist judges...As for military policy and the 'don't ask, don't tell' policy, I trust the counsel of those in uniform who have set these policies over a dozen years ago. I agree with President Bush's decision to maintain this policy and I would do the same."
- Interview with National Review, December 14, 2006 Read the interview

MARRIAGE AMENDMENT

From the Left:

In 2002, before the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court declared same-sex marriage protected by the Constitution, Romney denounced as "too extreme" the effort by pro-family groups to enact a preemptive state Marriage Protection Amendment prohibiting homosexual marriage, civil unions and same-sex public employee benefits.
- Boston Phoenix, May 14-20, 2004

From the Right:

MSNBC's Joe Scarborough: "Do you support a national constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage?"

Governor Romney: "Boy, I sure do. You know, that's a topic that's really, I think, very important to the country because marriage is not just about adults. Marriage is about the development and nurturing of kids, and in my view, the development of a child is enhanced by having a mom and dad. And so, I think it's very important that we have a national standard because marriage is a status. You get married in one place and then you move to another, you're still married at least in the eyes of the community and the children and the benefits may not follow you, but ultimately we're going to have one standard of marriage in this country and that standard ought to be one man and one woman."
- MSNBC's "Morning Joe" September 17, 2007

GUN RIGHTS

From the Left:

"He [Romney] is a supporter of the federal assault weapons ban."
- Romney 2002 campaign website

More from the Left:

In his 1994 US Senate run, Romney backed two gun-control measures strongly opposed by the National Rifle Association and other gun-rights groups: the Brady Bill, which imposed a five-day waiting period on gun sales, and a ban on certain assault weapons.

"That's not going to make me the hero of the NRA," Romney told the Boston Herald in 1994.

At another campaign stop that year, he told reporters: "I don't line up with the NRA."
- Boston Globe, January 14, 2007 Read the article

From the Right:

"Americans should have the right to own and possess firearms as guaranteed under the U.S. Constitution," said Governor Romney. "I'm proud to be among the many decent, law-abiding men and women who safely use firearms."
- Governor Romney, News Release, January 12, 2007

WAITING PERIODS FOR GUNS

From the Left:

Regarding the Brady Bill which required waiting periods to buy a handgun, Romney stated, "I don't think [the waiting period] will have a massive effect on crime but I think it will have a positive effect."
- Boston Herald, August 1, 1994

From the Right:

"Romney says he still backs the ban on assault weapons, but he won't say whether he stands by the Brady Bill. And after the gun show tour, his campaign declined to say whether he would still describe himself as a supporter of tough gun laws."
- Boston Globe, January 14, 2007 Read the article

MINIMUM WAGE INCREASE

From the Left:

"The minimum wage is important to our economy and Mitt Romney supports minimum wage increase, at least in line with inflation."
- Romney 2002 campaign website

From the Right:

Governor Mitt Romney yesterday rejected the Legislature's plan to raise the state minimum wage to $8 an hour over two years, angering Democratic lawmakers and advocates who accused him of abandoning a 2002 campaign pledge to significantly boost the pay of low-wage workers.
- Boston Globe, July 22, 2006 Read the article

EDUCATION

During his 1994 campaign for Senate he continually called for the abolishment of the Department of Education.
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

Governor Romney now supports the No Child Left Behind Act.
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

IMMIGRATION

From the Left:

In a November 2005 interview with the Boston Globe, Romney described immigration proposals by McCain and others as "quite different" from amnesty, because they required illegal immigrants to register with the government, work for years, pay taxes, not take public benefits, and pay a fine before applying for citizenship.

"That's very different than amnesty, where you literally say, 'OK, everybody here gets to stay,' " Romney said in the interview. "It's saying you could work your way into becoming a legal resident of the country by working here without taking benefits and then applying and then paying a fine."

Romney did not specifically endorse McCain's bill, saying he had not yet formulated a full position on immigration. But he did speak approvingly of efforts by McCain and Bush to solve the nation's immigration crisis, calling them "reasonable proposals."

Romney also said in the interview that it was not "practical or economic for the country" to deport the estimated 12 million immigrants living in the US illegally. "These people contribute in many cases to our economy and to our society," he said. "In some cases, they do not. But that's a whole group we're going to have to determine how to deal with."
- Boston Globe, March 16, 2007 Read the article

From the Right:

In his appeals to conservative voters, Romney has made the Arizona senator's work on immigration one of his favorite targets. When McCain and other senators unveiled the latest reform bill two weeks ago, Romney called it the "wrong approach" and immediately launched a television ad slamming "amnesty" for illegal immigrants.
- Boston Globe, June 1, 2007 Read the article

TAXES

From the Left:

"Governor Romney…imposed a slew of fee hikes and tax 'loophole' closures….The largest of these was $259 million worth of fee hikes in FY 2004, the bulk of which came from higher Registry of Deeds fees. Smaller fee hikes, including higher charges for boaters and golfers, we imposed in FY 2003 and FY 2005. Romney also sought $128 million worth of so-called tax loophole closures for FY 2004; $70 million for FY 2005; and $170 million for FY 2006, which were later reduced to $85 million due to backlash from business leaders."
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

"Romney continues to oppose the flat tax with harsh language, calling the tax 'unfair.'"
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

Romney didn't support President Bush's tax cuts in 2003. That earned him praise from liberal Congressman Barney Frank (D-MA)
- Boston Globe, April 11, 2003.

From the Right:

"I said no to a tax hike; raising taxes hurts working people and scares away jobs. I also said no to more borrowing; borrowing just shifts our problems to the backs of our kids...Instead, I went after waste, inefficiency, duplication, and patronage."
- Governor Romney, Boston Globe, October 24, 2005

NO NEW TAXES PLEDGE

From the Left:

In 2002, Romney broke with his predecessor, Jane Swift, and Republican governors before her by declining to sign a written vow not to raise taxes once in office.

- Boston Globe, January 5, 2007 Read the article

From the Right:

Almost five years after he refused to sign a "no new taxes" pledge during his campaign for governor, Mitt Romney announced yesterday that he had done just that, as his campaign for the 2008 Republican presidential nomination began in earnest.
- Boston Globe, January 5, 2007 Read the article

CAMPAIGN FINANCE LAWS

From the Left:

Governor Romney has changed his position on key campaign finance reform issues several times during public life. During his 1994 Senate campaign, he held far left positions that advocated for abolishing PACs and creating strict campaign spending limits.

- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

From the Right:

As he runs for President, Romney abandoned his previous stance and has come out as a harsh critic of McCain-Feingold, and those presidential candidates who support it. His transformation has even propelled him to call for the legislation's repeal.
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

ON HIS FAVORITE BOOK

From the Left:

He told Fox News his favorite book is L. Ron Hubbard's "Battlefield Earth"

From the Right:

He also told Fox news his favorite book is the The Bible

Or

Who Knows:

His MySpace page said his favorite book is "Huckleberry Finn"

Read more news articles on Mitt Romney's Record
Watch a video from Mitt Romney's 1994 debate with Sen. Ted Kennedy (D-MA)

First thoughts: Eight days out

David, Tallahassee FL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:43:57 GMT

Re: Guiliani's Florida strategy:
Perhaps someone should inform Mr. Guiliani that only half of Florida's delegates will count at the Republican convention.

First thoughts: Eight days out

eNews Reference — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:44:58 GMT

I think Romney and Pauls campaigns are in trouble... http://www.enewsreference.wordpress.com

First thoughts: Eight days out

James, Denver, CO — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:45:24 GMT

If being 1st lady is a qualification to run by that logic Laura Bush should be good to go right?

HRC has done some time in the Senate but historically the more time spent in the Senate translates to less electability. In the Senate hard compromises are needed that over time erode a candidate's sense of who they really are. I say the experience meme for Hillary is officially overblown and her voting record is indefensible...

First thoughts: Eight days out

Tim, CT — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:48:55 GMT

I'm curious...

If Ric Flair is worth a front page post, then is Kane?

http://people.ronpaul2008.com/endorsements/2007/12/19/glenn-jacobs/

And since Flair (and your beloved Chuck Norris) has been mentioned on MSNBC between 5-8pm... then I presume you'll be announcing this endorsement as well? I'm assuming that you didn't know of this endorsement. But now that you do... you'll be broadcasting it far and wide, right?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Carmen Ovalles — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:49:37 GMT

My God. I am not an American, so I dont vote. But looking at the way the americans attact this women, she has to be really tuff to stand so much. Mr. Obama, has no foreign policy experience at all unless we take his trip to Indonesia at 10 years old as experience.

All the news I hear via fox, cnn, nbc, ect...thru the cabel tv in my country. Are all attacking this person, If you guys would become more inpartial in your judgments you would make the world a lot more safer. And you would try to regain your roll as a Counrty with some values and intelligence.

I am looking forward to read Mr. Obamas, Mr. Mckains, Mr. Roomny, Mr. Huck, Mr. Edwards and all others resume. In a more partial way. Hope you guys really make a good choice this time, because every time you elect a bad president all the world is affected.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Sierra, SF — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:51:17 GMT

From CNN Raw politics for Thursday 12/20/07:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0712/20/acd.01.html

'... want to read you something that "TIME" magazine's editor at large mentioned to "The Washington Post," Mark Halperin. He said: "She's just held to a different standard in every respect. The press rooted for Obama to go negative. When he did, he was applauded. When she does it, it's treated as this huge violation of propriety. It's not a level playing field."

JENNIFER DONAHUE, SENIOR ADVISER FOR POLITICAL
AFFAIRS, NEW HAMPSHIRE INSTITUTE OF POLITICS AT SAINT
ANSELM COLLEGE:
Well, they're doing it in an entirely
different way.

When Barack Obama went negative on Hillary Clinton, he did it after Edwards did, first of all,. He grilled it and got it ready. And then Obama flipped it, and he basically did it in a way that was policy-based, issue-based.

What Kerry did the other day and what happened last
week on the drug issue with Shaheen, and, moreover,
with Mark Penn, who then kept repeating it over and
over and over, they're playing the race card. This is
not some small thing where they're saying, like Gore
did about Bradley in 2000, he wanted to raise the
retirement age, when, in fact, he didn't.

This is the race card. They're attacking his race. And I think it's really above the pale. Voters here don't like it.

COOPER: David Gergen, do you agree with that?

GERGEN: No, I don't, I don't think they're playing the race card at all. He happens to be black. He also
happens to be a very major, dramatic candidate.

(CROSSTALK)

DONAHUE: You don't think that saying that -- that --
that selling drugs, and that, did he buy it, did he
use them, did he sell them, has anything to do with
race?

GERGEN: Wait a minute. We went through a whole
campaign back in 2000 in New Hampshire about George
Bush and drugs, and he happened to be white.

We have had various other candidates who happened to
have been white, there have been questions raised
about their drug usage. I do think, when you start
using the word cocaine, as Mark Penn did, it does
suggest it, and I think it can have some
reverberations.

But I think it is unfair to say that they're playing
the race card. I do think they have been clumsy, but I think they're -- playing the race card suggests it's racially motivated and, in effect, it's racist. I think that's unfair to them.

COOPER: John King?

DONAHUE: Well, I guess -- if I could just really
quickly...

KING: Anderson, I'm getting e-mails -- as we're having this discussion, Anderson -- as we're having this discussion, I'm getting e-mails from Democrats. One of them suggests, go to the Web site
hillaryattacksbarackobama.com. They say that is an
Obama Web site. I can't tell you if that is true or
not.

But this is the kind of thing that happens at this
point in a campaign. The Clinton campaign would also
point out, very early in the campaign, an Obama press
release said, "Hillary Clinton D-Punjab," making fun
of the money she was raising from Indian sources that
the Obama campaign was questioning. Senator Obama had
to apologize for that.

So, there's a lot of this from all camps in the
campaign, some of it authorized, some of it not, some
of it done by kids who go overboard in their first
campaign, especially their first presidential
campaign.

But does it matter in electing a president? I don't
really know. It's not much about the economy. It's not much about what you do in Iraq.

(CROSSTALK)

KING: But it does set the tone of the campaign.

COOPER: Jennifer?

DONAHUE: Anderson, can I just jump in? Because I want
to hear David's perspective.

I mean, would you also say, then, that Huckabee is not playing the religion card against Romney?

GERGEN: No, I think he is playing the religion card.

But that's -- that's said in a positive way. But I
think, when you say somebody is playing a race card,
you suggest that they have racist motives and they
have a racist quality to them.

DONAHUE: I don't -- well, I guess I don't...

GERGEN: I think that's unfair to the people involved.

DONAHUE: They're trying to -- but don't you think -- I don't mean that Hillary Clinton is trying to play a
race card, but I think that they're bringing up the
issue of fear of African-Americans in a way that is
either intentional or not, but is real....'

From CNN on Thursday night.....

First thoughts: Eight days out

Dickie Flatts, Charlotte, NC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 15:52:18 GMT

If you want to believe thaty Hillary is inexperienced what does that make Obama or Edwards? Total puppies?

Fact is Clinton met more world leaders in one year as First Lady then Edwards and Obama have met in their lives - combined.

The fact is that Clinton has accomplished more in the Senate than either of them.

The fact is Clinton has been working in politics longer - with more results - than either of them.

If you watch the foreign policy segements of the debates, there is no question is the top candidate in the race when it comes to foreign policy and national security -- it is Hillary Clinton.

First thoughts: Eight days out

James A. Butler — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:00:33 GMT

When it's all said and done, the fluff that is Barak Obama will become aparent. He has as much chance of becoming President as Ross Perot did.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Pat Huntington NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:00:39 GMT

Hillary would have been better served if she stayed in the US Senate a bit longer, waited until NY Gov. Spitzer's first term was over, primary him and win because of his unpopularity, and become NY's first woman governor. Then, springboard from there to become the US's first female president. Then, all this experience talk, first lady nonsense, and the unelectability of a US senator, would be moot.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ernest, MIA, FL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:02:09 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

Thomas, little rock, arkansas — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:07:09 GMT

I refer to the POST BY Earl Biegert, Hamilton, Ohio (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 10:21 AM)

Thank you Earl for saying exactly what I feel. I would never vote for someone like Obama.
His supporters all do appear to be young and in their twenties for the most part and we all know those people are irresponsible and don't vote.

Obama won't win, but if by some fluke he did win the nomination I would be hoping for Michael Bloomberg and Chuck Hagel to form an independent ticket and I would support them. All of the Republican candidates are badly flawed, and have some major reason I could not vote for any of them either but I too would not vote for Obama, Imagine President Hussein Obama, I cannot.
We have good Democrat candidates all but Obama, Kucinich and Gravel. I could support any of the rest of them but my favorite is Senator Clinton.

Even if she does lose Iowa she is way ahead nationally.
I just did a straw poll on AOL this morning and she was 19 points ahead of Obama and it showed all of the states too. She was ahead in Iowa and NH in that straw poll too.
I feel confident that she will win but in the meantime we will just have to put up with these stupid bashers on this blog and Chris Matthews blasting her. He is worse than Fox news. She's great and she was first lady of both Arkansas and America, is a lawyer and has been in the Senate now for 6 years and furthermore having Bill Clinton as her advisor is invaluable to this country. We need the Clintons to pull this country back together again after the disasterous Bush years.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Hypothisis — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:07:34 GMT

The equation is really quite simple... If you want what has always been, vote for those who always were. If you want what can be but, never was, vote that way. If you want a combination of the two, because you are as most, afraid of change, you will vote the former. Sad because (with the exception of God himself)which never changes, will surely become extinct.

First thoughts: Eight days out

jerry/corpus christi texas — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:09:18 GMT

Hillary Clinton met more world leaders in one year as a first lady than Edwards and Obama - combined - have met in their entire lives. There is real experience there.

Dickie Flatts:
Can you show us one article or one piece of undenible proof that Hillary sent Bill back to the oval office while she sat down and discussed issues with these world leaders???????

“America faces a war abroad and a troubled economy at home -- critical moments that demand a President who is tested, ready to lead on Day 1 and offers real solutions to the big challenges we face. And that person is Hillary Clinton.”

Unless Hillary was the main planner in Somilia when Blackhawks were being shot out of the sky, someone really needs to explain how sitting behind her husband gives her the right to call herself "battle tested". There is no proof she is "battle tested" and for her campaing to make assumptions like that is just laughbale. No wonder Barrock is taking over in the race.

She touts her experience by association with her husband. If so, would that mean Monica Lewinsky also has experience to run this country? Would Jennifer Flowers have experience to be governor of Arkansas?

According to the book on the impeachment of Bill Clinotn, Monica was in the room when Bill took a phone call from the Israeli prime minister....
That, according to the Clinton campaign, would give Monica foreign policy experience.....

First thoughts: Eight days out

Elizabeth, Waukesha, Wisconsin — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:09:24 GMT

Being the first lady should never have been used as Hillary's "experience." However, she is in a double bind. Without her husband and his name recognition, it's unlikely she would even be a NY senator. It's also unlikely she'd be a top presidential contender without the recognition she's earned as a former first lady. She can't discount Bill, but her "experience" with him does not qualify her for the presidency.

The other aspect that disturbs me is that people didn't vote for Hillary. They voted for her husband. The spouse of a president should NOT be setting policy or even suggesting it. There should be legislation ensuring that presidential spouses are not given access to private information. They haven't earned the right to this information any more than an average citizen, and it is just plain wrong to vote for one person and get the advice and power of his/her spouse.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Shadow, Hamden, CT — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:10:39 GMT

Yes, Earl, that's very believable; I'm sure that my post at the top of this thread, in which I display preference for no candidate, is the reason you're not voting for Obama in the general, and that you would have voted for him otherwise.

First thoughts: Eight days out

csh, IL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:22:48 GMT

Where is the story on the new poll out today having Hillary up by 15 in Iowa. Why is it anytime there is a poll showing Obama up, we have it up within seconds, whether it looks like an outlier or not but when it's Hillary who's up, there is no mention of it?

Ernest – good question. I think it’s because MSNBC, led by the raving, ranting lunatic Chris Matthews (the host of Hardball) decided about 2 months ago that they wanted Obama to win. So any good news about Hillary goes unreported while Obama’s chances are hyped – even in the face of national polls which continually show Hillary with a 20-30 point lead.

In other words, MSNBC is about as reputable lately as FOX.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Elizabeth, West Bend, Wisconsin — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:25:46 GMT

Ernest: The new poll you mention is based on data from the American Research Group. Their polls are notoriously inaccurate. However, there is mention of the poll in several online news sites, so I don't think the story is being buried.

First thoughts: Eight days out

MK,MO — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:26:41 GMT

Earl Biegert, Hamilton, Ohio /

some people don't like to hear the truth about hillary, the clinton's are arrogant, elitist, devious, self-serving trash who's sole purpose is to see that the status quo is maintained in d.c., they offer the american public nothing but more of the same, they deserve nobody's respect, you sir are surely a fool if you look at them in any other manner

First thoughts: Eight days out

Kevin, Rehoboth Beach — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:26:42 GMT

Sierra, SF

Do you do ANYTHING other than "cut and paste" all freaking day long. For those of us with an IQ greater than double digits, we don't appreciate to have to scroll ad nauseum through your swill to get to the next post that isn't the nonsensical ramblings of someone seriously deranged.

I didn't realize one of the nicest things about the holidays was that you weren't posting for two whole days - whatever did you do with yourself? I hope you didn't have to go around kicking any cats or knocking over old ladies to give you some Christmas cheer!

But now the holidiays are over and you can get back to your bitter, hating ways! What a life!

HILLARY and BILLARY '08

Can't wait to see the latest from Van!!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Erin13, NY, NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:27:10 GMT

Response to Pat in Boston:
<<"Hillary Clinton is an extremely intelligent, popular Senator in New York.">>

Well, Senator Clinton may be FROM New York, but many of us here in Manhattan we don't actually think of her as either intelligent or popular.

First thoughts: Eight days out

John — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:28:01 GMT

Let's see former president Clinton says his wife is a world class genius. This coming from a guy who brought us the Whitewater scandal, Filegate, Travelgate,Paula Jones, Catherine Willy, Vince Foster's suspicious demise, the Lewinsky scandal, a new use for cigars and then perjured himself under oath. Not to mention his timely bombings of a Chinese embassy building (by accident), a baby formula factory in Somolia, an abandoned terrorist camp in the Middle East just when major scandals about him were to be front page news. Do we really need more of this? I hope we as a nation are smarter than that!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Nashville_fan — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:28:42 GMT

Earl Biegert wrote:
You are mean spirited, pugnacious, and politically-blood-thirsty people with whom I don't want my party's ideology affiliated.

__________

It is sad to see people let someone on a message board bully them into any opinion. Please sir, vote based on what and who you believe in, and let that vote speak for itself.

Also I would add, it is interesting that things are only considered out of hand when it is our preferred candidate on the receiving end. Otherwise, all topics are considered a part of necessary "vetting" . . . what a curious double standard.

First thoughts: Eight days out

virgil, Las Vegas, NV — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:31:57 GMT

I choose to trust the common sense of the people in Iowa! Don't just "Take a look", but vote or Joe Biden!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Richard, Clarksburg WV — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:33:59 GMT

Dickie Flatts, Charlotte, NC - "If you want to believe thaty Hillary is inexperienced what does that make Obama or Edwards? Total puppies?

Fact is Clinton met more world leaders in one year as First Lady then Edwards and Obama have met in their lives - combined.

The fact is that Clinton has accomplished more in the Senate than either of them.

The fact is Clinton has been working in politics longer - with more results - than either of them.

If you watch the foreign policy segements of the debates, there is no question is the top candidate in the race when it comes to foreign policy and national security -- it is Hillary Clinton."

Spoken like a die hard Senator Clinton fan. By your way of thinking having tea with the wives of other nation's leaders equates into having foriegn policy experience. I am not bashing Senator Clinton here, rather just saying that she was not in any real meaningful discussion with the leaders of all those nations while she was traveling. I would be happy to hear what great pieces of legislation she has authored and passed while in the Senate though. I really would. So please let me know what all she really has accomplished.

First thoughts: Eight days out

virgil, Las Vegas, NV — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:34:30 GMT

If the GOP wants to keep the White House, the BEST thing they can do is keep Clinton and Obama in the fore-front and headlines.

First thoughts: Eight days out

--nsmsnbc — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:36:39 GMT

[Then, all this experience talk, first lady nonsense, and the unelectability of a US senator, would be moot.
Pat Huntington NY]
--Pat, you seem to be saying some very smart things today. The only problem is that she didn't do any of that, so it is not currently moot. I believe that she and Bill had one goal when running for U.S. Senate (NY), and that was to eventually run for U.S. President. I'm up in the air about their marriage, but if they had to wait another 8 years to run ...?

First thoughts: Eight days out

PulSamsara — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:36:54 GMT

Barack Obama for President.

It's time for America to Rise and Shine again.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K, Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:39:01 GMT

Hillary Clinton met more world leaders in one year as a first lady than Edwards and Obama - combined - have met in their entire lives. There is real experience there.

Clinton on occasion also attended cabinet meetings, and according to Bob Woodward's book, 'The Agenda' was involved on the formulation of economic policy early in the Clinton Presidency. A policy that laid the foundation for the excellent economic condiditions that followed.

What is Obama's experience? What do we really even know about the guy? Who are his friends? What is he hiding?
Dickie Flatts, Charlotte, NC (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 9:56 AM)

-------------

Oh give me a f--king break, already. Read the NYT article and see that other than really shaking hands with the leaders, she never sat in on any high level meetings here or abroad. Shaking hands with a leader and sitting down for top level negotiations are two entirely different things. The prior is what Hillary did. The latter is what Bill did. Bill has experience. Hillary has jack squat to offer other than her frequent flier miles on the trips she took with Bill.

First thoughts: Eight days out

MK,MO — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:39:10 GMT

Ernest, MIA, FL / Where is the story on the new poll out today having Hillary up by 15 in Iowa.

please, did mark penn poll some of hillary operatives, because that's the only way hillary could appear 15 points ahead, ridiculous although with clinton's corrupt political machine it wouldn't surprise me to see them try something criminal once again, it's their legacy after all

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jesse, Burnsville, MN — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:40:50 GMT

Earl from Ohio, I can guarantee you that I will NEVER, AND I MEAN EVER, vote for Hillary if she is the nominee. Any other Democrat wins the nomination, they will get my vote.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Paul, NY, NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:41:25 GMT

Response to Erin13
<<Well, Senator Clinton may be FROM New York, but many of us here in Manhattan we don't actually think of her as either intelligent or popular.
Erin13, NY, NY (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:27 AM)>>

Well, there's PLENTY more New Yorkers that think Hillary has been a very effective Senator for our great state - that's why she was re-elected in a landslide with 67% of the vote - even winning in typically Republican counties. So if you think that just 33% is a majority you need to buy a calculator.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Rick,ky — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:41:55 GMT

For all of those who may be considering voting for Hillary Clinton or John Edwards, I want to make a few point's as to why you should'nt. 1st of all, for any of you who may not think this Iraq debacle was'nt for OIL, you're living in La-La-Land.Since this debacle started, a barrel of oil has risen to 3 times the price of what is was before Iraq was Invaded.We were told by this administration, that Oil would Pay for this " The Worst Foreign Policy Decision" ever.For all the Hatred towards America in the past, the World was in our hands because of 911. With the right kinda Leadership, America had the chance to bring the World together as 1 in the fight against those, that had a hand in 911.Go Shopping is what America was told to do! No 1 questioned our invasion of Afganistan to rid the Taliban who had harbored Bin Laden.The oppurtunity to capture Osama was passed onto those who were familiar with the land. The World's Best Miliatry was taken from this Hunt. WHY? LEADERSHIP is why!We as a Nation, MUST NOT REWARD those voices who helped lead us into Iraq, with the Highest office in the World, POTUS. They are Not deserving of our vote for POTUS, period.They can Apoligize (or Not), till Hell freezes over. It Should Not be mistaken for LEADERSHIP, more like Go along to Get along, without consideration for the long term effects, That decision was given.
So here we are, 6 years later, considering who we want to lead America forward.In my opinion, Clinton & Edwards should be Excluded from consideration for POTUS, because of the Blindness they showed back in 2002 when America needed them the Most.Hillary Clinton & John Edwards, Failed America with their Non-Leadership.

" DELUSIONAL THINKING BY COMMON SENSE AMERICAN'S IS OVER"

Barack Obama for President of the United states of America!

First thoughts: Eight days out

PulSamsara — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:42:26 GMT

Say no to Nepotism in the White House.
Because we a democracy -
Not a Monarchy.
Hasn't the past 7 years been enough ?

Say No to those who sent us to Iraq on false pretense in the first place ... that's you Clinton.

Barack Obama for President of the United States of America.

First thoughts: Eight days out

modernwoman, Anytown,USA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 16:55:04 GMT

here's the latest betting odds (USBet.com)for Iowa:

Barack Obama -140
Hillary Clinton EVEN
Chris Dodd +2500
Bill Richardson +2500
Joe Biden +3500

No odds given for John Edwards....hmmm...very interesting!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jamal, los angeles, ca — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:17:21 GMT

You guys should read the newsweek article on hilarys experience, it totally debunks msnbc's article!

I LOVE HILARY! GO HILARY!!! CLINTON 08!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Robert Houston, TX — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:18:27 GMT

It serves the Unites States justice that of the two top contenders in Iowa- one is ashamed to use his middle name, was right about one subject (the war) and wants to be President because he did great playing local kiss ass in Chicago. Another is in a huge scandal in Chapel Hill regarding a baby on the way with a mistress and while it is the rage in North Carolina- nobody wants to tackle it now nationally at Christmas. Not that it matters- Edwards will lose anyway- just funny how he is Mr. Family Values....... On the GOP side, the other joke is a liberal pastor former Gov- capturing the religious conservatives and weak minded fools who couldn't care less about his record- but like his smile and jokes. It's no wonder Huckabee made so much money when he was a pastor as has already been detailed in the Arkansas Little Rock Gazette. Then you have the ancient John McCain who would have been perfect in Dr. Strangelove- but he's the media darling- yet he can hardly turn his head or keep his cool. Then you have the reporters writing forever about every piece of Clinton gossip- yet they have made a career off of Bill & Hillary- so they are the biggest frauds-without the Clinton's-they would be doing horse racing or the horoscope. There is John Edwards whose claim to fame was barely beating a very old Senator named Lauch Faircloth (Faircloth was pulled over for DUI just before the election)- otherwise, he's a political loser and has been living in Iowa for 4 years and at best he's in a three way tie. Outside of Iowa- Edwards couldn't be elected dog catcher. With the writers on strike- Thompson has gone down the drain- I guess his campaign wasn't in the script- a huge flop. What a great field to choose from.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Terry, Disabled Vet, Des Moines, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:19:04 GMT

to all-----what this article points out is to be an informed voter we must look at all information and decifer it. We need not faux news or any news outlet to tell us what is real and what is fake. These candidates (I mean all) will tell us anyhting ( and I do mean anything) to get our vote. If you want to believe one or the other please do your own homework.

First thoughts: Eight days out

vanreuter, NY NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:23:28 GMT

Well, Senator Clinton may be FROM New York, but many of us here in Manhattan we don't actually think of her as either intelligent or popular.

Erin13, NY, NY (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:27 AM)

How many is, "many"?, Erin13? Senator Clinton won re-election in a LANDSLIDE, taking over 75% (SEVENTY-PERCENT!) of the vote in MANHATTAN (Where I live)and almost SEVENTY-PERCENT of the vote state-wide. When you say, "many of us", do you mean us REPUBLICANS? because when it comes to the democrats;

"Clinton's victory margin over her Republican opponent (67%-31%) was a significant gain over her showing in the 2000 senate race against Rick Lazio (55%-43%), and was the SECOND-largest margin of victory for a Senate race in New York HISTORY,[citation needed] and the third-largest for a statewide race in New York."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_United_States_Senate_Election,_2006#Election_results

Senator Clinton is much more popular in New York and especially in Manhattan, than you and the group of many you claim to speak for, based on the overwhelming margin of victory documented here.

Van

First thoughts: Eight days out

CitizenJ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:23:50 GMT

You guys should read the newsweek article on hilarys experience, it totally debunks msnbc's article!

I LOVE HILARY! GO HILARY!!! CLINTON 08!

Jamal, los angeles, ca (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 12:17 PM)

You love her so much you misspelled her name 3 times in 22-word post.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Robert Houston, Texas — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:25:01 GMT

Interesting points Richard, so what is your claim to fame for Obama? Having a middle name he is afraid to to use, playing Chicago politics in the state senate, or should Obama be President because Oprah loves him? And Edwards- outside of living in Iowa for 4 years and perhaps having a chnace to be elected dog catcher there- he's a loser and his only real victory was BARELY beating an ancient Republican named Lauch Faircloth- Edwards is a political loser- he should stick with court or his pregnant mistress. The press hates Hillary and will torture her on a daily basis- that is enough to brighten the day for any Republican. The Deocratic Congress was an even bigger flop than Bush-lol.

First thoughts: Eight days out

thomas, Little Rock, Arkansas — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:28:08 GMT

Way to go Kevin from Rehoboth Beach !!
Yeah that person Sierra is probably either on welfare or unemployment, what do you want to bet. Sierra and Van get a life or better still a job.
Also way to go csh from Il, posted as follows;
Ernest – good question. I think it’s because MSNBC, led by the raving, ranting lunatic Chris Matthews (the host of Hardball) decided about 2 months ago that they wanted Obama to win. So any good news about Hillary goes unreported while Obama’s chances are hyped – even in the face of national polls which continually show Hillary with a 20-30 point lead.

In other words, MSNBC is about as reputable lately as FOX.

csh, IL (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:22 AM)
<end post from csh>

You certainly described "Petro Head" lunatic Matthews right.
Have you ever noticed how he spits when he rants and raves. He is obsessed with taking Hilary down isn't he. gotta wonder why.
I used to like his show but cannot tolerate him anymore.
GO Hilary and Bilary 08

First thoughts: Eight days out

John B, Des Moines, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:29:00 GMT

Earl Biegert, I have no idea what you read from me that would give you the impression either that I am pushing Obama or that I hate Hillary. Neither is true. As further evidence please look at my first post on this thread. It's a statement that the extreme right will dump on HRC no matter what she does, which is blatantly unfair. Believe me I have my favorite right now, but I'll be solidly behind the eventual Democratic nominee. Any of the major contenders is hands down superior to anyone in the Republican field.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Willie Pearson, Phoenix, Arizona — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:36:17 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

Kathryn in Bham — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:38:26 GMT

In the context of bringing up Hillary Clinton's experience as White House spouse, I continue to wonder what role Bill would play should they call it home again. I am curious as to what role he would play in her administration and how the world would view their role. I agree that she was very active during her husband's years (although that experience does add to her resume, I don't think it counts as 'political' experience), so I wonder how the world would view them then. What would his influence be and would Hillary be truly viewed as the Commander in Chief or co-Commander?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Barbara C. Pompano Beach, FL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:40:21 GMT

You can continue to write, whine and remind all of us out there about "certain" Democrats running but hats to them.....at least they are out there campaigning their hearts out. With Giuliani - he thought he was so slick and maybe he can still pull it off, that he could miss the early states because of his "experience and name recognition". To Hillary's credit..and like her not...she is out there in the early states campaigning. I mention only Hillary because she and Rudy were considered the BIG MATCHUP in this election.

First thoughts: Eight days out

POLpursun — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:45:38 GMT

Playing the experience card

“America faces a war abroad and a troubled economy at home -- critical moments that demand a President who is tested, ready to lead on Day 1 and offers real solutions to the big challenges we face. And that person is Hillary Clinton."

The above is extracted from the input above to which these various comments apply. The quote is said to be from a statement just released by the Clinton campaign.

Succinctly, as previously said, the poor judgement, at critical junctures, informed by this vaunted experience dictates that it (the experience) should be significantly discounted.

Further, the following is a comment on a David Broder article [http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/outlook/5398557.html]

GreggHeacock wrote:
I have heard many speeches by Obama. His Labor Day speech in Manchester, New Hampshire, was inspiring. His Jefferson-Jackson Dinner speech in Iowa was defining. His present address, which I heard on December 10th in Los Angeles, was captivating. Broder is correct in comparing it to a Beethoven symphony. The speech is orchestrated for effect. When Barack tells people what we need to stand up for, the entire audience stands up. He doesn't even need to explain the origins, anymore, for "We're fired up and ready to go!" And, yes, his reference to King resonates strongly. When we ask, "What does this candidate bring to the table?," it is easy to recall King's vision of the sons of slaves and the sons of slave owners sitting at a common table, seeking what is best for
America's future. Obama promises to make King's dream a reality. That is what people hear when they are told to go out and change the world. His is an "Ode to Joy"!
12/23/2007 1:00 PM CST

The role of potus is, if properly conducted a leader role, NOT a manager role. Again, as previously proffered, there are only two ways to lead, by inspiration and by example, and they are not mutually exclusive. Mr. Heacock's comment clearly delineates the impact of the elements of the lead role. The inspiration is plain to "see"; the example of Obama's approach to this whole business is in clear contrast to the manipulation of the crass political calculation of the unattractive Clinton campaign, turned even more so when her coronation was perceived as threatened (and, good gracious, by whom!! ------ Ah! But it's judgement not experience).

You see, one LEADS people; one manages THINGS. Oftentimes, when people are "managed", what really happens is that they are manipulated.

Sen. Clinton: Leader or manager? --------- manager. And remember, she did not read the report which led Sen. Graham of Florida to vote against the Iraq fiasco.

Unless America wants, at core, more of the same, the January 2009 handover will involve a third family.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Fisa, Durant, Oklahoma — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:46:04 GMT

This message is from a neutral unbiased third-party observer:

Folks, earlier i had consistent doubts and fears about mr. Obama's ability to lead this nation and the rest of the world...but after a thorough research about mr. Obama's presidential character, i am now deeply convinced that mr. Barack Obama's got the right moral and intellectual substance for this 21st century.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K., Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:49:04 GMT

Where is the story on the new poll out today having Hillary up by 15 in Iowa. Why is it anytime there is a poll showing Obama up, we have it up within seconds, whether it looks like an outlier or not but when it's Hillary who's up, there is no mention of it?
Ernest, MIA, FL (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:02 AM)

---------------

The source of the poll isn't from a reputable pollster, perhaps? It didn't come from a news source or one of the Iowa papers or universities. Until then, it's meaningless.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:50:36 GMT

God only knows what will happen in Iowa, but Huck should look good when it's over on the Republican front.

Hillary may be the first candidate to lose in Iowa and New Hampshire and still still win the Democratic nomination. Think Florida 2000.

Expect Hillary Clinton to be inaugurated in January 2009.

It could be worse.

First thoughts: Eight days out

John M., San Diego, CA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:51:13 GMT

Hillary Clinton has no consisten message because she has no vision for where she wants to lead the country, no vision for what she wants America to be. She's great at getting the party machine in her camp, she's great at focus-testing positions and lines, and... that's about it.

First thoughts: Eight days out

John B, Des Moines, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:51:59 GMT

"I would never vote for someone like Obama.
His supporters all do appear to be young and in their twenties for the most part and we all know those people are irresponsible and don't vote." Not quite, my first vote was in the 1980 elections. I vote in every election including school board. Incidentally, I never said I was an Obama supporter and will caucus for Edwards. Fair is fair, however, and the "Obama is a Muslim" attacks are both unfair and dishonest. Additionally, don't count me in the group that thinks this whole thing comes out of the Clinton campaign. It originated with the right-wing media empire of Rev. Sun Myung Moon and has been propogated through the right wing smear machine...hardly friends of the Clintons.

"Obama won't win, but if by some fluke he did win the nomination I would be hoping for Michael Bloomberg and Chuck Hagel to form an independent ticket and I would support them." I hope you'd reconsider that. After all, without Ralph Nader the Florida recount fiasco would never have happened and we would never have President GW Bush. I know I'll get behind the Democratic nominee whoever that may be.
"We have good Democrat candidates..." We certainly do. If we can avoid infighting and the candidates run a smart strategy the Democrats will have a lock on the White House.

"...we will just have to put up with these stupid bashers on this blog..." Agreed but please do not lump me into that category. If you look at my history over time you will see that I have defended all of the top tier Democrats and thrown props to the others as well. The party hasn't had such a field of well-qualified, good choices for President within my adult lifetime. I can't help but be happy about that.

Thomas, little rock, arkansas (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:07 AM)

First thoughts: Eight days out

Sierra, SF — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:52:59 GMT

Dickie Flatts, Charlotte, NC: '...Clinton on occasion also attended cabinet meetings, and according to Bob Woodward's book, 'The Agenda' was involved on the formulation of economic policy early in the Clinton Presidency....'

Early in his term, Bill pushed through NAFTA on an unwilling Democratic Congress. He did it with Republicans and business oriented Democrats.

NAFTA has bee the biggest blow to organized labor and workers in the last 40 years !!
Think about it......
Ask for higher wages and the corporations threaten to move to Mexico
Manufacturing jobs moving to China...

Look at the meat packing industry in Iowa...
Those used to be high paying middle class jobs...
Now, those jobs are for illegal aliens, working for minimum wage...

Is THAT Hillary's doing ?
Is THAT the 'economic policy' she elped 'formulate' ?

It's GREAT policy for corporations.....
Not for workers

After the first few years of Clinton, we had the 1994 election with the 'angry white males'
They voted in a Republican majority in the House and Senate

Do we want repeat of that ?

Hillary Clinton has squandered a commanding lead in the Democratic race for the nomination....

Hillary Clinton went from 'inevitable' to borderline competitive...

If ditzy, disorganized Hillary can't run a primary campaign....

What will the Republicans do to her in the general election ?

It won't be pretty...

TURN THE PAGE
Obama/Edwards '08
A fighting chance to win

First thoughts: Eight days out

csh, IL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:56:01 GMT

Well, Senator Clinton may be FROM New York, but many of us here in Manhattan we don't actually think of her as either intelligent or popular. Erin 13

Well she won 67% of the vote for her re-election to the US Senate last year Erin. So, it looks like she's plenty popular in New York!

Oh - and breaking story - Hillary just named as THE Most Admired Woman in the World per the annual Gallup poll (www.gallup.com)- the 12th time she has won this annual designation.

Bet the haters won't like this poll either!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Willie Pearson, Phoenix, Arizona — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:58:06 GMT

Come on, Hillary would makea great president. She not only can talk the talk, but can walk the walk. Positive talk is great, but if not able to put talk into action, then it is useless. We have so many good Democratic candidates to choose from, lets get it done. Enough of George Bush.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Laura, St. Louis, MO — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:58:21 GMT

Obama lacks the experience, he will be ready in eight years. We need someone who can change this country in a positive way. We already got the same campaign from Bush, Obama claims he will bring everyone together, I don't think so. He will further divide this country.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Carrie, Eastern Iowa — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:58:52 GMT

Mike - Living in a third world country unsecluded for years and visiting a third world country for brief meetings are two very different things. If you think for a second that the latter is more relevant to understanding other cultures than the former, you are harboring the same sort of ignorance that allowed America to go into Iraq as "revenge" for 9/11. Living amongst people, seeing them as human beings, understanding their culture and their values, and subsequently determining how those countries will react to our policies is far more valuable experience to a President than a thousand goodwill missions to meet with dignitaries; someone who has only met dignitaries, after all, might think that average people in Islamic countries would respond well to a regime change and largescale military occupation, whereas someone who has lived extensively in a Muslim country amongst those average people would know right off the bat how retarded that is.
Shadow, Hamden, CT (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 9:56 AM)

Shadow, he was a CHILD. If he had lived overseas as an adult or maybe even a teenager, I would feel differently about this. But let's be real here. When you were that age, how much did you really grasp about regime change and large scale military operations? If you are anything like most kids, that wasn't exactly something you spent your time pondering.

...Gee, I think I'll take a walk down the road and instead of playing with my friends, I will stop and ask some adults what they think about regime change, and maybe try to get a feel for how they feel about large scale military operations...

Hm. I kind of doubt it. I think it is great that he has spent time living overseas. I also think that doesn't add to his qualifications for president because it happened before such an experience would really give him a greater understanding of that society.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jesse, Burnsville, MN — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 17:59:49 GMT

Robert, I can guarantee that you could not name another candidate's middle name besides Hillarys and Baracks. I think Barack's middle name is more of an issue for YOU than it is for HIM. You have stated the issue in every one of your posts, so you are either obsessive compulsive or xenophobic. Either way, good luck with that!

By the way, my middle name is Joe, which is short for Joseph. But, don't tell anybody. I wouldn't want anybody confusing me with Stalin!

Obama/Edwards '08

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K, Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:07:10 GMT

You guys should read the newsweek article on hilarys experience, it totally debunks msnbc's article!

I LOVE HILARY! GO HILARY!!! CLINTON 08!
Jamal, los angeles, ca (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 12:17 PM)

--------------------

And these days Newsweek = National Enquirer. I cancelled my subscription to it a long time ago.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Daniel, NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:07:54 GMT

Make sure to check these just-released detailed rankings of the state of play in the Republican race. With a week to go until Iowa, the race is in big movement... and these rankings have the shocking analysis of putting McCain on top: http://www.campaigndiaries.com/2007/12/presidential-rankings-republicans.html

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jamal, los angeles, CA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:12:39 GMT

Sorry about the Hillary mispelling. In one of my college classes, there is a girl who spells it with one l.

Anyways, Hillary is by far the best candidate: experience where it is needed. Obama is NOT the best candidate people! He has only been 2 years in the senate. How can someone who has been in the senate for 2 years be of any "change"?

This reminds me of my high school election. A new comer from boston came to my california high school and claimed that he would change our student government because he had an outsiders perspective; turns out the kid did nothing to help out anyone and I had to do everything!

This experience taught me something, and its not to trust inexperienced people.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K, Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:14:06 GMT

Van--

As I seem to recall in Clinton's re-election bid, the Republicans put up a near corpse to run against her. It wasn't as if she was matched up against Spitzer or Guiliani or a Bloomberg for the job. She won by default, not because she did anything worthwhile for the state.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K, Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:16:26 GMT

I can't believe all of the demeaning remarks by the media and others about Hillary. Fess up, she is intelligent, caring, compassionate and would make a very great president. There is a lot of jealously in those remarks made by so many. There is nothing wrong with Barack, John and many others running, however, all the media and others try to jump on Hillary for every word she utters. Get over it, she is great and would be a great president.
Willie Pearson, Phoenix, Arizona (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 12:36 PM)

----------

When did the words "caring" and "compassionate" become synonyms for "cold", "calculating", and "manipulative"? They sure don't like up in any dictionary or thesarus I own.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Nadeem, Toronto, Ontario, Canada — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:21:35 GMT

I am a Canadian who has lost faith in the ability of the US to provide leadership around the world. I grew up in a house where my father preached to us that the US was a beacon of hope for people around the world. He did not get immigration to the states so her chose the next best thing in his mind, Canada. Civil rights, the Kennedy's and women's rights were mandatory subjects. However the last 20 years have shattered that image of the US. With the last eight putting the icing on the cake. I never thought i could believe in the US again. Listening to Barak Hussein Obama is restoring the image that my father told us about. His vision of a purple america, not a blue America a white america. His honestly an integrity. His unwillingness to get ugly (like the Clintons have made a career of) or unwillingness to pit one america against another america, like Edward's does, are why i believe this. His middle name is part of why i like him. If america can elect a guy with the name of Barak Hussein Obama as President, than they are the visionary America my father spoke of. Not the negative, bigoted, muslim hating, do and say anything to win politicians, war mongering stereotypes most people now associate with Americans.

When i see an Obama victory i see a country that has judged someone based on the content of their character, not the color of their skin or the spelling of their name. Here is hoping Iowans can rise to that challenge and show many of us around the world an america reborn.

Nadeem
Toronto, Ontario Canada

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jamal, la, ca — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:21:58 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

fielder, St. louis, mo — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:24:40 GMT

I want to know who's going to pay for Hillary's Univeral Health Care Plan? How ever noble sounding I don't think we can handle paying anymore taxes! We are taxed on litteraly the air we breath, water, food, property, utilites, gasoline and the list is like the decoding of of our DNA, (meaning just as long as our genatic code). With ever new tax, the politians give themselves a raise and slap themselves on the back. When is America going to get a clue?

First thoughts: Eight days out

vanreuter, NY NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:29:29 GMT

Hillary Clinton Most Admired Woman

With 16% of total mentions for most admired woman, Winfrey had her strongest showing to date in the current poll. But Clinton also had a stronger-than-usual score in 2007 -- the 18% who mention the former first lady is the highest since 2000 (19%). Clinton's best performance was in 1998, when 28% said they most admired her, just as her husband was being impeached by the U.S. House of Representatives in the Monica Lewinsky matter."

This is bound to rile up the scroll brigade...

PS- Bill's 2nd most admired man...

http://www.gallup.com/poll/103462/Hillary-Edges-Oprah-Most-Admired-Woman-07.aspx#1

Van

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:31:04 GMT

Carrie,
That's what we keep telling folks. It is working in Iowa... but Florida is another state of mind.

Operatives and insiders are predicting Hillary will win at all costs, if only by a chad.

(It takes a village to raise a child, but it takes a sharp stick to hang a chad)

First thoughts: Eight days out

MK,MO — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:35:31 GMT

Mark Thieme / what's up with this 'it could be worse' endorsement of a candidate that you and I both know doesn't give a damn about anything but herself and her elitist click, it's time for change, hillary wants to maintain the status quo, that maybe enough to satisfy you but hopefully it isn't enough for most americans

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ron Dennis — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:40:06 GMT

All I read is hate and more hate. Why would anyone want to be president of this hateful and evil group of people? That is the real question. I believe that everyone running for the presidency,(republican and democrat alike), loves this country, are patriotic, want to keep us safe from terrorism and want to make a difference in the lives of all of us in a positive way.

Lets get off the negatives and start looking for the positives. We all know, whether you like her or not, that Hillary R Clinton will make a great president and is one of the most experienced in the bunch. I feel sorry for America that we have such hate and division in this country.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K, Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:40:25 GMT

"I would never vote for someone like Obama.
His supporters all do appear to be young and in their twenties for the most part and we all know those people are irresponsible and don't vote." Not quite, my first vote was in the 1980 elections. I vote in every election including school board. Incidentally, I never said I was an Obama supporter and will caucus for Edwards. Fair is fair, however, and the "Obama is a Muslim" attacks are both unfair and dishonest. Additionally, don't count me in the group that thinks this whole thing comes out of the Clinton campaign. It originated with the right-wing media empire of Rev. Sun Myung Moon and has been propogated through the right wing smear machine...hardly friends of the Clintons.
------------------

The amusing thing is we young people (I'll be 32 on Monday) have sat back and watched the baby boomers f--- the place up for the last 8 years. Some would argue that it really started somewhere back in Clinton's 2nd term when the Republicans were too busy worrying about a blow job, but I digress.

We've seen what you older people are capable of and it's a senile, hostile view of the world that shouldn't exist any longer, not if we have any say in the matter. You're going to have to hand over the reigns of power in the world to us sooner or later. If we waited till later, God help all of us. We'll take it now while there's still some opportunity to turn things around from the eternal damnation that Bush and even Hillary seem destined to take us into. That's why I'm voting for Obama, and yes, I DO vote.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Charlie K., Bronx, NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:40:31 GMT

You can't measure Hillary's "popularity" in NY by pointing to the margins of victory in her Senate campaigns. NY is always going to send Democrats to the Senate by wide margins. Once you're the Democratic party's choice, you win big.

What gets me is how many people I know who support Hillary while holding their noses, because they think she's the best bet to win back the White House. That's no way to vote in a primary. If everyone who's reluctantly supporting Hillary would vote instead for the person they actually want, Hillary would go down in flames in short order.

Question: Who's the Democratic candidate the Republicans most want to run against in the general election?

Follow-up question: Who's the Democrat the Republicans would rather not run against?

The answers are obvious to me.

I am another left-winger from NYC who can't stand the Clintons. Hillary will never get my vote no matter the circumstances.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Eric (Columbus, OH) — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:45:13 GMT

@ Thomas from Little Rock:

"I would never vote for someone like Obama.
His supporters all do appear to be young and in their twenties for the most part and we all know those people are irresponsible and don't vote. "

I take great exception to your statement (above), in which you apparently believe yourself to be the authority on the social habits and voting records of twenty-somethings in America. I happen to be in my twenties, am an educated member of society, a responsible family man, and have never missed voting in a single election since the day I turned eighteen more than a decade ago. I have taken great pains -- as I always do come election time -- to educate myself on the issues and find out where each candidate stands. As a result, I feel very confident in the vote I will be casting during our state's primary this coming March.

If you want to point fingers at an entire generation of "irresponsible" citizens, I'd suggest you look back in time just a bit further to the Baby Boomers. Here's just a quick sampling of the cultural and political events which took place during that generation's "reign" whose effects are still being felt today: assassinations of John Kennedy, Robert Kennedy, and Martin Luther King, Jr,; Vietnam war; sexual revolution; cultural desensitization to and experimentation of drugs and other intoxicants; Watergate; the Cold War; the Oil Embargo; the Energy Crisis; raging inflation; and, last but certainly not least, the election of George W. Bush. Now, only a fool would attempt to blame those events on an entire generation of people, but I think it would be prudent in the future for you, Thomas, to think about the ills of society which came to be because of your generation before you go pointing fingers and name-calling.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Gary Zero, Chillicothe, IL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:47:26 GMT

So in the end will it really matter who gets nominated in the Republican party? Or for that matter should anyone besides Clinton even be running? Do we even need an election, does your vote even matter?

I think we all know its going to be Clinton for president, which kind of scares the crap out of me, and not because its a she instead of a he.

First thoughts: Eight days out

James, in Sanford, NC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:47:54 GMT

Some very interesting post. I truly believe that most of us miss the point entirely. Does it really make that much of a difference whether Hilary has the experience as first lady, or that she really wasn’t involved in foreign affairs while in the White House? My guess is that in a general election a lot of what you are reading in some of these post will only get worse. The republicans would love nothing more than to face Hilary in the general election. I could see the ads now, with pictures of Monica flashing the screen and a voice in the back ground stating “do we really want Bill back in the White House with more time on his hands”. Folks, I have the utmost respect for HRC, I truly believe that she is an intelligent and very capable woman; I truly believe that if she could win, that she would do a great job as President. But sadly the truth is, she comes with to much baggage and the Republican dirt machine would eat her for breakfast.

As for you Obama fans, I hate to also break the news to you as well, middle America is not going to vote for someone who’s middle name is Hussein. Folks wake up, there are three qualified candidates who have a better chance in the general election than either Hillary or Barack. Biden, Edwards or Dodd will all do better in the red states than either Hillary or Barack. If the democrats are to take back the White House in 08 than they better get serious about whom they nominate.

As Democrats we seem to live in a world of fantasy where your sex and race will have no impact on who votes for you. As Democrats and as liberal open minded intelligent people that would be the case, but if you believe that independents and people who just vote for who they think they like the best, Your sex and race have everything to do with who you vote for. So once again if we want to win, and fix all that George Bush has broken, then we better take a long hard look at who can really win in 08.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ernest, MIA, FL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 18:50:07 GMT

Well, I just checked realpolitics.com and 3 of the last 4 polls taken have Hillary with a lead and the only one with Obama leading was done by a Republican group.So why do we keep hearing how Obama has all this momentum and how even John Edwards has a better shot than Hillary now? Didn't we learn anything from '04 when Howard Dean was hyped up to the top of the pyramid and then fell flat on his face because his base was weak? I have a feeling that the same will happen to Obama. His momentum has clearly slowed and we hear no reporting on this. His base is mostly made up of young males (who do not vote in big numbers and who caucus in even lower numbers) and he is not even leading the averages anymore so he can't afford a bad turnout. Why does anyone think he will win? And believe me, I am still undecided between Mr. Obama and Hillary but all of the hype that has been thrown his way has me wary of him and those hyping him up.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Marc, NY, NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:12:57 GMT

What factors make a candidate of ideal presidential material? Some, above, suggest that experience is a good determinant (ie, Hillary). Former Pres. GW Bush had plenty of that to boot and, yet, doesn't really stand out as a great. What about the quantity of legislation passed (as Richard opines above)? Again, former Pres. Ford was a Senator for many yrs. and will probably be more kindly looked upon as a short-term Pres. than an accomplished Senator.... What about likeability? Former Pres. Carter is, without dispute, the most affable and sociable individual in the whole lot of former Presidents. His reputation among historians, however, is still a matter of debate. Fact remains that when we elect someone to the highest office, we are somewhat gambling. It's a crap shoot as to whether someone will live up to expectations or not.

First thoughts: Eight days out

James, in Sanford, NC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:13:33 GMT

OK, I live in NC and this is the first I'm hearing about a mistress a baby and John Edwards, where do you people get your news from, the National Enquire.
Don't you think if this were even suggested that it would be national news.

WOW, reading some of these post just amazes me.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Debbie, Falls Church, Va — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:14:25 GMT

That poll that says Hillary is up by 15 points is by the American Research Group who are notorious for getting things WRONG! The Washington Post had an article sometime back giving the track record for various pollsters, and this group was at the bottom! They have been off by as much as 20 points in past elections. So that is why the media is ignoring this poll - it is worthless.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Frank, Hamptons, New York — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:18:09 GMT

Barack Obama for President.

It's time for America to Rise and Shine again.

Please read more and don't get caught up in this "change campain". Most candiates use this as thier theme and we never see any change. Obama is wishy-wahsy and kind of spineless. We need a leader that can stand up in strength in this country and this 3 year senator Obama is so lacking experience and check out his voting record. It is emabarrasing and I just will not simply waste vote on him. I am sure he may be a nice person but I want a President who can take charge. Not matter how many comments I read I will not change my stance and waste my vote on Obama. I want a viable candidate who can win the Presidential election. Screw Oprah!.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:19:17 GMT

Every Democrat on the Iowa ballot is better at retail than HC, but she may pull it off anyway.

Hillary is mass produced with global parts and assembly. Unlike Bill, the ultimate retail candidate, Hillary has to move product by the ton to survive.

Since Bill and pals invented globalism as we know it... guess who wins.

Guess where the election is won. Dime stores in Iowa and New Hampshire or Walmart megaplexes in New Jersey? Or perhaps the Disney Alternative Universe in Orlando?

Clinton will win... it is preordained in a voting machine near you.

It could be worse (martial law, national state of emergency, Cheney declares himself, or successor clones, to be President for Eternity?)

Happy Holidays!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Frank, Hamptons, New York — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:22:12 GMT

One other thing is I am voting Edwards or clinton. Men have been running and ruining this country for 200 years - Maybe it is time to see what a woman can do. I need to give that some thought.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Bermuda — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:24:09 GMT

Do we need the type of experience the Clinton's bring to the white house?
I think not, I'ts time for real quality change.
VOTE Obama.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Frank, Hamptons, New York — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:24:49 GMT

Dear nsmsbnc - what the hell does marriage got to do with it. I am sure you have a wonderful and flawless marriage. I would love to see the skeletons in your closet- If you are married I am sure you will respond with "I don't have skeletons - ummm right!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:29:09 GMT

Just one PS and then off to return all the sweaters with reindeer embroidered on the front.

So... I am not one to tell you I told you SO, but I did. You can look it up.

I said months ago these silly polls were just that... and here it comes, down to the wire and what damn good are they? Opiates for the masses, I say.

When will the logical positivists ever learn? When will the amateurs stop looking so foolish in their pontifications? When will the poll dorks ever wake up and smell the sweet smell of opium?

Anyway, back to the consumer village!

Have a good one!

First thoughts: Eight days out

DesertStormVet, Cedar Rapids, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:30:33 GMT

Vote with facts...great idea.
Fact: FISA bill, with retroactive immunity for criminal corporations who helped spy on Americans, was up for vote in the Senate on Monday, December 17.
Fact: Hillary vowed to stand with Americans and prevent this travesty from being passed.
Fact: On December 17, Hillary was flitting about Iowa in job interviews.
Fact: On December 17, Chris Dodd stood on the Senate floor for hours working to Support and Defend our Constitution. The Unconstitutional FISA bill is stopped by an Army of One, the only candidate who demonstrated his Support and Defense of our Constitution by serving in uniform.
Fact: On August 13, Hillary was the only candidate to send a civilian (one who's never worn the boots, one who's never been willing to put their life on the line for their country) to talk to Veterans at a forum in Des Moines - Other candidates who sent surrogates had the sense enough to send Veterans.
Fact: On August 13, Chris Dodd addresses the crowd at the Veterans Forum in Des Moines.

You're right about the press. They're focused on Haircut Boy (mill worker's son), No-Show O' (black? white? anything relevant?), and Hillarity (former first lady, not much else). It'd be nice if they focused on qualified, competent candidates (Dodd, Biden, Richardson), but they've got substance, and that doesn't make for compelling advertising (er, journalism? entertaiNewsment?).

I expect my Presidential candidate to be, well, Presidential. The "Top Tier" fails this test, as do all of the GOP. Willard and his Mittens (your kid driving a bus in Iowa isn't the same as our kids serving in uniform, schmuck), Hokey Huckabee (Science? What's that?), Crazy John (Bush Lite) and the rest aren't even close to the best America has to offer.

Facts Matter. Results Matter.
Dodd for President.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Marcia, Florence, KY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:32:41 GMT

Obama has the "Big Mo" at this point. Hillary has been steadily falling in both Iowa and NH over the past month, while Obama has been rising. It's not rocket science. The Clinton campaign has been in panic-mode, pulling every possible dirty trick out of their bag. Now the NY Times has uncovered the truth about her so-called experience as First Lady. Looks more and more like Bill is not going to get his third term in the WH. I'm doing my happy dance because Obama is going to win!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Steven F., Palo Alto, Ca. — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:33:53 GMT

Biden is Presidential now.

I'd like First Read to speak about Biden.

Any chance he can score better than expected and get a bounce?

First thoughts: Eight days out

DesertStormVet, Cedar Rapids, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:33:55 GMT

Mark Thieme (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 2:19 PM)
It could be worse (martial law, national state of emergency, Cheney declares himself, or successor clones, to be President for Eternity?)

Uncle Dick and Uncurious George declare themselves permanent, they'll find themselves down range while the red flag is up, so it won't last long at all.

...against all enemies, foreign and domestic...

First thoughts: Eight days out

J, Ca — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:35:23 GMT

Chuck Todd - Why are you pushing John Edwards chances so much? ...........
Mary Anne, Potomac, MD (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 10:39 AM)

I totally disagree with your accusations of Chuck Todd. He's one of very few in network TV today who can give a true balanced political analysis.
Also you are saying "Obama is surging" where? In Iraq?Certainly not in Iowa. Have you been following Polls lately. Go to realclearpolitics.com and check under Iowa. Obama's loosing.He's down in 4 out of last 5 polls realeased in iowa. Hillary has a double degit lead in the latest.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Solange Miller — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:40:46 GMT

This is getting exciting...

The demographic winter is coming to the US.

Aging workforce.
geocities(dot)com/demographic_crash

Good information on the subject.
Welcome for a visit.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Marbw — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:45:06 GMT

Joe Wilson helped direct Africa policy as Special Assistant to President Bill Clinton and Senior Director for African Affairs, National Security Council. This was his final position before his retirement from government service in 1998.

First thoughts: Eight days out

independentrevolt — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:47:15 GMT

everyone take a look and realize.

this is from a poller that usually reflects hrc favorably.

Clinton and Romney have highest level of core opposition no matter who else is on the ballot.

This means these are the percentage of voters that absolutely will not vote for a candidate and can't be swayed no matter what.

Mitt Romney-47%

Hillary Clinton-47%

Rudy GIuliani-38%

John Edwards-36%

Barack Obama-34%

Imagine when the independent voters are added to these statistics.

Think about electability our fellow Americans.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public

First thoughts: Eight days out

ME, Santa Ana, CA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:50:45 GMT

We are coming out of perhaps the most dishonest administration in US history. They did what they wanted when they wanted.

This is why people want change. When Romney or Clinton spin/flipflop/lie to get votes, it hardly seems like a new direction. Clinton should never have called herself the change candidate. That is a lie. Bush/Clinton/Bush/Clinton is not change. She should not have embellished her "co-presidency" qualifications. Romney's crazy civil-rights BS should disqualify him on the spot.

If you want change, Obama is it. If you want 90's style politics back (the good and the bad), then Clinton is it.

I am looking for true change. I am looking for someone who is intelligent and doesn't say whatever to get elected. I am looking for someone to bring everyone together, not continue the horrible split that exists between the parties. I just don't see that the right will allow Clinton to do anything - just because she is a Clinton. I see a Clinton presidency dogged by republicans trying to score "gotcha" points and, in the process, locking up our government during a critical period of recovery (moral, economic, military, political). It is not that she isn't intelligent - she is. She just isn't what the country needs right now. Obama will have a true "honeymoon" and will be able to work to get real change in how the country works and is perceived.

First thoughts: Eight days out

ese vato — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:52:28 GMT

Hmmmmm, Ross Perot, Ron Paul, both have the letter's "R" and "P" in the name. Both have Texas ties. Both are short with big ego's . Third party candidates? Paul could ruin it for the Republican candidate. Deja vu all over again?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Vet85, Washington DC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:52:53 GMT

As a recently retired military member, I thought our going into Iraq was wrong. Now that we're there, we need a strategic end game, not plan to be there forever, nor just pack up and leave.

Therefore, my leanings are towards McCain. If it came to the democratic side, my would give an edge to Obama.

There are specifc postion reasons I don'r support Romney, but to Mr. Jorenson...for crying out load, give it a rest and stop waisting everybody's time. You keep hitting these comment sections by cutting and pasting your long diatribe why you hate Romney, why not be a man and say what condidate you do stand for?

From several of your other posts, it is more than evident that your hatchet job isn't towards Romney as much as it is against the LDS church. We all got your message, you are a bigot and for some reason you couldn't get your engineering firm to successfully develop there in the middle of Mormon country. So, it must be a conspiracy against you, right? I'm sure nothing to do with your abitlity to understand your market. Are you one of those conspircy nuts who have all the undisclosed documents no one in the mainstream media has that proves all this?

Most people I'm sure just scroll down through all your dribble; so why waist all our time making us scroll through your endless dribble and venom? Please stop making an arse of yourself.

Now that we all know where you stand in the hate department, why don't you stop grand standing and actually contribute something worthwhile like..."I support (McCain, Clinton, Huckabee, Edwards, or whoever) and here's why?"

You defintiely remind of a quote from Reagan years ago..."There he goes again!"

First thoughts: Eight days out

Vet85, Washington DC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:54:26 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

cool ray washington d.c. — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:55:47 GMT

on obama does not need to get tough he has to show that democracy is still important to our country not petty,experience can't hurt look at our nation leader's now every one is not a war fanatic yet he did not okay it that's experience and he is part of a dream that the over 40 crowd can relate to

First thoughts: Eight days out

ese vato — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:56:52 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

Gina, Santa Fe, New Mexico — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 19:59:40 GMT

J,Ca - That poll that shows a double-digit lead for Mrs. Clinton is by the American Research Group who has one of the most awful reliabilty records in the history of polling! They are not taken seriously by anyone who watches politics closely. Obama is going to win Iowa - and you Hillary supporters know it. The New York Times article today exposing her faux experience as First Lady is just another indicator of how much trouble is ahead for Hillary. The once- mighty Clinton machine is quickly coming unhinged.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ron Jeffers, Arizona Independent — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:06:47 GMT

McCain is the only Republican who is even remotely electable. So if anyone other than he wins the Repub nomination, then the Repubs are out of the White House, regardless of who is running against them.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Will, New York — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:09:21 GMT

Bravo NYT (although I would say, it's about time). Finally the mainstream media asks the question that's been the elephant in the room since the first day the HRC campaign started touting her experience:

What experience? She claims she's the most experienced but won't release any of the records that would support her claims.

America is better than to perpetuate "legacy" politics. I think we learned our lesson with the last legacy election.

I'm an Independent (formerly Republican until the last 4 years). To those Democrats who are making their decision based on "electability," you may want to think twice about what the GOP will do to HRC's claims about all that experience. Don't think they'll let that claim go unchallenged (as it appears Barack and Edwards have). If electability is your decision-maker, you're much better off with Edwards or Obama. Neither has significant "experience" either but voters will forgive that; after all, the GOP doesn't have much to offer this year. What it won't overlook is HRC making grandiose claims about "experience" when she has far less than she's claiming.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jason, Tallahssee, FL — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:10:24 GMT

I wonder how many states Ron Paul is going to have to win to get news coverage. I was shocked to see him on Meet the Press Sunday, but other than that he continues to be ignored by those who think landline polls are still relevant.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Tiffany, Chicago, Il — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:15:09 GMT

I wanted to raise one point that I find somewhat ironic.

A long time ago, michelle obama said said something along the lines of "if you cant take care of your husband, how can you take care of america?"

Last time I checked, if obama cant take care of his daughter going on youtube and watching obama girl (which he was really disappointed), how can HE take care of america?

She didn't go on youtube and see it, she saw it on the news. At the time this first came out it was widely reported on. Having your child see something on the evening news is completely different from her checking out every video on youtube. Not to mention, when Michelle made that comment she was referring to her own family, and how her and her husband decided everything had to taken care of at home, and how they wanted to be comfortable with their family life before they set out "take care of america" as you put it. Don't comment on things you clearly have no accurate information on.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Wisdom Calls, Palisades Park, NJ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:17:01 GMT

HRC is surely headed for presidency,despite the negative press. She will win because America is not easily fooled.

We are desperate for a pragmatic and prudent person to take charge of this great nation.

We do not need feel good, emotional pseudo leaders who pump hope without proven works into us.

This is a serious election. We are aware of the consequences of being led into choosing pretenders.

Thank you for helping us see through you first read.
Hillary is the best choice this time around.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Scott, New York — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:18:07 GMT

Earl from Ohio,
I agree that the vitriol isn't necessary (from anyone's supporters). However, just so you know, there are a lot of non-dogmatic Republicans and Independents who will seriously consider Obama if he's the Dem nominee for a couple of simple reasons: 1) he has not taken lobbyist money and 2) his stance against the debacle in Iraq (yes it's still a debacle). Change cannot be brought by someone who's an insider. If it happens, it will only be triggered by someone who the mainstream media and those in the political establishment say has no experience. No experience with the twisted ways of Washington is good experience.

First thoughts: Eight days out

CitizenJ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:23:36 GMT

Also you are saying "Obama is surging" where? In Iraq?Certainly not in Iowa. Have you been following Polls lately. Go to realclearpolitics.com and check under Iowa. Obama's loosing.He's down in 4 out of last 5 polls realeased in iowa. Hillary has a double degit lead in the latest.

J, Ca (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 2:35 PM)

That's strange because I just looked at that same site and here are the numbers for the last 5 polls in Iowa:

12/20 - 12/23: Clinton 34, Obama 19
12/16 - 12/18: Clinton 27, Obama 30
12/14 - 12/18: Clinton 30, Obama 28
12/17 - 12/17: Clinton 31, Obama 27
12/16 - 12/17: Clinton 24, Obama 27

Clinton leads in 3, Obama in 2. All of them but one are statistically a tie.

Also, are you not the least bit unsure of a poll that has someone winning by 15 in a state in which every other poll for a month has been a statistical tie?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Richard, Baltimore — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:24:34 GMT

If we really think experience is important, shouldn't we be looking at Richardson, Biden and Todd ?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mike K, Denver — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:27:08 GMT

"Hillary is up double-digits in Iowa!" Will you please source for me, either posted here or via a link, to a reputable news organization (CNN, MSNBC, Newsweek, Des Moines Register, etc.) or to one of the universities in Iowa a poll that cites this supposed lead for Clinton?

Right. You can't. It's all spin by Mark Penn. It's all groups who already support Hillary. Until one of these news organizations is quoted with a poll stating that Clinton is again winning Iowa, I will no doubt believe that Obama is still steadily in the lead there and tied with her in New Hampshire.

You Clintonistas may continue drinking from the communal kool-aid.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Margaret, NYC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:29:05 GMT

There are tooo many sex and drug scandals connected to Obama's and Hillary's campaigns.
Cocaine, McClurkin, Monica, Paula, Gennifer...

John Edwards will be a great President - with a FAITHFUL wife of 30 years!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Margaret, NYC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:32:13 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

Lisa, Hampton, SC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:38:08 GMT

Why does the CORPORATE media and MSNBC limit the Dem race to 2 CORPORATE DEMOCRATS?

Because they know a black man won't be elected President until he's been elected VP. This strategy helps Hillary. However, she would lose the general.

Our votes go to John Edwards!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Lisa, Hampton, SC — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:38:08 GMT

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ava — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:38:32 GMT

Sierra SF - When you see comments like those made by Halpern, it's always important to know who the source is. Halpern's dad worked for the Clintons so they got him to rush to her defense. The Clintons still have their own press corps (e.g. Krugman, Halpern) that they can go to whenevery they want a fluff story about themselves or a hit story done on an opponent.

Look at it another way - I think the Clinton's really should have just kept their mussels shut. They have gotten a free ride from the press. If it was OK to bring up Obama's admitted drug use, they should be fine with having the press rake them over the coals for ALL of their past scandals (Monica, fundraising scandals, Whitewater, Rose Law Firm billing scandal, impeachment, Norman Hsu, all the bimbo eruptions, etc. etc.). They had one of the sleaziest presidencies in recent times. (Bill & the cigar? - YUK) They have been sooooo lucky. They need to shut up.

First thoughts: Eight days out

CitizenJ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:38:57 GMT

Also you are saying "Obama is surging" where? In Iraq?Certainly not in Iowa. Have you been following Polls lately. Go to realclearpolitics.com and check under Iowa. Obama's loosing.He's down in 4 out of last 5 polls realeased in iowa. Hillary has a double degit lead in the latest.

J, Ca (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 2:35 PM)

And another thing:

The last 4 polls in New Hampshire are Clinton +2 (a statistical tie), Clinton +3 (a statistical tie), a tie, and then you have the American Research Group poll which has Clinton +14 (the same poll which shows her +15 in Iowa).

What about South Carolina? Well, in December, 3 show Obama winning, and 5 show Clinton winning. The largest spread is 8 points. There is also 1 tie. And the most recent ARG poll ending on 11/29 shows Clinton leading +24.

The point is that ARG seems to have polls that lie way outside what all the other polls are showing, indicating that it might not be the most reliable indicator.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ava — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:42:51 GMT

Rick, KY - I agree with your statement that Iraq was about oil. One very simple thing prooves it.

--- WHY the heck would our president say that the oil would pay for the war? WE don't control a large percentage of the world's oil supplies! They went in there to STEAL Iraqi oil and planned to sell it and keep the profits, which is exactly what they did but they decided the profits should go to their corporate pals and the oil barrons.

First thoughts: Eight days out

james ,Newport beach, CA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:44:57 GMT

A thought about history.. Historically in our country we have almost always elected someone who has served in a capacity of executive office, either they were A Govenonor, Vice President or military leader (George Washington, Ulysses Grant, and Eisenhower). A few exceptions have occured where a legislator (senator or rep) was elected to the high office, and in each of these cases that individual was assasinated in office. With such a legacy of history .. Why would any legislator WANT the office of the presidency.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Song J, San Francisco, California — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:45:35 GMT

I believe that Obama truly wants to change America, and that he truly thinks he can make a difference as a member of the democratic party, but I think that wanting to do something is very far from having the vision to see it through, and having the integrity to always stand your ground, regardless of what your enemies do to destroy you. This is where I think he fails. So much hooplah about him turning from a Muslim to a Christian. I think it's pretty clear that he turned Christian because he figured out a while ago that being a Muslim would be much more difficult for him as a politician. Same goes with his anti war stance, the second the GOP calls him soft on terror, he threatens that he will bomb Pakistan. Where is your integrity? I would have supported Gravel or Kucinich first, but the democratic party has convinced all thier followers that they have no chance, regardless of their convictions, and democrats are as much sheep as anyone, but they like to act as if they're capable of making up thier own minds, pointing at pundits like Limbaugh and Coulter, they don't realize they are the same, that they are inable to think for themselves. It seems that being pro choice these days is not really pro choice at all. The Christian right has forced them to support only first trimester abortions, only when the "aborted" is only a fetus. So, for the first three months, they believe that a woman has the right to choose, but for the last six months, the majority of a pregnancy, they are pro life, they believe life is most important. Most democrats are more pro life than pro choice, and they don't even know it. The democratic party is a joke these days, promising change with a band aid, rather than looking at, or even admitting the root of problems. Republicans and Democrats become more of the same each election, regardless of what their retoric they poison us with. And it takes a candidate like Ron Paul to highlight this fact. Ron Paul is the only candidate who will bring into discussion the fact that the CIA overthrew the democratically elected leader of Iran for our oil interests, before he will ever propogate the idea of starting a war and killing thousands more. Ron Paul is the only candidate who is willing to level with the American people about what our government has done without our consent. Who cares if all five corporate media outlets say he has no chance. I'm tired of all this garbage, neo-cons talk about nation building, running the world's oil empire, and all the Dems saying one thing and doing another. No more corporate elitist wars on terror, global warming, drugs... Stop asking me to pay for some war against an invisible enemy, or asking me to pay for my carbon imprint, or asking me to fund the one of the most racist, classist, propagators of injustice in our society today. This is one pro-choice, pro-14th admendment progressive who has already registered as a republican... This time around, voting for the lesser evil is actually empowering. You tell me he will never win, but voting for anyone else is like not voting at all. What happened to this country, or has it always been this way? Sad....

First thoughts: Eight days out

DanN — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:51:06 GMT

"Fact is Clinton met more world leaders in one year as First Lady then Edwards and Obama have met in their lives - combined." -
----So has the valet at the UN.

"The fact is that Clinton has accomplished more in the Senate than either of them."
----OK, you got me. What bills has she delivered on?

"The fact is Clinton has been working in politics longer - with more results - than either of them."
----Working without a security clearance.

"If you watch the foreign policy segements of the debates, there is no question is the top candidate in the race when it comes to foreign policy and national security -- it is Hillary Clinton."

-----If you WILL watch the foreign policy segements of the GENERAL ELECTION debates, there is no question is the top candidate in the race when it comes to foreign policy and national security -- it is John McCain.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Evelyn Trautwein, Anaheim, California — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:02:04 GMT

I cannot believe the anger, and the rage that comes from these Obama supporters!
Who are these people for god's sakes? Their trite name-calling drivel appeals only to the worst basic emotions in the human soul; fear, anger, hatred, and envy.
I certainly hope whoever "inspires" these people to come out with the things they say doesn't ever achieve power in this country. I shudder at the thought of what might happen if all that anger were unleashed in the streets!
It also surprises me that they would behave this way over a Christian Holiday such as Christmas.
I'm afraid I have to say that I'm in agreement with Mr. Biegert in Hamilton, Ohio. I could never vote for someone who instills the kind of divisiveness, discord, and division that Barrack Obama's supporters espouse, and therefore I will not vote for him if he's nominated.
For 40 years I have belonged to the Democratic Party, and I'll vote for anyone who's nominated but him.
A lot of people I talk to say the same thing. They say they'll consider crossing the aisle if he's nominated. Mostly because of the way he attacked Hillary, and because his supporters are like vicious pit-bulls ready to rip the flesh off of anyone who challenges them. I can only assume they learned that sort of boorishness from the man they support.
I never really felt that way myself, until I took a good look at some of the things people like "Sierra, SF" and "MK,MO" and "Mike K, Denver" write everyday on this board.
I never knew human beings could harbor so much anger and so much hatred. God help us if these people are ever given any power whatsoever!

First thoughts: Eight days out

independentrevolt — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:03:35 GMT

Clinton campaign:

More coporate and lobbyist interest than any other campaign on the republican and democratic side.

Do you pay back your favors as a citizen?

Do you pay your debtors as a citzen?

Do you think HRC will pay back her favors and debts?

Who will HRC take care of first?

Her special interests or you?

answer truthfully to yourself?

First thoughts: Eight days out

b Livingston Columbia Sc — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:20:15 GMT

It's time for change and with Barack Obama he is the man for change.

First thoughts: Eight days out

rw, lake tahoe, ca — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:22:34 GMT

it's so unfortunate that joe biden and chris dodd are left out of so many discussions. they both have great things to say and have more experience than other dem candidates combined.

First thoughts: Eight days out

billie w, mcfarland — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:26:52 GMT

I still find it nothing but a "high tech lynching" by the msnbc bunch with matthews and russert tying the knot. the media has selected our presidents ever since r, regan and now look where we are. Go hillary go!

First thoughts: Eight days out

BiasedOpinion.Com — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:38:24 GMT

I just love how frequently polls are cited now by the Obama folks who spent so many months saying how unreliable and unimportant polls are. It appears that when their candidate is winning, polls are great but when their candidate is losing, polls suck.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Aidyn, NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:43:31 GMT

HILLARY 2008!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

CitizenJ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:48:32 GMT

So many ObamaBots afflicted with The Obama Disease -

http://www.zmag.org/content/print_article.cfm?itemID=14432&sectionID=90

Obama has duped many with his rhetoric of "unity" - but after Obama brings us all together - the Washington lobbyists that have funded Obama's political career - will still be controlling the government.
And THAT'S the REAL problem that Obama masks - but he doesn't fool us with his scam.

Margaret, NYC (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 3:32 PM)

Do you honestly think this is an unbiased source for factual information? It's fine if you are looking for fringe viewpoints from a website that proclaims "The Spirit of Resistance Lives", but I would hesitate to accept it as conventional wisdom if I were you.

First thoughts: Eight days out

MICK — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:00:41 GMT

Between Hillary's apparent inadequate "experience" and Romney's fairy-tale "experiences" two front-runners better be running fast and hard to cross the finish line of national "trust." Or is trust a thing of the past in American politics? ONLY if voters continue to neglect their research and to elect dishonest politicians.

In repetition, as others have posted on "First Read:"

For Romney, he started his campaign by Not being forthright with voters, when he first started bringing his religion into his campaign--he began telling voters he believes in God, Jesus and the Bible--with NO CLARIFICATION for all the millions who know NOTHING about LDS (many thanks to LDS secrecy oaths, sworn on their lives). It was easy to see, then, and it's easy to see now: a man who will mislead voters about his God can/will easily mislead America about other issues.

While LDS assume many names/words/phrases from the Bible, Judaism, Christianity, they are given 'very different' meanings:

LDS-"God" is "MAN" of flesh and bones, a god among many gods, with many wives bearing him many children (hence Romney's "all God's children"). LDS teach LDS may also become gods, and LDS-Abraham,Isaac,Jacob-Israel,David,Solomon...are also LDS-Gods (eg Moses 6:57, 7:35; LDS Doctrine and Covenants 130:22; 132).

LDS-"Jesus Christ" --IS-- "spirit-brother of Lucifer" (eg Moses 5:13, [LDS]Gospel Principles,revised 1979,ch3 and throughout LDS scriptures/teachings), his name is "AHMAN" (eg Doctrine and Covenants 78:20, 95:17). (Huckabee didn't apologize for a lie, he apologized for allowing Romney's religion into conversation with media. No, I have not decided to vote Huckabee. This post is meant to share information about Romney's less-than-truths, not to rally votes for any candidate).

Examples of LDS "belief in the Bible:"

A "Fool" says they have a Bible and need no more Bible (eg Book Of Mormon, 2Nephi 29:6).

The Bible would scarcely guide LDS 24 hours--LDS have living oracles (eg LDS Journal of Discourses,vol.9, p.324).

Christian God is LDS devil (eg J.of D.,vol.5, p.331).

Christianity was hatched in hell (eg J.of D.vol.6, p.176).

Like:
Romney's--hunted "all [his] life" and--
"seeing" [his] dad march with Martin Luther King and--
the "endorsement" of National Rifle Association and--
taking care of "meth" in 'his' state and...

Who cares if Romney tells the truth? America cares.
'Romney tales' are told--until media discover Romney's discrepancies and call Romney on them--then he back-peddles to try to clean up the media mess caused by disclosures of 'Romney believing what Romney believes' and Expects the rest of the world to go along with him. The rest of the world are NOT LDS who are to Obey, Uphold and Sustain the LDS priesthood and leadership/Romney is a LDS High Priest.

The High Priests of LDS--to whom the kingdom and power (of LDS-God) have been given (eg LDS Doctrine and Covenants 75:1).

Members of LDS--to speak against LDS leaders and do their own thinking--What cunning! When LDS leaders speak, the thinking has been done(eg The Improvement Era, Ward Teachers' Message, "Sustaining the General Authorities of the [LDS]Church").

LDS members are to learn to do as they are told, none of their business if it is right or wrong, just do it (eg J. of D.,vol.6, p.32).

For someone who grew up believing and obeying everything the priests/leadership of their church taught, because that is just the way it is, then, for Romney to become a high priest himself, being believed and obeyed regardless, it may seem foreign for him, for voters and the media to just not grab onto his sales-pitch and fall for it hook-line-and-sinker just because Romney says so.

This is not a 'test of religion.' But information showing the differences between what Romney 'says' and what they are/are not.

Romney hides behind the word "religion" while his "religion" is Very "Political."

The nations will bow to LDS, all hell cannot help it (eg J.of D.,vol.7, p.170).

The time's coming, anyone not heartily for LDS-God will be HEWN DOWN (eg J.of D.,vol.3, p.226).

LDS is SYSTEM OF GOVERNMENT and will govern and control the earth and its inhabitants (eg J.of D.,vol.10, p.320).

LDS will govern ALL people RELIGIOUSLY and POLITICALLY (eg J.of D.,vol.11, p.53).

These bear repeating. There are plenty more. THIS is the POLITICS of Mitt Romney, instilled since childhood in generational LDS.

Before I am accused of hating LDS, I do not. I have dear LDS family and friends. Have I been thrown out? No. But I may be, when it is discovered that I share "Deep Doctrine" of LDS with outsiders--for the sake of the future of our nation.

For Hillary and Romney, and any other candidates, tripping over their own words in attempt to lead voters their way, America is getting wiser. These last 12 years have been a lesson in politicians' word-games, Democrats And Republicans. If you can't back it up, don't bring it up.

First thoughts: Eight days out

vanreuter, NY NY — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:11:34 GMT

J-

Quad City Times (12/10-13) and Strategic Vision(R)(12/08-10) BOTH had Barack up by 9 and eight points, respectively, this month. The reliability of the poll is obviously in the eye of the beholder at this point...:)

I don't take stock in any of the Iowa polls, as they are attempting to predict what 6-8% of the electorate who show up to stand around for their candidate will do in a process that bears as much resemblance to an actual vote as duck bill does to a dollar bill.

That said, the decision to question ARG's methodology or to label them an outlier (which they may well be) would have more credibility if you had questioned any of the polls (like the Reuters/Zogby 12/14 national poll showing Obama trailing by only EIGHT, which was an obvious outlier, based on the dozens of other credible polls from the same period, or the ABC/WaPo Iowa polls that had Obama ahead by the MOE in November, when he trailed by the MOE in every other poll.)

There is a week to go before we get some real results, polls or no polls. As the, "Poll Guy" (for better or worse), here I will say that all polling trends the past 10 days (for the democrats) show a slowing momentum for Barack and a minor resurgence for Clinton.

As a Clinton supporter, I want to keep expectations down in Iowa. Edwards is much stronger than anyone imagines, and his placement is a big factor in how the winners and losers will be perceived next week.

If Edwards wins, and Barack and Hillary are both close, it's a wash and the focus (and many , Obama-leaning independents?) will be on NH. If Hillary wins and Barack is third, the NH indies may find the republican race (and McCain) to be more interesting. If Barack wins and Hillary is third, it's the same scenario as if Edwards wins, with indies being torn between Obama and McCain in NH.

Here's the one SURE thing; No one will wrap-up the nomination in IA or NH, so the process will continue until Tsunami Tuesday, and maybe beyond. The republicans are on track to have a raucous convention, with several candidates still in the hunt. The democrats stand a lesser chance of that happening, but you never know.

Van

First thoughts: Eight days out

Wayne, Fort Collins, Colorado — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:19:01 GMT

TO: Robert Jorgenson from Salt Lake City
FOR: Those who he misled in his post
FROM: Independent, Very Undecided in CO

Mr. Jorgenson, I am an independent. I like some things about each party (and candidate), but loathe voting for someone (or something) just because the person (or that issue is supported by) one party. That said, I began reading the messages associated with this article and came across yours - it definately did not set well with me. Why? Because you twisted context just to "prove" your points about a candidate (in this case Romney). It actually had the opposite effect on me. Here are some issues I found with your post.
1) When quoting the Boston Globe on the Emergency Contraception from the left section, you have kept the quotes around the entire snipit as if Romney himself had said those words. You do the same thing for the from the right section, though this does seem as if Romney is speaking. This contradiction in your choice of format calls into question the sincerity of your post. This caught my attention, but assumed it could have simply been an honest mistake on your part. So I read on, only to find further lack of integrity reporting/commenting on your part.
2)Under this section, the "left' view of Romney speaks of how he supports emergency contraception (assumed from the first abortion topic you posted above) in the case of rape, incest, etc... In the "right" view he vetoed a bill because in his view, the bill exceeded the limits underwhich he would or would not support a type of abortion. To sloppily throw all types of abortion under one guise is like saying that if a person supports one type of abortion, they must then be default all types of abortion. This is naive, by you, and perhaps by the Boston Globe. However, you do bring up a good point regarding his stated views of abortion in a general sense to which I will comment later.
3) Gay Rights
In the "left" view it indicates that Romney says that people should receive equal rights pertaining to health benefits and rights of survivorship - in 2002. In the "right" view it shares comments from him in 1994. During this period of time, his EXPERIENCE with the issue caused him to take a different stand. This is common for all people. How many people who took out an ARM mortgage a few years ago and thought it was great, now wish they hadn't? Experience causes people to change views from time to time.
4) Marriage Ammendment
You provide the context with one quote, "too extreme" of which Romney was speaking of the EFFORTS of the Pro-Family groups. It is not a statement of support either for or against. This is gross misrepresentation.
5) Gun Rights
First, statements (assumed) are being compared from 1994 and more recent times. Second, in 1994 he supported a specific measure (Brady Bill, wait period for purchase) of control. Never in the "right" statements provided does it indicate contradictory information with respect to the Brady Bill. He says he supports the constitutional right to bear arms. This is not a contradiction with the Brady Bill. Perhaps most revealing of faulty reporting is the "I don't line up with the NRA" line. Doesn't line up with what? This simple sentence presented out of context is all I needed to end my read of your post and recognize that likely your goal was to unethically tear down a candidate and represent statements in half-truths (half-lies) rather than present material in an honest effort to allow fair and open conversation on said topics.
6) Since Education is of interest to me I did peak at what was written on your post attributed to Romney. The abolishment of the Department of Education and support for NCLB are not necessarily philosophical opposites. Also, Romney could have been unhappy with the Dept of Ed in 1994, but happy with NCLB instituted in 2002 (I think). Again, several years separate these statements. Which brings me back to the Abortion topic foreshadowed earlier.
It appears Romney did have one view of abortion when his mother ran in the early 1970s and retained that view for a couple of decades roughly. At some point, it appears he changed. Why? I would like to hear the answer from him. Recognize what I had written earlier, that life's experiences can at times change a person's views or beliefs. That is normal. What I (and perhaps others) ask is for an explanation. Perhaps he has provided it already and I have not read it - I am certainly no expert on his views. Nonetheless, I do recognize he (and all of us) has the right to change views. That is one of the main tenets of politics - to get other people to change their views.
In your post you are guilty of providing half-truths (lies) and misrepresenting information purely for your own gain. You are guilty of the same thing in your post that you accuse Romney of doing in his politics. Unless you change the approach in your posts so that integrity is in evidence, your posts are not credible, not worth reading.

With Sincerity, WG

EMERGENCY CONTRACEPTION
From the Left:
"When he ran for governor in 2002, Romney said he supported expanding access to the emergency contraception pill, a high dose of hormones that women can take to prevent pregnancy up to five days after sex . . . On a questionnaire Planned Parenthood gave to the gubernatorial candidates in 2002, Romney answered 'yes' to the question, 'Do you support efforts to increase access to emergency contraception?' "
- Boston Globe, July 7, 2005

From the Right:
"Yesterday I vetoed a bill that the Legislature forwarded to my desk. Though described by its sponsors as a measure relating to contraception, there is more to it than that. The bill does not involve only the prevention of conception: The drug it authorizes would also terminate life after conception."
- Governor Mitt Romney, Op-Ed, "Why I Vetoed The Contraception Bill," Boston Globe, July 26, 2005 Read the article

GAY RIGHTS

From the Left:

"All citizens deserve equal rights, regardless of their sexual orientation. While he does not support gay marriage, Mitt Romney believes domestic partnership status should be recognized in a way that includes the potential for health benefits and rights of survivorship."
- Romney's 2002 campaign website

"Mitt and Kerry Wish You a Great Pride Weekend! All citizens deserve equal rights, regardless of their sexual preference"
- A flier handed out at "Gay Pride" by the Romney/Healey Campaign See the flier here

"We have discussed a number of important issues such as the Federal Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA), which I have agreed to co-sponsor, and if possible broaden to include housing and credit, and a bill to create a federal panel to find ways to reduce gay and lesbian youth suicide, which I also support. One issue I want to clarify concerns [grammar in context] President Clinton's "don't ask, don't tell, don't pursue" military policy. I believe that the Clinton compromise was a step in the right direction. I am also convinced that it is the first of a number of steps that will ultimately lead to gays and lesbians being able to serve openly and honestly in our nation's military. That goal will only be reached when preventing discrimination against gays and lesbians is a mainstream concern, which is a goal we share…"
- Governor Romney letter to Log Cabin Republicans, October 6, 1994 Read the letter here

From the Right:

Lopez: "And what about the 1994 letter to the Log Cabin Republicans where you indicated you would support the Federal Employment Non-Discrimination Act (ENDA) and seemed open to changing the "don't ask, don't tell" policy in the military? Are those your positions today?

Gov. Romney: "No. I don't see the need for new or special legislation. My experience over the past several years as governor has convinced me that ENDA would be an overly broad law that would open a litigation floodgate and unfairly penalize employers at the hands of activist judges...As for military policy and the 'don't ask, don't tell' policy, I trust the counsel of those in uniform who have set these policies over a dozen years ago. I agree with President Bush's decision to maintain this policy and I would do the same."
- Interview with National Review, December 14, 2006 Read the interview

MARRIAGE AMENDMENT

From the Left:

In 2002, before the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court declared same-sex marriage protected by the Constitution, Romney denounced as "too extreme" the effort by pro-family groups to enact a preemptive state Marriage Protection Amendment prohibiting homosexual marriage, civil unions and same-sex public employee benefits.
- Boston Phoenix, May 14-20, 2004

From the Right:

MSNBC's Joe Scarborough: "Do you support a national constitutional amendment to ban same-sex marriage?"

Governor Romney: "Boy, I sure do. You know, that's a topic that's really, I think, very important to the country because marriage is not just about adults. Marriage is about the development and nurturing of kids, and in my view, the development of a child is enhanced by having a mom and dad. And so, I think it's very important that we have a national standard because marriage is a status. You get married in one place and then you move to another, you're still married at least in the eyes of the community and the children and the benefits may not follow you, but ultimately we're going to have one standard of marriage in this country and that standard ought to be one man and one woman."
- MSNBC's "Morning Joe" September 17, 2007

GUN RIGHTS

From the Left:

"He [Romney] is a supporter of the federal assault weapons ban."
- Romney 2002 campaign website

More from the Left:

In his 1994 US Senate run, Romney backed two gun-control measures strongly opposed by the National Rifle Association and other gun-rights groups: the Brady Bill, which imposed a five-day waiting period on gun sales, and a ban on certain assault weapons.

"That's not going to make me the hero of the NRA," Romney told the Boston Herald in 1994.

At another campaign stop that year, he told reporters: "I don't line up with the NRA."
- Boston Globe, January 14, 2007 Read the article

From the Right:

"Americans should have the right to own and possess firearms as guaranteed under the U.S. Constitution," said Governor Romney. "I'm proud to be among the many decent, law-abiding men and women who safely use firearms."
- Governor Romney, News Release, January 12, 2007

EDUCATION

During his 1994 campaign for Senate he continually called for the abolishment of the Department of Education.
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

Governor Romney now supports the No Child Left Behind Act.
- Club for Growth's White Paper on Mitt Romney

First thoughts: Eight days out

CitizenJ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:31:09 GMT

vanreuter, NY NY (Sent Wednesday, December 26, 2007 5:11 PM)

I completely agree about the polling. I simply pointed out ARG because that is the latest one people are talking about. I do think (just off the top of my head) that they tend to be farther outside the norm than most other sources on a consistent basis.

As for Obama's slowing momentum, I never really expected it to carry all the way through. Nobody's momentum lasts too long - especially during this time of year.

I also think Edwards is stronger than the poll number show, simply because his supporters are more reliable than Clinton's or Obama's. But I think the best he will finish would be second.

But until Jan. 3 - and even after that - nobody knows what is going to happen. That's why this year is so exciting.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Ms. B., Decorah, IA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:36:04 GMT

Iowans for Barack Obama, Barack Obama for a promising future!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:49:15 GMT

Yeah right!
Just off the top of your head.

A recent NIH survey concludes that 73.7% of people in rural Illinois (as defined, "south of Interstate 70"), in reply to "certified" pollsters, do not enjoy the taste of rhubarb.
Surprisingly though, almost the same percentage (71.8%) claim to enjoy rhubarb pie.

You just never know do you?

Except of course, when it is "right off the top of (your) head."

Boink.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Marcus, Temecula, CA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:52:02 GMT

I can't wait to see Ron Paul shock all of you. Especially you, Chuck Todd, you've never given Ron Paul the time of day. He deserves better and has proven so on the campaign trail.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:04:48 GMT

Reading through the "commentary" of some of the more pompous and self-important of the phishers here reminds us why we might do better reading the professionals and leaving the BS to the less fortunate among us.

Some people think with their minds, others think, if and when,(right of the top of [their] heads).

Just like the turkey I had yesterday, these leftovers are getting pretty stale. My goodness gracious, how they smell up the kitchen!

Pass the beans please.

Please.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Michelle, Denver, CO — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:12:57 GMT

Mick, your post has little to do with debating Romney and more so with tearing down his religion. Of the religions I'm familiar with, most have "eye-brow raising pasts", and some are "interesting" in their present form - mormonism is no different. Several of your comments on the mormon religion are short exerpts that do not appear in context. Who can tell the truth with that? It reads like you are anti-mormon. If a person's religion really was important for running this country then I would suspect that many of us would be investigating the religious and personal practices of all candidates, not just the mormon one. Because some have chosen to do so, it speaks to the religous bigotry of this country.

I too have mormon friends and family, and they are not robots for their faith. One only needs to look at the mormon government officials (House, Senate, Governers - Harry Reid for Pete's sake) to see that they think for themselves. Suggesting Romney is influenced by his upbringing is the same as any other candidate. Why not then fault find with all the other candidates religions? The reason you don't is that you are prejudice against the mormon religion. Your post has little to do with Romney and politics. Please go find some other venue to bash mormons. Here, stick to the topic of politics.

I apologize to others who just had to read a post written by me about religion. I would rather comment on politics, but am sick of seeing religious bigots post messages under the auspices of politics.

MK

First thoughts: Eight days out

John, Sturbridge, MA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:14:17 GMT

Having lunch as First Lady with world leaders is not a great claim for experience unless you are on a special mission from the President.
Joe Biden calling the Pakistan President when he declared martial law and telling him it would be best for him to change his mind is much more impressive as experience in world leadership.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mark Thieme — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:17:08 GMT

It just wasn't right, of course, it was just. "Just off the top of my head." Not right.

At any rate it is no wonder some people lose their hair as they decline. Such head top thinking can't be good for your follicles.

I think 92.4% of men over 60 will agree with me.

I think therefore, I am excited.

Really an exciting time here!

Very entertaining, this election stuff, and what with all the fine tuned polling numbers... Gee whiz!

This is really exciting... did I say that already?

First thoughts: Eight days out

Rob, Phoenix, AZ — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:20:09 GMT

Hey when will the NY times run something taking aim at the saintly Obama? Gee whiz, the way the press treats BO, he must walk on water or turn blood into wine. In any case folks, the experience issue isn't all that complicated. Here are the facts about experience between the big three: Hillary is on her 2nd term as U.S. senator from New York. This means that, on her own, she has been elected twice by the voters of NY to represent them. Compare that to Obama who is on his first term as a U.S. senator from Illinois just elected in 2004. Obama also served one term as an Illinois state senator prior to his current 1st term as a U.S. senator. Meanwhile, Edwards served just one term as a U.S. Senator from North Carolina (he never sought re-election). In terms of legislative experience, Clinton, Edwards, and obama, are not that different.And none of them have executive experience. Although, I would argue that Clinton gets some extra credit for completing a full term as a U.S. Senator and getting re-elected before running for president. It has always turned me off that Edwards runs after just one senate term. And I do not feel that Obama should run until he at least completes one U.S. senate term. BTW, all three are lawyers. And all three have notable service to promoting their social agendas and causes. The point is this: For those who say that Hillary is not qualified at all to be president, the truth is that she is just as qualified by resume standards as the other candidates. For those who say that Obama is not experienced enough, the truth is that of the top three front runners his experience is a bit shallow but not enough to make it an issue. I for one do count Hillary's experience as First Lady but it is understandable why others don't.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Eric Sarin, Boston, MA — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:25:28 GMT

Thomas from Little Rock,

I am undecided for the record. I see qualities in both Obama and Clinton that I like. I understand your POV on Obama but respectfully disagree. What I don't understand about your position is what you would do if Obama gets the nomination.

In 2000 a select few decided to go Independent and took a decent sized bite out of Gore. This ultimately gave George W. enough of an edge to win and take control of our country.

You don't like the Republican field and I assume you are not pleased with the condition our country is in currently. If you vote Independent your will essentially put one of these Republicans in the white house. Isn’t this the farthest from where you would hope to be?

I would hope that we all think through the consequences of our positions completely.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Shannon, Cave Creek, Ariz. — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:29:28 GMT

Hillary Clinton for President. Because in a world run by amateurs, EXPERIENCE COUNTS!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Shannon, Cave Creek, Ariz. — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 23:33:29 GMT

All of you Obama brainwashees need to wake up and smell the coffee. Instead of trying so very hard to make Hillary into a monster by only quoting the negatives, why don't you try and entertain some of the positives. No, instead you'd rather continue the infighting that will guarantee another Republican victory in 2008. By the way, explain to me why you call it "mud-slinging" when Hillary wants to talk about Obama's positions and character, but it's okay for Obama to do the same thing to her. I have one question for you: If Obama wins the nomination, how long before the Republicans make the entire storyline of the campaign all about his COCAINE use? Do you think they will stop talking about it when all of you bleeding hearts start crying about it?

First thoughts: Eight days out

David DeChambeau, Cocolalla, ID — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 00:00:30 GMT

Why no mention of Ron Paul? He will place in the top three in Iowa and he will win New Hampshire .. that is if the election is kept fair and honest, and there are lots of people watching to ensure that it is.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Curtis Hill, Dallas, Texas — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 00:52:00 GMT

MSNBC has be come biased against Hillary Clinton. How is meeting with 79 world leaders over 8 years NOT experience. What other candidate can say that? Oh wait. I forgot.Obama once lived in Indonesia (amazing.)

First thoughts: Eight days out

rasputin — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 01:45:46 GMT

"But until Jan. 3 - and even after that - nobody knows what is going to happen. That's why this year is so exciting."

Even after January 3?

I had to read that here?

Nobody knows what is going to happen.

Someone should make a note of that insight for future reference.

Now THAT is EXCITING!!!!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

John, Claremont, CA — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 02:44:35 GMT

Hillary Clinton for President. Because in a world run by amateurs, EXPERIENCE COUNTS!

lol..i love that line!! GO HILLARY!!

CLINTON 08 BABY!!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Vet85, Washington DC — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 02:59:24 GMT

To Wayne from Ft Collins (posted Dec 26, 5:19 pm)

Thank-you for your spot on comments and the research you did on this. Most people who read through your piece honestly, will see that Romney is not the villian others like to make him out to be, nor the extreme flip-flopper as some would like to label him.

By no means is he perfect, and you do a great service with a very unbiased perspective. I hope everyone takes the chance to read your entry closely and with an open mind.

My leanings are more towards McCain because of his positions on the war, but Romney would be my #2 choice on the Republican side given his positions on immigration and the economy.

Thanks Wayne...Great research and analysis!

First thoughts: Eight days out

C Mu, Melaque, Jalisco, MX — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 03:13:49 GMT

I am confused by the comments. People seem to think it is a big deal that Hillary did not hold a security clearance or attend certain briefings. I don't get it? No one else did either -- nor did they represent our country on goodwill trips, be acknowledged as playing a major policy role in a prior administration or have ongoing dialogues on an almost daily basis with a sitting President. The NYT continues its wierd polemics of much ado about nothing. The story is truly bizarre since it posits experience as its subject and then does little to compare experience, instead just engaging in the same old Hillary bashing. I also agree that living in a foreign country (as I have for many years) offers a unique perspective that really is useful for foreign policy. So much of what Americans believe to be "true" is just cultural bias.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Johnny1967, Colorado — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 03:41:43 GMT

Obama, Edwards, and Bill Clinton became Presidential candidates on their own experience, hard work and talent. These people paid their own dues.

In contrast, Hillary Clinton would not be Presidential Candidate if she were not Bill Clintons wife. Bill Clinton paid most of her dues for her.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Michelle, Tucson, AZ — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 04:01:19 GMT

I met some high ranking people in Zimbabwe's government while working in that country 10 years ago. I also met Jim Belushi at a restaurant in Chicago when I was maybe 17 or 18. Oh yeah, I also hugged Arlo Guthrie after one of his concerts in Cincinnati. I must be highly qualified and experienced to...um...well...ok, maybe not so much...

This whole experience angle on Clinton's part really seems like a bad one to me. With all due respect, and as many have stated before me, if you want experience, vote for Biden or Dodd. The problem lies in the fact that so many smart people just don't have or take the time to look beyond the rhetoric.

I would be ok with Clinton if that's how it goes. I'd be ok with any of the Democratic candidates. I won't, however, vote for Clinton in the primary.

Obama '08!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Bryan — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 06:11:20 GMT

I just hope that after the next 30 days I never have to hear the name Ron Paul ever again and we can move on with real politics.

It is crunch time as we see from the article and we need to get rid of the sideshow and move into the real battle for the white house between the front runners.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Left here Right there — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 14:12:46 GMT

Ron Dennis wrote "We all know, whether you like her or not, that Hillary R Clinton will make a great president."
Ron we all know you're sniffing glue too but that doesn't make Hillary anything but a disaster for our country if elected president. Face the facts stophillary.com

Obama '08!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Bill, Albany NY — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 18:24:00 GMT

HRC is a carpet bagger. She used NY to get a run at the WH. I hear that she has done great things for NY, please name three. Name three Federal grants she secured for NY that created jobs or revenue? Well, I am upstate and I can tell you she has not done anything. Rochester is still hurting for jobs, Syracuse is as well. Buffalo is in the worst situation it has ever been in. Yet these cities will vote for her and continue to rot. It makes no sense to me.

I look at all the money that Alaska got and then wonder why we do not see all of this in NY? Then I remember that helping NY create jobs has nothing to do with her getting elected to the WH. What about her claims to NY that she would not use her seat to get to the WH? That lasted a term and a half.

I am a die hard conservative (not a Republican) and I will vote for HRC, no doubt about it. I want her out of NY so badly that I will gladly share our pain with the nation for four years.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Yevette Edwards, Jacksonville, Florida — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:11:42 GMT

I have read each entry with an open mind, I don't think Hillary would be a bad president, I just think she is the wrong choice at the wrong time. I have lood at her through the eyes of her husband, I think she stayed with Bill so that she could fulfill her political ambitions...think about it..... she is really a "republican" has any of her supporters rember, most of all know that she was a "Goldwater" girl, and what and where were her polictical veiws regarding the Nixon Impeachment.....she only became a democrate....when she met and married William Jefferson Clinton- the first black president..Yeah, right, its time for change, real change. will the real first Black President(skin color only)please standup for all americans of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA...BARACK HOUSEIN OBAMA-WHO DID NOT HAVE A DAMN NICKEL IN THE DIME REGARDING THE SELECTION OF IS NAME SAY IT LOUD...I AM AMERICAN AND PROUD TO VOTE FOR HER TALENTED SON, WHOSE SKIN HAPPENS TO BE OF A DARKER HUE

First thoughts: Eight days out

John Downs,Raleigh, NC — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:19:01 GMT

Barack Hussein Obama is a joke and the weakest candidate on both sides followed closely by the bigot Mike Huckabee and the Buffoon Ron Paul. Even HRC looks good compared to these trio!!

First thoughts: Eight days out

Jerry Firtel — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 21:08:03 GMT

It's depressing to hear all of the candidates tell us all of the "wonderful" things they have done and all of the "wonderful'things they will do when elected president How does one tell when it's the truth or a lie. I guess you choose the lesser two evils.

First thoughts: Eight days out

dmt, ft lauderdale, fl — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 23:45:36 GMT

I agree Chris Matthews is a egotistical slime ball. He must have failed Journalism 101....a journalist must be objective. He is a Hillary hater; he reports nothing positive about Hillary.That is why I will no longer watch his show, he is a disgrace as a journalist. Hillary is my girl. Hillary they hate you because you are smarter and more intelligent than they are....qualities we have not had in the WH in 7 years.

First thoughts: Eight days out

Mr. Larry, High Point, NC — Fri, 28 Dec 2007 13:03:17 GMT

GOP and Dems, beware of Ron Paul. Raising mega millions and has the support of the younger generation who is sick and tired of the status quo. They want dramatic change and it just may happen.

The top tier candidates should look in their rearview mirror, because there is a storm a-comming.